Interpretation of the Real Presence - valid?

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millstreet

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Hi,
I recently heard someone describe the Real Presence of Jesus in the following way, for a non-Catholic, to help them understand the idea. The person said to imagine you are talking to someone on Skype…the DNA is not present where you are standing, but everything else about the person is there looking at you, talking to you, etc. I know this is not exactly the right way to convey the principle, but is there anything wrong, per se, with describing it in this way for someone who is not Catholic, and in fact is rather unfamiliar with the Church?
Thanks!
 
To me, that example seems lacking. Catholic teaching on the Real Presence is that ALL of Jesus - his humanity and divinity - is present under the appearances of bread and wine. To remove any aspect of Christ’s total presence from the Eucharist in some way separates Him from the Sacrament which is his body, blood, soul, and divinity. I would say the Eucharist is far more intimate than a “Skype call with Jesus”. It is a physical and spiritual encounter with Him, though He remains veiled to our senses under the accidents of bread and wine.
 
DaddyGirl said:
So…does Catholic teaching say that Jesus’ DNA is present in the wine and wafers?

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Actually, Catholic teaching is that the bread and wine actually become Jesus Himself. However, in most circumstances, the appearance is still that of bread and wine - and your physical body cannot tell the difference. It looks like ordinary bread and wine, tastes like ordinary bread and wine, and is digested like ordinary bread and wine. However, it is not bread or wine - it is something different - it is the Body and Blood of Jesus Christ. Once in a while, the appearance does actually change - into real flesh and blood. There have been several Eucharistic miracles in which this has happened, and in each case, the blood has been able to be blood typed (always AB), and the flesh does not decay. And I’m sure that, if the flesh had been DNA tested, it would come to be that of a Middle-Eastern male. Still, though, it is impossible in most cases to understand how the bread and wine become Jesus - it is a mystery.

And, really, there’s nothing in the physical world that can be a proper analogy. It’s the same with the Trinity - there’s really nothing in the physical world that can be a proper analogy - the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit are distinct persons, yet they are each the One God in totality. And yet, they are not simply different ways the One God can be expressed - they are distinct persons with distinct characteristics and distinct purposes. And yet, they are not three gods, but One God.
 
DaddyGirl said:
So…does Catholic teaching say that Jesus’ DNA is present in the wine and wafers?
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Jesus is not present “IN” the bread or the wine. The bread and wine BECOME the WHOLE Jesus - meaning that the totality of Jesus Christ’s humanity and divinity is present. There is no longer bread and wine present - merely the outward appearance of bread and wine. If DNA is part of being a human, and the completeness of Jesus’ humanity is present, then yes Jesus’ human DNA is present. Of course, this is undetectable to our senses because Christ remains veiled under the accidents of bread and wine.
 
christus_vincit said:
Jesus is not present “IN” the bread or the wine. The bread and wine BECOME the WHOLE Jesus - meaning that the totality of Jesus Christ’s humanity and divinity is present.
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I believe in one of the passages, the words are “Hoc Corpus meum” (without the verb) This my body, iow, so there is no possible connection to “panem” (bread).
 
Skype is not a good analogy because the person with whom you are speaking on Skype is not actually present. Only an image and the representation of the voice is present. Jesus however, is actually present in the Eucharist. He is there. It is Jesus. It is the Lord.

Neither will you find Jesus’ DNA, just like you won’t find a leg bone or a piece of an ear. There have been Eucharistic miracles to be sure, but that is extremely rare. The Eucharist is the entire substance of Jesus’ body, blood, soul and divinity. You will not (normally) find DNA just as you would not find an eyeball.

-Tim-
 
DaddyGirl said:
Yeah, I’ve researched that one. The evidence does not seem very sound to me.
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May I ask what evidence you have come accross on the Eucharistic miracle of Lanciano that you found to be unsound?

Thank you for reading 🙂
Josh
 
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