Intimacy vs intercourse

[DiZent]

For a couple where intercourse is no longer an option due to medical conditions, is intimate touching to be avoided as well?

 

[GEddie]

For a couple where intercourse is no longer an option due to medical conditions, is intimate touching to be avoided as well?

Why should it be?

Are you referring to an **impossibility **of the marital act for whatever bodily reason, or an **inadvisability **of the act for medical reasons?

ICXC NIKA

 

[Hoosier_Daddy]

For a couple where intercourse is no longer an option due to medical conditions, is intimate touching to be avoided as well?

Do you mean the couple cannot physically perform the act. Then caressing would be ok. Actually caressing is always ok. Stimulation to orgasm outside of intercourse is wrong.

 

[DiZent]

I was hoping to not provide so much detail. There is a lot going on in our situation & I have discussed it with my doctor. Not inadvisable & not impossible, but improbable that coital intercourse will be completed

Husband is disabled & has had many surgeries including prostate surgery. He has not been able to ejaculate since the prostate surgery. He has the feeling, but no actual ejaculation. He also has ED & asked the doctor for Viagra. He is also an alcoholic, but does not/will not connect the ED to alcohol because it “gets him in the mood”. Alcoholism has him firmly in its grasp and he had no intention to address it. Attempts at intercourse have failed. Over & over, for years - even before the prostate surgery. No amount of touch will result in ejaculation for him, but he will ask for it none the less.

The alcoholism affects me as well - in the opposite way - puts me “out of the mood”. I am post menopausal. Attempts at intercourse became painful due to vaginal dryness. My doctor gave me a hormone cream that is supposed to help. A lot of effort required for intercourse that doesn’t complete or might be painful. For me, the touch is not necessarily sexual, but can result in an orgasm for me even without genital touch. I am not accepting the touch for that reason, but it has happened. Touch is the only form of intimacy we have left and it does give us closeness

 

[GEddie]

My condolences.

No, nothing about your situation would lead to grave matter. Since the marital act is impossible, intimacy however it works is good. How your body responds is no issue. Our human bodies are the **innocent **part of our being.

ICXC NIKA

 

[AdamP88]

Do you mean the couple cannot physically perform the act. Then caressing would be ok. Actually caressing is always ok. Stimulation to orgasm outside of intercourse is wrong.

Not necessarily always wrong. As I understand it the woman could be stimulated to orgasm as long as the sexual act is completed by the man ejaculating into his spouse’s vagina.

 

[DiZent]

Not necessarily always wrong. As I understand it the woman could be stimulated to orgasm as long as the sexual act is completed by the man ejaculating into his spouse’s vagina.

This was part of my concern. Regardless of whether coital intercourse occurs or not, stimulation for him does not complete in ejaculation - only the sensation of ejaculation. Am I supposed to stop him when the touch becomes stimulation for me. I at least need to let him know that having an orgasm is not my goal. My husband has very little understanding about the Catholic perspective on sexuality. We both need the intimacy of touch & caress.

 

[AdamP88]

@DiZent

So he can achieve orgasm but doesn’t ejaculate?

 

[DiZent]

@DiZent

So he can achieve orgasm but doesn’t ejaculate?

He has the sensation. Men don’t consider that an orgasm.

 

[AdamP88]

He has the sensation. Men don’t consider that an orgasm.

Doctors consider it an orgasm apparently. It’s called Dry Orgasm. I would suggest that you talk to a priest or spiritual advisor about your options for sex. This is out of my realm of knowledge.
God bless.

 

[Hoosier_Daddy]

This was part of my concern. Regardless of whether coital intercourse occurs or not, stimulation for him does not complete in ejaculation - only the sensation of ejaculation. Am I supposed to stop him when the touch becomes stimulation for me. I at least need to let him know that having an orgasm is not my goal. My husband has very little understanding about the Catholic perspective on sexuality. We both need the intimacy of touch & caress.

This is definately something you should seek counsel from a priest with. I think it is too complicated for the forums.

 

[bumby]

I apologise but this is what I hate about my faith sometimes. The debate over a man having to ejaculate inside his wife’s vagina in order for it to count.

Bleurgh.

 

[AdamP88]

I apologise but this is what I hate about my faith sometimes. The debate over a man having to ejaculate inside his wife’s vagina in order for it to count.

Bleurgh.

If you have trouble with church teaching on sexuality then you should try to understand the reason instead of summing it up with the phrase “bleurgh”.

 

[Scottgun]

If you have trouble with church teaching on sexuality then you should try to understand the reason instead of summing it up with the phrase “bleurgh”.

Indeed, but in a way it is a backhanded compliment pointing to the truth and sensibility of Church teaching that naysayers have to desperately mine edge cases in order to cobble together an objection.

 

[bumby]

Indeed, but in a way it is a backhanded compliment pointing to the truth and sensibility of Church teaching that naysayers have to desperately mine edge cases in order to cobble together an objection.

Out of interest, what does it say about this in the catechism?

 

[bumby]

If you have trouble with church teaching on sexuality then you should try to understand the reason instead of summing it up with the phrase “bleurgh”.

I can do both, thank you!

 

[AdamP88]

I can do both, thank you!

Well if you understood and accepted Church teaching you wouldn’t be saying that. The OP is trying to look for answers and clearly cares about church teaching. Your comment doesn’t really help her.

 

[Rau]

…Husband is disabled & has had many surgeries including prostate surgery. He has not been able to ejaculate since the prostate surgery. He has the feeling, but no actual ejaculation.

Prostrate surgery (removal) typically causes some nerve loss or damage - the nerves responsible for erection. The operation also removes the seminal vesicles. Recovery of erections is variable (case by case) - and may take a considerable time period eg. 2 years. Despite this, the man can usually still orgasm, given sufficient stimulation (masturbation, or intercourse if erections are sufficient recovered), but there will be no ejaculate.

He also has ED & asked the doctor for Viagra. He is also an alcoholic, but does not/will not connect the ED to alcohol because it “gets him in the mood”. Alcoholism has him firmly in its grasp and he had no intention to address it. Attempts at intercourse have failed. Over & over, for years - even before the prostate surgery. No amount of touch will result in ejaculation for him, but he will ask for it none the less

ED is a typical consequence of prostate surgery for the reasons give above. Daily small doses of Viagra is a standard treatment as it encourages greater blood flow and healing of nerves. Occasional full doses of Viagra may (in time) assist the man to achieve sufficient erection to permit intercourse. Note that alcohol restricts the capacity to have an erection and overconsumption can itself give rise to a level of ED.

 

[kdbueno]

Intercourse according to moral theology is moral. Intimacy profoundly arises from the interests of divine love.

 

[DiZent]

Prostrate surgery (removal) typically causes some nerve loss or damage - the nerves responsible for erection. The operation also removes the seminal vesicles. Recovery of erections is variable (case by case) - and may take a considerable time period eg. 2 years. Despite this, the man can usually still orgasm, given sufficient stimulation (masturbation, or intercourse if erections are sufficient recovered), but there will be no ejaculate.

ED is a typical consequence of prostate surgery for the reasons give above. Daily small doses of Viagra is a standard treatment as it encourages greater blood flow and healing of nerves. Occasional full doses of Viagra may (in time) assist the man to achieve sufficient erection to permit intercourse. Note that alcohol restricts the capacity to have an erection and overconsumption can itself give rise to a level of ED.

Thanks. This is a difficult issue to talk about. He had laser surgery for BPH in 2013, but it was not prostate removal. The urologist explained the lack of ejaculation, but said he would still have the sensation. It could be dry orgasm" or “retrograde orgasm”. The ED was a problem long before the prostate surgery. He has never accepted that alcohol is a major contributor to ED.

I have made the effort to educate myself regarding Catholic teaching on human sexuality, but there was a time when I did not understand all of those teachings.