N
Nicea325
Guest
In a nutshell:
I want God to conform to me a mere finite creature,not I comforming to the Infinite-Eternal.
Lucifer is the author of such a belief.
Interested in the Church, but cannot accept some of their beliefs
- Status
I want God to conform to me a mere finite creature,not I comforming to the Infinite-Eternal.
Lucifer is the author of such a belief.
O
Offdoodykcrn
Guest
It is not the teachings of Christ that I struggle with, although it is not always easy to ‘turn the other cheek’, or to love my neighbor despite how my neighbor treats me. I believe that the message of Christ was a revolutionary concept. The Jews were given 10 Commandments by God, through Moses. Since men have their own agendas and some like rules and others really like to argue around those rules, the Jewish faith ended up with 613 laws by the time that Christ came to save us. Remember how Jesus reacted to the merchants and money changers outside a temple? Obviously, people were headed in the wrong direction if they were given 10 laws which, over time resulted in 613, and people were still filled with hate, greed and sin - but somehow, as long as you don’t eat ham, you’re a ‘good person’ in the eyes of God.
His message was simple, direct and easy to understand: Love God first, and love your neighbor as you love yourself. I filter all of my beliefs through that teaching. I believe it has proven to be a good method for me because I feel the love of God in my life, and it is what gets me through each day. Christ’s message was simple, but my struggle isn’t with that, but in the complexity of the Church today. It is entirely possible I am wrong and the Church is right - which is why I continue with my spiritual quest, and why I value the CAF.
M
manualman
Guest
It’s a good thing to think and to listen. Good on you for that.
An interesting thing to notice about Jesus and the Mosaic Law. He often condemned Pharisees for their hypocrisy, but rarely if ever condemned their moral reasoning. On the contrary, he explicitly told his followers to listen to what they said and taught, but ignore what they did. Interesting, no?
Later on, God (through the apostles) abrogated the need for a lot of the disciplinary minutiae of the old covenant (dietary laws, etc). But neither God nor Jesus ever condemned those teachings as erroneous encrustations of man. It’s just that their time had past.
The dangerous thing about us humans is that we’re capable of rationalizing nearly anything. The lessons of history are NOT that some people are peculiarly evil and unable to reckon right from wrong, but that nearly ALL of us possess the moral blindness of our age. Excessive reliance on one’s own conscience as superior to all outside sources of moral authority ignores that reality of history. We need a balance between use of reason and conscience and revelation from God (not to mention a healthy dose of forgiveness and Grace) to rise above our fallen condition.
P
pablope
Guest
I am not sure, but correct me…do you believe merely believing in the message is enough? Or do we also need to live the message?
What did Jesus say about faith? Did he say just have faith and leave it at that?
Did he not say that our faith must grow from the mustard seed to the big old sturdy mustard tree?
Likewise, as the world grew, so must the Church grow to fulfill it role. Just as the mustard seed, the Church’s understanding grows as the world’s…it cannot remain stagnant.
C
CopticChristian
Guest
This is a powerful admission. We all make choices and there is no one keeping you from doing anything but you. With that in mind you would be able to step back and look at what allows you to choose this or that and realize that the one doing the choosing is not the choices you make. This may be an insight for you. I don’t know.
Having been raised by a Father, retired minister, that is Disciples of Christ and a mother that is Roman Catholic you have been taught some things. I would imagine that you were baptized. Catholics would say that God calls you. You respond. You are gifted with Faith/Hope/Charity in Baptism and not to undermine your choosing to be a Nurse…imagine that it was your response to God to be Charitable and all you did was nothing more than responding to that call and utilizing the graces given. In other words the Theologic Virtue of Charity was working with grace sharpening your virtues. If you believe you made a difference then you can be proud, on the other hand if you accept that you did nothing but respond, did nothing but do what your virtues and grace provided allowed you to do and acknowledge that you did nothing, then your Father is proud, and by that I don’t mean the minister.
Your mother was poorly Catechized. Wow. But do not dismay, so am I and many others on this thread and you can see how many don’t understand what it is we should. However there is always the opportunity to do what was not done for us, by us, and in the long run whatever you do will be manifest in how you think, believe and act.
You are not alone. Augustine, Paul, many others chose to do things other than what they were called to do and I am not saying that you are either of those and also I am not saying that you are neither of those because we all in some way resist something that makes us feel uncomfortable and I believe when you read about Paul and his thorn…he too was uncomfortable. It is always more comfortable to believe that "I’ know the answers when truly I do not.
I would hope not. I would believe that until we take our last breath that we all struggle so I believe that the answer to that question is clear.
One last thought…when you said…
Think about how it is you know, think about how it is you gained drive, how it is you gained intellect and understand that it is all a gift…and then as you dwelve into what the purpose of that gift is…I would imagine that someday, some night, somehwere, you will gaze, perhaps sigh…and realize it was given to you for one thing…
To discern the truth…
Keep truckin…
P
PRmerger
Guest
What about his other teachings?
Do you believe, as Jesus did, that, say, divorce and re-marriage is adultery?
M
mayogirl25
Guest
My advice is to attend RCIA and then decide.
T
TraditionalOne
Guest
Wow Kathryn reading your post was awesome for some reason made me cry. When I first started looking for a Church to attend the protestant church had nothing to offer me, 4 white walls and a podium and the people seemed way to nice I felt nothing and believe me I needed something. Later I then I started going to Mass with my then girlfriend now wife. I can’t explain the feeling of being inside a Catholic besides dark, mysterious, Holy etc. I mean I feel His presence. Hard to explain I guess. I recommend trying the classes, asking Priest questions and reading different conversion stories. Everything just made complete sense. There has to be a Pope from Saint Peter until Francis someone to be in charge. Also look up Alex Jones who converted. Good luck you will find the truth just go inside.
R
Rhubarb
Guest
I’ve been wrestling with the same thing for about ten years now. If you have a break through on the subject, OP, lemme know. I’d be very interested in how you came to it.
Y
YoungTradCath
Guest
I would suggest you not convert.
R
retiredtxn
Guest
Wow!! I can’t tell you how relevant this Q&A has been to me today! So many great answers to a few “nagging” questions of my own. Should I convert or shouldn’t I convert? That’s been my own struggle for many, many years, but Traditional One summed up my feelings when I enter the church for Mass. I FEEL the presence of God there. I’ve never felt that in any other church…and believe me, I’ve attended a LOT of different denominations looking for that “feeling” and never found it.
Another answer (can’t remember who said it) that struck a chord with me was…are you looking for a church that fits what you think it should be and if you are, then you will continue to be a seeker and never find it? That’s the gist of what was said, but I’ve been doing just exactly that. I’ve been searching for the perfect church to fit me!! There’s always something “wrong” with every church I attend. I don’t like the music, I don’t like the minister, the teachings are too conservative and “dry”, I don’t feel like I’ve gotten anything out of it, etc., etc.
No matter how many different churches I go to, I ALWAYS go back to the Catholic church. I’ve been like NeedingTruth in some areas of the Catholic church, I guess it would be good for me to attend RICA, too
I can’t wait to go to Mass today
D
Deconi
Guest
Infallibility -stems from the underlined bit of the above post. It comes from God ‘revealing’ something to Peter’s head and Pete makes the proclamation. What happens BECAUSE of that revelation is that Jesus gives Peter the Keys of The Kingdom of Heaven…etc…etc.
We know that Pete went on the demonstrate his FALLIBLE self by denying Christ 3-times and ‘slighting’ the Gentiles and Paul has him up on it. He also demonstrates his INfallible self by changing circumcision to be unnecessary! (Using those ‘Keys.’)
Like Pete, all the Popes have been like him when it comes to fallibility and declarations for The Church. They have written many volumes of theological thought which are NOT infallible, but have made declarations for The Church that are! (Abortion, Immaculate Conception etc) In other words, they can bet on a horse race, with the same ‘chance’ anyone else has.
The Priesthood used to be married as some of the Apostles were married. But it is Church doctrine that they do not anymore, following Paul’s example of serving Christ only without the distractions of a spouse and family as well.
Women can be priests in The Catholic Church the moment someone can show Christ was a woman.
M
Miriam1947
Guest
I believe it is a discipline in the church not a doctrine. It could be changed.**The Priesthood used to be married as some of the Apostles were married. But it is Church doctrine that they do not anymore, following Paul’s example of serving Christ only without the distractions of a spouse and family as well. **
Women can be priests in The Catholic Church the moment someone can show Christ was a woman.
Women can be priests in The Catholic Church the moment someone can show Christ was a woman.
The bold here means it is dogma and will never be changed.
F
Farsight001
Guest
I feel like this quote is appropriately thoughtful for this thread:
If you believe what you like in the Gospel, and reject what you don’t like, it is not the Gospel you believe, but yourself.”
― Augustine of Hippo
If you believe what you like in the Gospel, and reject what you don’t like, it is not the Gospel you believe, but yourself.”
― Augustine of Hippo
D
Deconi
Guest
I stand corrected, thank you, Miriam.
I meant to mean ‘discipline’ (changeable) as opposed to an ‘unchangeable.’
D
Deconi
Guest
‘Were it not for The Catholic Church, I would not believe a word of Scripture!’ (paraphrased)
- Augustine of Hippo
F
ffg
Guest
It is interesting how we are the ones who get in the way of our own growth.
Once we conclude that truth exists outside of our liking, learning more and more about that truth brings immense satisfaction, well beyond any joy our emotions create in deciding what is good for ourselves.
Once we conclude that truth exists outside of our liking, learning more and more about that truth brings immense satisfaction, well beyond any joy our emotions create in deciding what is good for ourselves.
C
cmodrmac
Guest
It is a long jump from the Southern Baptists to the Roman catholic Church-I think you would find the RC Church to have a beautiful liturgy - fairly dismal music (there are exceptions)
The Pope is much much more than a titular leader in the roman catholic Church-there really is little disagreement officially allowed-THe Pope is the biggest single obstacle to Christain Unity and I say this is a descriptive fashion not judgmental manner-
The Virgin Mary is not a hurdle as we honor Her as do the Orthodox as the “theotokos” the God Bearer-if not first among Saints close to it
I suggest you look carefully before you leap- you may want to look at a Lutheran or episcopal Church as an alternative-
Good LUck
The Pope is much much more than a titular leader in the roman catholic Church-there really is little disagreement officially allowed-THe Pope is the biggest single obstacle to Christain Unity and I say this is a descriptive fashion not judgmental manner-
The Virgin Mary is not a hurdle as we honor Her as do the Orthodox as the “theotokos” the God Bearer-if not first among Saints close to it
I suggest you look carefully before you leap- you may want to look at a Lutheran or episcopal Church as an alternative-
Good LUck
O
oneGODoneCHURCH
Guest
Hello and welcome.
I would most definately encourage you to begin RCIA. That is were you will not only get answers to your questions, but also the reasons behide those answers. I to have struggled with many of the same questions you pose as obsticules, For me the answers was I do not a have to agree I only have to accept. At the end of RCIA you will need to deside if you are going to become part of the Church at that time ask yourself can I accept the teachings of the Church even on those issues that I disagree with and keep those disagreements to myself? If you can then Go on to enterence into the Church at the Easter Vigal, if not then Don’t.
D
DAML72
Guest
Well, I noticed that this thread is over a year old. Would love to know what the outcome was.
There is a lot of advice here already - I would just add, for the sake of anyone reading this who is feeling the same way - RCIA is good, and it is a time of inquiry, but I wouldn’t rely solely on RCIA to come to an understanding of the theology. My advice would be to watch The Journey Home on EWTN, watch other programming on EWTN - particularly the shows geared towards women, as they do a good job of explaining the Church’s position on birth control and why it is such a blessing to us. I would read the Hahns’ conversion story (Rome Sweet Home), and I would pray the Rosary! Yes - even before conversion - pray the Rosary. It is very powerful and our Mother will teach you. Pray, ask questions of God, and read scripture and the Catechism. He will send the Holy Spirit to guide you.
It takes time. I’ve been at this a year, have completed my conversion, and did so much studying (I made sure I was able to accept every teaching of the Church before I converted), and I still feel myself tripping over my Calvinist roots constantly. We are all a work in progress. Go at your own pace.
There is a lot of advice here already - I would just add, for the sake of anyone reading this who is feeling the same way - RCIA is good, and it is a time of inquiry, but I wouldn’t rely solely on RCIA to come to an understanding of the theology. My advice would be to watch The Journey Home on EWTN, watch other programming on EWTN - particularly the shows geared towards women, as they do a good job of explaining the Church’s position on birth control and why it is such a blessing to us. I would read the Hahns’ conversion story (Rome Sweet Home), and I would pray the Rosary! Yes - even before conversion - pray the Rosary. It is very powerful and our Mother will teach you. Pray, ask questions of God, and read scripture and the Catechism. He will send the Holy Spirit to guide you.
It takes time. I’ve been at this a year, have completed my conversion, and did so much studying (I made sure I was able to accept every teaching of the Church before I converted), and I still feel myself tripping over my Calvinist roots constantly. We are all a work in progress. Go at your own pace.
- Status