Im sorry, I have yet another question about Mary, but it is from a catholic friend

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ALLFORHIM said:
…Also, I don’t accept the degree of honor that the CC gives Mary. Does that make me a bad Catholic?..
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Does your friend feel uncomfortable with the degree of honor given to Mary by the Bible? Revelation 12:1 depicts Mary in heaven wearing a crown of twelve stars. A crown! That’s a lot of honor.

She deserves that honor because she is the Mother of the King (in Hebrew culture, the King’s mother received great honor, as we find in the Old Testament).
 
ALLFORHIM said:
Here is another statement:

Tell them that we can know Christ without Mary because Christ is talked about in the scriptures and by the prophets, disciples and apostles. I don’t deny Mary and what she did by saying “yes” to God. She fulfilled the prophesy that “the Word became flesh and dwelt among us”. I just don’t feel right praying to her when I could just be praying to God. I’m not comfortable with the rosary or feast days honoring her.
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Then just pray to God. A Catholic Christian should never be asking Mary to pray for them in exclusion of praying to God.

It seems as if your friend seems to think it is an either or situation. We should NEVER abandon our prayers to God in favor of asking our friends to pray for us. We can certainly choose not to ask anyone else to pray for us but that shows a distinct misunderstanding of the communion of saints and the body of Christ.
ALLFORHIM said:
Another statement from her:

Catholics pray to Mary to intercession for us to Jesus. I don’t understand why you have to go through Mary when you can just go directly to God Himself?
I don’t find myself comfortable praying to Mary and asking her to ask God for things. I have a comfortable relationship with God that I feel like I can ask Him directly. Does that make me a bad Catholic for not praying to Mary like that?
Also, I don’t accept the degree of honor that the CC gives Mary. Does that make me a bad Catholic?
I define “pray” as “ask somebody for something in a reverent, serious manner”. :o)
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Again it is not that we have to go to Mary instead of Christ, it is that we can go to all of our friends AND Christ. She Should ask Him directly. And she can, if she wants, ask her friends also. Does she never ask any of her friends here on earth to pray for her? Through the communion of the saints, through God’s infinite Mercy, the saints in heaven are not excluded from the body of Christ.

Is it not One body as scripture states?

As the the level of honor given to Mary in the Catholic Church, how much honor is too much? Can you honor your parents too much? The Catholic Church has gone to great lengths to provide exact definitions in latin concerning what is appropriate only for God and what honor can be given Mary. Saying Mary is honored too much is like saying that you great-grandma, a pious and holy woman, recieved too much honor at the family dinner. Unless you actaully bow down and worship grandma’s feet, literally, how can you give to much honor to her?

As for the definition of pray, as long as she could also use the word pray in relation to asking her husband/good friend a serious question, then that would be okay. If she would never pray to her husband/good friend in the same manner one can pray to the saints, she really doesn’t understand the meaning of “pray to Mary” according to Catholic history and word usage.

God Bless,
Maria
 
ALLFORHIM said:
She says as far as Mary being called blessed by all nations she says that she is favored by all nations for obeying God’s will and giving birth to Jesus Christ–there is nothing more then that.

THESE ARE HER WORDS;)
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That is not what scripture says. Unless she wishes to disparage the plain word of God, it plainly states all generations will call me blessed.

Luke 1:48 for he has regarded the low estate of his handmaiden.
For behold, henceforth all generations will call me blessed;
 
MariaG said:
That is not what scripture says. Unless she wishes to disparage the plain word of God, it plainly states all generations will call me blessed.

Luke 1:48 for he has regarded the low estate of his handmaiden.
For behold, henceforth all generations will call me blessed;
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I think she feels or means that that statement doesnt mean the CC should put her on such a high pedastool as she thinks they do. Maybe she has seen catholics worship Mary where she lives. Lets face it there are always people who will go beyond what the church or even bible teach to the extremes. Maybe she witnessed someone. Ill have to ask her. Honestly, I have never spoken with her about this before and I dont know why or when she started to feel this way.
 
ALLFORHIM said:
I think she feels or means that that statement doesnt mean the CC should put her on such a high pedastool as she thinks they do. Maybe she has seen catholics worship Mary where she lives. Lets face it there are always people who will go beyond what the church or even bible teach to the extremes. Maybe she witnessed someone. Ill have to ask her. Honestly, I have never spoken with her about this before and I dont know why or when she started to feel this way.
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Well, to be technical she may have seen people who call themselves Catholics but haven’t been educated about Church teachings on idolatry or appropriate veneration for Mary and the other saints. Or she may simply have seen things without having a thorough understanding of them and inferred things that aren’t accurate.
 
LilyM said:
Well, to be technical she may have seen people who call themselves Catholics but haven’t been educated about Church teachings on idolatry or appropriate veneration for Mary and the other saints. Or she may simply have seen things without having a thorough understanding of them and inferred things that aren’t accurate.
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Her friend may have misunderstood but it is not her friend who said Catholics worship Mary.
Originally Posted by ALLFORHIM View Post
think she feels or means that that statement doesnt mean the CC should put her on such a high pedastool as she thinks they do. Maybe she has seen catholics worship Mary where she lives.
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This is a statement from ALLFORHIM. She didn’t say that her friend might have misunderstood. She said that her friend might have witnessed people worshipping Mary. She has been on this forum for awhile and should know that this is a false statement.
 
LilyM said:
Well, to be technical she may have seen people who call themselves Catholics but haven’t been educated about Church teachings on idolatry or appropriate veneration for Mary and the other saints. Or she may simply have seen things without having a thorough understanding of them and inferred things that aren’t accurate.
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I think I can agree with this. It is entirely possible that young Catholics will observe what they interpret to be an axaggerated deference to the Mother of God.

Some people actually DO go too far with it, and they seem (to me at least) to be the ones who protest the loudest when this observation is made. This continues to be harmful to the church as generation after generation has to address this issue.

The fact is the church teaching is very reasonable on the subject of Mary of Nazareth, the Mother of God, it’s what we do with it that can be problematic. Any Christian that feels more comfortable solely praying directly to God should simply do so. Those of us who feel comfortable asking the help of others (including the saints above) should do so. I ask for peoples prayers often, and I make no distinction between the living and those who have gone before.

http://www.brogilbert.org/jesus_christ/jusus_theotokos.JPG
 
I would tell your friend that as Catholics we are allowed and encouraged to love one another not only God but love everyone.

Since God is love we are encouraged to show love and Catholics are encouraged to show this for Mary and all the Saints.

Now regarding worship, it is impossible for Catholics to Worship Mary. As Catholic worship is the Catholic Mass the one Sacrifice of Jesus on the Cross for us presented all around the world every day.
The only way to worship Mary is to deny Catholic worship and subsititute it for unworthy worship that still isn’t good enough for God, which makes me even wonder if anyone worships Mary truly, since proper worship is offering sacrifice.
I would encourage your friend to seek to understand what worship truly is so they would see that it is impossible for Catholics to worship Mary, unless they are non-catholics.
(there are some non-catholics whose form of worship is singing, praying and stuff like that, Catholics worship ultimately and truly in the Mass)

In Christ
Scylla
 
I would tell your friend that as Catholics we are allowed and encouraged to love one another not only God but love everyone.

Since God is love we are encouraged to show love and Catholics are encouraged to show this for Mary and all the Saints.

Now regarding worship, it is impossible for Catholics to Worship Mary. As Catholic worship is the Catholic Mass the one Sacrifice of Jesus on the Cross for us presented all around the world every day.
The only way to worship Mary is to deny Catholic worship and subsititute it for unworthy worship that still isn’t good enough for God, which makes me even wonder if anyone worships Mary truly, since proper worship is offering sacrifice.
I would encourage your friend to seek to understand what worship truly is so they would see that it is impossible for Catholics to worship Mary, unless they are non-catholics.
(there are some non-catholics whose form of worship is singing, praying and stuff like that, Catholics worship ultimately and truly in the Mass)

In Christ
Scylla
 
I would tell your friend that as Catholics we are allowed and encouraged to love one another not only God but love everyone.

Since God is love we are encouraged to show love and Catholics are encouraged to show this for Mary and all the Saints.

Now regarding worship, it is impossible for Catholics to Worship Mary. As Catholic worship is the Catholic Mass the one Sacrifice of Jesus on the Cross for us presented all around the world every day. The one perfect God worthy sacrifice

The only way to worship Mary is to deny Catholic worship and subsititute it for a substitute worship which we would believe still isn’t good enough for God, which makes me even wonder if anyone worships Mary truly, since proper worship is offering sacrifice, and God deserves a perfect sacrifice.
I would encourage your friend to seek to understand what worship truly is so they would see that it is impossible for Catholics to worship Mary, unless they are non-catholics.
(there are some non-catholics whose form of worship is singing, praying and stuff like that, Catholics worship ultimately and truly in the Mass)

In Christ
Scylla
 
I would tell your friend that as Catholics we are allowed and encouraged to love one another not only God but love everyone.

Since God is love we are encouraged to show love and Catholics are encouraged to show this for Mary and all the Saints.

Now regarding worship, it is impossible for Catholics to Worship Mary. As Catholic worship is the Catholic Mass the one Sacrifice of Jesus on the Cross for us presented all around the world every day. The one perfect God worthy sacrifice

The only way to worship Mary is to deny Catholic worship and subsititute it for a substitute worship which we would believe still isn’t good enough for God, which makes me even wonder if anyone worships Mary truly, since proper worship is offering sacrifice, and God deserves a perfect sacrifice.
I would encourage your friend to seek to understand what worship truly is so they would see that it is impossible for Catholics to worship Mary, unless they are non-catholics.
(there are some non-catholics whose form of worship is singing, praying and stuff like that, Catholics worship ultimately and truly in the Mass)

In Christ
Scylla
 
I would tell your friend that as Catholics we are allowed and encouraged to love one another not only God but love everyone.

Since God is love we are encouraged to show love and Catholics are encouraged to show this for Mary and all the Saints.

Now regarding worship, it is impossible for Catholics to Worship Mary. As Catholic worship is the Catholic Mass the one Sacrifice of Jesus on the Cross for us presented all around the world every day. The one perfect God worthy sacrifice

The only way to worship Mary is to deny Catholic worship and subsititute it for a substitute worship which we would believe still isn’t good enough for God, which makes me even wonder if anyone worships Mary truly, since proper worship is offering sacrifice, and God deserves a perfect sacrifice.
I would encourage your friend to seek to understand what worship truly is so they would see that it is impossible for Catholics to worship Mary, unless they are non-catholics.
(there are some non-catholics whose form of worship is singing, praying and stuff like that, Catholics worship ultimately and truly in the Mass)

In Christ
Scylla
 
I would tell your friend that as Catholics we are allowed and encouraged to love one another not only God but love everyone.

Since God is love we are encouraged to show love and Catholics are encouraged to show this for Mary and all the Saints.

Now regarding worship, it is impossible for Catholics to Worship Mary. As Catholic worship is the Catholic Mass the one Sacrifice of Jesus on the Cross for us presented all around the world every day. The one perfect God worthy sacrifice

The only way to worship Mary is to deny Catholic worship and subsititute it for a substitute worship which we would believe still isn’t good enough for God, which makes me even wonder if anyone worships Mary truly, since proper worship is offering sacrifice, and God deserves a perfect sacrifice.
I would encourage your friend to seek to understand what worship truly is so they would see that it is impossible for Catholics to worship Mary, unless they are non-catholics.
(there are some non-catholics whose form of worship is singing, praying and stuff like that, Catholics worship ultimately and truly in the Mass)

In Christ
Scylla
 
I would tell your friend that as Catholics we are allowed and encouraged to love one another not only God but love everyone.

Since God is love we are encouraged to show love and Catholics are encouraged to show this for Mary and all the Saints.

Now regarding worship, it is impossible for Catholics to Worship Mary. As Catholic worship is the Catholic Mass the one Sacrifice of Jesus on the Cross for us presented all around the world every day. The one perfect God worthy sacrifice

The only way to worship Mary is to deny Catholic worship and subsititute it for a substitute worship which we would believe still isn’t good enough for God, which makes me even wonder if anyone worships Mary truly, since proper worship is offering sacrifice, and God deserves a perfect sacrifice.
I would encourage your friend to seek to understand what worship truly is so they would see that it is impossible for Catholics to worship Mary, unless they are non-catholics.
(there are some non-catholics whose form of worship is singing, praying and stuff like that, Catholics worship ultimately and truly in the Mass)

In Christ
Scylla
 
I would tell your friend that as Catholics we are allowed and encouraged to love one another not only God but love everyone.

Since God is love we are encouraged to show love and Catholics are encouraged to show this for Mary and all the Saints.

Now regarding worship, it is impossible for Catholics to Worship Mary. As Catholic worship is the Catholic Mass the one Sacrifice of Jesus on the Cross for us presented all around the world every day. The one perfect God worthy sacrifice

The only way to worship Mary is to deny Catholic worship and subsititute it for a substitute worship which we would believe still isn’t good enough for God, which makes me even wonder if anyone worships Mary truly, since proper worship is offering sacrifice, and God deserves a perfect sacrifice.
I would encourage your friend to seek to understand what worship truly is so they would see that it is impossible for Catholics to worship Mary, unless they are non-catholics.
(there are some non-catholics whose form of worship is singing, praying and stuff like that, Catholics worship ultimately and truly in the Mass)

In Christ
Scylla
 
I would tell your friend that as Catholics we are allowed and encouraged to love one another not only God but love everyone.

Since God is love we are encouraged to show love and Catholics are encouraged to show this for Mary and all the Saints.

Now regarding worship, it is impossible for Catholics to Worship Mary. As Catholic worship is the Catholic Mass the one Sacrifice of Jesus on the Cross for us presented all around the world every day. The one perfect God worthy sacrifice

The only way to worship Mary is to deny Catholic worship and subsititute it for a substitute worship which we would believe still isn’t good enough for God, which makes me even wonder if anyone worships Mary truly, since proper worship is offering sacrifice, and God deserves a perfect sacrifice.
I would encourage your friend to seek to understand what worship truly is so they would see that it is impossible for Catholics to worship Mary, unless they are non-catholics.
(there are some non-catholics whose form of worship is singing, praying and stuff like that, Catholics worship ultimately and truly in the Mass)

In Christ
Scylla
 
I would tell your friend that as Catholics we are allowed and encouraged to love one another not only God but love everyone.

Since God is love we are encouraged to show love and Catholics are encouraged to show this for Mary and all the Saints.

Now regarding worship, it is impossible for Catholics to Worship Mary. As Catholic worship is the Catholic Mass the one Sacrifice of Jesus on the Cross for us presented all around the world every day. The one perfect God worthy sacrifice

The only way to worship Mary is to deny Catholic worship and subsititute it for a substitute worship which we would believe still isn’t good enough for God, which makes me even wonder if anyone worships Mary truly, since proper worship is offering sacrifice, and God deserves a perfect sacrifice.
I would encourage your friend to seek to understand what worship truly is so they would see that it is impossible for Catholics to worship Mary, unless they are non-catholics.
(there are some non-catholics whose form of worship is singing, praying and stuff like that, Catholics worship ultimately and truly in the Mass)

In Christ
Scylla
 
adrift said:
Since Catholics do not worship Mary she could not have seen it.:tsktsk:
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I did not say they teach that but there are people in every christian branch that do take things to the extreme.Neither one of us know if there is any catholic out there that worships Mary. I dont know every catholic in the world and I’ll assume you do not either;) All Im saying is it is a possibility. I’ll ask her.
 
LilyM said:
Well, to be technical she may have seen people who call themselves Catholics but haven’t been educated about Church teachings on idolatry or appropriate veneration for Mary and the other saints. Or she may simply have seen things without having a thorough understanding of them and inferred things that aren’t accurate.
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Could be:shrug:
 
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