Innovations following Vatican 2 - References Only

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Lux_et_veritas

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I’m looking to compile some references on several topics that have been alleged to be innovations associated with Vatican 2, as opposed to being true documented changes of Vatican 2.

Please do not make any posts in this forum regarding your personal opinion or personal preference regarding any of the topics below. I know this will be tempting and I will ask the moderators to help keep this thread on target for collecting reference material by educated experts.

I am aware that there are many people within this forum that have researched various topics and have references. If you have an internet link, provide it with some text (follow forum rules). If you are going to reference a book, please cite the book name, copyright date, author, and page numbers you are quoting.

In particular, I am looking for comments out of church heirarchy, such as Cardinal Arinze, Ratzinger, or other experts.

Please do not quote or link this thread to any material written by those no longer in communion with the Catholic Church or who largely support schismatic sects. I want material from indisputable sources, such as Arinze or Ratzinger, and the like.

Topics (more may be added later)
  1. Were communion rails removed due to Vatican 2 instruction?
  2. Was distribution of Holy Communion from the tongue to the hand part of Vatican 2 instruction? Please provide any history.
  3. Was distribution of Holy Communion while standing part of Vatican 2 instruction? Please provide any history.
  4. Was orans posture part of Vatican 2 instruction? Please provide any history.
  5. Altar server attire from cassock to white, hooded robes - Vatican 2 instruction or not? Please provide history.
  6. Sign of Peace - Vatican 2 instruction? Provide history.
  7. Position of Tabernacle outside of sanctuary - PRovide History
Please provide history from any book or source following guidelines above. Don’t limit it to what is on the web.
 
fix said:
***
SACROSANCTUM CONCILIUM

vatican.va/archive/hist_councils/ii_vatican_council/documents/vat-ii_const_19631204_sacrosanctum-concilium_en.html***
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Hey fix - thanks for the link. I should probably clarify, that it would be nice to point out which of my points you are addressing, if not all, and give us the gist of what it says. As long as we can click and read what you are claiming, that is what I am after. Sorry if it came across wrongly.

Many people are making claims, but there is nothing concrete to reference for a specific issue. This thread can serve as a depot to pick up these references since the topics I posted seem to be hot-button, frequently discussed issues.
 
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Lux_et_veritas:
Hey fix - thanks for the link. I should probably clarify, that it would be nice to point out which of my points you are addressing, if not all, and give us the gist of what it says. As long as we can click and read what you are claiming, that is what I am after. Sorry if it came across wrongly.

Many people are making claims, but there is nothing concrete to reference for a specific issue. This thread can serve as a depot to pick up these references since the topics I posted seem to be hot-button, frequently discussed issues.
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I think I know what you are getting at and I think it is a great idea.

I have not found the information you seek, but this site has online versions of the missals from 1962 and 1970:

catholicliturgy.com/index.cfm/FuseAction/TextContents/Index/4/SubIndex/67/TextIndex/9
 
Ok, just found this on Orans Posture during the Our Father.

This is only a history of Orans Posture as described by Adoremus Bulletin. They explain in pretty good detail why there has been so much confusion. They base it off of questions they were receiving as to whether it is a required posture, as some were saying they were being told at the time. It goes through quite a bit of history and talks about the Sacramentary, which I did not know about. This is where some US Bishops were attempting to have it added. That entire* ICEL Sacramentary* was, as Adoremus puts it, “specifically rejected” and the GIRM took its place.

If anyone finds any other history on this please post it here, as I know that this began some time after Vatican 2, so it is quite obvious this did not originate there.

adoremus.org/1103OransPosture.html
 
Q) Was distribution of Holy Communion from the tongue to the hand part of Vatican 2 instruction? Please provide any history.

A) ewtn.com/library/CURIA/CDWREPON.HTM

Letter to presidents of those conferences of bishops petitioning the indult for communion in the hand, 29 May 1969: AAS 61 (1969) 546-47 (French).

In reply to the request of your conference of bishops regarding permission to give communion by placing the host on the hand of the faithful, I wish to communicate the following.

Pope Paul VI calls attention to the purpose of the instruction “Memoriale Domini” of 29 May, 1969, on retaining the traditional practice in use. At the same time he has taken into account the reasons given to support your request and the outcome of the vote taken on this matter. The Pope grants that throughout the territory of your conference, each bishop may, according to his prudent judgment and conscience, authorize the introduction in his diocese of the new rite for giving communion. The condition is the complete avoidance of any cause for the faithful to be shocked and of any danger of irreverence toward the Eucharist.
 
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Lux_et_veritas:
I’m looking to compile some references on several topics that have been alleged to be innovations associated with Vatican 2, as opposed to being true documented changes of Vatican 2.
  1. Was orans posture part of Vatican 2 instruction? Please provide any history.
Please provide history from any book or source following guidelines above. Don’t limit it to what is on the web.
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Is this right?

Orans for priests…
Q u i c k Q u e s t i o n s SHOULD WE LIFT OUR HANDS IN PRAYER?
Code: 
                 **Q: In my parish many people at Mass hold their hands up while praying, like the priest does. I heard that this is an ancient posture of prayer and that it is good to pray this way. Is this true?**
A: One can pray in whatever posture one feels is most conducive to prayer if one is engaging in private, non-liturgical prayer. However, when one is praying in a liturgical service, such as Mass, there are rules to be followed.

It is true that praying with arms outstretched is one of the historic postures of prayer. However, this fact alone does not mean that it is to be used in any and all circumstances.

Prostrating oneself on one’s face is also a historic posture of prayer, but neither the priest nor the laity are directed to assume this posture during a regular Mass. During a Mass where ordinations are taking place, the candidates for ordination are directed to prostrate themselves during the Litany of the Saints. However, if people were to assume this posture willy-nilly, in any Mass, the liturgy could be seriously impeded.

This is why people are supposed to adopt those postures the rubrics direct them to adopt and not other ones. Switching to a different posture causes problems in the liturgy, either physically or symbolically.

In the case of the laity praying with arms outstretched, it causes both physical and symbolic problems in the liturgy.

It causes physical problems because the laity typically sit right next to each other in pews. If they fully extended their arms, people would be whapped in the face or knocked out the pew. If they only partially extend their arms, everybody gets cramped unnecessarily. Either way, it is not a good idea, for physical reasons alone, for the laity to begin stretching their arms out in prayer at Mass.

There are also symbolic problems associated with their doing so. No matter how the posture may or may not have been used in antiquity, today it is a priestly posture in the liturgy.

This is repeatedly made clear in the Church’s liturgical documents. For example, the Ceremonial of Bishops notes: “Customarily in the Church a bishop or presbyter addresses prayers to God while standing with hands slightly raised and outstretched” (CB 104).

Similarly, in the Book of Blessings, whenever there is a blessing which can be performed either by a member of the clergy or the laity, the rubrics invariably directs that “A minister who is a priest or deacon says the prayer of blessing with hands outstretched; a lay minister says the prayer with hands joined” (BB 1999). Over and over again, the rubrics direct clergy to pray with hands outstretched and laity with hands joined.

Because of the special association praying with hands outstretched has with priestly office, some dissident elements in the Church have desired to get the laity into the habit of praying in this posture during Mass. This furthers the dissident agenda of continuing to blur the line between the laity and the clergy.

Fortunately, the recent Instruction on Collaboration (Nov. 13, 1997) drew the line on this issue and specifically mandated that “Neither may . . . non-ordained members of the faithful use gestures or actions which are proper to the . . . priest celebrant” (ICP, Practical Provisions 6 §2).

The reference to gestures that are appropriate to the priest celebrating the Mass certainly includes praying with arms outstretched, which is probably the single most frequent gesture the rubrics direct him to make during Mass and which is clearly tied to the office of priest in the Church’s liturgical documents.

Consequently, in the liturgy, laity should not be praying with hands outstretched.

James Akin
 
  1. Position of Tabernacle outside of sanctuary - Provide History
adoremus.org/eucharisticummysterium.html

***Eucharisticum Mysterium
*Instruction on Eucharistic Worship

Sacred Congregation of Rites

**May 25, 1967

54. The Tabernacle in the Middle of the Altar or in Some Other Part of the Church

“The Blessed Sacrament should be reserved in a solid, inviolable tabernacle in the middle of the main altar or on a secondary altar, but in a truly prominent place. Alternatively, according to legitimate customs and in individual cases to be decided by the local Ordinary, it may be placed in some other part of the church which is really worthy and properly equipped.
"Mass may be celebrated facing the people even though there is a tabernacle on the altar, provided this is small yet adequate.”
 
ewtn.com/library/Liturgy/LITURIND.HTM

*Father Edward McNamara, Professor of Liturgy at the *Regina Apostolorum Pontifical Athenaeum, answers common questions on liturgical norms, as published by ZENIT, the international news agency reporting from Rome.

Altar Rails, Removal of
Altar rails may be removed, if they are an obstacle to distribution of Communion, but “great care must be taken before altering churches of certain historical value or even particular elements of a church that may have particular artistic merit.”
 
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Joysong:
Q) Was distribution of Holy Communion from the tongue to the hand part of Vatican 2 instruction? Please provide any history.

A) ewtn.com/library/CURIA/CDWREPON.HTM

Letter to presidents of those conferences of bishops petitioning the indult for communion in the hand, 29 May 1969: AAS 61 (1969) 546-47 (French).

In reply to the request of your conference of bishops regarding permission to give communion by placing the host on the hand of the faithful, I wish to communicate the following.

Pope Paul VI calls attention to the purpose of the instruction “Memoriale Domini” of 29 May, 1969, on retaining the traditional practice in use. At the same time he has taken into account the reasons given to support your request and the outcome of the vote taken on this matter. The Pope grants that throughout the territory of your conference, each bishop may, according to his prudent judgment and conscience, authorize the introduction in his diocese of the new rite for giving communion. The condition is the complete avoidance of any cause for the faithful to be shocked and of any danger of irreverence toward the Eucharist.
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Well, this kind of confirms my suspicion that it was in the late 1960’s when it was granted.

Now, I’m hoping people can provide history on when parishes actually began implementing this, which based on what my sister told me, happened while she was still in elementary school. She graduated from high school in 1968 and if she remembers the priest sobbing because he had to deliver Communion to the hand (out of obedience to bishop) when she was a little girl, then certainly it was happening prior to 1969. From what I recall, she estimated her age to be about10-12. She distinctly remembers how one day they could not touch the rail with their hands, which had to be covered in a rail cloth, to getting Communion in the hands. While she has no problem receiving this way she said it was highly traumatic as a child and still has issues with how it was all done.

Now my sister’s account is second hand information. If there are folks reading this post that even recall being forced to receive in the hand prior to 1969, that would be considered personal testimony and is a form of data. However, I’m also hoping to find something written, article or other document which reveals that Communion in the hand became a “norm” before it permission was granted.
 
This is all I’ve got. Keep in mind, I’m hardly an expert on Vatican II and may be in error. See my comments below in red.
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Lux_et_veritas:
  1. Were communion rails removed due to Vatican 2 instruction? Negative.
  2. Was distribution of Holy Communion from the tongue to the hand part of Vatican 2 instruction? Please provide any history. Negative. In fact, an instruction from the Sacred Congregation for Divine Worship, Memoriale Domini dated May 29, 1969 said, in part: "Thus the custom was established of the minister placing a particle of consecrated bread on the tongue of the communicant. This method of distributing holy communion must be retained." (emphasis mine) However, (Rome giveth and Rome taketh away) this Instruction was accompanied by a letter which opened the door for episcopal conferences to ask for permission to approve the practice of hand reception by a 2/3 majority where the abuse had already become firmly established. This might be seen as a prudential error in judgement by the Holy See.
  3. Was distribution of Holy Communion while standing part of Vatican 2 instruction? Please provide any history. This was another post-Conciliar concession, but I can’t cite a source.
  4. Was orans posture part of Vatican 2 instruction? Please provide any history. I don’t know, this seems a more recent innovation.
  5. Altar server attire from cassock to white, hooded robes - Vatican 2 instruction or not? Please provide history. Don’t know, but I doubt the Council delved into the minutia of what, at that time, altar boys were wearing.
  6. Sign of Peace - Vatican 2 instruction? Provide history. The only thing I can find is a reference in the GIRM issued with the revised Roman Missal in 1970 which allowed local Bishops’ Conferences to establish guidelines for the Rite of Peace in accordance with local sensibilities.
  7. Position of Tabernacle outside of sanctuary - PRovide History. I believe this came about in a post-Conciliar instruction, Eucharisticum Mysterium dated May 25, 1967 not from the Council itself.
Please provide history from any book or source following guidelines above. Don’t limit it to what is on the web.
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Or I could’ve just waited since everyone else already posted my answers.

Way to make me look like a dope, my fellow boardies. :o
 
Maybe you forgot to include this in your list. Dumspiro was concerned about nonordained lectors, and we had touched on it briefly. These are permitted to serve God’s people in accordance with Canon Law, in case he or others need documentation:

Can. 230 §1 Lay men whose age and talents meet the requirements prescribed by decree of the Episcopal Conference, can be given the stable ministry of lector and of acolyte, through the prescribed liturgical rite. This conferral of ministry does not, however, give them a right to sustenance or remuneration from the Church.

§2 Lay people can receive a temporary assignment to the role of lector in liturgical actions. Likewise, all lay people can exercise the roles of commentator, cantor or other such, in accordance with the law.
 
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Joysong:
Maybe you forgot to include this in your list. Dumspiro was concerned about nonordained lectors, and we had touched on it briefly. These are permitted to serve God’s people in accordance with Canon Law, in case he or others need documentation:

Can. 230 §1 Lay men whose age and talents meet the requirements prescribed by decree of the Episcopal Conference, can be given the stable ministry of lector and of acolyte, through the prescribed liturgical rite. This conferral of ministry does not, however, give them a right to sustenance or remuneration from the Church.

§2 Lay people can receive a temporary assignment to the role of lector in liturgical actions. Likewise, all lay people can exercise the roles of commentator, cantor or other such, in accordance with the law.
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I took dumspiro to be talking about* preference. * However, since this thread is about which of these things were actually written in to Vatican 2 as opposed to being implemented after, then lets dig into this one too. It is history that I am after.

I’m trying to establish or ascertain if there were practices put into place prior to the approval of the Holy See. This would, of course, exclude any indults granted for specific parishes. Maybe no parish implemented all of these things before they were actually written into some form of document granting them. However, from all that I have heard from people who have been with the church since pre-v2, is that changes were implemented before approvals. I’m attempting to identify which ones.
 
In this sense your parish priest’s comment that the removal of the rail is consistent with the liturgical changes is broadly correct. Yet, no document explicitly mandates or even suggests that the removal of altar rails is required by the liturgical reform…
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The controversy following the application of the U.S. norms (that Communion be received standing) have shown that in this case the norm issued by the bishops’ conference is more an indication of prevalent custom than a strict legal obligation. Thus, a member of the faithful may still kneel if moved to do so by personal devotion…
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The abandonment of the altar rail seems to be a practical consequence of the permission to receive Communion standing and, later, from the indult allowing Communion in the hand and a wider use of the Blessed Sacrament under both species.

This change was never mandated in law. Indeed, there are still places where the custom of kneeling at the rail has been preserved, above all in countries where Communion in the hand is not yet permitted.
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ewtn.com/library/Liturgy/zlitur67.htm
 
I think it is necessary to distinguish between minister, either ordained (bishop, priest and deacon) or instituted (acolyte and lector) and those who may be delegated in some cases to substitute for them.

Thus the formal ministries of the Church are open only to males, while altar servers, readers and extraordinary ministers of Communion, whose function is to substitute for the lack of proper ministers, may be delegated to Catholics of either sex.

Even when these functions are carried out frequently, or even daily, they will always be essentially delegated and substitutive. In this context the canonical decision to open service at the altar to girls was logical since every other delegated ministry had already been opened up.

This is certainly a break with a very long-standing custom of having only males serve at the altar even in substitutive roles. But it does not appear to be an issue of doctrine.ewtn.com/library/Liturgy/zlitur19.htm
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I find this interesting, but it does not answer the position of those who claim female servers were introduced without permission prior to their authorization from Rome.
 
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Lux_et_veritas:
If anyone finds any other history on this please post it here, as I know that this began some time after Vatican 2, so it is quite obvious this did not originate there.
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Actually, the orans position is an ancient position of prayer in the Church. See this article in the online *Catholic Encyclopedia, *search down to the sentence:
It is remarkable that the “orantes” (praying figures) of early Christian art are in the catacomb frescoes invariably depicted as standing with arms extended.
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which will provide more information on this.

Deacon Ed
 
Deacon Ed:
Actually, the orans position is an ancient position of prayer in the Church. See this article in the online Catholic Encyclopedia, search down to the sentence: which will provide more information on this.

Deacon Ed
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Hi Deacon Ed,

I understand there are historical issues that go all the way back to the time of Christ on some of the things I raised. These are fine, but it is modern history that I am looking for. The years leading up to Vatican 2, Vatican 2 itself, and the years following Vatican 2. I should have clarified that.

Thanks!
 
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