Inequality

[gksaoh]

The CIA World Factbook says, “Since 1975, practically all the gains in household income have gone to the top 20% of households.”

Since 2000,there has been 76 new billionaires while 5,000,000 people have been added to the poverty count.

Although the U.S. is the world’s richest nation, its infant death rate compares with Malaysia. The nation’s capitol has a higher infant death rate among blacks than Kerela, India. 45,000,000 Americans lack health insurance.

Is this condition moral? Can a society be healthy with such economic extremes? All of us are responsible for the exploding national debt. Are tax cuts morally justified when they serve to concentrate wealth at the top?

 

[patshea1128]

gksaoh:

The CIA World Factbook says, “Since 1975, practically all the gains in household income have gone to the top 20% of households.”

Since 2000,there has been 76 new billionaires while 5,000,000 people have been added to the poverty count.

Although the U.S. is the world’s richest nation, its infant death rate compares with Malaysia. The nation’s capitol has a higher infant death rate among blacks than Kerela, India. 45,000,000 Americans lack health insurance.

Is this condition moral? Can a society be healthy with such economic extremes? All of us are responsible for the exploding national debt. Are tax cuts morally justified when they serve to concentrate wealth at the top?

You need to quit worrying about other people’s business and worry about yourself. The national debt is a result of people not willing to accept personal responsibility for themselves and relying on the government (ie. their taxpaying neighbor) for a handout all of the time. New Orleans should have been an eye opener to this country. Not only are tax cuts justified, they are essential to continued progress and welfare of this nation. Have you ever heard of the commandment: Thou shall not steal! Taxes, are nothing more than legalized stealing. Which part of this do you not understand? It is very simple. I owe you nothing. You owe me nothing. If I choose to help you out, that is my choice. For example, since you are on a Catholic Forum, let me give you a Catholic example. The Catholic church has it’s own schools. Catholic parents, that pay property taxes just like the protestant parents, shell out several thousands of dollars a year to send their children to Catholic schools. Why? Because they accept the personal responsibility of raising their own children. On the other hand, there are other denominations that feel it is the obligation of the property owner, or the community to help raise their children. That is complete and total rubbish. Parents raise the child, the village raises the idiot! You figure it out from there.

 

[MommaKat]

PatShea1128
Thank you, you express that better than I can. I wish I had more of my money back so I had more to give away. I pay grade school tutition I tithe to the Church and I support other charities. Socailism is the grave error that Mary warned would be spread through out the world by Russia at Fatima. It destroyed Russia, and it is destroying Western Europe and Canada and the United States. May Mary pray for us.

 

[Karin]

patshea1128:

You need to quit worrying about other people’s business and worry about yourself. The national debt is a result of people not willing to accept personal responsibility for themselves and relying on the government (ie. their taxpaying neighbor) for a handout all of the time. New Orleans should have been an eye opener to this country. Not only are tax cuts justified, they are essential to continued progress and welfare of this nation. Have you ever heard of the commandment: Thou shall not steal! Taxes, are nothing more than legalized stealing. Which part of this do you not understand? It is very simple. I owe you nothing. You owe me nothing. If I choose to help you out, that is my choice. For example, since you are on a Catholic Forum, let me give you a Catholic example. The Catholic church has it’s own schools. Catholic parents, that pay property taxes just like the protestant parents, shell out several thousands of dollars a year to send their children to Catholic schools. Why? Because they accept the personal responsibility of raising their own children. On the other hand, there are other denominations that feel it is the obligation of the property owner, or the community to help raise their children. That is complete and total rubbish. Parents raise the child, the village raises the idiot! You figure it out from there.

You said it perfectly:thumbsup: :clapping: ! I pay tuition for a Private Catholic High School…I pay too much in property taxes that do not benefit my kids or me and Uncle Sam takes way to much of my $$$ each year.
I would rather get to choose where and whom to give money too…I am sure my choices would be better than Uncle Sam.

 

[katybird]

Who said anything about taxes? The OP didn’t mention taxes. The OP pointed out some disturbing FACTS about our country.

 

[Karin]

katybird:

Who said anything about taxes? The OP didn’t mention taxes. The OP pointed out some disturbing FACTS about our country.

The OP did mention taxes…
Quote gksaoh:All of us are responsible for the exploding national debt. Are tax cuts morally justified when they serve to concentrate wealth at the top?

 

[patshea1128]

katybird:

Who said anything about taxes? The OP didn’t mention taxes. The OP pointed out some disturbing FACTS about our country.

Are tax cuts morally justified when they serve to concentrate wealth at the top?

Actually, she did and that was precisely the point of her entire post. Perhaps reading comprehension is not a strong suit of yours? (note: question, not an insult) Yes, I agree, she did point out some disturbing facts about our country. Did you not recognize the fact that I addressed the root cause of those disturbing facts or were you perhaps too wrapped up in trying to make a leftist, socialist, atheistic, statement?

 

[koda]

patshea1128:

Are tax cuts morally justified when they serve to concentrate wealth at the top?

Actually, she did and that was precisely the point of her entire post. Perhaps reading comprehension is not a strong suit of yours? (note: question, not an insult) Yes, I agree, she did point out some disturbing facts about our country. Did you not recognize the fact that I addressed the root cause of those disturbing facts or were you perhaps too wrapped up in trying to make a leftist, socialist, atheistic, statement?

I do not understand why following the Lord’s commandment to take care of the least among us is atheistic. Yes, there is some abuse of social programs, but the vast majority truly need them. As for taxes, if you’re suggesting people would do the right thing (support the poor, etc) if taxes weren’t mandatory, I have to disagree with you. Most people and corporations are only looking out for #1 - which is why we have laws. Two generations ago my family was very poor. They worked hard physical labor, including working in the coal mines which destroyed their health. No pension, only social security. Being poor is not a sin, as Jesus clearly knew. One way out of poverty is a good education - but people who can barely get by can’t pay tuition. People need decent housing and health care and they deserve it just by virtue of being human. The CCC is clear on our responsibilities to the poor, sick, disabled - remember, there but for the grace of God go you.

“Whatever you do for the least of mine, you do for me.” Jesus warned us time and time again not to build our fortune in this world - yet his words seem to fall on deaf ears.

 

[patshea1128]

koda:

As for taxes, if you’re suggesting people would do the right thing (support the poor, etc) if taxes weren’t mandatory, I have to disagree with you. (

WOW, that says it all right there! You’re not a Catholic are you? In essence, what you have said is that man is inherently evil. That is not true. God made man in his own image. You most certainly belong to a Protestant church, for that is how the Protestant ministers keep protestants, protestant. They teach the flock that man is inherently evil. You, by your statements, obviously believe that. MMMM…What should I say next?

 

[Lazerlike42]

Actually his profile says he is Catholic. I don’t see where what he said necessarily indicates that he believes anything at all about theology. It just means that he knows people hate taxes, and if the government made them optional, very few people would pay them. It’s a matter of experience about living in the world, not a matter of theology.

That being said, while I agree with you to a degree, you must remember that is is Church teaching that because of the fall man is… not conformed to the image of God as he was before. it would be correct to say that left alone, without God’s Holy Spirit to guide and sanctify us, humankind would be, to a large degree, a pretty evil bunch.

 

[patshea1128]

koda:

I do not understand why following the Lord’s commandment to take care of the least among us is atheistic. (

Did the Lord say anything about using your neighbor’s money to take care of the least among us? Are you trying to separate your religion from everyday life? Do you realize that the Protestants teach that as part of their basic doctrine? Protestants are real big into separating church and state unless is happens to be their brand of religion being intermixed with the state. By the way, who is the state?

 

[patshea1128]

Lazerlike42:

Actually his profile says he is Catholic. I don’t see where what he said necessarily indicates that he believes anything at all about theology. It just means that he knows people hate taxes, and if the government made them optional, very few people would pay them. It’s a matter of experience about living in the world, not a matter of theology.

I fail to see how you can rationally, as a Catholic, separate the two. ie. taxes and religion

That being said, while I agree with you to a degree, you must remember that is is Church teaching that because of the fall man is… not conformed to the image of God as he was before. it would be correct to say that left alone, without God’s Holy Spirit to guide and sanctify us, humankind would be, to a large degree, a pretty evil bunch.

I’m not sure what you are trying to say here and I’m not so sure you understand a single thing about what the church teaches. Are you telling me the Catholic Church teaches that man is inherently evil? You and I must be going to 2 different Catholic Churches. Your church sounds more like protestantism based on your words.

 

[MariaG]

Are tax cuts morally justified? the tax cuts directly helped my family. We have a 1500 square foot home, 3 bedrooms, 3 kids and in although my husband makes enough for me to stay home, we don’t even come close to being “rich”. Is a person “rich” just because they make more than those who don’t pay taxes at all?

What is rich?

A family that makes 50,000? They were helped by tax cuts
A family that makes 75,000? They were helped
Is 100,000 a year make a family rich?

Define Rich.

 

[Karin]

MariaG:

What is rich?

Define Rich.

IMHO Rich is being able to keep the roof over your head, put food on the table, provide medical care for your family, put clothes and shoes on the backs of family members & tithe if you so wish
Being rich is not taking handouts from the government.

 

[Lazerlike42]

St. Thomas Aquinas:

I answer that, Man’s nature may be looked at in two ways: first, in its integrity, as it was in our first parent before sin; secondly, as it is corrupted in us after the sin of our first parent. Now in both states human nature needs the help of God as First Mover, to do or wish any good whatsoever, as stated above (1). But in the state of integrity, as regards the sufficiency of the operative power, man by his natural endowments could wish and do the good proportionate to his nature, such as the good of acquired virtue; but not surpassing good, as the good of infused virtue. But in the state of corrupt nature, man falls short of what he could do by his nature, so that he is unable to fulfil it by his own natural powers. Yet because human nature is not altogether corrupted by sin, so as to be shorn of every natural good, even in the state of corrupted nature it can, by virtue of its natural endowments, work some particular good, as to build dwellings, plant vineyards, and the like; yet it cannot do all the good natural to it, so as to fall short in nothing; just as a sick man can of himself make some movements, yet he cannot be perfectly moved with the movements of one in health, unless by the help of medicine he be cured.

And thus in the state of perfect nature man needs a gratuitous strength superadded to natural strength for one reason, viz. in order to do and wish supernatural good; but for two reasons, in the state of corrupt nature, viz. in order to be healed, and furthermore in order to carry out works of supernatural virtue, which are meritorious. Beyond this, in both states man needs the Divine help, that he may be moved to act well.

• newadvent.org/summa/210902.htm

Also see newadvent.org/summa/210900.htm

Also see here: cin.org/users/james/files/tulip.htm

 

[jman507]

gksaoh:

Although the U.S. is the world’s richest nation, its infant death rate compares with Malaysia. The nation’s capitol has a higher infant death rate among blacks than Kerela, India. 45,000,000 Americans lack health insurance.

Something will have to be done about the health care system. For that matter I think something is going to have to be done everywhere. At one point in time the system was ok, but then medical care inflation has just quickly out paced normal economic growth, and thats really across the whole spectrum of the industry.

Before a lot of time the system could cover those uninsured, but now there is not a lot of left over money. There is only so much care that can be written off before it hurts the system itself. You need to pay your workers, you need to pay for proper tools and equiptment.

Some people are eventually going to have to sit down and make some hard decisions. In the US it might mean uninsured people and/or a bloating Medicare/Medicade system, in other countries it might mean a ballooning budget. If say Medical care takes up 16% of GDP, then it goes up to 23% it is going to take away from other areas. It’s going to eat up more household income and more government spending.

 

[patshea1128]

jman507:

Something will have to be done about the health care system. For that matter I think something is going to have to be done everywhere. .

For starters, let’s kill all the lawyers!

 

[MikeinSD]

patshea1128:

You need to quit worrying about other people’s business and worry about yourself. The national debt is a result of people not willing to accept personal responsibility for themselves and relying on the government (ie. their taxpaying neighbor) for a handout all of the time. New Orleans should have been an eye opener to this country. Not only are tax cuts justified, they are essential to continued progress and welfare of this nation. Have you ever heard of the commandment: Thou shall not steal! Taxes, are nothing more than legalized stealing. Which part of this do you not understand? It is very simple. I owe you nothing. You owe me nothing. If I choose to help you out, that is my choice. For example, since you are on a Catholic Forum, let me give you a Catholic example. The Catholic church has it’s own schools. Catholic parents, that pay property taxes just like the protestant parents, shell out several thousands of dollars a year to send their children to Catholic schools. Why? Because they accept the personal responsibility of raising their own children. On the other hand, there are other denominations that feel it is the obligation of the property owner, or the community to help raise their children. That is complete and total rubbish. Parents raise the child, the village raises the idiot! You figure it out from there.

I take it you read Matthew’s 25th chapter. Didn’t Jesus say “As you have done to the least of these, you have done to me.” Of course Jesus might of have been talking about the capital gains tax. I just don’t think so.

 

[patshea1128]

MikeinSD:

I take it you read Matthew’s 25th chapter. Didn’t Jesus say “As you have done to the least of these, you have done to me.” Of course Jesus might of have been talking about the capital gains tax. I just don’t think so.

I’m absolutely certain Jesus did NOT have the middle man (ie. federal government) involved in any part of the equation. I have yet to find the passage in the Bible where Jesus speaks of giving to one entity unwillingly so that the entity may redistribute it as the entity sees fit. Catholicism and liberalism are entirely incompatible! Protestantism and Liberalism are a match made in hell! The truth can be very painful to some people.

 

[MikeinSD]

The only thing Jesus said about taxes was “give Caesar what is due Caesar’s” which didn’t seem a ringing endorsement of a capital gains tax cut.

Jesus talked a lot about the poor. An awful lot. Enough to suggest that decent treatment of all people, despite economic status, was a central part of his teachings. In fact, I think He instructed his followers “The Spirit of the Lord is upon me, because he has annointed me to bring good news to the poor.” The poor – the same folks we saw screaming, desperate, and dying in New Orleans.

Anyone see a divine suggestion for a tax cut for folks earning over $100,000 in anything Jesus said? How about a preference for the poor?