Is abortion ever justified?

[benedictus2]

Whose life is more valuable? Who has memories? Children to care for and care for them?

And that mother’s life you value so much would not be there value if when she was a child in the womb her mother decided to kill her.

Same thing with the scientists you admire. You can only value them now because someone kind and loving, allowed them to live in the first place.

 

[Cinette]

Wonderful, wonderful post! Kudos to you for standing up. What a sorry world we have where everyone seems to be buying into Hitlers propaganda and claim to be “decent” people. They condemn Hitler but proceed to do what he advocated

The more I hear of the atrocities committed against humans by humans the more I despair of the human race!

What is wrong with dwarfism anyway. Your comparison with Hitler’s plan is spot on. Yes, how can anyone condemn a child in the womb for dwarfism or any other “defects” and criticize Hitler for what he did. It is the same thing. Can’t these pro-choice people see it?

Oh maaaannnn!

 

[benedictus2]

Others have proposed that a girl threatening suicide is justification for killing the child. However, no one would propose that it is justification for killing the cause of the problem–the rapist, right? But the other innocent person in the equation–the baby–it is all right to kill.

In the same way, those who oppose the death penalty even for those guilty of heinous crimes think that it would be all right to kill the baby.

I asked the question to show the absurdity of this type of “justification” for the deliberate and direct killing of a human being simply because he or she has not yet been born.

Bravo!:clapping:

 

[Abbadon]

Cinette - I think that David & Sarah Seabrook will not receive the miracle they are looking for
whywontgodhealamputees.com/
If miracles and prayers actually worked we wouldn’t need science and medicine.

 

[Cinette]

Cinette - I think that David & Sarah Seabrook will not receive the miracle they are looking for
whywontgodhealamputees.com/
If miracles and prayers actually worked we wouldn’t need science and medicine.

Abbadon I do not expect you to understand.

God works in many different ways. Sometimes his responses are not what one expects or imagines as happened in my life but the results are most satisfying. God is a God of surprises.

Why don’t you surprise God and pray for David and Sarah and their little boy Daniel?

 

[benedictus2]

Cinette - I think that David & Sarah Seabrook will not receive the miracle they are looking for
whywontgodhealamputees.com/
If miracles and prayers actually worked we wouldn’t need science and medicine.

This is because you do not understand miracles. God works through science and medicine. After all He is its author. But every now and again, the laws of nature are suspended and a cure that baffles scientists and doctors happen. There have been atheist doctors who have converted to Catholicism because they were the attending doctors of these people who have been miraculously healed.

By miraculous we mean, a healing that cannot be attrubuted to medication and natural processes.

 

[tqualey]

Hi, St Francis,

I certainly appreciate you taking the time to point out the obvious to Limerck … it could be that this cynicism he claims as a virtue - has really robbed him of his INsight.

Others have proposed that a girl threatening suicide is justification for killing the child. However, no one would propose that it is justification for killing the cause of the problem–the rapist, right? But the other innocent person in the equation–the baby–it is all right to kill.

In the same way, those who oppose the death penalty even for those guilty of heinous crimes think that it would be all right to kill the baby.

I asked the question to show the absurdity of this type of “justification” for the deliberate and direct killing of a human being simply because he or she has not yet been born.

I work on weekends as a Registered Nurse at a psychiatric hospital that has an Adolescent Unit. General speaking, under the best of conditions, teenagers are an unstable group - their ability to make sound judgment is just getting a start. This girl in the example you gave may honestly been not too stable to being with. No doubt about it - she was traumatized. To encourage further trauma to this girl - especially by going along with what she says, shows a total lack fo parental / adult leadership.

God bless

 

[djeter]

How 'bout this?

Has anyone heard about this story? I found out as much as I could about it and put it on my blog where I also have links to the three articles I read about and summarized.

To whit:

On July 1st, Caritas Christi, the Catholic Health care system run by the Archdiocese of Boston, will enter into a contract with a subsidiary of the Centene Corporation to provide “reproductive services," such as abortion, sterilization, contraception, and counseling for Commonwealth Care (the compulsory state health care system) members in Massachusetts.

Despite the fig leaf of Centene’s subsidiary doing the actual dirty work, Caritas will profit from the relationship and will in fact be counseling patients to receive those immoral services from Centene, even to the point of transporting patients to abortion facilities. The Massachusetts plan foreshadows the national model under consideration by the Obama Administration.

There’s a link to the Archdiocese of Boston for you to send an appropriate “Say it ain’t so!” message.

DJ

 

[St_Francis]

How 'bout this?

Has anyone heard about this story? I found out as much as I could about it and put it on my blog where I also have links to the three articles I read about and summarized.

To whit:

On July 1st, Caritas Christi, the Catholic Health care system run by the Archdiocese of Boston, will enter into a contract with a subsidiary of the Centene Corporation to provide “reproductive services," such as abortion, sterilization, contraception, and counseling for Commonwealth Care (the compulsory state health care system) members in Massachusetts.

Despite the fig leaf of Centene’s subsidiary doing the actual dirty work, Caritas will profit from the relationship and will in fact be counseling patients to receive those immoral services from Centene, even to the point of transporting patients to abortion facilities. The Massachusetts plan foreshadows the national model under consideration by the Obama Administration.

There’s a link to the Archdiocese of Boston for you to send an appropriate “Say it ain’t so!” message.

DJ

I really think you should post this as a separate topic!

Just sayin’…

 

[livi]

look, abortion is NEVER okay, regardless of the circumstances. and just because a child isn’t physically perfect is not a reason to kill him or her. people already kill their children before birth based on gender. what’s next, aborting based on hair or eye color?

and in response to the comments about the death penalty, i don’t think that it is okay either, but it is a very different conversation.

 

[NEWCATHOLICJEFF]

Well from what I have read and the way I believe abortion is always wrong. That being said if you wanted to accept the fact that at times certain abortions were ok…then you would have to ask the question what if the fetus (child) can be removed and it survives is that acceptable. The answer from Planned Parenthood and even our new President is NO. The fetus has no right to life if the Mother does not want it to life.

Using your scenario that would be the equivalent of the lady waking up disconnecting the tubes. The Man struggling and successfully finding another way to survive and the woman deciding, “No” this is not good enough and running a pair of scissors through the back of his skull.

This is Partial Birth abortion or even a removal abortion at 5 months. You know eventually medical science is going to invent an artificial womb… Big can of worm there, but what is planned parenthood going to say then? I bet they will say that a human life is not a human life unless the mother wants it to be.

That begs the next question why cant a women change her mind? What if she wants her delinquent 13 year old to be gone. What gives him any more right to life then a 1 minute old 6 month old fetus that only needs an incubator to live? Instead Planned Parenthood lets the youngster suffocate.

In the end…the old saying of Two wrongs do not make a right applies. If you believe that God is responsible for the placement of the human soul then the genetic make up of the shell that holds that soul does not really matter. If that is true the persons of the father and mother do not really matter in the grand scheme of things and so for Rape or Incest the soul, which God placed, should not be harmed unless you want to play God and say that the particular soul placed in that human body is not worthwhile. I doubt that any human currently walking this earth has purity to make such a call.

I struggled with this for many years, kind of, but not really. Deep in my heart I knew that killing a baby was wrong. Their is NO justifiable reason. If my son fell over the side of a boat I would jump in the water even if I had a 99.9% chance of dying. A mother that conceives, knowing that she might die should likewise take a chance. It is easy to say well it is her body, but honestly if she is allowed to kill this life she should have to participate in the death. Each abortionist must account for the pieces of the fetus thy rip out. I think that by law the mother should be required to make that accounting… It is ONLY fair that she should do this. She should acknowledge the sacrifice that was made so that she could live. I wonder how many would be Pro-Death then?

 

[St_Francis]

look, abortion is NEVER okay, regardless of the circumstances. and just because a child isn’t physically perfect is not a reason to kill him or her. people already kill their children before birth based on gender. what’s next, aborting based on hair or eye color?

and in response to the comments about the death penalty, i don’t think that it is okay either, but it is a very different conversation.

I was just trying to point out the irony of people’s thinking it would be all right to kill the innocent child of the rapist but not the rapist himself. (wrt the suicide scenario).

 

[GodLovesTheSpek]

Thirty-three pages to answer the question. “No” is the answer.

The child belongs to God. End of story,

 

[benedictus2]

It is easy to say well it is her body, but honestly if she is allowed to kill this life she should have to participate in the death. Each abortionist must account for the pieces of the fetus thy rip out. I think that by law the mother should be required to make that accounting… It is ONLY fair that she should do this. She should acknowledge the sacrifice that was made so that she could live. I wonder how many would be Pro-Death then?

I think that is a good suggestion. Every mother if they want to abort should be presented with the dismembered pieces of their child. They should also be enabled to see the ripping and the cutting as it proceedes on wide screen tv.

 

[limerick]

Hi, St Francis,

I certainly appreciate you taking the time to point out the obvious to Limerck … it could be that this cynicism he claims as a virtue - has really robbed him of his INsight.

**So, to ask for clarification on a point is to invite ridicule from a registered nurse on a psych ward?

I’m honored.

I don’t claim cynicism as a virtue. It simply was the last house on the block for me when other avenues had served up the likes of you and your attitude. Thank you for affirming my worldview. And for your arsenal: I am not a male. See how you can use that to smack me around, o charitable one.

Limerick**

 

[Cinette]

**So, to ask for clarification on a point is to invite ridicule from a registered nurse on a psych ward?

I’m honored.

I don’t claim cynicism as a virtue. It simply was the last house on the block for me when other avenues had served up the likes of you and your attitude. Thank you for affirming my worldview. And for your arsenal: I am not a male. See how you can use that to smack me around, o charitable one.

Limerick**

Now, now, Children! Play nicely!

:tsktsk::tsktsk:

 

[jmtowle]

If even one person is persuaded not to facilitate an abortion after considering the messages in this thread, that is a very positive outcome.

If even one person is convinced that facilitating an abortion is acceptable after considering the messages in this thread, that is both a negative and sorrowful outcome.

Many eyes and minds pass over these messages without responding. We will never know the impact of these words of ours, positive or otherwise.

Abortion is an evil that requires graphic exposure if it is to be recognized for it’s true nature.

A person may possess the Truth about this evil and be inspired to do all that they can to put an end to it’s practice but anything said or done without kindness, compassion, patience and additional virtues, lacks the Love that softens hearts.

It’s not about being right, it’s about persuading others that it is in their best interest to hear what you have to say and want to join you.

May the Peace of Christ be with us all, always.

JT

 

[limerick]

**Originally Posted by tqualey
"Hi, St Francis,

“I certainly appreciate you taking the time to point out the obvious to Limerck … it could be that this cynicism he claims as a virtue - has really robbed him of his INsight.”**

Originally posted by Cinette:

“Now, now, Children! Play nicely!”

Who’s hungry?

Limerick

 

[tqualey]

Hi, Ms Limerick,

Just go back and re-read your posts. Bitterness and scathing comments are the rule rather the exception. This is simply pointing out the obvious.

**So, to ask for clarification on a point is to invite ridicule from a registered nurse on a psych ward?

I’m honored.

I don’t claim cynicism as a virtue. It simply was the last house on the block for me when other avenues had served up the likes of you and your attitude. Thank you for affirming my worldview. And for your arsenal: I am not a male. See how you can use that to smack me around, o charitable one.

Limerick**

Your written responses embrace cynicism - there is no reluctance on your part to criticize the sentiments of others yet you recoil when this is addressed? Really now, Ms Limerick, thanks for identifying your gender - and, as you know, my comments were gender neutral - but, just look back at your posts, you’ve been ‘smacking’ around others for some time.

As I understand it, charity does not do violence to honesty.

And, considering your comment on having retreated to the ‘last house’ on the block - please - if you are not careful, you will soon find yourself homeless. My suggestion would be to treat others with the respect they are entitled to when responding to their posts. I think you can do that, so, please try. Thank you, in advance.

God bless

 

[Cinette]

When I was a little girl I was so happy to be a little girl and now that I am a woman I continue to enjoy being a woman. I also love my gender - I think we have some wonderful attributes.

H O W E V E R, I confess that we are inclined to be more aggressive than men. Men have done some stupid things and have made a mess of the world but if we were in charge we would probably have started World War III long ago!