Infant Baptism...need help explaining why

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Hi…
I will be going to a “dedication” service this weekend for my cousins 1year old. They do not want to have her baptized because they are not practicing Catholics any longer and say they do not believe that an infant should be baptized that young because they are not able to make the decision for themselves and they do not believe in Limbo, or really the whole, what they call…“original sin thing”.

Can someone give me some ideas on what to say when they say this to me? I feel I need to defend the Churchs teaching on infant baptism, as well as speak the truth to my cousin to help her understand. She was born and raised Catholic, but married a Pentecostal. She does not agree with much of what the Church teaches…and she just lately told me that ‘the Bible has been rewritten and handed down from so long…that you cant really expect to follow it word for word because alot of what was originally said has prob been changed’. http://forum.catholic.org/images/smiles/icon_neutral.gif Hum…so this is thought process I am dealing with…

Any suggestions on explaining infant baptism to someone who doesnt really even believe that the Bible is infallible?

Any help would be great…we go on Saturday…

p.s. Do you think its ok as Catholics to go to a non-denominational church service like this. I am going because she is family.

Kraftster
 
And all the while I thought the Grace of Justification was a FREE Gift. Infant Baptism is the Salutary proof of that Cath. & Prot doctrine.

Let’s be glad they are not Jewish. Couldn’t you see them telling the rabbi that no circumcism for their newborn. Just not old enough to request it on their own! I believe God intended to KILL Moses for that idea.

Certainly in line with this thinking, no shots, no medicne until old enough to know what it’s all about. No changing diapers until the baby asks for it either.:bigyikes:

Babes are in the care and authority of parents, both physical and spiritual.

Are newborns Citizens of the Country, yet with no citizen rights to vote, make contracts, nor can they be prosecuted. So, why do the parents allow them citizenship if the babe had NO sayso whatsoever, and cannot even practice their rights? The answer is because they would be under the protection of NO country, and would be international ORPHANS. Their BIRTH Certificate makes them citizens.
Baptism makes one a member of the Church otherwise they remain spiritual ORPHANS. They have NO citizenship to Heaven. NONE. NADA, ZIP. They have no BAPTISM certificate to reveal membership.
There is NO EXCEPTION to: “unless a man be BORN again, of WATER & the HS, he CANNOT enter the Kingdom of Heaven.” That is from God Almighty, and all other Apostolic revelation must conform to it
When God said “do not prevent the little babes from coming to Him”, He knew that adults COULD prevent them. Otherwise why did He say “do not prevent”? And so some still do by denying the waters of Salvation.

Are the parents going to teach this person at the age of reason, ALL the religions of the world so they can REALLY decide for themselves, or are they going to allow only ONE religion be taught to them, and thus prejudice their whole so-called selection to choose Christ only in a particular sect?

By their own admission, the babe is a heathen BECAUSE he has made NO choice for Christ! DO heathens go to heaven, if so, where does the bible reveal it?

2/3’s of the biblical baptisms were “WHOLE HOUSEHOLDS” .
BTW:
What exactly is this “dedication” suppose to dedicate what to who??
Is this babe old enough to responsibly “CHOOSE” to be “dedicated”?
 
How do I explain that the parent’s roll in infant baptism? Since the Child cannot make the decision for itself how does the parent’s “I believes” “rub off” on the infant?
 
I would take a stab like this. The parents cooperated with God to bring the child into the physical world. Now, the parents cooperate with God through the Sacrament of Baptism to bring the child’s soul to into the Grace of the spiritual realm and ultimately to Heaven should the child die after Baptism but before personal sin. Hope this helps a little. Thanks and God Bless.
 
I would not attend the service. Attendance is de facto approval.
 
p.s. Do you think its ok as Catholics to go to a non-denominational church service like this. I am going because she is family.
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Be true to yourself.👍

Fat lotta help that was…

Pulling the faithful away from the Pentacostals is very difficult. They are attracted to the din, the noise makes them feel secure. The Church is a place of quiet contemplation, not always very comfortable. (Ever been in a group where no one had anything to talk about so everyone just stood around feeling foolish:?)
 
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PioMagnus:
How do I explain that the parent’s roll in infant baptism? Since the Child cannot make the decision for itself how does the parent’s “I believes” “rub off” on the infant?
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The same way the Parents’ “I believe” “rubbed off” in Circumcision.
Baptism is more than a profession of Faith.
  1. Removes effect of Original Sin from the soul.
  2. Gives the habitation of Sanctifying Grace
  3. Makes one a member of the Church of Christ-The Mystical Body.
  4. Fulfills the command that all must be BORN AGAIN of Water and the Holy Spirit.
  5. Making one suitable for seeing the “Kingdom of Heaven”.
    (Jn 3)
    1-5 are perfectly suited to the infant, the retarded, the sick.
 
In the 1950’s and 1960’s, there was a common belief in the theology of “limbo.” That idea is not currently entertained or held at all. What is taught now is that if a child dies without the sacrament of baptism, we believe that this child is at the mercy of our benevolent Lord and Savior. Who once said, let the little children come to me. So inevitably, he would embrace these innocent lives into his own.

It is a requirement of the Catholic church that in order for a baby to baptized into the Catholic Church, the parents must consent to it, first and also agree to raise the child up into the Catholic faith.
If that is not going to happen, no good intentions of the grandparents, relatives etc can bring that child to be baptized. However, in the case of impending death of a child, anyone can perform an emergency baptism, even if the parents do not consent to it. Most of all, keep praying for the parent’s conversion and also for the little one. As far as going along with the dedication service, personally I would be otherwise preoccupied…Provide the little one with a small gift…like a book about his guardian angel or something like that.
 
Great answer, can I copy it for my sister? How would you also address that they (Church of Christ) don’t believe that baptism removes original sin. I get kinda lost in their theology-am trying to be VERY respectful-they agree baptism is required for salvation, but that original sin was not passed on from Adam or something?

I know being too general on Church of Christ theology would be a mistake too. I can’t keep up with the difference in the 3 here in the same town.

Oh, I forgot, they are absolutely opposed to infant baptism and it must be immersion.
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TNT:
The same way the Parents’ “I believe” “rubbed off” in Circumcision.
Baptism is more than a profession of Faith.
  1. Removes effect of Original Sin from the soul.
  2. Gives the habitation of Sanctifying Grace
  3. Makes one a member of the Church of Christ-The Mystical Body.
  4. Fulfills the command that all must be BORN AGAIN of Water and the Holy Spirit.
  5. Making one suitable for seeing the “Kingdom of Heaven”.
    (Jn 3)
    1-5 are perfectly suited to the infant, the retarded, the sick.
Click to expand...
 
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PJR:
Great answer, can I copy it for my sister? How would you also address that they (Church of Christ) don’t believe that baptism removes original sin. I get kinda lost in their theology-am trying to be VERY respectful-they agree baptism is required for salvation, but that original sin was not passed on from Adam or something?

I know being too general on Church of Christ theology would be a mistake too. I can’t keep up with the difference in the 3 here in the same town.

Oh, I forgot, they are absolutely opposed to infant baptism and it must be immersion.
Click to expand...
COC is my “favorite” prot sect, though they deny being a sect.
I have spent many years examining, conversing with them. About 80% of what they believe is Catholic.
The BIGGEST heresy they practice is complete denial of Original sin passing on from Adam.
This is THE one cause of no infant baptism. They believe all are Immaculate Conceptions.
The second reason is that they believe that one must reach the age of reason AND sin to even need Baptism.
This sect comes from the legacy of Presbyterian mixed with Baptist theology.
They believe that ALL sin is equal in condemnation from stealing a candy bar to mass murder-all equal to condemnation.
I have relatives that are strict conservative COC.
Now, UNLESS you can get them to agree that Original sin ie the privation of Sanctifying (justifying) Grace , then you go nowhere in convincing them of infant Baptism.
They will, in the meantime, “bible” you to nausea about ACTUAL sin is required for Baptism.
They do, in contradiction, believe all that Baptism does in my post 3-5 you referred to. Which, of course is Catholic, and anti-Baptist but pro-presbyterian.
It is difficult for them to give a cogent reason WHY an infant is a member of the Church, but has no baptism to prove it. Then, how does one become “un-churched” at the age of reason, and sins. Yet, they admit that they sin throughout life, and THAT does not un-church them nor does it require re-baptism, just a public confession of any sin which harms another. Go figure.
Their theology is just not well thought out, thus they will refuse to discuss the contradictions.
Finally, not all COC members believe the very same doctrine. So, what is true for one may not be true for another.
I’ll get you some sites for COC Catholic convert apologetics on my next post.
It is interesting that a large number of their conversions are former ignorant or fallen away Catholics.
ps. You can copy any post you want. No permission needed. If there is a site quotation, then that may be different. The site or person needs credit. Otherwise adopt it as your own.
I never tire of discussing COC theology. so if you choose, you can email me any time about a specific. If you have MS Word software, I can send you just about anything they believe or the rebuttals.
God Bless,
Pray for my dear relatives as I will for yours.
 
The Catholic church believes in two types of baptism, pouring of water over the head of the child as well as immersion. Some parishes have provision to do immersion and others do not. But both ways are perfectable identifiable means of baptism in the Catholic church.
 
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