I'm leaving my parish..

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Ceasar has never said anyting against social justice as far as I know and he has been posting here a long time. I have read many of his posts and he is nothing but fair and honest at all times.
Why bash Ceasar? He is trying to become a Priest! Come on everyone!
 
Ask if there is a ministry that girls are welcome to participate in.

If it turns out that the reason he’s banning girl altar servers is that he believes that womanhood is of the Devil (and unfortunately we do find that even in the Catholic Church, in some quarters - amazingly, considering that the greatest Catholic is Mother Mary) then leave and don’t look back.

But if he also cares about girls, honors Mother Mary, and also wants girls, who are the very image of our Blessed Mother, to be welcome in his church, then he has probably already got something in mind that is “girls only” to balance the “boys only” of altar service.
 
It sounds like you have a new, traditional priest who replaced an outgoing, liberal, modernist priest. That certainly would shake things up. I wish it would happen at my parish! Give it time and see if you can adapt. You may find some of the changes inspire holiness in the parish.
 
Hey original poster…

I have been through something similar.

We had a parochial vicar who the first Sunday…I thought wow this guy is dynamite. He was very orthodox. Over time I realized he was also disturbingly negative. He did not project any joy. His attitude projected the image of a man who is disgusted with people and always sees the glass half empty. He was clearly a man who hated his job. Fortunately, he was replaced by a new priest who is probably even more orthodox and traditional, but who exudes a joyfulness beyond compare. We now have 2 priests who are obviously in love with Christ and his Church. It is a night and day difference. Sometimes it has to do with a person’s attitude and not whether they are orthodox or heterodox.

I pray that you will find somewhere that shows you the joy of Christ and his Church.

By the way, maybe the ladies wearing the mantilla’s are spanish? Or maybe they are from the 1880’s? Are they really really old?
 
QUESTIONINGMOM said:
After over 20 years I am sad to say that I am searching for a new parish. IMO my parish has been taken over by a sanctimonious, officious, advocate of excessive religiosity, throwback to pre vatican 2, lunatic. No question really, just wanted to vent.
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Yes, Yes—please let us know what parish you want to leave. As was mentioned prior----there are many people-- who are looking for a parish such as this.
 
In all fairness, not all ladies that wear mantillas are “Spanish” or “really really old”----
talk about profiling! That is the sterotype of someone who obviously has not been to a more Orthodox parish!

I have seen young girls wearing them, and also wearing very modest attire, as well as going to confession during the Mass!

Now, we do no one any good by knocking anyone here as long as they are not in violation of the rules and regs. It is so counterproductive.
 
I think the lack of joy is the real troubling part of the OP’s description. Our Pastor is young (younger than me, the big smarty pants) and very orthodox. We still have some young girls involved as altar servers but more and more boys are being drawn to this ministry. For awhile only young girls were available. But our parish is growing so that could be the reason.

The one thing that really makes our Pastor stand out, however, is his true love for his parish family. The man is bubbling over with happiness, smiles and love. He does not shy away from the tough subjects but he truly LOVES us and goes out of his way to make EVERYONE - even the mantilla-wearing ladies - as welcome as possible.

I will pray for you, OP…what a sad state of affairs.
 
Damascus said:
In all fairness, not all ladies that wear mantillas are “Spanish” or “really really old”----
talk about profiling! That is the sterotype of someone who obviously has not been to a more Orthodox parish!

I have seen young girls wearing them, and also wearing very modest attire, as well as going to confession during the Mass!
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I have noticed that many female college-age Catholics (my parish is near a university) are wearing mantillas- at my liberal, Novus Order parish :eek:
 
QUESTIONINGMOM said:
After over 20 years I am sad to say that I am searching for a new parish. IMO my parish has been taken over by a sanctimonious, officious, advocate of excessive religiosity, throwback to pre vatican 2, lunatic. No question really, just wanted to vent.
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How is he acting lunatic?
 
Caesar said:
I have noticed that many female college-age Catholics (my parish is near a university) are wearing mantillas- at my liberal, Novus Order parish :eek:
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Well, then things are different in Canada! “Blame Canada” j/k!

Guess I am just as guilty of profiling!

But it really is wonderful that young people dont see this as a prehistoric thing to do.

Maybe this is a trend or something. I saw a post on headcoverings here somewhere- maybe I should read it.

The thing is though- Do you think headcoverings in a novus ordo is the norm?
 
Caesar said:
Oh yes, lets believe whatever we want. If we dont like a teaching of the Church, lets shrug it off. There are many levels of being Catholic, but they are all good. Right?
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Right!

And as you reminded me below about social justice, I didn’t refer any anything doctrinal, just some of the accidents of practice that tend to get 95% of the attention.
Caesar said:
Wrong. Altar girls should only be used in circumstances where altar boys are not available. The service of the altar is meant to introduce young male Catholics to the priesthood and the administration of the sarcraments.
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That is not the only function, else the Vatican would not have allowed female altar servers.
As we all know, women cannot be priests, so there is no real need for altar girls.
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That does not follow of necessity.
As for the mantilla, it is a way for women to show reverance at Mass. A fine practice.
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I didn’t say that it wasn’t, I merely cautioned that one person’s vision of Catholicism shouldn’t be applied to the whole.
Oh, and you may notice that I said nothing against social justice.
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True dat. My apologies.
 
I think the difficulty the OP is trying to express is something I’ve found in a couple of parishes, both orthodox and the heterodox ones.

I’m talking about parishes where things are done in a completely negative, joyless, power- or rules- or ideology- obsessed manner. Remember St Paul saying ‘I can speak with the tongues of men and of angels, but if I have not love then I am no more than a sounding brass or clanging gong’?

So even the most good-looking, respectful and rubrical liturgy can be totally empty of meaning. Yes we are re-presenting the sacrifice of Calvary at each mass, and that demands a respectful demeanour. But we are also given a unique opportunity to join in intimate union with our God, which should be a joyful and not an oppressively gloomy experience.
 
I think the original poster’s parish is going on the right track actually.
 
It is sad that you are ready to leave a church that is beginning to display its Catholic identity. You mentioned you are not leaving for any small issue, but you mentioned the mantilla. We should become excited that the Church is universal and people find spirituality in many forms or prayer and worship.

The Eucharist is the source and summit of our life. I have never seen a Church that spends money on the tabernacle and chalies etc neglect the poor. We someone walks into a Church they should know without a doubt that something about that tabernacle is special. That something contained in that chalice is special. Those who care for God care for those whom God loves.
 
This happened in our parish as well, and many left for surrounding parishes. Our former pastor spoke about loving your neighbor, everyone is included, etc., while our new pastor, without necessarily disagreeing with the first, put more emphasis on moral issues that are plaguing our culture, including unfortunately, many Catholics.

One thing you might consider – if you leave Mass feeling a little uncomfortable because you realize that you might need to make changes to yourself, then perhaps that is Christ speaking to your heart. If, on the other hand, you leave Mass with a warm fuzzy feeling with no sense of mission or challenge to change your life…

It’s good to be uncomfortable.

After many years of the protestantation of our parishes, it is a shock for many when a priest comes in and reinstitutes more traditional forms of worship and values. For instance, the word obedience is a nasty word for many, but we’d all be good to practice it.

And what is “excessive religiosity”? Encouraging the bowing to the Eucharist or other external signs of respect? Can we show too much respect for Jesus? For some in our culture, just going to church or frequently praying would be considered “excessive religiosity”. And if there’s no sincere belief behind our external actions, then they’re right.

Perhaps this irritation is a grace from God. Pray about it. Maybe He wants to teach you something but you’re to angry to learn. Humility is the first stage of Wisdom. And is it really humility if it’s only done on your terms?
 
I guess this post hasn’t succeeded in stiring up as much controversy as the poster was looking for, although she did get a few to rise to the occasion.👍

Note: I have noticed on these posts that when someone loudly screams out anything about Pre Vatican II practices in a deroguatory way, as this one did immediately

1 it is usually a junior poster often the first time they post

2 They generally will post once or twice and then let others fight it out

3 Won’t provide much information as to specifics and if they do the allegations are either tiny insignificant things, OR things so terrible that you wonder wht the Parish is still operating

Of course, I may be wrong and this poster could be totally sincere in her beliefs and if so I’m truly sorry. See I’m learning to be kind compassionate and non judgemental and accepting of all things no matter how ridiculous they sound initially.
 
milimac said:
This happened in our parish as well, and many left for surrounding parishes. Our former pastor spoke about loving your neighbor, everyone is included, etc., while our new pastor, without necessarily disagreeing with the first, put more emphasis on moral issues that are plaguing our culture, including unfortunately, many Catholics.

One thing you might consider – if you leave Mass feeling a little uncomfortable because you realize that you might need to make changes to yourself, then perhaps that is Christ speaking to your heart. If, on the other hand, you leave Mass with a warm fuzzy feeling with no sense of mission or challenge to change your life…

It’s good to be uncomfortable.

After many years of the protestantation of our parishes, it is a shock for many when a priest comes in and reinstitutes more traditional forms of worship and values. For instance, the word obedience is a nasty word for many, but we’d all be good to practice it.

And what is “excessive religiosity”? Encouraging the bowing to the Eucharist or other external signs of respect? Can we show too much respect for Jesus? For some in our culture, just going to church or frequently praying would be considered “excessive religiosity”. And if there’s no sincere belief behind our external actions, then they’re right.

Perhaps this irritation is a grace from God. Pray about it. Maybe He wants to teach you something but you’re to angry to learn. Humility is the first stage of Wisdom. And is it really humility if it’s only done on your terms?
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While it’s good to sometimes be uncomfortable it is not good to leave church with a feeling of overwhelming oppression and hopelessness, which unfortunately can sometimes happen when the harsher aspects of life are excessively dwelt on.
 
I found the parish the op wants to leave and left the parish she’s looking for.
I’ve never been more filled with joy.
 
cheese_sdc said:
Catholicism as you understand it. There are other, equally valid, licit and acceptable ways to practice catholicism that involve altar girls, uncovered female heads, and social justice.

Please do not be insisting that your understanding of catholicism is the only “true” version of catholicism.
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I don’t see you stating any problems with the liturgy… so apparently the priest is devout, and reverent, and not limited to fluff homilies. And hopefully he talks of sin/confession, faith/reason etc.

But VatII was not the problem, nor is it today. It taught no error. Rather, history now shows us, the call for “active participation” was wrongly interpreted by many of the clergy, and they permitted lay intervention… things you may have become accustomed to these past 20 years. Abuses have become “norms” So I think I understand your concern at the changes.

But as long as your priest is not worshiping God in his own way, but rather worshipping in HIS way… you have a gift to your parish and I pray you take your time and look closer.

As for the social justice things…

Well, the priest is there to bring us the Eucharist first and foremost. Additionally he is there to bring us the sacraments.

All thing of social justice should be the fruits of his work, not his main work… nor yours. Seek support in the daily Mass, and eventually God will insure that social justice actions take their proper place in your journey to heaven.

.
 
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