Immigration Rallies Planned Nationwide

[mary_bobo]

We don’t know who all the marchers at these rallies are, and no one should make a sweeping statement that the marchers are those who are in fear of being deported, or those who use false identification, or those who do not pay taxes.

I would march at one of those rallies if I lived close enough, and I am a tax-paying American citizen.

You would be suppporting your convictions, I suppose. But I have this old-fashioned thing about the law. If we in the US don’t like the law, help get it changed. I’m sorry you can’t see the illegals marching in the streets, waving Mexican flags and making demands on the country that they are not citizens of is just not the way to get what you want. Nor is it a way to garner sympathy for your cause.

 

[meeshy]

IRS/social security fraud is not the same as simply using a fake ID, obviously. Not all illegals have fake ID or fake social security numbers. It is entirely possible to live in this country without any ID at all. I know plenty of illegals who do it, and plenty of citizens who do it, as well.

The persons in this country who do use false social security numbers are taxed but never receive any refund. The government just keeps the revenue. The use of the fake number doesn’t benefit the one using it aside from affording them the chance to work. How could you be so outraged about that? The government still receives its taxes. I guess you’re outraged just because it’s a so-called felony.

We all know plenty of American citizens, especially famous ones, who perpetrate tax fraud (which is a felony), or who evade paying their taxes (which is a felony). We know huge American corporations who have crafty CPA’s working to reduce their tax bills any way they can. Are you outraged by that, too?

I know many, many American restaurant workers who NEVER report their tips. I know several American employers who don’t pay all the required taxes on their American employees. Are you outraged by that, too?

If you want to by outraged by the actions of a few, be outraged by the actions of the masses, as well.

About the Bishops and their position: they have everything covered fully. You have to look into it. The more I read on their websites, the more I understand how fully they have it covered. You can’t read a few pages and come to the conclusion that they’ve not considered entire issues. That’s just being misinformed.

Regarding not liking the law and getting it changed: THAT’S EXACTLY WHY THERE ARE RALLIES. There are plenty of other ways to get the law changed, as well. Write or call your Senators and tell them you want them to follow the Bishops’ plan. Send emails to your friends and tell them to contact their Senators. Write letters to newspaper editors.

Our Bishops have come up with a comprehensive plan. Use their resources, their research, their talking points to spread the word. Don’t rely on your own opinions.

Voting will be taking place this week and next week on key proposals. We need to support the Bishops’ proposals by spreading the word. Many Catholics don’t even know the Bishops’ plan or website exists. Many Catholics don’t even know the real issues or what is being voted on.

Here’s a good example for people to reference. It’s S.2611, which comes up for consideration in the coming weeks. Here’s how the Bishops respond to the bill and its amendments, point by point:

S2611

To insinuate that the Catholic Bishops in this country wish to harbor criminals is really offensive. As I said before, it simply amazes me that a person could think him/herself more intelligent, informed, or moral than the entire USCCB.

 

[YinYangMom]

IRS/social security fraud is not the same as simply using a fake ID, obviously. Not all illegals have fake ID or fake social security numbers

Not all but many do rely on SS fraud to work in this country illegally. They are the ones who are being sought by our government to deport. They are already quite fortunate that that is the consequence our government is willing to impose upon them - it is a slap on the wrist to be sent back to their country rather than prosecuted and thrown in jail before deporting them.

As for those who manage to earn enough income ‘under the table’ without using false SS identification, they’re still breaking our tax laws by not reporting their income. I state again that I believe we really need to go after those businesses providing the illegal wages rather than the people earning them, but apparently the bishops are willing to look the other way on that.

The persons in this country who do use false social security numbers are taxed but never receive any refund. The government just keeps the revenue… I guess you’re outraged just because it’s a so-called felony.

I’m not outraged. I’m concerned. It isn’t a ‘so-called’ felony as I’ve already proven, and whether or not they benefit or the government does is not the point. In fact, this is one of the point the Catholic church is trying to remedy. They are attempting to stop the unfair practices affecting immigrants - documented or not. The Church does not condone depriving the worker of their entitlements, why should you shrug the practice off as if it doesn’t matter?

Are you outraged by that, too?

Not outraged. All criminals should face the consequences for their actions when they are caught. I would not support the bishops rallying to their aid in an attempt to thwart sentences being handed down and served by them any more than I do the attempts to thwart justice on those undocumented workers who committed felonies in order to live here.

If you want to by outraged by the actions of a few, be outraged by the actions of the masses, as well.

If I’m outraged about anything it’s about our government’s ‘behind the scenes’ support of this racket. The Church is absolutely correct to admonish the governments who fail to care for their own such that they feel compelled to break laws in order to seek a better life for themselves. The USCCB should be devoting their resources to admonishing our own government for looking the other way at all the industries who feed the illigal immigration racket.

Regarding not liking the law and getting it changed: THAT’S EXACTLY WHY THERE ARE RALLIES. …
Our Bishops have come up with a comprehensive plan.

It is not comprehensive if it does not address the demand side of the equation, and it is not complete if it encourages the faithful to break the laws of the land in order to harbor felons.

To insinuate that the Catholic Bishops in this country wish to harbor criminals is really offensive.

Who’s insinuating? It was declared a fact when they announced they would participate in the New Sanctuary Movement:

“Since last May, U.S. immigration authorities have been cracking down on** illegal immigrants who ignore deportation orders** …Under the sanctuary plan, six to eight congregations in Los Angeles, New York, Seattle and San Diego will initially harbor one family each of immigrant families who have at least one member facing, or at risk of, deportation…These are all individuals who have had their day in court, and often they appealed, and a judge said 'sorry, you don’t qualify.”

They qualify their participation with: “Families being offered sanctuary have worked in the United States for some years, paid U.S. taxes and have no criminal records. They have also agreed to be publicly identified.”

Now, again I question how they’ve managed to work here for some years while paying taxes. They need social security cards in order to do that. That they were not caught and charged and convicted of the felony for SS fraud is what keeps them from having a criminal record and thus qualifying for the Sanctuary program, but that is still deceit and I do not understand how the Catholic church could support any deception.

 

[YinYangMom]

By the way, much of your previous post falls on the, ‘well who does it really hurt anyway, and everyone else is doing it so what’s the problem’ approach to morality. As a recent convert and one who trusts the Church’s wisdom on all matters, you should recognize there’s no way the Church would support such a position. You know, having read the documentation, that the Church takes the position it does for nobler reasons than those.

Here’s a good example for people to reference. It’s S.2611, which comes up for consideration in the coming weeks. Here’s how the Bishops respond to the bill and its amendments, point by point:

S2611

As for this part of your post…

I understand why the bishops would take the positions they did on most of those amendments. It is not fair that the undocumented worker lose their entitlements because an employer chooses to break laws in order to hire the undocumented worker. The bishops are correct to defend the rights of the worker - documented or not. For the most part their position is consistent and I do understand the motives behind their support/opposition. When it comes to legal documents one has to shoot down any and all attempts which erode the human rights of an individual, I get that.

But looking at 4106 it perplexes me that they take the stand to come down on business for unfair labor practices with regard to wages and working conditions for the worker without acknowledging that the employer should not be hiring the worker in the first place! It’s like they’re saying, since you’re going to break the law anyway, at least make sure you treat your undocumented workers fairly. How could representatives of Christ’s church ever look beyond an immoral action in order to justify the action on the other side with a moral action??

The Church has always taught that the ends do not justify the means. What the bishops are proposing does just that.

 

[meeshy]

I never said I was a “recent” convert.

The whole world can disagree with the Bishops and their position. The whole world usually does disagree with the Church in general. But a wise person, especially a Catholic, should never think they are wiser concerning a particular issue, than the Bishops speaking as a whole.

With all the waste in our country, the huge corporations avoiding paying taxes, the CEO’s getting richer and the average worker struggling, the hideous practice of idolizing film, music, and sports figures and paying them tens of millions of dollars per year… with all this going on in our country, people still say the resident evil here in the U.S. is illegal immigrants?

Come on. Get real.

Don’t kid yourself that we’ll have a great society if we just get rid of the illegals. Citizens will still disobey laws here. Taxes will still go unpaid. Schools will still not receive the funding they need. Drivers will still drive over the speed limit and/or drunk. Teenagers will still try to sneak into bars or buy alcohol and cigarettes. Students will still cheat on tests. People will still default on student loans, credit card bills, hospital bills, and other debts. People will still claim bankruptcy or sue eachother unnecessarily. Domestic violence will still continue. Deadbeat dads will still avoid paying child support. Abortions will still be performed. Drugs will still be sold on the street. Pornography will still run rampant. Stripper clubs will still be in operation and underage girls will still dance there. Banks will still be robbed. Cars will still be jacked. Panhandlers will still beg on the streets. Animals will still be abused. Children will still be abused. The list goes on forever.

Get real. Don’t be a vigilante unless you’re going to be vigilant against every offense and every perpetrator. Do not single people out, whether they are citizens or not. And especially do not accuse our Holy Mother Church of harboring criminals. The Church forgives, as we must. Even a murderer can be forgiven and allowed the opportunity to change his life.

Let’s not forget that we’re not the only country with an influx of immigrants or refugees. Plenty of countries have the same problem, and it has to be looked at with compassion and intelligence. Not vigilante-ism.

Peace,
Meeshy

 

[meeshy]

Regarding the New Sanctuary movement: show me where the USCCB has endorsed this.

This movement is an interfaith movement. A few Catholic parishes are involved, but I have found nothing to indicate that it is sanctioned by the USCCB as a whole.

If you want to say something is condoned by the Church, you have to provide the proof.

Peace,
Meeshy

 

[LCMS_No_More]

I never said I was a “recent” convert.

The whole world can disagree with the Bishops and their position. The whole world usually does disagree with the Church in general. But a wise person, especially a Catholic, should never think they are wiser concerning a particular issue, than the Bishops speaking as a whole.

With all the waste in our country, the huge corporations avoiding paying taxes, the CEO’s getting richer and the average worker struggling, the hideous practice of idolizing film, music, and sports figures and paying them tens of millions of dollars per year… with all this going on in our country, people still say the resident evil here in the U.S. is illegal immigrants?

Come on. Get real.

Don’t kid yourself that we’ll have a great society if we just get rid of the illegals. Citizens will still disobey laws here. Taxes will still go unpaid. Schools will still not receive the funding they need. Drivers will still drive over the speed limit and/or drunk. Teenagers will still try to sneak into bars or buy alcohol and cigarettes. Students will still cheat on tests. People will still default on student loans, credit card bills, hospital bills, and other debts. People will still claim bankruptcy or sue eachother unnecessarily. Domestic violence will still continue. Deadbeat dads will still avoid paying child support. Abortions will still be performed. Drugs will still be sold on the street. Pornography will still run rampant. Stripper clubs will still be in operation and underage girls will still dance there. Banks will still be robbed. Cars will still be jacked. Panhandlers will still beg on the streets. Animals will still be abused. Children will still be abused. The list goes on forever.

Get real. Don’t be a vigilante unless you’re going to be vigilant against every offense and every perpetrator. Do not single people out, whether they are citizens or not. And especially do not accuse our Holy Mother Church of harboring criminals. The Church forgives, as we must. Even a murderer can be forgiven and allowed the opportunity to change his life.

Let’s not forget that we’re not the only country with an influx of immigrants or refugees. Plenty of countries have the same problem, and it has to be looked at with compassion and intelligence. Not vigilante-ism.

Peace,
Meeshy

:clapping: :clapping: :clapping: :clapping:

 

[meeshy]

Regarding the Church “harboring criminals”…

In World War II Europe, the Church harbored many Jews, Catholics, anti-Nazis, gays, and others, who were considered “criminals” by the Nazi regime.

Just food for thought.

Peace,
Meeshy

 

[EMAC]

I never said I was a “recent” convert.

The whole world can disagree with the Bishops and their position. The whole world usually does disagree with the Church in general. But a wise person, especially a Catholic, should never think they are wiser concerning a particular issue, than the Bishops speaking as a whole.

With all the waste in our country, the huge corporations avoiding paying taxes, the CEO’s getting richer and the average worker struggling, the hideous practice of idolizing film, music, and sports figures and paying them tens of millions of dollars per year… with all this going on in our country, people still say the resident evil here in the U.S. is illegal immigrants?

Come on. Get real.

Don’t kid yourself that we’ll have a great society if we just get rid of the illegals. Citizens will still disobey laws here. Taxes will still go unpaid. Schools will still not receive the funding they need. Drivers will still drive over the speed limit and/or drunk. Teenagers will still try to sneak into bars or buy alcohol and cigarettes. Students will still cheat on tests. People will still default on student loans, credit card bills, hospital bills, and other debts. People will still claim bankruptcy or sue eachother unnecessarily. Domestic violence will still continue. Deadbeat dads will still avoid paying child support. Abortions will still be performed. Drugs will still be sold on the street. Pornography will still run rampant. Stripper clubs will still be in operation and underage girls will still dance there. Banks will still be robbed. Cars will still be jacked. Panhandlers will still beg on the streets. Animals will still be abused. Children will still be abused. The list goes on forever.

Get real. Don’t be a vigilante unless you’re going to be vigilant against every offense and every perpetrator. Do not single people out, whether they are citizens or not. And especially do not accuse our Holy Mother Church of harboring criminals. The Church forgives, as we must. Even a murderer can be forgiven and allowed the opportunity to change his life.

Let’s not forget that we’re not the only country with an influx of immigrants or refugees. Plenty of countries have the same problem, and it has to be looked at with compassion and intelligence. Not vigilante-ism.

Peace,
Meeshy

 

[YinYangMom]

The whole world can disagree with the Bishops and their position. The whole world usually does disagree with the Church in general. But a wise person, especially a Catholic, should never think they are wiser concerning a particular issue, than the Bishops speaking as a whole.

I do not think I am wiser than the bishops. I am asking what the bishops position is on the huge corporations and CEOs who are fueling the illegal immigration racket. That is different from saying the bishops are wrong about everything having to do with the undocumented worker issue. Don’t over-generalize my position.

With all the waste in our country, the huge corporations avoiding paying taxes, the CEO’s getting richer and the average worker struggling, the hideous practice of idolizing film, music, and sports figures and paying them tens of millions of dollars per year… with all this going on in our country, people still say the resident evil here in the U.S. is illegal immigrants?

My point exactly…why focus the reform around legalizing other wise illegal immigrants when the real problem lies in all the other issues which draw the illegals here in the first place? You and I seem to be in agreement about the root of the real problem.

Don’t kid yourself that we’ll have a great society if we just get rid of the illegals.

Never claimed we would. The only reason this is an issue is become the undocumented workers, in their numbers, have been rallied together to begin demanding rights and privileges they are not entitled to. They act as though we’ve taken away rights they used to have (as with the jews and others who were persecuted by Hitler). It is not the same at all because they broke the law to come here. We tolerated their stay and helped them attain comforts, and now they are crying foul when they get caught and have to face the consequences of their decision.

Let’s not forget that we’re not the only country with an influx of immigrants or refugees. Plenty of countries have the same problem, and it has to be looked at with compassion and intelligence. Not vigilante-ism.

I have no idea where you get the vigilante-ism. Being deported because the authorities catch up with you for breaking the law is not vigilante-ism. It’s justice.

 

[Verisimilitude]

I never said I was a “recent” convert.

The whole world can disagree with the Bishops and their position. The whole world usually does disagree with the Church in general. But a wise person, especially a Catholic, should never think they are wiser concerning a particular issue, than the Bishops speaking as a whole.

With 1 in 6 people on the planet Catholic, it isn’t correct to say the whole world disagrees with the Church.

With all the waste in our country, the huge corporations avoiding paying taxes, the CEO’s getting richer and the average worker struggling, the hideous practice of idolizing film, music, and sports figures and paying them tens of millions of dollars per year… with all this going on in our country, people still say the resident evil here in the U.S. is illegal immigrants?

Come on. Get real.

Maybe some think illegals themselves are the resident evil, but I didn’t see that in most of the posts here. The blatent disregard for the rule of law is the evil, and the perceived support for those who break the law was being debated.

Don’t kid yourself that we’ll have a great society if we just get rid of the illegals. Citizens will still disobey laws here.

Don’t kid yourself that legalizing 20 million people with an unknown % who have no intent to become or abide by US law one way or the other because they have shirked the law for so long.

Taxes will still go unpaid. Schools will still not receive the funding they need. Drivers will still drive over the speed limit and/or drunk. Teenagers will still try to sneak into bars or buy alcohol and cigarettes. Students will still cheat on tests. People will still default on student loans, credit card bills, hospital bills, and other debts. People will still claim bankruptcy or sue eachother unnecessarily. Domestic violence will still continue. Deadbeat dads will still avoid paying child support. Abortions will still be performed. Drugs will still be sold on the street. Pornography will still run rampant. Stripper clubs will still be in operation and underage girls will still dance there. Banks will still be robbed. Cars will still be jacked. Panhandlers will still beg on the streets. Animals will still be abused. Children will still be abused. The list goes on forever.

And without real border enforcment all of that will be compunded by millions who continue to break all of those laws and more.

Get real. Don’t be a vigilante unless you’re going to be vigilant against every offense and every perpetrator. Do not single people out, whether they are citizens or not. And especially do not accuse our Holy Mother Church of harboring criminals. The Church forgives, as we must. Even a murderer can be forgiven and allowed the opportunity to change his life.

Yes, let’s please all get real. Who said anything about being a vigilante? Don’t obey only the laws you like and disobey those you don’t. Being a citizen means something to me if not to you. Being a legal naturalized citizen means something to my wife, if not to you. I, my father, my brothers, and countless relatives did not serve in the military to have our laws be discarded by non-citizens because they find it easier to demand from US what they refuse to demand from their own country. Veterans who have died in the defense of our laws and nation deserve more honor than that.

Don’t confuse forgivness and compassion with just civil law. This is not a debate of whether or not the current law is just. Start a new thread if you want to have that discussion. On a plane in an emergency they tell you to put your own oxygen mask on before helping others- even your child. I’m sure you could guess why. When you let the forgiven murder live in your house instead of jail then you might have a right to say such a thing. I’m all for helping them change their life but not at the expense of my own or my family. These streets are not paved with gold. It is not heaven on earth. It’s hard even in America.

Let’s not forget that we’re not the only country with an influx of immigrants or refugees. Plenty of countries have the same problem, and it has to be looked at with compassion and intelligence. Not vigilante-ism.

Peace,
Meeshy

No, I do not forget, nor do I shut my eyes. France has a huge issue with immigrants as does the UK with many of the same claims of compassion. There are greater dangers than you may realize in their case as in ours if only our hearts lead when good sense is left behind.

 

[YinYangMom]

Regarding the New Sanctuary movement: show me where the USCCB has endorsed this.

This movement is an interfaith movement. A few Catholic parishes are involved, but I have found nothing to indicate that it is sanctioned by the USCCB as a whole.

If you want to say something is condoned by the Church, you have to provide the proof.

Peace,
Meeshy

With the USCCB’s official position clearly stated as you pointed out via the website of the organization they founded to deal with the matter I think you’ll find enough evidence in that website to show that the few Catholic parishes involved in the New Sanctuary Movement probably believe they are following the lead of the USCCB.

That basically was my question in the New Sanctuary Movement thread - how could these Catholic parishes sign on with this movement? Where are the bishops on this announcement? Do they know about it? If so do they approve or will they issue a statement distancing the Catholic church from the ‘rogue’ parishes? Will there be ramifications for the Catholic parishes?

As the article stands now it gives off the impression the Catholic church is behind the movement. If She is not then those parishes are bringing scandal to the Church by participating.

 

[meeshy]

Some people don’t read posts very clearly, nor websites. Some people don’t get the point of analogies. Some don’t see the real reason why thousands of human beings are demonstrating in our streets.

The whole point of everything, OBVIOUSLY, is to change the law, not to excuse those who broke it.

Now guess what, as of today the government has a proposal. Hopefully it will go into effect by the end of the summer, like the president wants. And all the whining about illegals must then cease.

I cannot and will not debate points with people who didn’t understand my position from the beginning, nor the USCCB’s position. Y’all can debate it with the president now, because he’s going to sign it into law soon.

It IS vigilante-ism when you stay on top of a particular group and demand accountability for their actions. My rebuttal to this is another obvious point that some seem to have missed: are you holding everyone in the U.S. accountable for their offenses? Are you staying on them? Complaining in forums? Writing letters to editors and Senators? If not, then you indeed have singled out one particular group and indeed you are vigilantes.

Another obvious point, when I say the whole world opposes the Church it OBVIOUSLY means the whole non-Catholic world. I don’t think I need to explain trivialities like that. It just muddies the posts, which I think might actually be what some people want.

As far as my comment about the Church during WWII, which again was obviously not understood, I’ll simplify it for you:
A government can make laws, but it doesn’t mean the laws are just. The Church upholds a higher justice, and will do all she can to help those who are victimized by unjust laws. She did it in Nazi-occupied Europe, and she’s doing it here in the good ole U.S. of A.

Some of this stuff is so basic I find it very tedious to go over it again and again.

Let the visas flow freely now… and let us forgive our brothers who have trespassed against us. Let freedom ring, long live the Church, and ¡viva la raza!

Peace Out.
Meeshy

 

[Verisimilitude]

Some people don’t read posts very clearly, nor websites. Some people don’t get the point of analogies. Some don’t see the real reason why thousands of human beings are demonstrating in our streets.

Some people don’t like the hard questions. Your real reason is disputed as valid. Poverty is not a crime, but other things are.

The whole point of everything, OBVIOUSLY, is to change the law, not to excuse those who broke it.

You ignore the law is broken because it does not fit you sentimentality.

Now guess what, as of today the government has a proposal. Hopefully it will go into effect by the end of the summer, like the president wants. And all the whining about illegals must then cease.

It has yet to pass the House. Whining? That’s out of line.

I cannot and will not debate points with people who didn’t understand my position from the beginning, nor the USCCB’s position. Y’all can debate it with the president now, because he’s going to sign it into law soon.

Your position is clear- amnesty.

It IS vigilante-ism when you stay on top of a particular group and demand accountability for their actions.

What do you have against holding someone accountable for their actions?

My rebuttal to this is another obvious point that some seem to have missed: are you holding everyone in the U.S. accountable for their offenses? Are you staying on them? Complaining in forums? Writing letters to editors and Senators?

Yes. You clearly do not.

If not, then you indeed have singled out one particular group and indeed you are vigilantes.

Are you talking about Mexicans only or all illegal immigrants?

Another obvious point, when I say the whole world opposes the Church it OBVIOUSLY means the whole non-Catholic world. I don’t think I need to explain trivialities like that. It just muddies the posts, which I think might actually be what some people want.

The law is obvious as well, and you don’t seem to understand that 800 lb gorilla.

As far as my comment about the Church during WWII, which again was obviously not understood, I’ll simplify it for you:
A government can make laws, but it doesn’t mean the laws are just. The Church upholds a higher justice, and will do all she can to help those who are victimized by unjust laws. She did it in Nazi-occupied Europe, and she’s doing it here in the good ole U.S. of A.

Give unto Caesar… Who are you to decide what is unjust law?

Some of this stuff is so basic I find it very tedious to go over it again and again.

Becasue you don’t have a great deal of comprehension seemingly.

Let the visas flow freely now… and let us forgive our brothers who have trespassed against us. Let freedom ring, long live the Church, and ¡viva la raza!

Peace Out.
Meeshy

Yes, your position is very clear. How does hypocrite sound?

 

[YinYangMom]

The whole point of everything, OBVIOUSLY, is to change the law, not to excuse those who broke it.

When they put in the packet a means by which those already here will be granted full civil rights they most certainly do attempt to excuse those who broke the law to secure a life here.

It IS vigilante-ism when you stay on top of a particular group and demand accountability for their actions. My rebuttal to this is another obvious point that some seem to have missed: are you holding everyone in the U.S. accountable for their offenses? Are you staying on them? Complaining in forums? Writing letters to editors and Senators? If not, then you indeed have singled out one particular group and indeed you are vigilantes.

I don’t know where you’ve been but there have been uproars over the unjust abortion laws, against euthanasia, embryonic stem cell research, against the Enron people, even against the war in Iraq and our administration.

As far as my comment about the Church during WWII, which again was obviously not understood, I’ll simplify it for you:
A government can make laws, but it doesn’t mean the laws are just. The Church upholds a higher justice, and will do all she can to help those who are victimized by unjust laws. She did it in Nazi-occupied Europe, and she’s doing it here in the good ole U.S. of A.

I let it slide the first time, but now, I’m truly offended by your statement. I’ve been blessed to know survivors of the holocaust and they, too, would be offended by you comparing the plight of the undocumented worker to theirs. I believe the USCCB would be insulted as well. I can assure you they would not hold to this position of yours.

A government invaded and occupied their nation. They were full citizens of that nation prior to that. The invading government then cast them out of their homeland, stripped them not only of civil rights but human ones as well.

When the authorities catch up with the undocumented worker they do not strip them of their clothes, shave their heads, round them up into cattle cars, submit them to medical experiments, beat, rape, or kill them. They send them home with clothes, money, food and their dignity. There is no comparison to the way they are treated while they are accumulating their assets here (home, children, cars, investments) or while justice is being served.

This is our nation. The undocumented workers have come into our homeland and are rallying to change our laws to accommodate their demands to make our nation more like home for them.

They do this here because they can. If they attempt to rally at home they and their leaders would be killed, I know this. But that does not excuse them from abandoning the plight of their people, or make it right for them to change us as a nation.

I come from a border town and I have seen how the local governments there have now become extensions of Mexico’s government - including the corruption. This is not good for our country and it certainly does not help the people of Mexico who cannot pay the thousands of dollars a head to leave their homeland for a better life. The honorable thing to do is to remain at home and fight for human rights there. They’ve now tasted the power of a united front through these rallies, let them take that energy and apply it at home where it could do the most good - for their relatives and future generations.

 

[meeshy]

Wow.

Like I said, and will say again: some people don’t read very well, nor understand analogies.

I’m not going to debate this anymore. I have said over and over that my only position is the position of the USCCB.

Whether you agree with the USCCB or not in the end is your problem, not mine.

And although I find the diatribe about our Bishops, Holy Mother Church, and me really distasteful, it’s easy to ignore because I know the truth about the Church’s position and about mine.

Peace,
Meeshy

 

[meeshy]

P.S. Please read the history of the Nazi regime. They were voted into office in Germany; obviously you don’t realize this. Thus you might better be able to understand what I wrote about the Church during World War II.

Once again, here it is:

The Church, during World War II, protected many Jews, Catholics, gays, teachers, anti-Nazis, and more. She offered her protection because she saw the injustice of the laws and the events which were current at that time. She offered her protection because the Church upholds a higher system of justice than man-made or man-enforced law.

In all ages, in all circumstances, whether during the horrors of war or during other times of human conflict, the Church will always be there, protecting those who have been afflicted by unjust law.

Now, if you still do not understand my statements, I’m sorry, because I’m not going to explain it further.

Peace,
Meeshy

 

[Verisimilitude]

Now, if you still do not understand my statements, I’m sorry, because I’m not going to explain it further.

Peace,
Meeshy

http://www.badnissaninfiniticars.com/no_head_in_sand_150t.gif

 

[Ituyu]

Ignored it, no. I dismissed it as junk.

Your source site is a hack. ratical.org/

 

[PauloFreire2]

The Sanctuary Movement is anti-American. It’s forcing American Catholics to choose between their faith or their country. I can’t support it. I am against the take-over of my country by any nation, or community of nations.