Impossible situation

[seagal]

If you think your Mom is “at risk” then someone should step in and help her. If your sister is “assigned” to this role, even unofficially, and is not capable of ensuring your Mom’s basic needs ex. bathing, nutrition, healthcare needs, clean house, etc, then I would say that she is “negligent” and the situation should be reported to elder services. My 2 cents. I don’t know if you can make your call to elder services anonymously or not. You’d have to ask them.
It is difficult to get people to do the right thing when they have poor judgement or insight. Even if you were to call 911 to get them to the hospital, they can still refuse to go with the paramedics. It is a tough situation but don’t just neglect your mother if you feel she is in a bad situation. We’re supposed to show mercy, which means treating people well even when they don’t deserve it. It seems that she will be mad at you either way, whether you help out or not. I’m sorry for your trouble. Prayers offered.

I don’t know what it’s like in the states but here in Canada, when adult protective services are called it’s like CFS – they have to investigate. That might be the best thing for your mom.

 

[1990Domer]

I don’t know what it’s like in the states but here in Canada, when adult protective services are called it’s like CFS – they have to investigate. That might be the best thing for your mom.

Honestly, that may be the most selfless thing to do!

 

[mommy_k]

Thank you for your kind words 1990Domer. It is a great comfort to know that you have survived a similar experience. Over the years we have distanced ourselves-- once my dad passed, mom also got out of hand. She would never say abusive things to me in his presence, but once he died, she turned it up.

Polki-- my mom has no proxy’s that I know of—and yes I agree she probably is mentally ill and has been this way for years. Not diagnosed though. I have forgiven her due to the fact that I suspected this.

 

[1990Domer]

Thank you for your kind words 1990Domer. It is a great comfort to know that you have survived a similar experience. Over the years we have distanced ourselves-- once my dad passed, mom also got out of hand. She would never say abusive things to me in his presence, but once he died, she turned it up.

Polki-- my mom has no proxy’s that I know of—and yes I agree she probably is mentally ill and has been this way for years. Not diagnosed though. I have forgiven her due to the fact that I suspected this.

Please be assured of my prayers. This is truly heartbreaking. My son and I are going to adoration later today, so I will your burdens to our Lord and pray for you.

God bless you. Stay strong and feel free to PM at any time!

 

[1990Domer]

I am happy to offer a prayer, this situation is so very sad. As far as direction for you, I think there is no question at all here when it comes to your mom. If there is a doubt whether or not your mother is living in unsafe or unsanitary living conditions you should report it to the authorities, period. That is nothing you need to think about for more than 10 seconds, it is simple, clear-cut but you probably already knew that.

Where things are not so clear cut and where you are probably struggling with needing direction is what to do with YOURSELF. Dear one you are the daughter of a King! Jesus has glorious plans for your life! Satan wants you dragged down by this nonsense and doubt and drama in order to make you an emotional wreck, that is his victory. Satan loves it when you spend time on the phone with your mom, then spend hours and hours ruminating over everything she said, then even more time doubting yourself. Seek the freedom that Jesus longs to give you!

Much of your posts give detail about the little things your mom says and does these details are meaningless, what about YOU? What are the plans for your life? What wonderful things does God have in store for you? You have played this game for too long with your family, you already know how it is going to end, it is time to stop now. Call the authorities with a report about your mom if that is what you have to do, then make a plan about cutting down the time that you have contact with her.

God is the one that is really needed to help your mom and your sister, not you. Please let them go, it will be hard, I will pray for you. God bless.

Monicad, the is so wonderfully put. You don’t realize how much your posts have helped me on my faith journey. May God bless you and your family abundantly.

 

[m_crane]

Thank you all for your replies and links.

I don’t know for sure how bad off she is on a daily basis. From what I have gathered, she watches tv all day, and orders take out for meals. The last time I was there, the house like strong urine as she is incontinent. Then she had her money kept in grocery bags. She has to crawl down stairs because she has limited mobility. She complainns about how my sis does nothing, no cooking cleaning anything. I believe it from what I saw. No food in the fridge, house a horrible mess.
She has also had multiple heart attacks.

When I call for a nurse or home care she will not open the door, When I called for maid service, she did not open the door. When takeout comes, she instructs them to call the house when they get there-or she does not open. Same when I go.I told her that the cost of takeout is more then a nurse would be, but she does not want strangers in the house. When I tell my nephew, he says–you know how she is…

At one point I called my nephew to check on her and suggested that perhaps we should consult a lawyer. He told her-and she immediately had her lawyer go to her house and changed her will. My nephew is youngish, so he doesn’t realize perhaps she needs more help.

Then I asked her how can she do this and elimnate me from everything, she says that I should get down on my hands and knees and thank God that I have a husband , a nice house, and children. I thinlk this is pretty normal for a woman-but I am thankful-- but she makes it seem like this was an impossibility for me…And then she throws a curse-such as I hope just ONE of your children turns out like you…but she has been saying this sin
ce - was about 5 years old. So I thank her…and then I am a cold you- know-what for not getting mad.

Then I take a break from calling her, and she starts with the phone calls. She even called the town police–and said she thought I was dead, please check on me.

So I want to do the right thing in God’s eyes for my extended family while being at peace here for my husband and children.

Obviously, my mom is not typical, but deserves a clean house, care, and it is breaking my heart to see her living like this.

I feel so badly that you are going through this. It sounds like a lifetime of problems with your mom.

I have a mom and a MIL like your mom.

I think the best advice is to wait for a crisis then step in and do what you need to do. A shrink on the radio gives this advice to folks in our situation. It sounds awful but these drama mamas make it impossible to help until they are forced(by circumstances) to give up control and take help. And don’t let others draw you into the drama. My SILs are always trying to create drama to make my husband drop everything and run if MIL has a hang nail.
So far, my husband who is easy manipulated, have an agreement call our moms once a week, visit once a month, call on special occasions.

Again sorry for your pain.

 

[MCGar]

I have an undiagnosed bipolar mother. I think I recognize something in your posts. You take what she says personally. You also view this situation from ‘inside the box/ all the limitations you have described,’ instead of from ‘outside the box.’

Firstly, it’s difficult but from now on view anything she says as something that needs to be filtered through a ‘she’s mentally ill’ viewpoint. She is, she doesn’t see herself or anything rationally, even though it might SEEM like she ‘gets it, but is just manipulating,’ it doesn’t matter, you are the rational one and only need to rely on your own rational comprehension instead of her viewpoint. So when she calls and rants at people, don’t feel bad or embarrassed, just tell them that your mother has issues and you hope they will support you in your decisions. Call the police and notify them of the matter. Let them know of her mental issues and false alarms in regards to you so that they won’t have to check on you when she calls them. Believe me, she isn’t the first person that sends them false alarms.

Secondly, YOU HAVE NO POWER in regards to what happens to that money and how quickly it is spent. The only thing you can/should do is respond appropriately to your mother’s living conditions within your power. The rest is up to the other adults in the situation to manage.

Call social services for the elderly. EXPLAIN everything, her conditions, the condition of the people living with her, her unwillingness to open the door. They might request that you come down with them so that they can get in the house to do a wellness check. Or they might have other channels to get into the house.

Also, you need to consider the ramifications of not reporting this, instead of thinking of your sis being out of her inheritance. If something happens to your mother and your sister is living in her house (you didn’t say sis was living with her directly, so correct me if I’m wrong), do you know that she could go to jail for elder abuse?

Just an example, if you mother is sick and they don’t know about it because she always complains about everything; she might end up dying. The coroner could find that she died from dehydration or even starvation. Once they see the conditions of the house and start asking your sister why she didn’t take her to the dr., open the door for services or do more for her in general. What will be her excuse? Will they buy it, especially since they’ll see what the house looks like? Elder abuse isn’t just physical violence it is also neglect.

Also, for the love of Pete, please tell all the people in your life that your Mother has the number for, that you doing your best to help your mother but if they don’t want to receive her false alarm calls that they need to block her number, if they don’t want to block her number it is up to them BUT that you hope they respect not coming to you with gossip about your mother’s calls because you are already dealing with the situation!

 

[Xantippe]

I

Also, you need to consider the ramifications of not reporting this, instead of thinking of your sis being out of her inheritance. If something happens to your mother and your sister is living in her house (you didn’t say sis was living with her directly, so correct me if I’m wrong), do you know that she could go to jail for elder abuse?

Just an example, if you mother is sick and they don’t know about it because she always complains about everything; she might end up dying. The coroner could find that she died from dehydration or even starvation. Once they see the conditions of the house and start asking your sister why she didn’t take her to the dr., open the door for services or do more for her in general. What will be her excuse? Will they buy it, especially since they’ll see what the house looks like? Elder abuse isn’t just physical violence it is also neglect.

That is a very good point.

Also, for the love of Pete, please tell all the people in your life that your Mother has the number for, that you doing your best to help your mother but if they don’t want to receive her false alarm calls that they need to block her number, if they don’t want to block her number it is up to them BUT that you hope they respect not coming to you with gossip about your mother’s calls because you are already dealing with the situation!

Yeah.

 

[utah_rose]

Thank you all for your replies and links.

I don’t know for sure how bad off she is on a daily basis. From what I have gathered, she watches tv all day, and orders take out for meals. The last time I was there, the house like strong urine as she is incontinent. Then she had her money kept in grocery bags. She has to crawl down stairs because she has limited mobility. She complainns about how my sis does nothing, no cooking cleaning anything. I believe it from what I saw. No food in the fridge, house a horrible mess.
She has also had multiple heart attacks.

When I call for a nurse or home care she will not open the door, When I called for maid service, she did not open the door. When takeout comes, she instructs them to call the house when they get there-or she does not open. Same when I go.I told her that the cost of takeout is more then a nurse would be, but she does not want strangers in the house. When I tell my nephew, he says–you know how she is…

At one point I called my nephew to check on her and suggested that perhaps we should consult a lawyer. He told her-and she immediately had her lawyer go to her house and changed her will. My nephew is youngish, so he doesn’t realize perhaps she needs more help.

Then I asked her how can she do this and elimnate me from everything, she says that I should get down on my hands and knees and thank God that I have a husband , a nice house, and children. I thinlk this is pretty normal for a woman-but I am thankful-- but she makes it seem like this was an impossibility for me…And then she throws a curse-such as I hope just ONE of your children turns out like you…but she has been saying this sin
ce - was about 5 years old. So I thank her…and then I am a cold you- know-what for not getting mad.

Then I take a break from calling her, and she starts with the phone calls. She even called the town police–and said she thought I was dead, please check on me.

So I want to do the right thing in God’s eyes for my extended family while being at peace here for my husband and children.

Obviously, my mom is not typical, but deserves a clean house, care, and it is breaking my heart to see her living like this.

I would certainly get in touch with her doctor! He may be able to advice you what to do. I know that Medicare will pay for home health 100% if a doctor prescribes it. They will usually send someone to access the situation. Perhaps if you can be there at that time, it will be easier. They do not send a nurse, but some of them have some type of social services like social workers. They can also provide medical papers such as power of Attirney, attendants that can bathe her, ot specialists and nurses, and housekeeping services.

The reason I suggest a doctor is your mother from what you describe could have early Alzheimer’s disease which could help you get the services you need. You may be able to make an appointment privately to talk to him.

And if she doesn’t have a doctor, I would definitely call adult social services. Most states do have elderly care services. They can provide your mother meals on wheels which would definitely be better than take out food.

Forget about your sister! Your mom is more important, and your sister may be eligible for low income housing if your mother has to be hospitalized or in a nursing home.

 

[1990Domer]

I would certainly get in touch with her doctor! He may be able to advice you what to do. I know that Medicare will pay for home health 100% if a doctor prescribes it. They will usually send someone to access the situation. Perhaps if you can be there at that time, it will be easier. They do not send a nurse, but some of them have some type of social services like social workers. They can also provide medical papers such as power of Attirney, attendants that can bathe her, ot specialists and nurses, and housekeeping services.

The reason I suggest a doctor is your mother from what you describe could have early Alzheimer’s disease which could help you get the services you need. You may be able to make an appointment privately to talk to him.

And if she doesn’t have a doctor, I would definitely call adult social services. Most states do have elderly care services. They can provide your mother meals on wheels which would definitely be better than take out food.

Forget about your sister! Your mom is more important, and your sister may be eligible for low income housing if your mother has to be hospitalized or in a nursing home.

If the OP isn’t on the HIPAA forms filled out by her mother, the doctor can tell her NOTHING. Been through that, but thankfully not out of toxic reasons. Just lack of education.

 

[Sheeniac]

Call social services for the elderly. EXPLAIN everything, her conditions, the condition of the people living with her, her unwillingness to open the door. They might request that you come down with them so that they can get in the house to do a wellness check. Or they might have other channels to get into the house.

Also, you need to consider the ramifications of not reporting this, instead of thinking of your sis being out of her inheritance. If something happens to your mother and your sister is living in her house (you didn’t say sis was living with her directly, so correct me if I’m wrong), do you know that she could go to jail for elder abuse?

I agree with much of the above. Your sister is not your problem. As you have said, she’s had many years to pull herself together. Again - NOT YOUR PROBLEM.

Call social services with a listing of your concerns. If anyone can do anything, they can. You can’t. It’s a pity, but that’s the way the laws are.

You need to do the right thing for your mother with regard to her personal health and safety. I applaud your commitment to her and that you haven’t walked away. I’m blessed - my mother is my biggest cheerleader, so I can’t address the best path to take with regard to a personal relationship with her. I think much of what has been said by others is wise.

 

[1990Domer]

Mommy K,

Just wanted to let you know I’m thinking about you and praying for your peace and acceptance for those things that are out of your control.

 

[insideitall]

hey, apparently this is a thing, huh? my mother just went through almost the exact same thing with her parents. social services and lawyers had to get involved.

I don’t have anything else to add, since everyone else covered it really well. prayers!

 

[hally23]

I found this post doing a search on the boards about elder care, as my family is going through a very similar situation. My dad is having to shoulder the bulk of the burden of my grandmother’s care after her stroke this spring.
She has a very toxic personality, so much so that the majority of her family does not speak to her and she goes through friends constantly. After going through rehab at a nursing facility she is home now, but is constantly on my dad to do things for her, mad he’s not more affectionate (after a lifetime of verbal abuse and physical abuse when he was a child.) She expected all to be forgiven by the hurt she had caused her family and that everyone would rush around her to take care of her, and it hasnt happened.
I call or visit her a little bit, mostly as a favor to my dad, who is at his wit’s end. But I have small children and I dont really have the ability to leave them at home while I go visit her— and I am scared of what we’d be walking in on if I took them (crying jags, blaming everyone else for her problems, etc) that I dont want my children to see and get upset about.

I feel like she is living in a situation that she created, but also feeling massive amounts of guilt from not WANTING to do more for her…or letting a family member be lonely and upset and not doing more to help that. Fighting that push/pull between “she’s your grandmother, you should help her no matter what” and “she is so hurtful and spiteful and selfish that nothing you ever do is enough.” I am also very resentful of the terrible things she says to my dad and they way she keeps him constantly having to make his life revolve around her. I worry for HIS health as she gives him little downtime and is constantly telling him what a terrible son he is, despite his being the only one taking on the majority of her care.

I was really curious to see what others here would say about this sort of toxic situation…reading all your posts have been helpful. I hope the situation has become better for the OP as well!

 

[His_helpmeet]

There is a situation in the extended family that is just not right.
My mother who is and has been an extremely difficult person her entire life has changed her will to support my sister who is divorced for 25 years, never worked, and living with her.

Mom changed the will after my dad passed. Mom has enabled my sister to be dependant.
The entire extended family has abandoned my mom becuase of her forceful and toxic personality. Now she is alone with my sister, and sis is not caring for her. Out of Christian charity, and because she is my mom, I converse with her on the phone as she lives an hour away. All she does is complain, look for pity and so on. When I don’t call for a week or so, she will pick up the phone and call people who know me, saying I am a horrible daughter—she has called my MIL, the pastor, friends and so on. She has told them ‘what kind of a daughter only calls their mother once a week’?
Can you imagine your MIL calling to ask why you don’t call your mother–or facing your pastor? She makes it so dramatic-- Ugh.

She collects rent, has a comfortable income from dad’s retirement. She has made my adult nephew (my sister’s son) the executor.
She has never given our children anything-zero. She has rarely attended any occasion for them.
The problem is she needs full time care-sis is useless. Nephew will not step in.
I am still getting over the toxic and abusive childhood due to her, and she keeps piling it on. If I call adult services, sis’s money (inheritatnce) will be eaten up, as mom is frugal, and states she cannot afford nursing home). The reality is -sis needs the money, and a place to live. She refuses in home care.she will not open the door.
Mom is late 80’s with limited mobility, and needs help. Her parents lived until they were 100. So if she goes to a nursing home even for 10 years, money will go.

She has tied my hands-leaving me with a moral dilemma. I feel that this is not right. I feel God is somehow testing me with this, because it is so difficult. If I was not Catholic, it would not be a problem. It is not the inheritance, that is just part of it. I know St. Francis and many saints gave up everything. But I don’t want to interfere with sis’ living arrangements as she really can’t take care of herself financially, and her son is in a relationship and living with his girlfriend. He is not going to take in his mother. Ugh…

I do think the right thing in this case is to call adult protective services. They may be able to put mom and sis in touch with a social worker who would be able to determine if additional benefits may be available.

Sometimes the “right” path is not always the “easy” one.

 

[ChelleyD]

I feel like she is living in a situation that she created, but also feeling massive amounts of guilt from not WANTING to do more for her…or letting a family member be lonely and upset and not doing more to help that. Fighting that push/pull between “she’s your grandmother, you should help her no matter what” and “she is so hurtful and spiteful and selfish that nothing you ever do is enough.” I am also very resentful of the terrible things she says to my dad and they way she keeps him constantly having to make his life revolve around her. I worry for HIS health as she gives him little downtime and is constantly telling him what a terrible son he is, despite his being the only one taking on the majority of her care.

Personal opinion…I think the only thing YOU can do in your circumstances is to LOVE your grandmother (or in the case of the OP, her mother).

What is LOVE? The Church teaches us “to Love is to will the good of the other” (CCC 1766).

That Love isn’t necessarily about feelings or emotions, but is an act of the will. You can decide to Love your grandmother. That does NOT mean that you have to visit her, or talk to her. But can you bring yourself to PRAY for her? Bring her situation, as well as your resentment of her, to the Lord in prayer. Find a Saint who you feel identifies with your situation and implore their intercession. Your grandmother may never change, but YOU will. You don’t want to let the resentment poison your heart. That will only hurt you and your family.

You may even be able to be of some help by helping your father. Can you provide a meal here and there for him? Can you make sure his house is clean, or his yard is mown? Can you ease HIS burden in some way other than physically helping with your grandmother?

And don’t forget to bring your earthly father to your Heavenly Father in prayer also.

Just some thoughts of mine. I hope they help in some small way.

 

[His_helpmeet]

In my humble opinion and experience, it may be difficult for the OP to discern truth from fantasy. Sadly, many toxic people use passive-aggressive tactics to get you entangled and pull you closer to them. I remember someone on this forum told me to look up “toxic personality disorder.” My jaw dropped!

Also, due to HIPPA, the OP may have her hands tied as far as being able to talk to her mom’s healthcare providers. Once again, I think keeping a safe distance and trying to heal herself is the best medicine right now…and lots of prayers for the OP!

In many cases, the OP CAN go to her mother’s doctor and simply describe her concerns. The doctor cannot give the OP her mother’s health information, but he/she CAN note the OP’s concerns and raise them at the mother’s next appointment.

 

[1990Domer]

In many cases, the OP CAN go to her mother’s doctor and simply describe her concerns. The doctor cannot give the OP her mother’s health information, but he/she CAN note the OP’s concerns and raise them at the mother’s next appointment.

You are right, but I actually had doctors discourage me from discussing my concerns because it came close to possibly crossing a line.