Is 'Amazing Grace' a Catholic song? Anyone know the author and verses?

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Does anyone know who wrote Amazing Grace, is it a Catholic song?

By the way, am I missing out on some verses? The way I sing it is like -
1 Amazing grace, how sweet the sound…
2 Twas grace that taught my heart to fear…
3 Through many dangers, toils and snares…
4 When we’ve been here 10 thousand years…
Then back to verse 1 to finish.
 
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Flopfoot:
Does anyone know who wrote Amazing Grace, is it a Catholic song?

By the way, am I missing out on some verses? The way I sing it is like -
1 Amazing grace, how sweet the sound…
2 Twas grace that taught my heart to fear…
3 Through many dangers, toils and snares…
4 When we’ve been here 10 thousand years…
Then back to verse 1 to finish.
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No it’s not a Catholic song, and it disturbs me that I hear it so often in Catholic churches. Apart from the dirgeful tune, the words very strongly imply presumption of salvation (that we are already “saved” and WILL go to Heaven no matter what we do). Presumption of salvation is heresy and a very serious sin.
 
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Petergee:
No it’s not a Catholic song, and it disturbs me that I hear it so often in Catholic churches. Apart from the dirgeful tune, the words very strongly imply presumption of salvation (that we are already “saved” and WILL go to Heaven no matter what we do). Presumption of salvation is heresy and a very serious sin.
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Balderdash.

Nothing non-Catholic about it, despite the fact that it was written by an Anglican slave trader who experienced a profound conversion and dedicated the remainder of his life to the abolition of slavery.

There is no presumption of salvation in the verses, implicit, explicit or otherwise.
 
I have searched high and low…the very prettiest version of Amazing Grace is here

Amazing Grace 2

Click on the words Amazing Grace 2

"Amazing Grace, how sweet the sound,
That saved a wretch like me…
I once was lost but now am found,
Was blind, but now, I see.

T’was Grace that taught…
my heart to fear.
And Grace, my fears relieved.
How precious did that Grace appear…
the hour I first believed.

Through many dangers, toils and snares…
we have already come.
T’was Grace that brought us safe thus far…
and Grace will lead us home.

The Lord has promised good to me…
His word my hope secures.
He will my shield and portion be…
as long as life endures.

When we’ve been here ten thousand years…
bright shining as the sun.
We’ve no less days to sing God’s praise…
then when we’ve first begun.

"Amazing Grace, how sweet the sound,
That saved a wretch like me…
I once was lost but now am found,
Was blind, but now, I see.

By John Newton
 
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mercygate:
Balderdash.
Nothing non-Catholic about it, despite the fact that it was written by an Anglican slave trader who experienced a profound conversion and dedicated the remainder of his life to the abolition of slavery.
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No, I’m afraid THAT is “balderdash” as you so charitably put it. The author continued merrily slave-trading (and committing adultery) for many years after he was supposedly “saved” after becoming a “born-again” protestant. He ceased slave-trading only because he gained a more remunerative job which did not entail leaving home for long periods. He wrote “Amazing Grace” many years after that again, as one of a large number of hymns he wrote for a hymn-writing competition. Several years after THAT he first began to express doubts about his former career, and years after that again, in his old age, he first began to speak against the slave trade.
There is no presumption of salvation in the verses, implicit, explicit or otherwise.
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I’m afraid that’s purely wishful thinking on your part. I was being charitable by saying it was merely implied. In fact the words baldly state outright that the author is “saved” (past perfect tense, not conditional future) merely by “the sound” of him first saying that he “believed”; that when “we” (he and his fellow elect) “have been” (future perfect) “there” (Heaven) “10,000 years” they will still have all eternity there. The song’s basis is the heretical belief (rejected even by moderate protestants) that from the hour one “first believed”, passage to Heaven is guaranteed no matter what “dangers toils and snares” lie in store. It first began being sung in Catholic churches after a dreadful bagpipes version of it became a novelty pop hit in the 1970s, but its theology, style, authorship and worldview are all decidedly non-Catholic.
 
Actually, as far as I can tell most Protestants don’t reject the idea that one is “saved” at ‘the hour they first believed’. But Catholics do. That’s a good point, maybe we shouldn’t sing it at my local youth group then (since it sounds like a good Catholic song, people might just assume that the lyrics are good and right when, as you point out, they’re not very good). But I can still play it on my harmonica (-:
 
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Petergee:
No it’s not a Catholic song, and it disturbs me that I hear it so often in Catholic churches. Apart from the dirgeful tune, the words very strongly imply presumption of salvation (that we are already “saved” and WILL go to Heaven no matter what we do). Presumption of salvation is heresy and a very serious sin.
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It’s about Grace, a very Catholic idea the last time I checked.

AJC
 
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AJC:
It’s about Grace, a very Catholic idea the last time I checked.

AJC
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Yes it is, but the word “Grace” means something quite different when used by evangelical protestants like the author of this song.
 
Actually, don’t we believe we have been saved, are being saved, and hope to be saved in the future? That is, aren’t there different meanings to “saved”? In one sense we have already been saved. I don’t think the lyrics of the song necessarily conflict with our beliefs.
 
I dont care what the authors past was. AG is one of the most beautiful songs that crosses these Catholic lips of mine when I feel in union with the Lord over ALL catholic songs. It speaks to MY heart that is what counts…not what religion wrote the tune.

I support any Catholic church that sings it as long as its at opening or closing services and not used for MASS itself.

To call it a dirgful tune is laughable.
 
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Petergee:
No, I’m afraid THAT is “balderdash” as you so charitably put it. The author continued merrily slave-trading (and committing adultery) for many years after he was supposedly “saved” after becoming a “born-again” protestant. He ceased slave-trading only because he gained a more remunerative job which did not entail leaving home for long periods. He wrote “Amazing Grace” many years after that again, as one of a large number of hymns he wrote for a hymn-writing competition. Several years after THAT he first began to express doubts about his former career, and years after that again, in his old age, he first began to speak against the slave trade.

Please provide reliable historic evidence of the above. This is absolutely the first time I’ve heard this.
I’m afraid that’s purely wishful thinking on your part. I was being charitable by saying it was merely implied. In fact the words baldly state outright that the author is “saved” (past perfect tense, not conditional future) merely by “the sound” of him first saying that he “believed”; that when “we” (he and his fellow elect) “have been” (future perfect) “there” (Heaven) “10,000 years” they will still have all eternity there. The song’s basis is the heretical belief (rejected even by moderate protestants) that from the hour one “first believed”, passage to Heaven is guaranteed no matter what “dangers toils and snares” lie in store. It first began being sung in Catholic churches after a dreadful bagpipes version of it became a novelty pop hit in the 1970s, but its theology, style, authorship and worldview are all decidedly non-Catholic.
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Hmm, let’s see:

"Amazing grace, how sweet the sound
**That saved a wretch like me." **
(Saved him from the wretchedness of his life at that time.
Anglicans do not believe in once saved, always saved, no matter what).
**I once was lost, but now I’m found, **
Was blind, but now I see!"
(Seems to me that NOW he has a grip on his life, by the grace of God. You do know that Trent proclaimed that we are saved by grace alone, right? Not faith alone, certainly, but solo gratia is the teaching of the Church, last I checked).

"Twas grace that taught my heart to fear (very Catholic)
And grace my fear relieved (again very Catholic)
How precious did that grace appear
The hour I first believed!"
(Don’t most adult converts remember the “turning,” the “changing” moment?)

"Through many dangers, toils, and snares
We have already come!
Twas grace that brought us safe thus far
And grace will lead us home."
(Well, if we get there, it will be by God’s grace, which is Catholic through and through. It seems to imply a confidence in God’s grace, not a presumption or an assumption, see above about classic Anglican doctrine)

"When we’ve been there 10,000 years
Bright shinning as the sun.
We’ve no less days to sing God’s praise
Than when we’ve first begun."
(Completely Catholic)

**I think the song is SAFE. However, the latest version I’ve heard has gotten rid of the word “wretch” or rather the whole line and inserted a completely PC replacement (which I cannot recall right now). I don’t like it when they do that. Also, it’s become a bit banalized, IMHO, because it used sooo much, in soooo many contexts. I think it’s even been background music in comercials, IIRC. The only version I personally care for is…the one played by bagpipes, esp. at funerals. **
 
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Flopfoot:
Actually, as far as I can tell most Protestants don’t reject the idea that one is “saved” at ‘the hour they first believed’. But Catholics do. That’s a good point, maybe we shouldn’t sing it at my local youth group then (since it sounds like a good Catholic song, people might just assume that the lyrics are good and right when, as you point out, they’re not very good). But I can still play it on my harmonica (-:
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“We have been saved, we are being saved, and, by God’s Grace, we will be saved.” That’s supposed to be our response to the fundies who ask us if we’ve been saved.
 
The “dirgeful tune” is actually an Appalachian folk tune. The words of Amazing Grace that John Newton wrote were not originally sung to that tune. We have the Americanized version of the hymn.

Concerning whether or not the issue of salvation spoken of in the words to the song are Catholic or not, let’s consider the matter from God’s point of view since he is not bound by time. In Romans 8:29-30 we read: “29 For those whom he foreknew he also predestined to be conformed to the image of his Son, in order that he might be the firstborn among many brothers. 30 And those whom he predestined he also called, and those whom he called he also justified, and those whom he justified he also glorified.”

The Greek grammar construction of “predestined,” “called,” “justified,” and “glorified,” are all past action completed verbs with continuing abiding results.

God views the matter of the salvation of his elect as a done deal. He is not up in heaven biting his fingernals hoping that the elect make it. We are the ones who are working our salvation out in time-space history.

The ongoing process of conversion continues for us as the Holy Spirit transforms us from one degree of glory to another. We sin, repent, and grow. We sin, repent, and grow. It is ongoing. But in God’s mind, the plan of redemption is an accomplished fact.

So Catholics can sing Amazing Grace with complete confidence. When we get to heaven we will have to say as in the words of another old hymn:

Nothing in my hands I bring, simply to Thy cross I cling;
Naked look to Thee for dress; helpless, look to Thee for Grace.

Abp
 
The author continued merrily slave-trading (and committing adultery) for many years after he was supposedly “saved” after becoming a “born-again” protestant. He ceased slave-trading only because he gained a more remunerative job which did not entail leaving home for long periods. He wrote “Amazing Grace” many years after that again, as one of a large number of hymns he wrote for a hymn-writing competition. Several years after THAT he first began to express doubts about his former career, and years after that again, in his old age, he first began to speak against the slave trade.
Please provide reliable historic evidence of the above. This is absolutely the first time I’ve heard this.
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No problem, see snopes.com/religion/amazing.htm

The efforts of several of you to defend the song deserve an A for effort. But I’m afraid it will always be to me just the most common example of the dreary, boring, formulaic and theologically faulty protestant hypocrisy and smug misplaced self-righteousness which is forced on us far too often, on the basis that “if it’s “Christian” and “popular” it must be OK”.
 
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Petergee:
No it’s not a Catholic song, and it disturbs me that I hear it so often in Catholic churches.
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Well, the hymnal at one Church in our area contains “Morning Has Broken” by Cat Stevens. I’ll take “Amazing Grace” over that anyday.
 
mark a:
Well, the hymnal at one Church in our area contains “Morning Has Broken” by Cat Stevens. I’ll take “Amazing Grace” over that anyday.
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I can’t find any theological errors in “Morning Has Broken”, and its tune is far more inspiring than AG’s, although it’s not very suitable for congregational singing.
 
Archbishop, I notice you are new here. Let me give you some advice. If you want to argue about views on salvation and OSAS, don’t post in a thread about a song. By doing that, you either kill the thread, or else (and more likely), the thread kills your post. In this thread, in order to discuss the merits of the song AG, we assume that Catholic views on salvation are what really matter.

Better to make a thread about salvation in the Apologetics sub-forum if you want to discuss it. In fact, there might even be a thread discussing that very issue in the forum already - a thread that fits your post much better than this one.

(Or, of course, you could just leave those views off this forum and talk about them to your congregation instead. Not that you, or any other Protestants, don’t have a right to post here, just that Catholics are unlikely to be receptive to your ideas.)
 
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Petergee:
No problem, see snopes.com/religion/amazing.htm

The efforts of several of you to defend the song deserve an A for effort. But I’m afraid it will always be to me just the most common example of the dreary, boring, formulaic and theologically faulty protestant hypocrisy and smug misplaced self-righteousness which is forced on us far too often, on the basis that “if it’s “Christian” and “popular” it must be OK”.
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Well, I do thank you for the link. An interesting read. I still disagree about the content of the song (though it’s not my favorite…“Adoramus Te Christi” is and I don’t think anyone can question the Catholicity of that!). As for “Morning Has Broken,” I sing in our choir and whenever we’re offering up this little number, I always imagine what it would be like to see God doze off (I know He can’t doze off, I’m just saying…).
 
mark a:
Well, the hymnal at one Church in our area contains “Morning Has Broken” by Cat Stevens. I’ll take “Amazing Grace” over that anyday.
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Morning Has Broken is not BY Cat Stevens, though he did sing it (before he became a Muslim?). My mom said she remembered it from her childhood (she was educated in a convent school in Montreal so it was sung pre Vatican II)

I like AG, and particularly that 70s bagpipe version sung by Joan Baez and the other 70s version sung by Judy Collins. I never interpreted the song as having protestant meaning.
 
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