Immortal Soul

[Martlut]

THE CATHLIC CHURCH
Teachers the immortality of the soul, and it also teachers that when, you die, you go to heaven or the flames of hell, or purgatory,
Re:1:4: John to the seven churches which are in Asia: Grace be unto you, and peace, from him which is, and which was, and which is to come; and from the seven Spirits which are before his throne; no mention of Rome, 7 CHURCHS 7 SPIRITS,
The apostle John who wrote many books of the bible, and the book of revelations lived In Asia mina and out lived peter, and paul ,appointed a bishop there, named Polycarp. Who was a disciple of John, and was martyred when he was old,
Polycarp taught that the body and soul were to be resurrected, hence he taught against the immortality of the soul doctrine: I bless you for because you have considered me worthy of this day and hour, that I might receive a place among the number of martyrs in the cup of your Christ, to the resurrection to eternal life, both of soul and of body, in the incorruptibility of the Holy Spirit,
One leader of influence was the Justin Martyr
. Notice that he wrote: For I choose to follow not men or men’s doctrines, but God and the doctrines [delivered] by Him. For if you have fallen in with some who are called Christians, but who do not admit this [truth], and venture to blaspheme the God of Abraham, and the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob; who say there is no resurrection of the dead, and that their souls, when they die, are taken to heaven; do not imagine that they are Christians…But I and others, who are right-minded Christians on all points, are assured that there will be a resurrection of the dead

My question is, is Polycarp teaching that the soul and body are resurrected, and he said that they sleep, he dos not believe in the immortality of the soul, and he was Johns disciple
And Justin Martyr goes as far as saying that their souls, when they die, are taken to heaven; do not imagine that they are Christians,
And is you read what I sent you, their seams to be a contradiction
In what is believed today.

Why do Catholics belive in the immortality of the soul now?

 

[Verbum]

Hi Martlut,

Polycarp taught that the body and soul were to be resurrected, hence he taught against the immortality of the soul doctrine:

Polycarp, like the whole church taught that we would resurrect with our body and soul. This does not mean that the soul was dead and would be brought to life. The soul is a pure spirit. It cannot die.

This is the Church’s belief as stated in the Catechism of the Catholic Church :

997 What is “rising”? In death, the separation of the soul from the body, the human body decays and the soul goes to meet God, while awaiting its reunion with its glorified body. God, in his almighty power, will definitively grant incorruptible life to our bodies by reuniting them with our souls, through the power of Jesus’ Resurrection.

Verbum

 

[Nita]

Polycarp taught that the body and soul were to be resurrected, hence he taught against the immortality of the soul doctrine: I bless you for because you have considered me worthy of this day and hour, that I might receive a place among the number of martyrs in the cup of your Christ, to the resurrection to eternal life, both of soul and of body, in the incorruptibility of the Holy Spirit,

Your post is a reference to his prayer at his martyrdom (presumably heard and written down by a witness).
O Lord God Almighty, the Father of your beloved and blessed Son Jesus Christ, by whom we have received the knowledge of You, the God of angels and powers, and of every creature, and of the whole race of the righteous who live before you, I give You thanks that You have counted me, worthy of this day and this hour, that I should have a part in the number of Your martyrs, in the cup of your Christ,** to the resurrection of eternal life, both of soul and body, through the incorruption [imparted] by the Holy Ghost**. Among whom may I be accepted this day before You as a fat and acceptable sacrifice, according as You, the ever-truthful God, have foreordained, have revealed beforehand to me, and now have fulfilled. Wherefore also I praise You for all things, I bless You, I glorify You, along with the everlasting and heavenly Jesus Christ, Your beloved Son, with whom, to You, and the Holy Ghost, be glory both now and to all coming ages. Amen.

newadvent.org/fathers/0102.htm

I do not see his words as teaching against the “immortality of the soul”. In speaking of the “resurrection of eternal life”, the final resurrection, he merely notes that both body and soul will be present and experiencing it.

In his epistle to the Philipians, Polycarp writes:I exhort you all, therefore, to yield obedience to the word of righteousness, and to exercise all patience, such as you have seen [set] before your eyes, not only in the case of the blessed Ignatius, and Zosimus, and Rufus, but also in others among yourselves, and in Paul himself, and the rest of the apostles. [This do] in the assurance that all these have not run Philippians 2:16; Galatians 2:2 in vain, but in faith and righteousness,** and that they are [now] in their due place in the presence of the Lord, **with whom also they suffered. For they loved not this present world, but Him who died for us, and for our sakes was raised again by God from the dead.

newadvent.org/fathers/0136.htm

 

[Nita]

One leader of influence was the Justin Martyr
. Notice that he wrote: For I choose to follow not men or men’s doctrines, but God and the doctrines [delivered] by Him. For if you have fallen in with some who are called Christians, but who do not admit this [truth], and venture to blaspheme the God of Abraham, and the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob; who say there is no resurrection of the dead, and that their souls, when they die, are taken to heaven; do not imagine that they are Christians…But I and others, who are right-minded Christians on all points, are assured that there will be a resurrection of the dead

…And Justin Martyr goes as far as saying that their souls, when they die, are taken to heaven; do not imagine that they are Christians,
…

Which writing of Justin Martyr are you quoting? Also, if possible, could you reference where it appears in the particular writing. I would like to read the whole section to get a full and proper context. Thanks in advance.

 

[Nita]

By the way, here is a quote from Justin Martyr’s* First Apology* which certainly indicates that he did believe in the immortality of the soul.
newadvent.org/fathers/0126.htm
Chapter 18. Proof of immortality and the resurrection
For reflect upon the end of each of the preceding kings, how they died the death common to all, which, if it issued in insensibility, would be a godsend to all the wicked. But since sensation remains to all who have ever lived, and eternal punishment is laid up (i.e., for the wicked), see that you neglect not to be convinced, and to hold as your belief, that these things are true. For let even necromancy, and the divinations you practise by immaculate children, and the evoking of departed human souls, and those who are called among the magi, Dream-senders and Assistant-spirits (Familiars), and all that is done by those who are skilled in such matters — let these persuade you that even after death souls are in a state of sensation; and those who are seized and cast about by the spirits of the dead, whom all call dæmoniacs or madmen; and what you repute as oracles, both of Amphilochus, Dodana, Pytho, and as many other such as exist; and the opinions of your authors, Empedocles and Pythagoras, Plato and Socrates, and the pit of Homer, and the descent of Ulysses to inspect these things, and all that has been uttered of a like kind. Such favour as you grant to these, grant also to us, who not less but more firmly than they believe in God; since we expect to receive again our own bodies, though they be dead and cast into the earth, for we maintain that with God nothing is impossible.

 

[steve_b]

THE CATHLIC CHURCH
Teachers the immortality of the soul, and it also teachers that when, you die, you go to heaven or the flames of hell, or purgatory,
Re:1:4: John to the seven churches which are in Asia: Grace be unto you, and peace, from him which is, and which was, and which is to come; and from the seven Spirits which are before his throne; no mention of Rome, 7 CHURCHS 7 SPIRITS,

Why would Rome be mentioned? Rome isn’t in Asia.
m:

The apostle John who wrote many books of the bible, and the book of revelations lived In Asia mina and out lived peter, and paul ,appointed a bishop there, named Polycarp.

true
m:

Who was a disciple of John, and was martyred when he was old,
Polycarp taught that the body and soul were to be resurrected, hence he taught against the immortality of the soul doctrine:

this is what he said

Chapter 14. The prayer of Polycarp

[snip]

You have counted me, worthy of this day and this hour, that I should have a part in the number of Your martyrs, in the cup of your Christ, to the resurrection of eternal life, both of soul and body, through the incorruption [imparted] by the Holy Ghost.

[snip]

newadvent.org/fathers/0102.htm

He is NOT denying the immortality of the soul
m:

One leader of influence was the Justin Martyr
. Notice that he wrote: For I choose to follow not men or men’s doctrines, but God and the doctrines [delivered] by Him. For if you have fallen in with some who are called Christians, but who do not admit this [truth], and venture to blaspheme the God of Abraham, and the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob; who say there is no resurrection of the dead, and that their souls, when they die, are taken to heaven; do not imagine that they are Christians…But I and others, who are right-minded Christians on all points, are assured that there will be a resurrection of the dead

The body dies not the soul. The soul in this case he mentions, goes on to heaven. At the final judgement the resurrected body and soul are reunited
m:

My question is, is Polycarp teaching that the soul and body are resurrected, and he said that they sleep, he dos not believe in the immortality of the soul, and he was Johns disciple

The body dies and goes to dust. The soul does NOT sleep, and it does not die. At the death of the body the soul is immediately judged. It either goes to heaven purgatory or hell. At the final judgement, when the world comes to an end, the souls of the dead, are reunited with thewir bodies. If the soul was in heaven, body and soul return to heaven. If the soul was in hell, body and soul return to hell.
m:

And Justin Martyr goes as far as saying that their souls, when they die, are taken to heaven; do not imagine that they are Christians,

You read it wrong. Go back and read it again.
scroll to #80 to Trypho
newadvent.org/fathers/01286.htm
m:

Why do Catholics belive in the immortality of the soul now?

The Catholic Church has always believed in the immortality of the soul.

 

[kelvinf]

Why would Rome be mentioned? Rome isn’t in Asia.

true

this is what he said

Chapter 14. The prayer of Polycarp

[snip]

You have counted me, worthy of this day and this hour, that I should have a part in the number of Your martyrs, in the cup of your Christ, to the resurrection of eternal life, both of soul and body, through the incorruption [imparted] by the Holy Ghost.

[snip]

newadvent.org/fathers/0102.htm

He is NOT denying the immortality of the soul

The body dies not the soul. The soul in this case he mentions, goes on to heaven. At the final judgement the resurrected body and soul are reunited

The body dies and goes to dust. The soul does NOT sleep, and it does not die. At the death of the body the soul is immediately judged. It either goes to heaven purgatory or hell. At the final judgement, when the world comes to an end, the souls of the dead, are reunited with thewir bodies. If the soul was in heaven, body and soul return to heaven. If the soul was in hell, body and soul return to hell.

You read it wrong. Go back and read it again.
scroll to #80 to Trypho
newadvent.org/fathers/01286.htm

The Catholic Church has always believed in the immortality of the soul.

How do you know that the soul is immediately judged when the body dies? I can’t relate that to the final judgement. So the final judgement is more or less a second judgement (judgement of dead bodies)?