I'm torn.

[BeeRod]

A part of me is glad to come back to my Catholic roots. Being in church, taking RCIA class, even having great conversations with the Mgsr. is great. I’m happy that I’m waking up from years sleeping.

But I’m also torn. I still feel gay couples should be free to love and if they want to get married, they should (civil ceremony, of course). In addition, when my fiance and I get married and have children, we want to stop when we know we can’t afford another child. We’re already in our 30s so we’ll most likely have our children back to back, unless they’re twins. In the meantime, the threads I’m reading about premarital sex and birth control (using it for my irregular periods and anemic problems) is making me feel uneasy. I love my fiance with all my heart and while it’s great sexually between us, he means so much more to me than just “bow chicky bow bow” fun.

I’m just torn about everything. Been praying but it’s still making me feel uneasy. :imsorry:

 

[Trishie]

Step by step.
When you first return a lot seems overwhelming, but you take it step by step as God leads you.

Welcome back!

 

[LaFleurDeLis]

Hey there,

I know what you’re going through in regards to the sexual portion of being married. I reccomend you check out a website called Living the Sacrament. It’s a Catholic NFP community and I have found great information there. If you aren’t familiar with Natural Family Planning it will be a great asset to you. I just got married in June and we have been battling sexual temptations. I’ve just started charting again with the Billings method and hope to get an instructor very soon to help me through the learning process. In the end I know it will pay off, because we will be living how God wants us to live out marriage. Granted, I’m scared right now, but I know I need to trust in the Lord!

As far as your feelings on homosexuality, let me point out one thing. The Church is not against gay people. We accept them as we accept anyone else. However, if they choose to live with eachother, they MUST do so as brother and brother or sister and sister. In other words, no sexual activity. If they live in this way, they are in complete line with the Catholic faith and can receive the sacraments. However, if the engage in sexual activity, they are not living as brother and brother or sister and sister and therefore, then are committing mortal sin. I don’t think this happens very often however.

And I suppose this is my second thought on that, sorry I know I promised just one… When thinking about marriage for homosexuals, keep in mind that God created man and woman in his image, male and female he created them. They are meant to leave their parents and become one flesh. This isn’t possible for homosexuals and therefore is the reason they are not allowed to be married.

I hope this helps. Keep going through with RCIA. Discuss these things with them or with your priest. There is a wealth of knowledge at your disposal. If there’s one thing I wish I would have done while I was in RCIA it would have been to ask more questions and to be like a sponge to everything that was discussed.

 

[Delaine75]

I love my fiance with all my heart and while it’s great sexually between us, he means so much more to me than just “bow chicky bow bow” fun.

This jumped out at me – pretty sure you and your fiance should maybe NOT be doing this right now as you’re unmarried. (I know that in my RCIA class last year, the priest was very vocal with this young unmarried couple about how if they were living together and/or continuing to have sexual relations outside of marriage, perhaps they weren’t quite ready to be a part of the Catholic Church because they weren’t taking things seriously.)

Please speak with your priest about your feelings about the things you mentioned. Perhaps he can shed some light on it for you so that you understand where the Church is coming from in these matters. I guess you cannot help how you feel inside about these things, but perhaps actively supporting it (gay marriage, birth control, etc.) would be a very different story. Praying for you!

 

[Irishgal49]

Hi there,

Welcome to RCIA. If you are unsure about something I would just leave that be for now. Since you do not mention having issues around homosexual feelings I would just leave that sit and come back to it later. Focus on learning what you need to grow closer to God. It’s so easy to focus on one or two things that derail us. We are all in a process of conversion and it takes time to grow into the faith. There are things I do not agree with at all and prayer and growing step-by-step can bring us closer to the Church and its teachings. When I pick at that one or two things I am not agreeing with I can get all focused on that and totally sidetrack my growth toward God. Keep it in prayer and continue to study and don’t obsess about it. You can always discuss it with a priest or spiritual advisor later. You will always have problem areas in your faith as no one is perfectly Catholic.

As far as your comments about your sexual relationship with your boyfriend you might want to talk to the priest about how to handle that. Again, it’s about growing in becoming a Catholic and we are always in a process of conversion.

When I became Catholic I was living with my boyfriend. The priest knew it and let me join the faith. I am pretty sure that is not done normally but here I am. I have changed that part of my life but I still have my areas of struggle.

Keep praying and ask the Blessed Mother what to do. She will always lead you to her son.

God bless!

 

[BeeRod]

Hi there,

Welcome to RCIA. If you are unsure about something I would just leave that be for now. Since you do not mention having issues around homosexual feelings I would just leave that sit and come back to it later. Focus on learning what you need to grow closer to God. It’s so easy to focus on one or two things that derail us. We are all in a process of conversion and it takes time to grow into the faith. There are things I do not agree with at all and prayer and growing step-by-step can bring us closer to the Church and its teachings. When I pick at that one or two things I am not agreeing with I can get all focused on that and totally sidetrack my growth toward God. Keep it in prayer and continue to study and don’t obsess about it. You can always discuss it with a priest or spiritual advisor later. You will always have problem areas in your faith as no one is perfectly Catholic.

As far as your comments about your sexual relationship with your boyfriend you might want to talk to the priest about how to handle that. Again, it’s about growing in becoming a Catholic and we are always in a process of conversion.

When I became Catholic I was living with my boyfriend. The priest knew it and let me join the faith. I am pretty sure that is not done normally but here I am. I have changed that part of my life but I still have my areas of struggle.

Keep praying and ask the Blessed Mother what to do. She will always lead you to her son.

God bless!

My monsignor let me join the Church too despite living with my fiance. I’ve only moved in a couple of months ago, just as we were getting engaged. On the other hand, I do spend plenty of nights at my mother’s house 10 miles away. That’s mostly because during his overnight shifts, I rarely see him. So I would stay over her house to keep each other company. Most likely it’ll stay that way until we are married.

As for homosexuality, I’ve always believed that love is love and we’re God’s children. My cousin’s gay and wanted to marry his partner for a while. It took them a few years until New York adopted the same-sex marriage law. Many people in my family (mind you the majority of my family are Evangelical Christians) are completely against homosexuality. But like I said, love is love regardless of your sexual orientation.

When I started RCIA, it’s for spiritual growth. I want to continue to grow in the faith. But these issues is making me nervous. It also doesn’t help that my monsignor is away for 2 weeks (he also teaches RCIA), so I’m getting another priest to conduct the classes during his absence.

 

[agapewolf]

No, it isn’t. I don’t think you understand the meaning of love.

Love is NOT a feeling. It is not affection, and it isn’t just pleasant attraction.

Love is a decision, and act of the will for the other’s good. Love is self-sacrificial. Love is Christ dying on the cross. Love must be LIFE GIVING.

Marriage on earth is an icon of Christ’s (groom) love for the church (bride). Just as the Father is the initiator of the gift, there must be a receiver. This is stamped into our bodies. Two people of the same sex cannot image this love.

I recommend Theology of the Body for beginners and Good news about sex and marriage both by Christopher West. They are very easy reading and give lots of explanations of the Christian understanding of life and love.

 

[BeeRod]

No, it isn’t. I don’t think you understand the meaning of love.

Love is NOT a feeling. It is not affection, and it isn’t just pleasant attraction.

Love is a decision, and act of the will for the other’s good. Love is self-sacrificial. Love is Christ dying on the cross. Love must be LIFE GIVING.

Marriage on earth is an icon of Christ’s (groom) love for the church (bride). Just as the Father is the initiator of the gift, there must be a receiver. This is stamped into our bodies. Two people of the same sex cannot image this love.

I recommend Theology of the Body for beginners and Good news about sex and marriage both by Christopher West. They are very easy reading and give lots of explanations of the Christian understanding of life and love.

So you’re saying I know nothing of love?

Thank you for making me feel more torn than I was before. I feel I’ve made a mistake starting this thread.

 

[SecretaryMonday]

In the meantime, the threads I’m reading about premarital sex and birth control (using it for my irregular periods and anemic problems) is making me feel uneasy.

Hello BeeRod!

Are you aware that you are allowed to use “the Pill” as treatment for legitimate medical conditions (i.e., if you have irregular periods)? I have met many people who didn’t know this.
Pregnancy is not a disease ; if you are using birth control for the purpose of preventing or eliminating pregnancy, the Catholic Church teaches that this is a sin. However, if you are taking the Pill for health issues such as the ones that you described, there is no sin; you need to take care of your body.

Here is one of Michelle Arnold’s answers (there are several, and these can be found by doing an “Advanced Search” of the forums) on this issue from the “Ask An Apologist” section:
forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=636947&highlight=birth+control

 

[agapewolf]

So you’re saying I know nothing of love?

Thank you for making me feel more torn than I was before. I feel I’ve made a mistake starting this thread.

I didn’t say that. There is no need to be sarcastic.

People who think same sex unions should happen are missing a very serious, deep intricate part of the definition of love.

You are obviously conflicted so I recommended some reading sources for you to explain the church’s understandings better.

instead you get defensive and make up something I didn’t say.

 

[Demetra2]

Welcome back to the Church! That is truly a blessing that you are embracing our beautiful faith. Please understand that for many of us trust and faith come first and then understanding. I am a convert married to a Cradle Catholic and over the years my opinions that opposed church teachings have dissolved as my maturity and understanding of God’s incredible and gentle love for me increased. Sex in marriage is beautiful but sex outside of marriage degrades its beauty . There are many reasons for this and you can get guidance from many sources including JPII’s theology of the body. For now just TRUST and give in to this request from God. He will give you understanding about many things and your love for Him will grow.Our culture is toxic and very opposed to many doctrines of the Church. Because you have grown up saturated in this toxic mess you have “feelings” opposed to church doctrine. Start getting your answers from orthodox Catholic sources and ask God for his help. It will all make sense eventually and you will find understanding in addition to faith. It may happen overnight or it make take years but have the guts to trust God and he will lead you in the right direction. God Bless.

 

[mountee]

As you can see BeeRod, you have to have some patience with these threads as you don’t have the opportunity to talk face to face, to factor in body language, tone of voice, etc. I can really empathize with what you posted, believe it or not, in the past couple of months I have read things on here that I did not know that caused me concern also. I am a cradle Catholic educated in Catholic schools from elementary through college. How is it possible that I would have missed some of these things? I, too, am constantly torn as I want to be a good Catholic. I don’t have the same issues as you but I do understand yours. Please discuss these concerns with the parish priest and allow him to take you through the examination of your life and the Churches rules. I am so glad you posted and I urge you to read everything with an open mind. Don’t give up just yet, people can make you feel very bad here but for the most part I really don’t think they mean to hurt, they just are “talking” to you with the keyboard and that has a lot of risk of miscommunication. God bless your journey back:thumbsup:

 

[cmscms]

But I’m also torn. I still feel gay couples should be free to love and if they want to get married, they should (civil ceremony, of course).:

Gays are free to marry in a civil ceremony because God has given everyone free will. However, there are a lot of things people feel they should be able to do and it doesn’t change the fact that they are sins.

True love means helping one get to heaven. If a gay loves a gay, he would help him get to heaven not marry him. Performing sexual acts harms one emotionally and spiritually and simply tears us further away from God. Everyone has crosses to bear and temptations to fight. With God’s grace we can be successful. The more you grow close to God, the more this will make sense

In addition, when my fiance and I get married and have children, we want to stop when we know we can’t afford another child. We’re already in our 30s

In whose opinion can you not afford another child? If you insist on dressing your kids in designer clothes and making sure they always have the latest gadgets, it is a wonder anyone can afford one kid. But if you simply want to make sure they are fed with a roof over their head then God will provide. Not to mention being in your 30s, you won’t have all that many years to have to worry about NFP failing

I love my fiance with all my heart and while it’s great sexually between us, he means so much more to me than just “bow chicky bow bow” fun.

Perhaps it is more than fun for you but… it is not true love. True love helps one get to heaven and makes sure the wedding night is special. Also, a lot of secular people have told me, ‘no man will wait until marriage’ What a ridiculous statement. That implies that if a woman is sick and can’t have sex, since her husband can’t wait he will cheat.

I am sure there are times when couples can not be together such as seperate on business trips etc, love means waiting

CM

 

[Cristiano]

Hello BeeRod!

Are you aware that you are allowed to use “the Pill” as treatment for legitimate medical conditions (i.e., if you have irregular periods)? I have met many people who didn’t know this.
Pregnancy is not a disease ; if you are using birth control for the purpose of preventing or eliminating pregnancy, the Catholic Church teaches that this is a sin. However, if you are taking the Pill for health issues such as the ones that you described, there is no sin; you need to take care of your body.

Here is one of Michelle Arnold’s answers (there are several, and these can be found by doing an “Advanced Search” of the forums) on this issue from the “Ask An Apologist” section:
forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=636947&highlight=birth+control

I think that you are giving misleading information here. The post that you refer too is the case of a celibate person. The case of a person that is having sexual relations is completely different from a moral point of view.

 

[BlueEyedLady]

So you’re saying I know nothing of love?

Thank you for making me feel more torn than I was before. I feel I’ve made a mistake starting this thread.

Please don’t take that post personally, nor the one telling you that the love between you and your fiance isn’t real. Both of those were pretty mean. If your priest knows you’re living with your fiance and let you convert anyway then I’ll venture to say that he knew something about you and your situation that the posters on here don’t. (Go figure, right?) I also think he would have mentioned something to you about the love between the two of you not being real if that’s how he felt.

Please take your concerns to him. He has worked with you, he will hear you out, and if he has questions or issues he can go to the bishop.

Sometimes newcomers are treated harshly here. I don’t know why but that seems to be how it goes, so please stick around and give the forums a fair shot even if you feel uncomfortable at first.

 

[BeeRod]

I needed to take a quick break from posting after the earlier post. Got me at a very bad time.

When I said “love is love”, I was not only referring to romantic love. People can love without being physically intimate. People can love by listening to each other, caring about that person, giving yourself to that person (not only physically, but emotionally and spiritually). It’s that relationship you have with God, your family, and your friends. I can be more technical about different types of love but I won’t go there. All I’m saying is that we all are human, gay or straight, and should experience love at least one point in our lives.

I feel like I don’t make sense but I need to put it down there.

In response to BlueEyedBaby: I’ve been honest with the Monsignor about coming back, living with my fiance, etc. I could’ve been denied but he still welcomed me with open arms and let me register

In response to cmscms: We could care less about designer stuff. Heck, I don’t even own an IPhone. We both want to provide a wonderful life for our future kids, giving our attention to them 100%. It also helps that our families are nearby and willing to help when we need it.

As for the sex comment, he and I waited nearly a year before having sex. Before that, I didn’t had sex for a few years. Even now, we would go a week or two without it (due to work and fatigue) but spending time together is enough. I know, it’s a little TMI.

I’m still feeling a lot discouraged after earlier today. I mean, I went through 22 years of bouncing from one Protestant church to another and opened my mind to so many different thoughts through school (I was a Geography major), the media, and personal experience. I’m just returning back to a Church, but now as an adult.

 

[SecretaryMonday]

I think that you are giving misleading information here. The post that you refer too is the case of a celibate person. The case of a person that is having sexual relations is completely different from a moral point of view.

I’m sorry if I was misleading. I was trying to address the issue of whether or not birth control could be used at all, as I have talked to many people who thought that the Catholic Church forbade the use of the Pill in any and all circumstances.

This might be a better answer, as it deals more specifically with using the Pill while having sexual relations:
forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=15756

 

[BeeRod]

Thought I should give you an update.

While I’m not as torn as I was when I started this post (still annoyed that I was told I knew nothing of love), I now have a new fear. I’ve done something in the past that would be considered “unforgivable”. But during that time I wasn’t practicing the faith and was very scared. I was only a teenager at the time. Part of me wants to tell the priest but if I do, I might get kicked out of RCIA class. I’ve been feeling this guilt for a long time and only told a few people, including my fiance. :frighten: I’m now stuck!

 

[jprice66]

Thought I should give you an update.

While I’m not as torn as I was when I started this post (still annoyed that I was told I knew nothing of love), I now have a new fear. I’ve done something in the past that would be considered “unforgivable”. But during that time I wasn’t practicing the faith and was very scared. I was only a teenager at the time. Part of me wants to tell the priest but if I do, I might get kicked out of RCIA class. I’ve been feeling this guilt for a long time and only told a few people, including my fiance. :frighten: I’m now stuck!

There is no sin that’s unforgivable, except for blasphemy against the Holy Spirit. As you are still alive and posting here, you have not committed it. Blasphemy against the Holy Spirit is rejecting God’s call to repentance throughout your life and therefore dying in sin.

 

[BeeRod]

There is no sin that’s unforgivable, except for blasphemy against the Holy Spirit. As you are still alive and posting here, you have not committed it. Blasphemy against the Holy Spirit is rejecting God’s call to repentance throughout your life and therefore dying in sin.

Don’t worry, it’s not blasphemy!