Irrefutable Proof against being born gay?

[mr_bamber]

Is there irrefutable proof against the born gay theory?

 

[ecedmondson]

I’m not an expert on this, but I don’t think there is.

I do know that there was a suspicion that came along with the Human Genome Project that XQ-28 found on the X-Chromosome could be indicative of homosexuality in males, but no such correlation in females. However, in recent studies its been proven much more likely for a male to be a homosexual if he has had older brothers. Something about another Y-Chromosome having inhabited the same womb. I’ll have to re-check my genetics book and get back to you on this.

 

[flyingfish]

I’m not an expert on this, but I don’t think there is.

I do know that there was a suspicion that came along with the Human Genome Project that XQ-28 found on the X-Chromosome could be indicative of homosexuality in males, but no such correlation in females. However, in recent studies its been proven much more likely for a male to be a homosexual if he has had older brothers. Something about another Y-Chromosome having inhabited the same womb. I’ll have to re-check my genetics book and get back to you on this.

As far as I remember, something like 10% of homosexual men are homosexual for this reason. The idea is that with successive male pregnancies, the mother’s immune system starts destroying the male hormones (or something along those lines) and the later male children have a higher percentage of being gay.

This is still an example of environment rather than genetics.

There have been studies done on twins and siblings, identical twins are more likely to share the same sexual orientation than fraternal twins than siblings. But it’s not 100%, like in all cases it’s a combination of genetic and environmental factors.

 

[ecedmondson]

As far as I remember, something like 10% of homosexual men are homosexual for this reason. The idea is that with successive male pregnancies, the mother’s immune system starts destroying the male hormones (or something along those lines) and the later male children have a higher percentage of being gay.

This is still an example of environment rather than genetics.

There have been studies done on twins and siblings, identical twins are more likely to share the same sexual orientation than fraternal twins than siblings. But it’s not 100%, like in all cases it’s a combination of genetic and environmental factors.

Yes, yes, I was just about to post that.

It’s a combination of the genetics and epigenetics, according to my genetics book. That basically means, the body doesn’t certain things with the genetics it already has based on the environment its in and what it is being presented with.

 

[Advocatus_Fidei]

How can you disprove it when there is no evidence to support it in the first place?

They looked for a gay gene, it doesn’t exist.

It is up to them to prove it don’t you think?

 

[DihydrogenOxide]

Do you usually see homosexual horses, geese or mice, etc? No.

Can humans be born physically or psychologically homosexual? No. There is no disposition for homosexuality, since it is outside the norm.

If you want to speak about it terms of science, through evolution, what do homosexuals gain? Nothing. The purpose of sexuality in animals is to procreate. Theirs is a sexual perversion.

This argument is used as an attempt to excuse people who are homosexual as though it is natural. Explaining it as, “He/She can’t help how he/she acts he/she was born that way.”

It is not a natural attribute of the human body, as it is not a natural attribute of a horse.

It is a learned psychological mentality and a spiritual problem when acted upon.

 

[flyingfish]

Do you usually see homosexual horses, geese or mice, etc? No.

Actually, homo/bisexuality is there in the animal kingdom: news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2004/07/0722_040722_gayanimal.html

But, actually, some same-sex birds do do it. So do beetles, sheep, fruit bats, dolphins, and orangutans. Zoologists are discovering that homosexual and bisexual activity is not unknown within the animal kingdom.

…
The bonobo, an African ape closely related to humans, has an even bigger sexual appetite. Studies suggest 75 percent of bonobo sex is nonreproductive and that nearly all bonobos are bisexual. Frans de Waal, author of Bonobo: The Forgotten Ape, calls the species a “make love, not war” primate. He believes bonobos use sex to resolve conflicts between individuals.

 

[warpspeedpetey]

Is there irrefutable proof against the born gay theory?

yes, there is.

there is nothing that prevents someone who says they are gay from having any kind of intercourse whatsoever. like every human being.

that isnt being born gay, thats being born human.

everyone just has different preferences. that is no reason say they are inborn.

would you think a woman who prefers tall men, a man who prefers petite women, or anyone who dates someone of another ethnicity were born with that preference? of course not

so the whole “born gay” argument doesnt stand up to reason.

 

[Moscati]

Of course not, unless there is irrefutable evidence against the “born sinful theory”.

Homosexual acts are sinful. And all humans are born with the propensity to sin. Our particular sins are our own, but we all have tendencies. Homosexuals are no different, and deserve our love and understanding.

 

[camerong]

In the field of moral theology, it is completely immaterial whether homosexuals are born that way or become that way after being born. The only important question is whether they CHOSE to be gay. If so, then homosexuality itself is a sin. If they do not chose to be homosexuals, it is not a sin.

However, for Catholics, this question is clearly, indisputably answered in the Catechism:

2358 The number of men and women who have deep-seated homosexual tendencies is not negligible. **They do not choose their homosexual condition; for most of them it is a trial. **This inclination, which is objectively disordered, constitutes for most of them a trial. They must be accepted with respect, compassion, and sensitivity. Every sign of unjust discrimination in their regard should be avoided. These persons are called to fulfill God’s will in their lives and, if they are Christians, to unite to the sacrifice of the Lord’s Cross the difficulties they may encounter from their condition.

2359 Homosexual persons are called to chastity. By the virtues of self-mastery that teach them inner freedom, at times by the support of disinterested friendship, by prayer and sacramental grace, they can and should gradually and resolutely approach Christian perfection.

 

[horselvr]

Hmmm.

Quite a few years back, an old friend came over with her 4 yr old son. He was absolutely adorable with blond hair and big blue eyes and when he introduced himself to me, he was more feminine then I could ever hope to be. 30 yrs later he still is.

Now someone please explain THAT to me.

 

[warpspeedpetey]

Hmmm.

Quite a few years back, an old friend came over with her 4 yr old son. He was absolutely adorable with blond hair and big blue eyes and when he introduced himself to me, he was more feminine then I could ever hope to be. 30 yrs later he still is.

Now someone please explain THAT to me.

is he physically incapable of heterosexual intercourse? if not then it is a choice.

 

[horselvr]

I am not privie to that information and honestly, I have never asked. He has never questioned me about my sexual activity so----eventhough he pals around with the girls he has always had a boyfriend.

My question though is why was he so very feminine and at such a young age? And he still is very feminine in his speach and actions. Since then I have noticed this in a few other little boys.

It makes me think that maybe some ARE born that way. I’m just asking.

 

[thistle]

I am not privie to that information and honestly, I have never asked. He has never questioned me about my sexual activity so----eventhough he pals around with the girls he has always had a boyfriend.

My question though is why was he so very feminine and at such a young age? And he still is very feminine in his speach and actions. Since then I have noticed this in a few other little boys.

It makes me think that maybe some ARE born that way. I’m just asking.

Nobody is born gay. People want to believe it to justify their sinful ways by saying they cannot help being like that.
There is ZERO evidence for a gay gene.
People become homosexual through one or more of upbringing, environment, choice.

 

[warpspeedpetey]

I am not privie to that information and honestly, I have never asked. He has never questioned me about my sexual activity so----eventhough he pals around with the girls he has always had a boyfriend.

My question though is why was he so very feminine and at such a young age? And he still is very feminine in his speach and actions. Since then I have noticed this in a few other little boys.

It makes me think that maybe some ARE born that way. I’m just asking.

who knows, people arent born with preferences. id much sooner chalk it up to socialization than anything else.

 

[Moscati]

Nobody is born gay. People want to believe it to justify their sinful ways by saying they cannot help being like that.
There is ZERO evidence for a gay gene.
People become homosexual through one or more of upbringing, environment, choice.

I think you’re confusing being homosexual (being attracted to the same sex) with homosexual acts. Most of us have areas of sin with which we struggle. Remember St. Augustine and the pear tree? He (as the Church teaches now) believed we were born with the tendency to sin. Do you think his tendency to sin was a result of his upbringing or environment? With St. Monica as his mother? He made the choice to act on his desires, and that was sin. But the desires themselves existed, and he was born with them.

The Catechism does not share in your assertions.

 

[thistle]

I think you’re confusing being homosexual (being attracted to the same sex) with homosexual acts. Most of us have areas of sin with which we struggle. Remember St. Augustine and the pear tree? He (as the Church teaches now) believed we were born with the tendency to sin. Do you think his tendency to sin was a result of his upbringing or environment? With St. Monica as his mother? He made the choice to act on his desires, and that was sin. But the desires themselves existed, and he was born with them.

The Catechism does not share in your assertions.

St Augustine was NOT born a sex addict and nor was it due to his upbringing by his mother. It resulted from the environment he found himself in away from his mother and his choice to sin.

 

[Jermosh]

There is no proof or evidence that same sex attraction is not a genetic trait, a genetic trait stays dormant till they hit the right environment or get matched with a different strain and make it more dominant. SSA is prevalent in quite a few social mammals and birds for many reasons like dominance, juvenile experimentation, genetic preservation, lack of female stimulation, more. We see these in humans as well, and the Gay Twin studies over the last few decades make a conclusion that it is certainly a environmental stimuli that triggers it but a genetic signal as well.

 

[camerong]

For those who keep insisting homosexuality is a choice, please consult the Catechism. I suspect Catholics with that opinion haven’t done so. This is such a clearly decided issue, the lack of information is the only thing I can chalk it up to.

 

[baylee]

For those who keep insisting homosexuality is a choice, please consult the Catechism. I suspect Catholics with that opinion haven’t done so. This is such a clearly decided issue, the lack of information is the only thing I can chalk it up to.

Camerong, apparently no one wants to read your posts…