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dorand76
Guest
My Prophet?
Buddy I dont know if u got it yet or not… but I dont have no prophets, the idea that I said we all come from apes should give you the spark that this guy maybe believes in evolution… That said ur answer says everything. Why dont I reply to the accusations of the Prophet. Because I dont like accusations.I dont like ppl accusing other ppl faiths. I am not accusing anybody of anything. And why I am keep repeating the same thing? Because I am trying to make a point here but since you are too busy formulating accusations you missing my point that is better to give the accusations a rest and for a chance start respecting ppl. I can fully say that it is ppl like u (because u r informed and fully know what you are talking about) so ppl like u and these muslim extremists that have cause all this mess. Please read my conversation with InJesus. That will give you and Idea of how this discussion should go about.
Buddy I dont know if u got it yet or not… but I dont have no prophets, the idea that I said we all come from apes should give you the spark that this guy maybe believes in evolution… That said ur answer says everything. Why dont I reply to the accusations of the Prophet. Because I dont like accusations.I dont like ppl accusing other ppl faiths. I am not accusing anybody of anything. And why I am keep repeating the same thing? Because I am trying to make a point here but since you are too busy formulating accusations you missing my point that is better to give the accusations a rest and for a chance start respecting ppl. I can fully say that it is ppl like u (because u r informed and fully know what you are talking about) so ppl like u and these muslim extremists that have cause all this mess. Please read my conversation with InJesus. That will give you and Idea of how this discussion should go about.
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inJESUS
Guest
Dorand, what is your understanding of success in order to compare between Jesus and Muhammad?
Jesus ministered for 3 years or so (very short period), fed thousands, healed many,raised the dead, taught about the Father, without a drop of blood, without a single war,without raiding caravans, without taking sexual slaves, without asking people for forced submission or else, without killing some of those who mocked Him, and His disciples followed His footsteps, doing miracles, healing, without a single battle, without raiding people but simply by preaching.
None of which applies to Muhammad.
On what basis do you compare the ministry of both?
Jesus ministered for 3 years or so (very short period), fed thousands, healed many,raised the dead, taught about the Father, without a drop of blood, without a single war,without raiding caravans, without taking sexual slaves, without asking people for forced submission or else, without killing some of those who mocked Him, and His disciples followed His footsteps, doing miracles, healing, without a single battle, without raiding people but simply by preaching.
None of which applies to Muhammad.
On what basis do you compare the ministry of both?
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dorand76
Guest
InJesus Hi, as you well know the purpose of my discussion is not to compare anyone with anyone. You believe in Jesus The muslims believe in Mohammed. To an outsider like myself Jesus fed thousands ,Mohammed fed thousands Jesus started a religion that took off 300 years after his death and resurection Mohammed started a religion that within 20 years reached further that anybody did in 20 years. Jesus preached a lot of good things We cant deny that Mohammed preached a lot of good things. Jesus got attacked and Died on the Cross for our sins as you would say…Mohammed got attacked, fought back and won the war. Please understand that the comparison is made just to keep it balaced here. As you well know I hope I am trying to understand something but the matter has come to the point that everyone is deffending their own views . This is a forum and in no way shape or form I am trying to have a discussion about it ,and I am at work too,lol, so I hope you not taking offense to what I am saying. If I did offend you I deeply apopologize and say SORRY. No harm intendet. To just say though that Mohammed started killing ppl just beacause he felt so that is distorting the facts. You got to understand that he was in a war and that the ppl that he killed tryed to kill him is that right? But anyhow I have read all this about Mohammed and believe me I have read the bible more than 4-5 times ILIKE TO READ THE FACTS BEFORE I DECIEDE ANYTHING WITH MY LIFE. I like to be informed properly. Let’s hope I will get the right info from you guys about you.And I can see that I am comming of as a Mohammed deffender but that is not the purpose belive me.
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inJESUS
Guest
InJesus Hi,
Hi
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rpp
Guest
You have been corrected on this several times already. That means you know that it is false.
What is is called when someone knowingly makes a false statement? In addition, such behavior, is highly offensive.
Your profile says “undecided”. It seems to me that you are really bashing Jesus Christ and all of Christianity. You keep asking for respect, but you are not giving any.
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Charlie_Zeaiter
Guest
You know, some people believe that Jesus rose from the dead and now sits on the right hand side of the Father, and are waiting patiently for Him to come again. But I can accept that this contradicts the Islamic faith.
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dorand76
Guest
Ok buddy u keep insisting so let’s do this
how did Muhammad feed thousands?
He did feed his ppl didn’t he. They must have been eating. lol. As far as the Jesus story of feeding thousends with fish and bread I do agree with you on every aspect if that is what u believe I agree with u 100%. As I said if u found peace on that I respect that and I really mean that. Me personally I dont take those stories literaly but that is just me. I try to take the meaning out of the story not the actual story but as I said JUST MY THINKING.
300 hundred??? Christianity started as soon as He asked His followers to go preach the good news (read Acts). Christanity started in the first century, right after He left the earth. The apostles established different churches in different countries without bloodshed, without subduing others, without taking slaves. By the year 300, God knows how many churches there was and how many Church Father wrote and how many Christians there were!Where do you get your history from?
Ok InJesus the best christian theologists have addmitted that if it wasn’t for the Constantine the Christendom would have been a local Legend or it would have taken much much much much longer for the massage to be spread and with the comming of Mohammed only 300 years after Constantine the christendom would have probably been desolved. Let’s keep in mind that the strongest areas of christianity where In Constant(name removed by moderator)ole and Constantinopole turned muslim in Mohammed’s time That is why Constatine’s Mother is still a saint today. So do not take the Constatine effect out. It is very very important.Even Jesus would be mad at you.
the first 10 years he had no bulk of followers except some family and relatives as far as i know …after that he reached wherever he reached by including wars and raidings and taking slaves and establishing sharia and subduing others and making treaties. Where is the comparison and what exactly did he reach?
In the first 10 years yes but after they tryed to kill him and ploted against his life he fought back and in the next 10 years we all know what he did. And the killing part Moses killed and he still is a prophet right? Just a comparison there
and Jesus had people who wanted to kill him but He did not start wars, neither did His disciples…they all died killed because of what they preached. Where is exactly the success you are talking about? being at war and killing your ennemies is more successful than living in peace DESPITE what the ennemies what? what is more successful, peace or war? who is more successful, a person whose religion was spread by no drop of blood or someone who himelf killed and had his followrs kill after him? both had ennemies and both reacted in the opposite way…just to understand how you assess things.
And the point that you guys not getting is that I agree with you and every view you guys have about Jesus. If that is what you believe it is only fair to respect that. The success that I am talkind about is that still to the present day a lot of ppl follow him. And as far as a religion spread without a drop of blood LOL In Europe in the middle ages more ppl died cause of Chatholicism than died from the plague. The Crussaders did a lot of killing too right? Remember that the greatest scientists where sent to the fire from the pope right? I am from Europe I went to school for that. Vatican in Europe is not as strong as it is here because we know what they have done.Just because we live in the present we dont have to forget the past. Lol Now u know how I think, but let me make sure u understand 1 more time.
I AM NOT AGAINST JESUS I AM NOT AGAINST MOHAMMED I AM JUST AGAINST PPL THAT THINK “MY WAY IS RIGHT AND UR WAY IS WRONG” AS I SAID WE ALL DIRT AND PRETTY SOON WE GOING TO TURN TO OUR ORIGINE D I R T.
God have mercy on us.
how did Muhammad feed thousands?
He did feed his ppl didn’t he. They must have been eating. lol. As far as the Jesus story of feeding thousends with fish and bread I do agree with you on every aspect if that is what u believe I agree with u 100%. As I said if u found peace on that I respect that and I really mean that. Me personally I dont take those stories literaly but that is just me. I try to take the meaning out of the story not the actual story but as I said JUST MY THINKING.
300 hundred??? Christianity started as soon as He asked His followers to go preach the good news (read Acts). Christanity started in the first century, right after He left the earth. The apostles established different churches in different countries without bloodshed, without subduing others, without taking slaves. By the year 300, God knows how many churches there was and how many Church Father wrote and how many Christians there were!Where do you get your history from?
Ok InJesus the best christian theologists have addmitted that if it wasn’t for the Constantine the Christendom would have been a local Legend or it would have taken much much much much longer for the massage to be spread and with the comming of Mohammed only 300 years after Constantine the christendom would have probably been desolved. Let’s keep in mind that the strongest areas of christianity where In Constant(name removed by moderator)ole and Constantinopole turned muslim in Mohammed’s time That is why Constatine’s Mother is still a saint today. So do not take the Constatine effect out. It is very very important.Even Jesus would be mad at you.
the first 10 years he had no bulk of followers except some family and relatives as far as i know …after that he reached wherever he reached by including wars and raidings and taking slaves and establishing sharia and subduing others and making treaties. Where is the comparison and what exactly did he reach?
In the first 10 years yes but after they tryed to kill him and ploted against his life he fought back and in the next 10 years we all know what he did. And the killing part Moses killed and he still is a prophet right? Just a comparison there
and Jesus had people who wanted to kill him but He did not start wars, neither did His disciples…they all died killed because of what they preached. Where is exactly the success you are talking about? being at war and killing your ennemies is more successful than living in peace DESPITE what the ennemies what? what is more successful, peace or war? who is more successful, a person whose religion was spread by no drop of blood or someone who himelf killed and had his followrs kill after him? both had ennemies and both reacted in the opposite way…just to understand how you assess things.
And the point that you guys not getting is that I agree with you and every view you guys have about Jesus. If that is what you believe it is only fair to respect that. The success that I am talkind about is that still to the present day a lot of ppl follow him. And as far as a religion spread without a drop of blood LOL In Europe in the middle ages more ppl died cause of Chatholicism than died from the plague. The Crussaders did a lot of killing too right? Remember that the greatest scientists where sent to the fire from the pope right? I am from Europe I went to school for that. Vatican in Europe is not as strong as it is here because we know what they have done.Just because we live in the present we dont have to forget the past. Lol Now u know how I think, but let me make sure u understand 1 more time.
I AM NOT AGAINST JESUS I AM NOT AGAINST MOHAMMED I AM JUST AGAINST PPL THAT THINK “MY WAY IS RIGHT AND UR WAY IS WRONG” AS I SAID WE ALL DIRT AND PRETTY SOON WE GOING TO TURN TO OUR ORIGINE D I R T.
God have mercy on us.
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Charlie_Zeaiter
Guest
Really? I always thought you were muslim. I’ll have to read your posts in a different light from now on.
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rpp
Guest
You can say that, but that is exactly what you are doing. Don’t believe me? Read the rest of your post.
You believe in Jesus The muslims believe in Mohammed.
So what?
Jesus fed thousands using miracles. Mohamed fed no one.
Documented miracles by Jesus: 34.
Alleged miracles by Mohamed: 0.
You have been corrected on this several times already. That means you know that it is false.
What is is called when someone knowingly makes a false statement?
I suppose from a certain point of view, Christ teaching us to love our enemies is comparable with Mohamed teaching to kill his enemies. Though I myself do not see these as morally equivalent.
Christ was never attacked. He was arrested and did not attempt to defend Himself and forbade other to defend Him.
Mohamed first organized raiding parties to attack caravans, then organized armies to lay siege to cities. Mohamed started wars, he was the aggressor. Later, in an attempt to defend themselves from his growing empire, City-states attacked Mohamed. Unfortunately they mostly lost.
Wait! I’m confused. What did you say in your first “sentence”?
Oh, yeah.
For someone who seeks understanding, you do not seem to be doing any listening. You have been repeatedly corrected on your erroneous history, yet you keep repeating this. This is not what I call “trying to understand”. I was always taught that requires listening.
It is a distortion to claim Mohamed did not kill. His wars were were the key to the spread of Islam.
Admirable. Did you use any study guides, or did you just try to figure it out on your own without proper context and background information? That can be difficult for best people.
If you are sincere then I think the first step would be to stop comparing a man who started wars and married a 9 year old girl to someone who taught people to love their enemies. This is highly offensive, especially when his modern day followers punish women for being rape victims. All in the name of Mohamed.
Next, you need to *humbly *reassess your knowledge and understanding of history, since that appears important to you. Christianity was not some underground cult for 300 years. Within those first 300 years it had spread through all of the Roman empire, despite persecutions, and had millions of adherents.
Finally, stop making statements and start listening. With humility. Realize that you, just like me, do not know everything and that much of what you may have learned is factually incorrect. I myself had many misconceptions about historical Christianity. It is only through years of study, with the willingness to be convinced, that I corrected those misconceptions.
You are probably correct. The statements you made would not be offensive if they were posted on an Islamic forum. But this is mostly Catholic here.
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dorand76
Guest
Thank you finally someone is trying to understands what’s going on here Once u take that view out of your image you will find out that what i say is totally different than what u may have understood please tell me if u see the difference now
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Charlie_Zeaiter
Guest
Well, since you brought up Moses - I wonder if you ever researched the parallels between the Jewish Passover festival and the Crucifixion?
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dorand76
Guest
You are probably correct. The statements you made would not be offensive if they were posted on an Islamic forum. But this is mostly Catholic here.
Buddy if my views are not welcomed just say so I would unsubscribe right away. My family is roman catholic but me as i have said when i registered i am undeciededand u know why? Just cause ppl like u. I got in this forum to learn but to tell the truth all I am getting is hostality. And I dont know how manny time i have to repeat it I AM NOT A MYSLIM. I JUST READ A LOT AND AM FASCINATED WITH HISTORY. I am not a muslim but now I can see what they go through in middst of ppl like u. And you tell me u believe in Jesus. Lol. Riiiiight Jesus welcomed Mary Magdalena ur not welcoming somebody with a different view? Sorry. As I said if i offended anybody please tell me so I can unsubscribe.
Buddy if my views are not welcomed just say so I would unsubscribe right away. My family is roman catholic but me as i have said when i registered i am undeciededand u know why? Just cause ppl like u. I got in this forum to learn but to tell the truth all I am getting is hostality. And I dont know how manny time i have to repeat it I AM NOT A MYSLIM. I JUST READ A LOT AND AM FASCINATED WITH HISTORY. I am not a muslim but now I can see what they go through in middst of ppl like u. And you tell me u believe in Jesus. Lol. Riiiiight Jesus welcomed Mary Magdalena ur not welcoming somebody with a different view? Sorry. As I said if i offended anybody please tell me so I can unsubscribe.
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dorand76
Guest
No charlie but I will do that as soon as I can,and will reply you with my thoughts.
Thanx
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rpp
Guest
First, I am not your buddy as I do not know who you are. Why are you using that term of endearment? Are you confusing me with someone you know?
You seem to take correction as an insult. That was not what I meant by trying to learn with a spirit of humility. A humble spirit will accept correction in the spirit it was given. In my case, I was attempting a civil discussion.
You have certainly misunderstood me. From your very first post which I responded to on this thread, you said were not “Myslim” and I presumed you meant “Muslim”. I never suggested you were. Saying your posts would not offensive to Muslims is not calling you Muslim.
I noticed that your writing style is very similar to another poster here. Your post on the same subject too. Not quite sure what to make of that.
As for welcoming, when you introduce yourself by insulting Jesus Christ, you should expect to rub people the wrong way.
And to respond to your final sentence, yes, you have and continue to offend people here. But no one is suggesting that you unsubscribe. Rather, stay and learn with the spirit of humility.
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dorand76
Guest
Lol,
U Sir are trying to put words in my mouth.
As for welcoming, when you introduce yourself by insulting Jesus Christ, you should expect to rub people the wrong way.
This is what you said. In all of my threads read them carefully if I have mention anything against Jesus Christ other than the facts than you right. I have said over and over again I respect ur belief in Jesus. But as usual your way of interpreting things either your way or now way at all seems to take over from time to time.
I have said that over and over again I do not intend to offend anybody but … I understand your point of view now. U think the world is out to get you because for sure u mistake me with somebody else that probably u had the same discussion. Lol. And no I would not use the buddy term with you again because Yes you are right u are not my friend. And by the way u need to chill Sir it’s all good. The world would still spin tomorrow. I may go to hell but the world is still going to spin.
U Sir are trying to put words in my mouth.
As for welcoming, when you introduce yourself by insulting Jesus Christ, you should expect to rub people the wrong way.
This is what you said. In all of my threads read them carefully if I have mention anything against Jesus Christ other than the facts than you right. I have said over and over again I respect ur belief in Jesus. But as usual your way of interpreting things either your way or now way at all seems to take over from time to time.
I have said that over and over again I do not intend to offend anybody but … I understand your point of view now. U think the world is out to get you because for sure u mistake me with somebody else that probably u had the same discussion. Lol. And no I would not use the buddy term with you again because Yes you are right u are not my friend. And by the way u need to chill Sir it’s all good. The world would still spin tomorrow. I may go to hell but the world is still going to spin.
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thistle
Guest
Check up on mohammad. He was a killer and forced people to convert or be killed. He also had sex with a 9 year old. Even Muslims don’t dispute these things. They simply pass it off as the culture then.
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planten
Guest
I don’t know thistle is a catholic or protestant. But my apology to the Catholics, there is some news that Mary gave birth to Jesus at the age of 12. Is that right and should we discuss such things here?? What thistle has posted is some derived meanings and not true at all.
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rpp
Guest
The age of Mary at the time of Christ’s birth is not known with certainty. However the generally accepted range is 15-16. A few say as young as 14. No serious scholar suggests 12. Secondly, the conception and birth of Jesus were miraculous and Mary remained a perpetual virgin even after Christ’s birth.
Mohamed did murder and have people murdered. And he did marry a girl at the age of 6 and consummated the marriage while she was still prepubescent at the age of 9. these are both well documented and not disputed. There are a number of posts on this thread documenting these facts.
So Thistle’s phrase, “murdering pedophile” is not inaccurate.
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planten
Guest
Sorry, we know that Mary left the temple as soon as (or even before) her menses started. That was perhaps when she was about ten years old. Joseph took her away with him. She lived with Joseph all her life and they both used to close their door upon public eyes every night. That means they were living as husband and wife.
I wanted to know whether these things should be discussed here?? We have proof from our books that joseph and Mary lived like husband and wife behind closed doors all the time. Why??
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