Inter-Church marriage and growing together

[wanderingone]

I have question and I’m wondering what others might think?

My wife and I are part of an interchurch marriage and we’ve been married 19 years.

We respect each others faith and we’ve become much closer now that we are both totally engaged in christian churches.

There are some differences, but we are accepting of them.

I’m considering a Believer’s Baptism in the baptist church and I can’t find anything that would compromise my faith.

In this church, it is about displaying your commitment to Christ to the community.

Although I’ve reconciled with the Church, the concept of being born again is also fitting because we did stray for quite a while and both came fully back to Chist although in different ways.

I don’t see anything wrong with this and I don’t feel it compromises my faith.

If anything, it is recommitting to my walk in Christ

I don’t see anything that contradicts the Catholic church either.

I believe in christian unity and will always strive for that and I was wondering what others thought about that

Is there something wrong with proclaiming my faith to a community, especially if it brings my wife and I even closer?

Can participation in non-Catholic churches enhance our Catholic faith and walk in Christ?

 

[1ke]

As a Catholic, you cannot do a “believer’s baptism” in another ecclesial community. Catholics are not permitted to participate in other denominations liturgies, services, or sacramental rites.

Go talk to your priest.

If you feel you need to rededicate yourself to Christ, that is what the Sacrament of Reconciliation is for.

 

[rinnie]

Also the only place that you can receive the Eucharist is in the Catholic Church, you are sure giving up alot if you give up the CC.

 

[wanderingone]

I’m just wondering about this though. It is found in the Guidelines of Ecumenism. Not sure if it really addresses the question and what it really means.

1. According to the local situation and as occasion may arise, Catholics may, in common celebration with other Christians, commemorate the baptism which unites them, by renewing the engagement to undertake a full Christian life which they have assumed in the promises of their baptism, and by pledging to cooperate with the grace of the Holy Spirit in striving to heal the divisions which exist among Christians.

vatican.va/roman_curia/pontifical_councils/chrstuni/general-docs/rc_pc_chrstuni_doc_19930325_directory_en.html

 

[Seatuck]

I’m just wondering about this though. It is found in the Guidelines of Ecumenism. Not sure if it really addresses the question and what it really means.

1. According to the local situation and as occasion may arise, Catholics may, in common celebration with other Christians, commemorate the baptism which unites them, by renewing the engagement to undertake a full Christian life which they have assumed in the promises of their baptism, and by pledging to cooperate with the grace of the Holy Spirit in striving to heal the divisions which exist among Christians.

vatican.va/roman_curia/pontifical_councils/chrstuni/general-docs/rc_pc_chrstuni_doc_19930325_directory_en.html

Although I’ve reconciled with the Church, the concept of being born again is also fitting because we did stray for quite a while and both came fully back to Chist although in different ways.

You were born again. In baptism.
A believers baptism usually ignores or denies the properties of water baptism which is the forgiveness of sins. Water baptism is what unites us.

Why don’t you submit this to Father Serpa or call up your diocese and ask them? I know I’m not truly qualified to answer it. But my guts are saying no. To stand up in front of the Baptist church and make a statement is a public denial of your baptism in the Catholic Church.
I’m pretty sure the above quote from the document on ecumenism involves a jointly held service. With leaders from both churches. A planned ecumencial event. Not an individual Catholic in an individual non catholic church.

 

[kage_ar]

What the Vatican statement means is that you can go attend a valid baptism at non-Catholic Church, and if they ask everyone to repeat the baptismal vows you can repeat along.

Baptists do not take baptismal vows, so, it would not even matter at a Baptist congregation - it simply means you can attend when someone else is validly baptized there.

Scripture leads the Catholics -

One Lord, One Faith, ONE Baptism.

 

[Seatuck]

I have question and I’m wondering what others might think?

My wife and I are part of an interchurch marriage and we’ve been married 19 years.

We respect each others faith and we’ve become much closer now that we are both totally engaged in christian churches.

There are some differences, but we are accepting of them.

I’m considering a Believer’s Baptism in the baptist church and I can’t find anything that would compromise my faith.

In this church, it is about displaying your commitment to Christ to the community.

Although I’ve reconciled with the Church, the concept of being born again is also fitting because we did stray for quite a while and both came fully back to Chist although in different ways.

I don’t see anything wrong with this and I don’t feel it compromises my faith.

If anything, it is recommitting to my walk in Christ

I don’t see anything that contradicts the Catholic church either.

I believe in christian unity and will always strive for that and I was wondering what others thought about that

Is there something wrong with proclaiming my faith to a community, especially if it brings my wife and I even closer?

Can participation in non-Catholic churches enhance our Catholic faith and walk in Christ?

There isn’t anything wrong with proclaiming your faith to a community. But are you doing that? Are you proclaiming the Catholic Faith to this community? You seem to be proclaiming faith in their community by doing this. That is problematic in my opinion. Your role in ecumenism is to help them become Catholic , isn’t it?

 

[smallcat]

I don’t know anything about the Baptist faith or traditions, but it sounds like a “believer’s baptism” would entail assenting to the *Baptist *beliefs – many of which are indeed dramatically different from Catholic teachings and beliefs. So, no, I don’t see how you could do that and remain a faithful Catholic.

I did, however, want to respond to this from 1ke:

Catholics are not permitted to participate in other denominations liturgies, services, or sacramental rites

Catholics certainly may not participate in another denomination’s communion service, but it is my understanding (please correct me if I am wrong) that a Catholic may participate in the service or liturgy of another denomination by attending, singing hymns, reading scripture, listening to sermons, and the like. To my mind, these kind of activities do indeed promote ecumenism (assuming none of the above activities contain anything which contradicts the Catholic faith). I have seen many interfaith/interdenominational marriages grown closer through the spouses’ participation in the other’s faith traditions.

 

[wanderingone]

Interestingly this church is completely independent. Which of course has its pro’s and con’s. But this church has a surprising alignment to Catholic teachings, I haven’t come across anything that has made me say “That is not true” based on my Catholic understandings. It’s almost like they believe in most of the Catholic teachings but worship a different way.

It’s not what I had always thought of in a Baptist church.

 

[Seatuck]

Interestingly this church is completely independent. Which of course has its pro’s and con’s. But this church has a surprising alignment to Catholic teachings, I haven’t come across anything that has made me say “That is not true” based on my Catholic understandings. It’s almost like they believe in most of the Catholic teachings but worship a different way.

It’s not what I had always thought of in a Baptist church.

It’s bound to happen with over 30,000 denominations of christianity that one or two would develop many of the same beliefs. Doesn’t give them any authority though.

 

[1ke]

Catholics certainly may not participate in another denomination’s communion service, but it is my understanding (please correct me if I am wrong) that a Catholic may participate in the service or liturgy of another denomination by attending, singing hymns, reading scripture, listening to sermons, and the like. To my mind, these kind of activities do indeed promote ecumenism (assuming none of the above activities contain anything which contradicts the Catholic faith). I have seen many interfaith/interdenominational marriages grown closer through the spouses’ participation in the other’s faith traditions.

They could not “read scripture” as something akin to a lector. They could “read scripture” in the sense of following along in a bible or missal.

Certainly attendance can be permitted, as can singing.

That is not what I meant when I said “participate”. He wants to “participate” in a ceremony as if he were a member of this church-- i.e. the “believer’s baptism”. That is what I meant by liturgies, sacraments, rites, cermonies, etc.

Catholics may attend. They may not participate, except in limited ways such as witnessing a wedding, baptism, etc.

 

[kage_ar]

Interestingly this church is completely independent. Which of course has its pro’s and con’s. But this church has a surprising alignment to Catholic teachings, I haven’t come across anything that has made me say “That is not true” based on my Catholic understandings. It’s almost like they believe in most of the Catholic teachings but worship a different way.

It’s not what I had always thought of in a Baptist church.

Do they believe that Baptism is only a symbol done in obedience? Then they do not share the Catholic belief in Baptism.

Do they believe that he bread and wine become the ACTUAL body and blood of Christ? Then they do not align with Catholic teachings.

Do they have sacramental confession?

Do they believe in Sola Scriptura?

What about Faith Alone?

Becareful, it sounds as if you are also close to the falling into the danger of indifference that is warned about in the Catechism when a Catholic marries a non-Catholic.

 

[Thomas63116]

First, welcome to the forums and thank you for posting.

I think part of the answer to this question depends on what a “believers baptism” entails at your wife’s church. Have you witnessed one previously? What happens?

I am not terribly familiar with Baptist practices, but my understanding is that this would most likely be a water baptism with the recitation of a baptismal formula. In other words, it would essentially replicate your prior baptism in the Catholic church. As Catholics, we believe that baptism leaves an indelible mark on the soul and cannot be repeated. You are already baptized. Receiving a “new” baptism would seem to imply that your first baptism “didn’t take.” I would find that very troubling.

On the other hand, what you are describing may be more of a recitation of faith, without a water baptism. Publicly proclaiming the elements of Christian faith that you as a Catholic share with this congregation would not be as troubling. It might be similar to reciting the Apostles’ Creed along with the congregation at another church. However, even if that were the case, I would still be troubled by calling it a “baptism” when you are already baptized and one of the essential elements of a valid baptism (water) is missing.

I’m curious about many other elements of how you and your wife have lived your inter-church marriage, including whether your were married in the church, how you have raised any children, whether she is attending Mass with you regularly, etc. But I don;t want to derail the thread if you don’t want to go into those details.

 

[capsaicin]

Do they believe that he bread and wine become the ACTUAL body and blood of Christ? Then they do not align with Catholic teachings.

Actually, this would be in line with Catholic teaching, would it not? If they believe Transubstantiation happens?

Of course, their ministers still have no Apostolic authority to preside over said sacrament/miracle…

 

[kage_ar]

Actually, this would be in line with Catholic teaching, would it not? If they believe Transubstantiation happens?

Of course, their ministers still have no Apostolic authority to preside over said sacrament/miracle…

Baptists believe that communion is symbolic - the answer he gets should he ask that question will not be in line with Catholic teaching.

 

[wanderingone]

Their baptisms are with water and as part of it they explain that the baptism they perform is for the baptee to publicly show that they have chosen the walk with Christ to the rest of the church. With the father, son, and holy spirit etc…

Still can’t say I see anything wrong with that.

My wife and I have always stayed connected with spirit, through different paths. We were married very young and even through we’ve traveled through many paths, we’ve always found ways to grow together.

Unfortunately, this doesn’t seem possible without one or the other giving up their church, or what they are connected to, so that they can continue growing together, be engaged with each other, and be present in their walks together.

 

[capsaicin]

If you don’t see anything wrong with it, then you are willfully and forcefully ignoring the truth of baptism as a sacrament and the explanations given you here. You cannot be baptized again, and if you participate in this ritual, it might negatively impact your membership in the Catholic church. One of the ways to end your membership in the Catholic church is to publicly make a profession of faith in another church’s teaching and doctrine, and a public water baptism would seem to fulfill that.

If you want to remain Catholic don’t do it…

Never mind the insult to God. By doing this, you would be saying that your first baptism wasn’t good enough and you need another. You would be telling God He wasn’t powerful enough to claim you and cleanse you of original sin the first time, so let’s have another go at it! That attitude leads to bad things… read the story of the time Moses, in the desert, struck the rock twice for water instead of only once as God commanded him. For that momentary lapse, that tiny lack of faith in God’s power and promises, God barred Moses from entering the Holy Land with the people he brought out of Egypt!

 

[kage_ar]

Maybe get a copy of the Compendium of the Catechism (or access it on-line herehttp://www.vatican.va/archive/compendium_ccc/documents/archive_2005_compendium-ccc_en.html ) - and read together with your wife.

Another great study would be “Common Ground” from www.catholicprotestant.com

Last suggestion, “Catholicism For Dummies”.

These will give both you, and your wife, insight into what we as Catholics believe.

Perhaps she would attend RCIA with you, and seek to join you in full Communion with the One Holy Apostolic Catholic Church!

 

[Thomas63116]

Their baptisms are with water and as part of it they explain that the baptism they perform is for the baptee to publicly show that they have chosen the walk with Christ to the rest of the church. With the father, son, and holy spirit etc…

Still can’t say I see anything wrong with that.

Do you see how a “new” baptism would suggest something incomplete and/or deficient in your “old” baptism?

Unfortunately, this doesn’t seem possible without one or the other giving up their church, or what they are connected to, so that they can continue growing together, be engaged with each other, and be present in their walks together.

How have you managed for the past 19 years? What seems different now?

 

[1ke]

Their baptisms are with water and as part of it they explain that the baptism they perform is for the baptee to publicly show that they have chosen the walk with Christ to the rest of the church. With the father, son, and holy spirit etc…

Still can’t say I see anything wrong with that.

The Catholic Church expressly states that one can be baptized only once. You are baptized.

To attempt another baptism would be rejecting Church teaching on baptism and respecting its rules regarding participation in non-Catholic services. This is very serious. Again, talk to your priest and let him explain why you cannot be baptized again.

This isn’t just about you going through a ceremony at the Baptist church but also your apparent lack of understanding of what the Sacraments are, what they do, and why they should only be conducted in the Catholic Church.