Incest

[Auriel]

I am not a Catholic and this is probably too much information to share. But being a victim myself of incest I do understand your dilemma, and why a religious discussion probably would not cut it. It is hard for a child because they equate an earthy Father with a heavenly one. Or the idea of what a father is I should say. It takes a while to figure that one out. It took me years.

And no, for the other comments, many hate this, hate the memories, and would do anything to keep this from happening to other kids. We even go as far as to make up a normal family to tell others about when asked about our childhood, because the reality is unbelievable. This situation makes me want to cry.

Prayers for ya. Whether or not they believe in creation or evolution would not matter…soo…maybe tell them about how in the animal kingdom this would be natural but we are higher evolved than animals? They may see this as just a sex act…no big deal. I know Jr high school girls that see things as oral sex as not real sex. (For some reason kids spill their guts to me, even strangers, weird)

Maybe you could try to explain to them how this cheats them out of a healthy relationship when they are adults?

Anyway, good luck to you. And I do understand, all children need someone to love them, even ones seen as too damaged and unlovable. I hope you have good support system, you are a rare breed.

 

[nablaise]

The normal secular argument is about being ‘open to society’; open to others.

Incest is about being ‘closed’ to society, and it would go with some kind of egoism.

Of course it would be needed to explain to them that sex makes sens only in a marriage environment. Some catholic resources can help.

I don’t think the secular world have a clear explanation or defense against incest just as they dont concerning other kinds of immorality. (I would not be surprised if tomorrow some people are defending their right for incests…what arguments would courts give? if they can make sens of homosexuality, I think they can make sens of incest). So some catholic documents on sexuality should help.

Of course here we are dealing with kids which is a slighly different matter.

God bless

 

[nablaise]

Brother, it was simply a miscommunication, obviously. You are forgiven Now, how about those arguments against this work of the devil called incest.

We know it’s wrong because God says it is through the Holy Scriptures and through His church. How can we combat this across the board to society as a whole?

Peace…

MW

It is a matter of explaining somehow how love works.
With incest they are like in the uncontacted tribe in the Amazon.
Sex is for marriage and for procreation. Sex creates a bond which is hard to brake, thus can not be shared.
People marry ‘strangers’ to the family to keep strong connections with other people other than our own families.

You can tell them that it is a special things worthy of being saved until the right time.
You can also tell them that it can be dangereous, very dangereous and find them examples. They are plenty of examples.

God bless

 

[ElizabethPH]

These young people are all under 18. They do not live with their parents. They were abandoned by their parents and are now in a state run children’s home. The authorities know of the abuse. The parents have been dealt with. I’m dealing with the aftermath.

Listen, there are extenuating circumstances here. I’m planning on adopting them, at least 4 of these children. They have all been abused in every way. My wife and I have gotten attached to them and want to help them heal and show them what a real family should be like.

I’m looking for a response on the immorality of incest that will make sense to these brainwashed kids so that they will stop doing this. It’s a long story about how I met them. Some things have to be in place before they can live in our home and this is one of the issues.

I guess I should have been more clear in the first post about this. So, now you know.

Now, can anyone help me with at least a secular response on why incest should not be practiced?

Peace…

MW

I think you ought to be consulting with professionals. Especially since you are going to adopt them. You really must know what your getting into and how to handle it. I don’t think there is a pat answer that you can give them that is going to make them stop. They might need years of therapy.

 

[ElizabethPH]

Let’s take another approach on this question, because we’ve really gotten off track from the intent of this thread.

So, the question is this:

What arguments can one make against the practice of incest to anyone in the secular world who doesn’t accept the immorality of it from a Christian perspective? I’ve seen places on the internet where seemingly intelligent people think it is acceptable and not harmful to do this. I did a search for “arguments against incest” and I was rather surprised to see that sites came up that attempted to refute the assertion that incest was immoral.

Peace…

MW

thats awful. Those people need help…and so do those children. Hopefully they are in therapy of some sort. I think even with all the right answers it will take time before they finally understand what they are doing is wrong. Then the guilt they will feel once they know what they have been and how totally against human nature it is to have done it. All of that is going to take years to overcome it just won’t happen over night.

 

[Jimdandy]

Mystic,

May the Holy Spirit filll your home with His Light and Strength.

Thank you so much for being willing to love these precious children because that is exactly what they need-all they know right now is that their parents abused and abandoned them and they are left to comfort each other in the only way they know how.

People forget that sex feels good and bonds people in a very special way.

I think that you should begin a very basic Bible School project with them-use an old fashioned felt board if need be.

Because, you see, incest was ok when the earth was sparsely populated-but as the families grew, God told them not to anymore. They need to hear that God loves us all just as we are.

And if you start this study with Genesis the stories come one after another how incest leads to jealousy, lust, greed , brothers fighting and killing each other etc.

Just don’t make a big deal about-keep your voice as calm as possible when discussing this, and keep going when you are past Genesis-after Exodus, switch to the Gospel of St. John,
they need to know of the very special love that Jesus has for them.Then return to the OT

A children’s book of Bible stories would be good too.
These children would benefit from going to a private, Christian School.

The older children need your love so much, and mostly need to know that you will always care and that you will not leave them…

I will pray for you four little ones-

I am sure the psychologists will advise on rules, schedules, etc.

May God Bless you

 

[Mystic_Warrior]

I am not a Catholic and this is probably too much information to share. But being a victim myself of incest I do understand your dilemma, and why a religious discussion probably would not cut it. It is hard for a child because they equate an earthy Father with a heavenly one. Or the idea of what a father is I should say. It takes a while to figure that one out. It took me years.

And no, for the other comments, many hate this, hate the memories, and would do anything to keep this from happening to other kids. We even go as far as to make up a normal family to tell others about when asked about our childhood, because the reality is unbelievable. This situation makes me want to cry.

Prayers for ya. Whether or not they believe in creation or evolution would not matter…soo…maybe tell them about how in the animal kingdom this would be natural but we are higher evolved than animals? They may see this as just a sex act…no big deal. I know Jr high school girls that see things as oral sex as not real sex. (For some reason kids spill their guts to me, even strangers, weird)

Maybe you could try to explain to them how this cheats them out of a healthy relationship when they are adults?

Anyway, good luck to you. And I do understand, all children need someone to love them, even ones seen as too damaged and unlovable. I hope you have good support system, you are a rare breed.

Auriel,

God bless you sister. Thank you for sharing that. I will take your thoughts and use them. It seems our society gets morally worse every day. There is no sense of right and wrong. And it is the young ones who grow up thinking some of this behavior is okay.

Peace…

MW

 

[Mystic_Warrior]

It is a matter of explaining somehow how love works.
With incest they are like in the uncontacted tribe in the Amazon.
Sex is for marriage and for procreation. Sex creates a bond which is hard to brake, thus can not be shared.
People marry ‘strangers’ to the family to keep strong connections with other people other than our own families.

You can tell them that it is a special things worthy of being saved until the right time.
You can also tell them that it can be dangereous, very dangereous and find them examples. They are plenty of examples.

God bless

Thanks for the thoughts, nablaise. Yes, I heard the comment from an older one that “it’s just sex”. What a statement. Without God and the church as our guide, we have no legs to stand on concerning what’s right and wrong.

May God help us and our country.

Peace…

MW

 

[Mystic_Warrior]

thats awful. Those people need help…and so do those children. Hopefully they are in therapy of some sort. I think even with all the right answers it will take time before they finally understand what they are doing is wrong. Then the guilt they will feel once they know what they have been and how totally against human nature it is to have done it. All of that is going to take years to overcome it just won’t happen over night.

Thanks Elizabeth. Yes, it is awful. But the really terrible thing is that this is a real problem in our society and goes unreported much of the time. I only saw statistics on wikipedia (not real trustworthy) about percentages in society where this occurs and it’s astounding. Pray for our country. Pray not only for these kids but for a society that says it’s okay.

Peace…

MW

 

[Mystic_Warrior]

Mystic,

May the Holy Spirit filll your home with His Light and Strength.

Thank you so much for being willing to love these precious children because that is exactly what they need-all they know right now is that their parents abused and abandoned them and they are left to comfort each other in the only way they know how.

People forget that sex feels good and bonds people in a very special way.

I think that you should begin a very basic Bible School project with them-use an old fashioned felt board if need be.

Because, you see, incest was ok when the earth was sparsely populated-but as the families grew, God told them not to anymore. They need to hear that God loves us all just as we are.

And if you start this study with Genesis the stories come one after another how incest leads to jealousy, lust, greed , brothers fighting and killing each other etc.

Just don’t make a big deal about-keep your voice as calm as possible when discussing this, and keep going when you are past Genesis-after Exodus, switch to the Gospel of St. John,
they need to know of the very special love that Jesus has for them.Then return to the OT

A children’s book of Bible stories would be good too.
These children would benefit from going to a private, Christian School.

The older children need your love so much, and mostly need to know that you will always care and that you will not leave them…

I will pray for you four little ones-

I am sure the psychologists will advise on rules, schedules, etc.

May God Bless you

Thank you so much for your kind words. What a blessing to receive such greetings and love from a brother. I think you’re exactly right. Go back to Genesis. Read about how God designed things to give Him glory and not to glorify ourselves. Show them Godly love always.

Seeing everything they have went through and the horrible life they have lived and hearing their cries for someone to love them makes me all the more determined to make a difference for them and the world.

God bless you and thank you.

MW