Is a nuns husband God Or Jesus?

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Ok so i just wanted to know something whos a nuns husband God or Jesus, well me and my friend was talking on facebook today and i she wants to be a carmelite nun to and i askd her and she was like i really dont know that one but she said she was going to ask some of the carmelites next week. So im just asking you guys.

thanks.
 
I believe it would be Jesus. We aren’t “married” to Jesus, however, in the physical sense when we become nuns. It’s a spiritual betrothal and therefore, much more beautiful than anything in the physical world. 🙂
 
Ok so i just wanted to know something whos a nuns husband God or Jesus, well me and my friend was talking on facebook today and i she wants to be a carmelite nun to and i askd her and she was like i really dont know that one but she said she was going to ask some of the carmelites next week. So im just asking you guys.

thanks.
Jesus is God. I don’t think Nuns are married to a specific person of the Holy Trinity. Then again I could be wrong.
 
Men and women religious (brothers, sisters and nuns) are not really married to anyone. Our vow of chastity is a lifetime commitment to our community and to the Church. That being said, the religious (male or female) is a person who consecrates his life to Christ. Christ becomes the beginning and end of our lives. Everything that we do and everything that we give up is presented as a gift to him.

Religious life is rooted in Baptism. Those of us who profess vows have been called to live out our baptismal commitment in a more intense manner than the average Christian. We have been called to live in intimacy with Christ, by living a life of prayer, silence, solitude, detachment and community. In certain respect, our life is a marriage where there is intimacy between the lover and the beloved: the religious and God. It proclaims to the world what awaits us in heaven where men and women are neither given or taken in marriage, where there is no exclusive love.

If one were to compare the religious life to marriage one would have to say that religious men and women have given up the right to marriage and family to make God our life partner and his people our family. Because we are human beings, we do not exist in isolation. Like everyone else, we need companionship, nurturing, love, support, correction, a shoulder to lean on and so forth. This is provided through community life and prayer. In this regard, God becomes the Divine Spouse who enters into the life of the religious to fill the place that would ordinarily be occupied by a spouse and children. We’re not particularly married to any one person of the Blessed Trinity, though the Church in her rituals often refers to Christ and the religious as spouses. But this is a very different espousal that can’t be compared to the Sacrament of Marriage.

Fraternally,

Br. JR, OSF 🙂
 
carmelitegirl93-You have to understand that Jesus is God…How is that so? The Blessed Trinity is three “persons” in one God.

God the Father, God the Son, and God the Holy Spirit.

2 Corinthians 5:18-6:4

How is that possible?

This is quoted from a magazine I read. I also remember our Priest explained the Holy Trinity in the same manner with music.

Trinity refers to three persons of the Godhead. it conveys the meaning “three in unity.” This is one of the most difficult truths of God’s word to understand. Although any attempt to define the Trinity fails to capture the awesome mystery, it might be best described in analogy. Music is made up of three basic elements-melody, harmony, and rhythm. Any one aspect could stand alone by itself, but would be more complete if it is accompanied by the other two. So it is with Trinity: God the Father, God the Son, and God the Holy Spirit. Each stands complete in expression and existence but the three are interwoven into an eternal song.

Whenever you have time please check out Mystical Marriage

newadvent.org/cathen/09703a.htm

By the way, Brother JR, OSF gave you a really good explanation.

God bless,
goforgoal
 
It was once the case that religious profession was treated as though each religious making perpetual vows was a spouse of Christ. Today this is no longer the case because for the majority of religious men and women the spousal imagery does not describe the kind of relationship they experience. Thus, once upon a time nuns used wedding dresses which they exchanged for habits and used rings as a sign of espousal. Today the ring is generally a sign of a life-commitment, nothing less, nor other. The profession rite includes some spousal imagery, but this may be minimized (or maximized) in individual cases. It was never a doctrinal matter however, nor essential to an understanding of either the vows or consecrated life. Nor is it today. Only in the case of consecrated virgins (whether of nuns or women living in the world who are not identified as Sister and do not make vows) is the Rite itself replete with such imagery and only in these cases does a women ordinarily identify herself as a spouse of Christ.

However, individual religious professions are a different matter. The Sister(s) may want to use nuptial or spousal language and imagery because this fits her experience of Christ’s presence in her life. This is true in eremitical professions as well, but in most cases today it is the individual Sister who identifies herself as spouse, not the congregation which imposes the imagery. In any case, while I have no wish to minimize the nuptial experience which is at the heart of even my own profession, religious men and women are not literally brides or spouses of Christ in the same way a man and woman become husband and wife, nor is religious profession literally the counterpart of the Sacrament of Matrimony, even when the spousal imagery is strong and the lived experience of Christ in prayer a nuptial one. For instance, I have described Christ as my spouse (I did so in my perpetual eremitical profession liturgy in fact), but I would never call him my husband. While both statements are meaningful and important, the first statement is figurative, the second is more literal.
 
I should note that the Church as a whole is most often called the Bride of Christ and Christ her bridegroom.
 
Ok so i just wanted to know something whos a nuns husband God or Jesus, well me and my friend was talking on facebook today and i she wants to be a carmelite nun to and i askd her and she was like i really dont know that one but she said she was going to ask some of the carmelites next week. So im just asking you guys.

thanks.
Getting married as husband and wife is like a sign of how the Church is the Bride of Christ.
I once heard that nuns give their celibacy to Christ that they might skip from being part of the sign into being directly married to Christ… as we would be in Heaven as the Church–the Bride of Christ… of course I’m not explaining as well and as beautifully as when I heard it… I actually heard it from that awesome series on EWTN called Theology of the Body for Teens… and then from an order of nuns who were on EWTN… some orders of nuns even wear wedding gowns during one of their professions. It isn’t that Jesus has many wives, but that they are all one Body in the Church Who is Jesus’ wife.

Priests marry Christ’s Church to be a sign of Christ who marries the Body of Christ–the Bride of Christ–the Church… it isn’t that the Church has many husbands, but there is one Priesthood in Jesus Christ who marries the Church.

I would assume then that Brothers (monks and friars and such) would then be married to Christ as members of the Body of Christ–Holy Mother Church.

That’s just my take on it all.

…and this does not really contradict what anyone else has said here…

The Church is married to Christ and Christ is married to the Church… celibates live sort of as an outward sign of this to us all–in a liberal sense of the word,celibates are sort of living sacramentals.
 
Getting married as husband and wife is like a sign of how the Church is the Bride of Christ.
I once heard that nuns give their celibacy to Christ that they might skip from being part of the sign into being directly married to Christ… as we would be in Heaven as the Church–the Bride of Christ… of course I’m not explaining as well and as beautifully as when I heard it… I actually heard it from that awesome series on EWTN called Theology of the Body for Teens… and then from an order of nuns who were on EWTN… some orders of nuns even wear wedding gowns during one of their professions. It isn’t that Jesus has many wives, but that they are all one Body in the Church Who is Jesus’ wife.

Priests marry Christ’s Church to be a sign of Christ who marries the Body of Christ–the Bride of Christ–the Church… it isn’t that the Church has many husbands, but there is one Priesthood in Jesus Christ who marries the Church.

I would assume then that Brothers (monks and friars and such) would then be married to Christ as members of the Body of Christ–Holy Mother Church.

That’s just my take on it all.

…and this does not really contradict what anyone else has said here…

The Church is married to Christ and Christ is married to the Church… celibates live sort of as an outward sign of this to us all–in a liberal sense of the word,celibates are sort of living sacramentals.
Nope, sorry. In profession of religious or eremitical vows we give our whole selves to Christ (not our celibacy which is a negative reality, the absence of something else). We remain celibate (that is, unmarried for the sake of the Kingdom) because celibate love is the form of love characteristic of the Kingdom of God. It is universal rather than exclusive. Married or sexual love is characteristic of this world, and itself is a literal sacrament celebrating the holiness of sexual love (which is love that tends towrds and celebrates the complete union of two persons). It is exclusive rather than universal in the sense of celibate love.

The Church is not married to Christ. Marriage is a symbol which stresses both love and unity, partnership in interdependence, the gift of two individual freedoms given to one another to find an even greater freedom in communion. She IS Christ, the very body of Christ. Again, marriage is a wonderfully rich image used to speak of a particular unity in love, the inextricable linking of divine and human destinies. But the Church does not exist apart from Christ and cannot be said to marry him.

As for priests they do NOT marry, not the Church, not Christ, not anyone at all (unless of course they are Episcopal priests before they become Roman Catholic!). They are consecrated celibates: literally again those who remain unmarried for the sake of the Kingdom. Neither are nuns “directly married to Christ.” The spousal imagery in all of this is a beautiful and powerfully significant expression of a particular kind of love relationship, but it is figurative, not literal.
 
Nope, sorry. In profession of religious or eremitical vows we give our whole selves to Christ (not our celibacy which is a negative reality, the absence of something else). We remain celibate (that is, unmarried for the sake of the Kingdom) because celibate love is the form of love characteristic of the Kingdom of God. It is universal rather than exclusive. Married or sexual love is characteristic of this world, and itself is a literal sacrament celebrating the holiness of sexual love (which is love that tends towrds and celebrates the complete union of two persons). It is exclusive rather than universal in the sense of celibate love.

The Church is not married to Christ. Marriage is a symbol which stresses both love and unity, partnership in interdependence, the gift of two individual freedoms given to one another to find an even greater freedom in communion. She IS Christ, the very body of Christ. Again, marriage is a wonderfully rich image used to speak of a particular unity in love, the inextricable linking of divine and human destinies. But the Church does not exist apart from Christ and cannot be said to marry him.

As for priests they do NOT marry, not the Church, not Christ, not anyone at all (unless of course they are Episcopal priests before they become Roman Catholic!). They are consecrated celibates: literally again those who remain unmarried for the sake of the Kingdom. Neither are nuns “directly married to Christ.” The spousal imagery in all of this is a beautiful and powerfully significant expression of a particular kind of love relationship, but it is figurative, not literal.
I’m sorry but you are either very confused, very misguided, or I don’t know…
but priests are married to the Church…

and the Church is married to Christ… it says so in the Bible… and as members of the Church we are married to Christ.

To me, you are saying that you do not give your celibacy to Christ (offer it all to Christ!).

Celibacy is not being married to another human being… celibates are spiritually wed to Christ… just as the Church is the Bride of Christ and we (the people of the Church) are the Church…

We are the Church… we compose Christ’s Body… Christ marries the Church… it’s all in the Bible, go ahead… read the Epistles, read the Holy Gospels, read the Bible!
…it’s all in there… and nothing I have said contradicts Catholic teaching… I can tell you that much!

Apocalypse 19:7:
“Let us be glad and rejoice, and give glory to Him; for the marriage of the Lamb is come, and his wife hath prepared herself.”

Ephesians 5:23:
“Because the husband is the head of the wife, as Christ is the head of the Church. He is the savior of his body.”

And, i’m talking about a symbolical wedding… and a spiritual one… one that is not like a regular wedding…

Marriage of a man and woman is like Holy Communion in the Eucharist… marriage of Christ and his Church like the priest and the Church and the nuns and Christ and such is like being in Communion with Christ in Heaven… I guess it might be described as that.

…basically, nuns realize that as members of the body of Christ, they are the Bride of Christ, thus they are wed to Christ, and they ARE reminded of this through celibacy and such whether celibacy was intended to be that way or not.
Sister, receive this ring for you are betrothed to the eternal King: Keep faith with your Bridegroom so that you may come to the wedding feast of Eternal joy."
 
Let try to break this down into pieces here.
  1. The language found in scripture is allegorical. It is meant to help the reader understand the intimate communion between Christ and his Church. It is not literal. It is a language that attempt to explain an ontnological reality about the Church. The Church is the bride of Christ was written to help the reader understand that Christ and the Church are one, as spouses are one. Just as the love between spouses is exclusive, the love between Christ and the Church is also exclusive. In other parts of scripture we read that Christ is the head and the Church is the body. We also know that this is not literal as the relationship between Christ and the Church cannot be defined by physiological terms. But human language has no way to describe this adequately. This is the best that we can do.
  2. Priests are not married to the Church. If we pay close attention to the ordiantion of deacons, priests and bishops, the word marriage is no where in the liturgy or Holy Orders. Those called to Holy Orders are called to serve the Church as Christ the High Priest serves the Church. Their relationship with the Church is that of Christ the High Priest. Together the three orders of the priesthood are a visible sign of Christ’s service to the Church. The bishop, of course, is the only one of the three orders who has the fulness of the priesthood. He is deacon, presbyter and bishop. He has all three orders conferred upon him. But those orders are a sign of service. They are a sign that gives grace to the individual and to the Church. This is why a married man can be a deacon or priest. Because Holy Orders is not a marriage. Otherwise, we would have to commitments that are in conflict with each other.
  3. Male and female religious are not married to Christ or the Church either. We are consecrated to Christ. What we offer to Christ is the gift of our entire lives. We voluntarilly vow to live a celibate life so as to be free to love Christ. Christ is the beloved. Our vow of chasity is a foreshadowing of life in the Kingdom of God when men and women are not given in marriage. If we were literally married to Christ, then we would be representing a life that is contrary to life in the Kingdom. In heaven no one is in an exclusive relationship with Christ. The relationship with Christ is all embracing. It embraces Christ and his entire Mystical Body. Our vow of celibacy or chastity is rooted in the sacrament of Baptism, not marriage. In Baptism we die to sin and are born to Christ. In our vows, we express in a visible manner what happend in Baptism. We give witness to the world that all men are born in Christ and therefore, we do not need an exclusive relationship with anyone, because Christ fulfills every human need and brings all things into oneness with him through Baptism. We are one with Christ through Baptism. Through the vows of religious life, we make that reality that happened at Baptism and we make it visible to the world by the way that we live. The word marriage is not part of the liturgy of consecration either. This wording has been used again in an allegorical way to show the intimacy between the baptized person who is called to give witness to the life of Christian perfection and Jesus Christ. But this witness is a sign of what will come in heaven for all of us. The difference is that religious begin to live on earth what will continue in heaven, to live in the perfection of charity with Christ as the beloved and by loving Christ, we love all men and women who make up the Body of Christ. That’s our mission, to be signs of what is to come.
Spouses are a sign of the relationship between Christ and the Church, because of their exclusive surrender to each other, their charity toward each other, their cooperation to bring life into the world, they proclaim to the world that Christ and his Church are inseparable and that together they are the fount of life.

I’m using th word sign here as John uses it. When John uses the word sign in his book of signs, he’s speaking of proofs. Each vocation is a proof a divine reality.

Fraternally,

Br. JR, OSF 🙂
 
Thank you so much this just what i needed to know, your answer was the best out of all of them i think thank you.
 
I have to admit I’m a bit confused and this might be off-topic. But, can someone please tell me why St. Teresa de Los Andes refers to Jesus as her husband? It’s 3:05 in the video.

youtube.com/watch?v=yWCBEqU9mhQ

I also recall on one of the “Interviews with a Carmelite Nun” with Sister Cushla she refers to Jesus as her husband? I’m sorry I don’t remember which part it’s on.

youtube.com/user/jbh67

Thank you in advance in answering my question and God bless,
goforgoal
 
I have to admit I’m a bit confused and this might be off-topic. But, can someone please tell me why St. Teresa de Los Andes refers to Jesus as her husband? It’s 3:05 in the video.

youtube.com/watch?v=yWCBEqU9mhQ

I also recall on one of the “Interviews with a Carmelite Nun” with Sister Cushla she refers to Jesus as her husband? I’m sorry I don’t remember which part it’s on.

youtube.com/user/jbh67

Thank you in advance in answering my question and God bless,
goforgoal
Again, language is used other than literally. Most religious men and women will use the term spouse (if they use the nuptial imagery at all) but none that I know use the term husband (or wife) because the term is reserved for the mutual givng of selves to one another in sexual love. In any case, a casual or theologically inaccurate use of language does not justify the general conclusion that nuns or monks, sisters or brothers (much less priests!) are married to Christ or to the Church.

The word used for those professed is consecrated, not married. We are consecrated to God and in some cases, he is (experientially) our spouse, but literally? I am not Jesus’ wife nor is he my husband — not least because these categories are this worldly ones while in the Kingdom of God men and women are neither given nor taken in marriage. Consecrated celibacy or celibate love witnesses to THIS Kingdom where people are not given in marriage.

I prefer to distinguish between spouse and husband in this situation. On the other hand I have NEVER heard any nun or Sister refer to themselves as Jesus’ wife even while they do use the term spouse. I suspect we all have a gut sense that when nuptial language is appropriate there are still lines we do not cross, designations we do not claim — a few exceptions notwithstanding.
 
I have to admit I’m a bit confused and this might be off-topic. But, can someone please tell me why St. Teresa de Los Andes refers to Jesus as her husband? It’s 3:05 in the video.

youtube.com/watch?v=yWCBEqU9mhQ

I also recall on one of the “Interviews with a Carmelite Nun” with Sister Cushla she refers to Jesus as her husband? I’m sorry I don’t remember which part it’s on.

youtube.com/user/jbh67

Thank you in advance in answering my question and God bless,
goforgoal
Remember, saints are human beings. They are not angels. They are no omniscient. They may not even be theologians, as is the case with St. Teresa of the Andes. They will use language in a manner that conveys how they feel. Human language is limited. We can’t always convey the mystical experience in words. In fact, we can never do so. We have to sue allegory. St. Teresa of Avila spoke of the Interior Castle. St. Francis of Assisi spoke of Lady Poverty. St. Vincent de Paul called modestly a cloister. Jesus refers to himself as a vine.

Does this help you get the picture?

Fraternally,

Br. JR, OSF 🙂
 
Let try to break this down into pieces here.
  1. The language found in scripture is allegorical. It is meant to help the reader understand the intimate communion between Christ and his Church. It is not literal. It is a language that attempt to explain an ontnological reality about the Church. The Church is the bride of Christ was written to help the reader understand that Christ and the Church are one, as spouses are one. Just as the love between spouses is exclusive, the love between Christ and the Church is also exclusive. In other parts of scripture we read that Christ is the head and the Church is the body. We also know that this is not literal as the relationship between Christ and the Church cannot be defined by physiological terms. But human language has no way to describe this adequately. This is the best that we can do.
  2. Priests are not married to the Church. If we pay close attention to the ordiantion of deacons, priests and bishops, the word marriage is no where in the liturgy or Holy Orders. Those called to Holy Orders are called to serve the Church as Christ the High Priest serves the Church. Their relationship with the Church is that of Christ the High Priest. Together the three orders of the priesthood are a visible sign of Christ’s service to the Church. The bishop, of course, is the only one of the three orders who has the fulness of the priesthood. He is deacon, presbyter and bishop. He has all three orders conferred upon him. But those orders are a sign of service. They are a sign that gives grace to the individual and to the Church. This is why a married man can be a deacon or priest. Because Holy Orders is not a marriage. Otherwise, we would have to commitments that are in conflict with each other.
  3. Male and female religious are not married to Christ or the Church either. We are consecrated to Christ. What we offer to Christ is the gift of our entire lives. We voluntarilly vow to live a celibate life so as to be free to love Christ. Christ is the beloved. Our vow of chasity is a foreshadowing of life in the Kingdom of God when men and women are not given in marriage. If we were literally married to Christ, then we would be representing a life that is contrary to life in the Kingdom. In heaven no one is in an exclusive relationship with Christ. The relationship with Christ is all embracing. It embraces Christ and his entire Mystical Body. Our vow of celibacy or chastity is rooted in the sacrament of Baptism, not marriage. In Baptism we die to sin and are born to Christ. In our vows, we express in a visible manner what happend in Baptism. We give witness to the world that all men are born in Christ and therefore, we do not need an exclusive relationship with anyone, because Christ fulfills every human need and brings all things into oneness with him through Baptism. We are one with Christ through Baptism. Through the vows of religious life, we make that reality that happened at Baptism and we make it visible to the world by the way that we live. The word marriage is not part of the liturgy of consecration either. This wording has been used again in an allegorical way to show the intimacy between the baptized person who is called to give witness to the life of Christian perfection and Jesus Christ. But this witness is a sign of what will come in heaven for all of us. The difference is that religious begin to live on earth what will continue in heaven, to live in the perfection of charity with Christ as the beloved and by loving Christ, we love all men and women who make up the Body of Christ. That’s our mission, to be signs of what is to come.
Spouses are a sign of the relationship between Christ and the Church, because of their exclusive surrender to each other, their charity toward each other, their cooperation to bring life into the world, they proclaim to the world that Christ and his Church are inseparable and that together they are the fount of life.

I’m using th word sign here as John uses it. When John uses the word sign in his book of signs, he’s speaking of proofs. Each vocation is a proof a divine reality.

Fraternally,

Br. JR, OSF 🙂
But they are married… in a symbolic way… would you not agree because of course we are not literally the physical Body of Christ, but in a symbolic way, we are the Body of Christ… the same applies as being the Bride of Christ.

…just as some people describe their spouses as sadly being “married” to their work.

…and Jesus = God, so you see yourself as married to Christ, but as Christ is Lord, you are married to God if you think about it… but of course… I am still using “married” in the symbolic sense… never meant it to mean like you were actually married to Jesus or the Church.

Would you not agree, Brother? …probably semantics.
 
But they are married… in a symbolic way… would you not agree because of course we are not literally the physical Body of Christ, but in a symbolic way, we are the Body of Christ… the same applies as being the Bride of Christ.

…just as some people describe their spouses as sadly being “married” to their work.

…and Jesus = God, so you see yourself as married to Christ, but as Christ is Lord, you are married to God if you think about it… but of course… I am still using “married” in the symbolic sense… never meant it to mean like you were actually married to Jesus or the Church.

Would you not agree, Brother? …probably semantics.
Semantics are important. What Brother has written is accurate. The figurative language works for some, not for others because their experience of Christ is not nuptial. Br and I have written pretty much the same thing and yet I was told I was “very misguided or. . .”

The fact is, however, nuns and priests are not literally married to the Church nor to Christ. They are not wives relating to a husband. I will affirm anytime I need to that Christ is spouse to me, but he is not my husband. He is my Lord, savior and brother, but NOT my husband. I will affirm anytime that I am spouse to him but that I am NOT his wife. I am consecrated in a life commitment to him but we are NOT married. My love is not married love. It is eschatological marking the love of the Kingdom where no one is given or taken in marriage and it will continue to be that on the other side of death.

You continue to press that you are speaking merely figuratively but what you want people to affirm in a general way is that nuns are married to Christ and priests are married to the Church. In fact, they are not. For some few religious women and men spousal imagery works. For most it does not and they will eschew it for a number of different reasons ---- not least their own esteem for the Sacrament of marriage and all it means.

It remains that no where in Church doctrine does it speak of nuns or priests as married to Christ or the Church, nor of consecration and profession as a form of marriage. The single reference to betrothal in the giving of the ring at perpetual profession indicates figurative espousal and the literal consecration of one’s whole life to Christ. One is set aside forever in the consecrated state and the ring marks this. Even here, however, the Church is restrained in her use of such language.

As for your comment about us not being literally the physical body of Christ, there is some theological nuancing needed with your statement. The phrase body of Christ is not just poetry. It is a literal description. The Church IS the risen (not physical) body of Christ and Christ is her head. Here, though it is often thought otherwise, we are speaking literally as well as figuratively. Christ is risen in his Church. We truly ARE the body of Christ in the world. We have literally become this in baptism and need to take it deadly seriously.
 
But they are married… in a symbolic way… would you not agree because of course we are not literally the physical Body of Christ, but in a symbolic way, we are the Body of Christ… the same applies as being the Bride of Christ.

…just as some people describe their spouses as sadly being “married” to their work.

…and Jesus = God, so you see yourself as married to Christ, but as Christ is Lord, you are married to God if you think about it… but of course… I am still using “married” in the symbolic sense… never meant it to mean like you were actually married to Jesus or the Church.

Would you not agree, Brother? …probably semantics.
Bold is mine. When we speak of language being allegorical, this is exactly what we mean. It is symbollic language that tries to capture a very profound reality that cannot be expressed precesly in human language.

There is a deeper relationship than just being married. Remember, marriage is the exclusive love between two parties. This love is not exclusive. So while religious give our lives to Christ and it looks like a marriage, it is deeper than that, because in Christ we find the entire spectrum of humanity, those who came before and those who will come after we’re dead. By surrendering our lives to Christ, we encounter and love the entire spectrum of humanity that makes up the Body of Christ.

Fraternally,

Br. JR, OSF 🙂
 
Bold is mine. When we speak of language being allegorical, this is exactly what we mean. It is symbollic language that tries to capture a very profound reality that cannot be expressed precesly in human language.

There is a deeper relationship than just being married. Remember, marriage is the exclusive love between two parties. This love is not exclusive. So while religious give our lives to Christ and it looks like a marriage, it is deeper than that, because in Christ we find the entire spectrum of humanity, those who came before and those who will come after we’re dead. By surrendering our lives to Christ, we encounter and love the entire spectrum of humanity that makes up the Body of Christ.

Fraternally,

Br. JR, OSF 🙂
agreed… and well put… that’s what I’ve been trying to grasp here… but you’ve worded it quite simply in a way that can more easily be understood.
 
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