Is 'Amazing Grace' a Catholic song? Anyone know the author and verses?

[mark_a]

Morning Has Broken is not BY Cat Stevens, though he did sing it (before he became a Muslim?). My mom said she remembered it from her childhood (she was educated in a convent school in Montreal so it was sung pre Vatican II)

I like AG, and particularly that 70s bagpipe version sung by Joan Baez and the other 70s version sung by Judy Collins. I never interpreted the song as having protestant meaning.

Oops!!!

 

[davy39]

At any rate, I like the song. And it’s not as overdone as the ever popular, “Let there be piece on Earth”, which is not a Catholic song by a long shot. I cringe anymore, when I here it.

 

[mikew262]

mercygate:

Balderdash.

Nothing non-Catholic about it, despite the fact that it was written by an Anglican slave trader who experienced a profound conversion and dedicated the remainder of his life to the abolition of slavery.

There is no presumption of salvation in the verses, implicit, explicit or otherwise.

I agree. It’s a beautiful Christian hymn.

 

[jimmy]

Flopfoot:

Does anyone know who wrote Amazing Grace, is it a Catholic song?

By the way, am I missing out on some verses? The way I sing it is like -
1 Amazing grace, how sweet the sound…
2 Twas grace that taught my heart to fear…
3 Through many dangers, toils and snares…
4 When we’ve been here 10 thousand years…
Then back to verse 1 to finish.

I think it was one of the Wesley brothers, so no it is not Catholic.

 

[AlanFromWichita]

Yesterday at two Masses I played a hymn sung to that same tune. People love that tune regardless of its source, and the lyrics were absolutely Catholic.

Whether Protestant or not, people love the tune and the very thought of the tune points them toward God, although some people seem to hear it as a song which points our weapons at each other.

Honestly, you’d think the very bricks and mortar of the Church had to be specially made for God’s Church, untouched by unbeliever’s hands. If it OK for Protestants to help build the building, drive the concrete truck, etc, then it is OK for them to author melodies by which we offer our solely Catholic praise.

That’s right. There was one stone the builders rejected, but that stone is not found on the corner of any building but in our hearts, to the degree that we quit dividing and start uniting in more ways than in lip service.

Here are the words to the awful, non-Catholic hymn we sung at my sole choosing, and you know what? It went over very well and I just might do it again next year, God willing I still can! It sounds like we Catholics need a little multicultural training after all, if we cannot even share a sequence of notes with Protestants. Gosh, now Catholics have a patent on musical thoughts – like Microsoft and Intel have their little sound logos (the “Intel Inside” chime) and get rich off it. I guess it is that “haunting” sound that happens when people connect with the divine – that is scary.

Now, given these lyrics, I wish somebody to explain to me how it is sinful that I imposed this hymn on a grateful audience:
Mary's Song -- to the tune of Amazing Grace:

1. My soul proclaims the Lord my God.
   My spirit sings God’s praise,
   Who looks on me, and lifts me up,
   That gladness fills my days.
2. All nations now will share my joy;
   For gifts God has outpoured.
   This lowly one has been made great.
   I magnify the Lord.
3. For those who fear the Holy One,
   God’s mercy will not die.
   Whose strong right arm puts down the proud,
   And lifts the lowly high.
4. Fod fills the hungry with good things,
   And sends the rich away;
   The promise made to Abraham
   Is filled to endless day.
5. Then let all nations praise our God,
   The Father and the Son.
   The Spirit blest, who lives in us,
   While endless ages run.

Some may find the lyrics lame or boring, but they certainly aren’t Protestant, so at worst you have a Catholic message which shares a few notes in common with Protestants. Do you think this message is divisive, and if so, how have I sinned by playing it and thus forcing my choice upon hundreds of people in an admittedly captive audience? I think people like the song but teh clear Catholic sounding words give them comfort that it’s OK; this song is for them. If that is false comfort, then we’d better purge pretty much everything except possibly a few gregorian chants, which would be beautiful but then I’d be out of a job. – OK, so I want to be useful but I used to get so anxious about choosing exactly the right hymns for the readings and to satisfy various nit-pickers that during a weak part of my life I actually became suicidal every Saturday morning, like clockwork, when time to choose began to run out.

Now I just pick the dumb songs and quit worrying about it, mostly to exemplify the feast day and/or scripture readings, then according to various other criteria, one of which is NOT fear of somebody crapping on my music choice just before Mass and I say, “I have all music – would you prefer something else” and get a snort, “Oh, no, just play what you’ve picked for us.” Honestly I think they should pay organists hazard pay. I can only imagine the garbage a priest has to put up with.

Alan

 

[Kristina_P]

Petergee:

I’m afraid that’s purely wishful thinking on your part. I was being charitable by saying it was merely implied. In fact the words baldly state outright that the author is “saved” (past perfect tense, not conditional future) merely by “the sound” of him first saying that he “believed”; that when “we” (he and his fellow elect) “have been” (future perfect) “there” (Heaven) “10,000 years” they will still have all eternity there. The song’s basis is the heretical belief (rejected even by moderate protestants) that from the hour one “first believed”, passage to Heaven is guaranteed no matter what “dangers toils and snares” lie in store. It first began being sung in Catholic churches after a dreadful bagpipes version of it became a novelty pop hit in the 1970s, but its theology, style, authorship and worldview are all decidedly non-Catholic.

I disagree with this interpretation. I’m not really sure why he uses the word “sound” in the first stanza, but it’s obvious he’s speaking of grace. He is saved by the grace of God. The Bible uses the word “saved” in the past tense as well, e.g., Romans 8:24, Ephesians 2:5, 8. It is not to exclude the fact that we are also being saved and hope that we will be saved.

The first verse says that grace saved him and gave him ears to hear and eyes to see.

The second verse says that grace taught him to fear God and that grace also relieved his fears. This is Biblical; see Romans 8:15. It goes on to say that grace appeared a precious thing when he first believed.

The third verse says that grace has led him through the dangers of his life and that grace will lead him home. This is not presumptive, merely hopeful. If anything is going to “lead us home,” it is grace.

The fourth verse simply states that God has promised good things to those who follow Him and that our trust is in God.

The fifth verse is a hopeful look at the joy of Heaven. It is not forbidden to have reasonably confident hope in our salvation if we are living a life that pleases God.

Just because a hymn was not written by a Catholic does not mean that it is anti-Catholic. Just because a hymn was not written by a righteous man does not mean that it is unrighteous. I have no idea whether the man who wrote this hymn was righteous or not, but I perceive that your interpretation of his hymn is convoluted. You may choose to interpret the third and fifth verses as presumptive, but I look at them in light of the New Testament exhortations to hope and confident trust in God. Someone who is walking with Christ does not need to be fearful of losing their salvation beyond the level of “fear” that is necessary to keep them working out their salvation. They are permitted to look forward to heaven.

 

[Kristina_P]

Petergee:

Yes it is, but the word “Grace” means something quite different when used by evangelical protestants like the author of this song.

I personally don’t care about the author’s intent. If I were analyzing this in a literature class, that would matter, but I am deciding whether or not I find the hymn heretical. If I can assign to the words of the hymn an orthodox meaning, then the hymn is not heretical.

Also, I spent a lot of time as an Evangelical Protestant. Why do you say that they have a “quite different” definition of the word grace?

 

[AlanFromWichita]

Kristina P.:

I personally don’t care about the author’s intent. If I were analyzing this in a literature class, that would matter, but I am deciding whether or not I find the hymn heretical. If I can assign to the words of the hymn an orthodox meaning, then the hymn is not heretical.

Also, I spent a lot of time as an Evangelical Protestant. Why do you say that they have a “quite different” definition of the word grace?

Thank you for a glimmer of hope.

We can always twist the Word, or in groups words, so that they can become anti-Catholic.

If we quit using words that Protestants have also used, then we would have nothing left but silence – and I’m not so sure that would be a Bad Thing for most of us. :ehh:

Alan