So I was Roman Catholic. I left Roman Catholicism for Holy Orthodoxy. I formally rejected my Roman Catholicism in the part of the ritual where converts are asked to “revoke their former delusions.” So there’s no doubt I knowingly rejected Roman Catholicism. This is a mortal sin. One cannot, in Roman Catholicism, receive Communion while in a state of mortal sin. I am welcome, however, as an Orthodox Christian, to receive Communion in the Roman Catholic Church provided I am in a state that I could receive Holy Communion in my own parish.
So, as a schismatic former Roman Catholic I am in a state of mortal sin and cannot receive Communion. As a practicing Orthodox Christian I am free to receive Communion in your church.
…which is it? Note this is purely an academic discussion, I’m not seeking RC Communion. It’s just an interesting problem.
It’s not an interesting problem at all. It’s an utterly facile problem, at best.
The Second Vatican Council’s Dogmatic Constitution on the Church teaches,
"Those also can attain to salvation who through no fault of their own do not know the Gospel of Christ or His Church, yet sincerely seek God and moved by grace strive by their deeds to do His will as it is known to them through the dictates of conscience."
So, the (Roman) Catholic Church maintains that Christ’s Church on earth fully subsists only in her. If you think you’ve found the true Church elsewhere, then it follows self-evidently that the RCC considers you someone who “does not know * His Church.”
The fact that this authoritative document from our last ecumenical council explicitly teaches that a non-Catholic may “attain to salvation” necessarily leads to the conclusion that rejecting membership in the Catholic Church does not necessarily involve
mortal sin.
If you really believe that the Holy Faith is not found in the RCC, and if this belief is incorrect (as the RCC obviously holds), and if you are - for whatever reason - not culpable for holding to this mistaken belief, and have sought God and His Truth with sincere devotion and courage, then you would
not be in mortal sin.
In short: While leaving the Catholic Church is, objectively speaking, an act of schism, your culpability for that choice stems from
subjective factors known only to God rather than to what is
objectively observable.
So your premise that Catholic teaching necessarily leads to the conclusion that you are in mortal sin is incorrect.
And there is therefore no problem with the fact that the Catholic Church would permit you to receive Holy Communion from our churches if your own church allowed you to commune with us.
For Roman Catholicism, since your church is the one allowing me to receive. It seems to say that one cannot be in a state of mortal sin and receive Communion…except I am in, by your definition, a state of mortal sin and yet welcome to receive.
For the reasons I explained above, it cannot be presumed that you are in a state of mortal sin any more than it can be presumed that you are in a state of grace.
We can’t know that. That’s why this supposed “problem” is no problem at all.
the Mortal/Venial sin distinction
Not to derail the thread, but I know that you obviously believe in Holy Scripture, which mentions a division in 1 John between sins that lead to death and sins that do not lead to death.
I’ve heard Orthodox Christians explain what that passage means according to their Faith, but as a Latin Catholic all my life, raised and catechized in the Latin Church, I have never been able to discover the discrepancy or incompatibility between those Orthodox explanations and the Latin ones I’ve always received.
Just sayin’.
But aren’t they accurate? Whether or not one can receive Communion in Roman Catholicism is black and white - are you in a state of mortal sin or not? If so, no. By your church’s definition I am in a state of mortal sin. Yet I am welcome to receive Communion as long as my own Orthodox priest would receive me at the Cup, which right now, he would. Thus I am in a state of mortal sin yet welcome to receive. It’s a paradox.
It’s not a paradox at all, because the premise “By your church’s definition I am in a state of mortal sin” is incorrect. As you know, Latin teaching has three conditions which must be fulfilled for an individual’s sin to be mortal, and two of them are subjective. We can by no means know that your choice to leave communion with the Holy See - which is, by RCC standards, objectively schism - is actually mortally sinful.
What I find insulting is when people are continually telling me “It’s ok, you might just be Invincibly ignorant.” To which I respond “No, I’m not. I knew the Roman Catholic faith. I knowingly rejected it.” and they just sort of sigh and say “But did you really understand it? I don’t think you could’ve and left.” “No, I did.” “I really don’t think you did…” The patronizing is galling and rude. Better just to cut it off at the source. It’s the same sort of disclaimer (which is incredibly necessary when conversing with many of the participants on this forum) that I put in my response to rcwitness. Were it just you and I talking, I know I could’ve left it off.
No offense, but when you include “the mortal/venial sin distinction” in your list of things you reject, and when I
know that you profess to believe in the teachings of a Church that fully acknowledges 1 John 5:16-17 as inspired Scripture… then sorry, man, there’s definitely
something you’re not getting about Catholic teaching.*
