In the Apostle Creed, Jesus descended into hell

[irishcolleen45]

According to the Apostle Creed, Jesus descended into hell when he died.

Last night my husband and I were discussing this with our adult son. Our son said at Jesus’ death there were four stages of hell:
1st stage: Limbo
2nd stage: The bosom of Abraham and the patriarchs where all virtuous went at their death before Jesus came to release them
3rd stage: Purgatory
4th stage: Place of the damned.

Our son was told this at a recent catechism class he attended at his parish. He also said Limbo still exits and that the souls there will not get to heaven but it is a place of happiness. I thought I read recently that Limbo is not part of dogma or doctrine.

Has anyone heard of this?

 

[GEddie]

Limbo is not Church doctrine, and the rest of it is pure speculation.

“Hell” as used in this context is not the place of spiritual punishment, but simply the place of the dead, Hebrew Sheol, Greek Hades. It is no more nor less than the venue of all dead human beings. As a dead human being, our LORD went there. As a Divine person HE let HIMself out.

ICXC NIKA

 

[DihydrogenOxide]

Yes. Limbo is a possibility talked about by some Church fathers about those infants who were not baptized but were not placed in hell.

Your son is correct. Although 1 of the 4 listed is now forever done away with, the possibility that there is a limbo is still there. St. Augustine and several other theologians have spoken about it. It’s something the Church does not have a defined stand on.

Limbo of the Fathers, was a place, known as a prison, where those who had died, still in the friendship of God awaited their salvation by the Cross of Jesus. They could not enter heaven until he died for them, mending their relationship with the Father. Once Jesus had won their salvation, he descended to where they were and released them from their prison, allowing them to enter heaven.

Hell as the Church sees it, is the place of eternal damnation, and not the same idea as the hell spoken about in the Apostles’ Creed. Jesus descended to the place of the limbo of the fathers.

 

[TimothyH]

I don’t see purgatory as a stage of Hell.

Purgatory is a great gift of mercy given to us by God, where those who have died in God’s friendship are purified so that they may function correctly in and enter heaven.

I would welcome correction however.

-Tim-

 

[Gorgias]

According to the Apostle Creed, Jesus descended into hell when he died.

Last night my husband and I were discussing this with our adult son. Our son said at Jesus’ death there were four stages of hell:
1st stage: Limbo
2nd stage: The bosom of Abraham and the patriarchs where all virtuous went at their death before Jesus came to release them
3rd stage: Purgatory
4th stage: Place of the damned.

Our son was told this at a recent catechism class he attended at his parish. He also said Limbo still exits and that the souls there will not get to heaven but it is a place of happiness. I thought I read recently that Limbo is not part of dogma or doctrine.

Has anyone heard of this?

Hmm… this doesn’t seem quite right. I think your son has mis-remembered what he heard (or it was presented inaccurately at the class).

As others have mentioned, “limbo” has been used in two different ways in Church history. The “limbo of the fathers” is the term used to describe the “place” that the “patriarchs (and) all virtuous went at their death before Jesus came to release them”. So, already, we have the first two things your son listed.

(Incidentally, this “limbo of the fathers” is where Jesus went – what the creed calls “hell” – following His death, so that He could lead them to heaven. Once Jesus took all the virtuous souls from this place, it no longer had any function; so we say that it no longer exists.)

The second use of “limbo”, as others have mentioned, is a theologian’s hypothesis. It exists to answer the question, “if baptism is necessary, where do infants go to if they die before they were able to have been baptized?”. Some have held that while they shouldn’t be in hell, they can’t go to heaven, either. The Church doesn’t really hold to that idea these days, although (if memory serves) Pope Benedict has asked a Vatican committee to meet and come up with a recommendation on what to do with this idea. It doesn’t make sense to say that it existed “at the time of Jesus’ death”, because it’s tied up with the notion of baptism – and at that point, no one had been baptized with the baptism of Jesus!

As others have mentioned, Purgatory is less “a stage of hell” as it is a waypoint on the way to heaven – those who have been judged worthy of heaven, but who still require purification, are purified before entering heaven. this state of purification is known as “purgatory” – it’s the place where we’re purged of our imperfections!

 

[ProtectorRoss]

Yes. Limbo is a possibility talked about by some Church fathers about those infants who were not baptized but were not placed in hell.

Your son is correct. Although 1 of the 4 listed is now forever done away with, the possibility that there is a limbo is still there. St. Augustine and several other theologians have spoken about it. It’s something the Church does not have a defined stand on.

Limbo of the Fathers, was a place, known as a prison, where those who had died, still in the friendship of God awaited their salvation by the Cross of Jesus. They could not enter heaven until he died for them, mending their relationship with the Father. Once Jesus had won their salvation, he descended to where they were and released them from their prison, allowing them to enter heaven.

Hell as the Church sees it, is the place of eternal damnation, and not the same idea as the hell spoken about in the Apostles’ Creed. Jesus descended to the place of the limbo of the fathers.

Doesn’t your Bible talk about Abraham and Moses and Elijah being in heaven before Jesus died?

 

[irishcolleen45]

Yes. Limbo is a possibility talked about by some Church fathers about those infants who were not baptized but were not placed in hell.

Limbo of the Fathers, was a place, known as a prison, where those who had died, still in the friendship of God awaited their salvation by the Cross of Jesus. They could not enter heaven until he died for them, mending their relationship with the Father. Once Jesus had won their salvation, he descended to where they were and released them from their prison, allowing them to enter heaven.

My son said that those Jesus released from prison (Limbo of the Fathers) did not go to heaven until Jesus ascended to heaven. That Jesus brought them to heaven. I can understand that this could be true.

 

[graceandglory]

[BIBLEDRB]matt. 27:52-53[/BIBLEDRB]

When Jesus resurrected, those who had died and had been preached to “in hell” were also raised.

 

[irishcolleen45]

From the Apostles’ Creed: “on the third day he rose again from the dead”.

I find this sentence very confusing. Didn’t Jesus rise from the dead only once?

 

[DihydrogenOxide]

It’s further pointing to the fact that Jesus descended into the “Limbo of the Fathers” and not the eternal damnation “hell”.

He only did it once.

So, "he descended into hell (the abode of the dead/Sheol) and on the 3rd day rose.

 

[GEddie]

From the Apostles’ Creed: “on the third day he rose again from the dead”.

I find this sentence very confusing. Didn’t Jesus rise from the dead only once?

“Again” simply meant that HE resumed HIS aliveness; it does not imply there was more than one rising.

ICXC NIKA

 

[Phyllo]

From the Apostles’ Creed: “on the third day he rose again from the dead”.

I find this sentence very confusing. Didn’t Jesus rise from the dead only once?

If you have a Catechism of the Catholic Church start reading on page 164 with paragraph 631. If you don’t have a CCC you can find it on line. This should help answer your questions.

 

[ProVobis]

It’s the translation into English that’s confusing.

Resurrexit indeed means rose again. And in Latin it’s part of the verb, not the prepositional phrase.

Doesn’t mean he rose again from the dead, though. It means this time the surrexit happened to be from the dead.

 

[DaveBj]

From the Apostles’ Creed: “on the third day he rose again from the dead”.

I find this sentence very confusing. Didn’t Jesus rise from the dead only once?

It’s just a figure of speech in English. Don’t try to make it walk on all fours.

 

[thistle]

According to the Apostle Creed, Jesus descended into hell when he died.

Last night my husband and I were discussing this with our adult son. Our son said at Jesus’ death there were four stages of hell:
1st stage: Limbo
2nd stage: The bosom of Abraham and the patriarchs where all virtuous went at their death before Jesus came to release them
3rd stage: Purgatory
4th stage: Place of the damned.

Our son was told this at a recent catechism class he attended at his parish. He also said Limbo still exits and that the souls there will not get to heaven but it is a place of happiness. I thought I read recently that Limbo is not part of dogma or doctrine.

Has anyone heard of this?

If you mean Limbo for Infants that is not Church doctrine nor has it ever been. It was only ever a theological hypothesis.

As for the rest:

“HE DESCENDED INTO HELL. ON THE THIRD DAY HE ROSE AGAIN”

CCC 631 Jesus “descended into the lower parts of the earth. He who descended is he who also ascended far above all the heavens.” The Apostles’ Creed confesses in the same article Christ’s descent into hell and his Resurrection from the dead on the third day, because in his Passover it was precisely out of the depths of death that he made life spring forth:

Christ, that Morning Star, who came back from the dead, and shed his peaceful light on all mankind, your Son who lives and reigns for ever and ever. Amen.

Paragraph 1. Christ Descended into Hell

CCC 632 The frequent New Testament affirmations that Jesus was “raised from the dead” presuppose that the crucified one sojourned in the realm of the dead prior to his resurrection. This was the first meaning given in the apostolic preaching to Christ’s descent into hell: that Jesus, like all men, experienced death and in his soul joined the others in the realm of the dead. But he descended there as Savior, proclaiming the Good News to the spirits imprisoned there.

CCC 633 Scripture calls the abode of the dead, to which the dead Christ went down, “hell” - Sheol in Hebrew or Hades in Greek - because those who are there are deprived of the vision of God. Such is the case for all the dead, whether evil or righteous, while they await the Redeemer: which does not mean that their lot is identical, as Jesus shows through the parable of the poor man Lazarus who was received into “Abraham’s bosom”: “It is precisely these holy souls, who awaited their Savior in Abraham’s bosom, whom Christ the Lord delivered when he descended into hell.” Jesus did not descend into hell to deliver the damned, nor to destroy the hell of damnation, but to free the just who had gone before him.

CCC 634 “The gospel was preached even to the dead.” The descent into hell brings the Gospel message of salvation to complete fulfilment. This is the last phase of Jesus’ messianic mission, a phase which is condensed in time but vast in its real significance: the spread of Christ’s redemptive work to all men of all times and all places, for all who are saved have been made sharers in the redemption.

CCC 635 Christ went down into the depths of death so that “the dead will hear the voice of the Son of God, and those who hear will live.” Jesus, “the Author of life”, by dying destroyed "him who has the power of death, that is, the devil, and [delivered] all those who through fear of death were subject to lifelong bondage."Henceforth the risen Christ holds “the keys of Death and Hades”, so that “at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, in heaven and on earth and under the earth.”

Today a great silence reigns on earth, a great silence and a great stillness. A great silence because the King is asleep. The earth trembled and is still because God has fallen asleep in the flesh and he has raised up all who have slept ever since the world began. . . He has gone to search for Adam, our first father, as for a lost sheep. Greatly desiring to visit those who live in darkness and in the shadow of death, he has gone to free from sorrow Adam in his bonds and Eve, captive with him - He who is both their God and the son of Eve. . . “I am your God, who for your sake have become your son. . . I order you, O sleeper, to awake. I did not create you to be a prisoner in hell. Rise from the dead, for I am the life of the dead.”

 

[JonathonofOhio]

According to the Apostle Creed, Jesus descended into hell when he died.

Last night my husband and I were discussing this with our adult son. Our son said at Jesus’ death there were four stages of hell:
1st stage: Limbo
2nd stage: The bosom of Abraham and the patriarchs where all virtuous went at their death before Jesus came to release them
3rd stage: Purgatory
4th stage: Place of the damned.

Our son was told this at a recent catechism class he attended at his parish. He also said Limbo still exits and that the souls there will not get to heaven but it is a place of happiness. I thought I read recently that Limbo is not part of dogma or doctrine.

Has anyone heard of this?

Limbo does not exist and is not part of the church doctrine (as others have said). It was a theological hypothesis, and the church has stated it should not be taught anymore.

Purgatory is a process of purification not a place. You are purified so that you can enter into heaven (1 Corinthians 3:10-15). A person who goes through purgation is going to heaven; they are saved.

Rather than stages, there are two areas of Hell. One is the place of torment and the other is the place of comfort, both are separated from each other. The word “Hell” (translated from Sheol [Hebrew] or Hades [Greek]) is sometimes used to describe the entire place, and sometimes to distinguish the place of torment from the place of comfort (depends on context). Often times, the word “paradise” is inserted to specifically refer to the place of comfort (Luke 23:43) within Hell, and “Gehenna” is used to refer to the place of torment. It was traditional to refer to the place of comfort as the “Bosom of Abraham (Luke 16:22-23)”. The entire place is called “Hell” in English. In Hebrew it was “Sheol” and in Greek it was “Hades”. Jesus descended into Hell (1 Peter 3:19), and then rose from the dead and ascended into heaven; so now these souls that were once there in ‘paradise’ are in Heaven. It is now common to refer to Heaven as “Paradise” since this is the true paradise, and it is now the destination of the the just.

 

[irishcolleen45]

I want to thank you all for your replies to my question.

 

[Evan]

Limbo does not exist and is not part of the church doctrine (as others have said). It was a theological hypothesis, and the church has stated it should not be taught anymore.

Never seen a church document stating this. Only that it is still a viable theological hypothesis.

Purgatory is a process of purification not a place. You are purified so that you can enter into heaven (1 Corinthians 3:10-15). A person who goes through purgation is going to heaven; they are saved.

Since you must be in some place during this process, and it is not heaven, you could call it hell.

What we need here is to determine what does the general term hell refer to. In the RCIA class being given, the term hell was apparently being used to refer to any place that is separate from God in heaven.

At the end of time, hell of the fathers (before the crucifixion), hell of purgation, and hell on earth, will all be gone. Only the hell of the damned will remain. And, as you stated, it may be separated into levels of punishment/happiness. According to your deserved punishment.

 

[Gorgias]

Never seen a church document stating this. Only that it is still a viable theological hypothesis.

Check out vatican.va/roman_curia/congregations/cfaith/cti_documents/rc_con_cfaith_doc_20070419_un-baptised-infants_en.html …

Since you must be in some place during this process, and it is not heaven, you could call it hell.

No, you can’t. Hell is a terminal destination – once you’re there, you’re can’t go anywhere else. Purgatory, by definition, is a state that you’re in prior to getting to heaven; once you’re in Purgatory, there’s nowhere else you can go but to heaven.

At the end of time, hell of the fathers (before the crucifixion), hell of purgation, and hell on earth, will all be gone.

The limbo of the patriarchs (where were you getting the term “hell of the fathers”?) is already empty, and will never be populated by anyone; there’s no need of it. As for “hell on earth”, do you have a reference to a Magisterial document that uses that term?

 

[Evan]

Check out vatican.va/roman_curia/congregations/cfaith/cti_documents/rc_con_cfaith_doc_20070419_un-baptised-infants_en.html …

2nd paragraph

It is clear that the traditional teaching on this topic has concentrated on the theory of limbo, understood as a state which includes the souls of infants who die subject to original sin and without baptism, and who, therefore, neither merit the beatific vision, nor yet are subjected to any punishment, because they are not guilty of any personal sin. This theory, elaborated by theologians beginning in the Middle Ages, never entered into the dogmatic definitions of the Magisterium, even if that same Magisterium did at times mention the theory in its ordinary teaching up until the Second Vatican Council.** It remains therefore a possible theological hypothesis. **

No, you can’t.

That would depend on your definition of hell. The definition of hell I gave puts non-heavenly locations as a type of hell.

Hell is a terminal destination – once you’re there, you’re can’t go anywhere else.

You’re close on this one. The Hell of the Damned is a terminal desitination

Purgatory, by definition, is a state that you’re in prior to getting to heaven; once you’re in Purgatory, there’s nowhere else you can go but to heaven.

Correct, but it is not heaven, therefore a ‘type’ of hell’ in that there is suffering and separation from God, though only temporary.

The limbo of the patriarchs (where were you getting the term “hell of the fathers”?) is already empty, and will never be populated by anyone; there’s no need of it.

Correct, but it did exist. And “limbo” is referring to the “fringe of hell”. Limbo of the fathers was considered a hell that was temporary (until salvation was made available). “Limbo of the infants” would also be on the “fringe of hell”. It’s not heaven, it is a region of total natural happiness in hell, or so goes the theological hypothesis.

As for “hell on earth”, do you have a reference to a Magisterial document that uses that term?

This could be taken as my ecclesial humor (I try to keep things light) but it also makes sense (using our definition of hell given above) since the mass is where heaven touches earth. If you want to experience heaven reaching down to earth: try an Eastern Rite Catholic Divine Liturgy. If you want to experience earth ascending to heaven: try a Latin Right Catholic Mass.

When we are not at mass we are in this ‘vale of tears’, and we await our release to be joined with God in heaven.