Is Animal Testing Necessary?

[Marfran]

And even if someone chooses it for purely cosmetic reasons, are we to judge? It is less invasive than a face lift, and costs less. There is no need for a general anesthesia, less risk for blood loss than there would be with surgery.

Are we too judge every cosmetic use as being vain?

NO ONE is judging!!! Women or men who choose cosmetic Botox ***don’t even know ***that animals die for their choice of this injection. Did you know this before this thread??? The company has alternatives, and the HSUS among other groups is putting pressure on this manufacturer, but what incentive do they have to change the ways that they are doing things??? The consumer keeps buying the product, the sales are booming–and all because the CONSUMER IS NOT AWARE of the situation. If all cosmetic Botox users boycotted the product for just a few short months–the company would change its ways in a hurry.

hsus.org/animals_in_research/animals_in_research_news/the_hsus_continues_to.html

 

[bigfootbob]

Good key word: needs. How can they make shampoos and make-up and laundry soaps that are NOT tested on animals (and there are many companies that do NOT test their products on animals)??? How can they make them if there is a concern for human safety??? The products that are NOT tested on animals are generally gentler and many of them also contain the biodegradable symbol (it’s a leaf). They contain less potent chemicals and are generally also better for the planet/environment. Sounds like a win-win situation to me. Laundry detergent that will take your scalp off if you grab it instead of the shampoo, or laundry detergent that you can wash a baby’s behind in??? But gentler laundry detergent won’t get my clothes clean… Baloney!!! I use ***Seventh Generation ***Laundry soap–NOT tested on animals–and it does a fantastic job getting fabric clean–and it smells great too!!!

Look, I dont know anything about soap, I’m a guy. When there is a concern for my personal safety/health I want to know the drugs or whatever I’m gonna take are safe (or at least that they’re not going to kill me or do serious damage)

 

[severus68]

Totally agree!

Is there that much to discuss on this topic?

As for Botox, Cosmetic surgery is not considered sinful. Use of Botox could be used to create more symmetry in the faces of stroke victims, it is still used for migraine treatment. It is used to treat incontinence, hyperhydrosis.

And even if someone chooses it for purely cosmetic reasons, are we to judge? It is less invasive than a face lift, and costs less. There is no need for a general anesthesia, less risk for blood loss than there would be with surgery.

Are we too judge every cosmetic use as being vain?

So we need to do animal testing on botox so some can purely elective procedures instead of purely elective surgery? How does that go with the Cathechism? I don’t want to go into vanity issues. This is a non essential use of the drug, actualy a poison, so how is the suffering justified?

 

[Mary_Gail_36]

NO ONE is judging!!! Women or men who choose cosmetic Botox ***don’t even know ***that animals die for their choice of this injection. Did you know this before this thread??? The company has alternatives, and the HSUS among other groups is putting pressure on this manufacturer, but what incentive do they have to change the ways that they are doing things??? The consumer keeps buying the product, the sales are booming–and all because the CONSUMER IS NOT AWARE of the situation. If all cosmetic Botox users boycotted the product for just a few short months–the company would change its ways in a hurry.

hsus.org/animals_in_research/animals_in_research_news/the_hsus_continues_to.html

I didn’t specifically know that Botox was tested on animals. Should it be tested on humans? Or not tested?

I think it is safe to see a judgmental tone when posters say that there is no need for Botox, because it is mainly cosmetic.

By the way, proctor and gamble, hasn’t done any animal testing for a decade. It only took a few minutes to research. They makwe cosmetics, laundry detergent, lots of things.

Is the topic of the thread somewhat a moot point? And ironic, considering “embryonic research” is still legal.

 

[Mary_Gail_36]

Totally agree!

Is there that much to discuss on this topic?

As for Botox, Cosmetic surgery is not considered sinful. Use of Botox could be used to create more symmetry in the faces of stroke victims, it is still used for migraine treatment. It is used to treat incontinence, hyperhydrosis.
And even if someone chooses it for purely cosmetic reasons, are we to judge? It is less invasive than a face lift, and costs less. There is no need for a general anesthesia, less risk for blood loss than there would be with surgery.

Are we too judge every cosmetic use as being vain?

So we need to do animal testing on botox so some can purely elective procedures instead of purely elective surgery? How does that go with the Cathechism? I don’t want to go into vanity issues. This is a non essential use of the drug, actualy a poison, so how is the suffering justified?

You responded to my post, and ignored the medical uses of Botox.

 

[severus68]

NO ONE is judging!!! Women or men who choose cosmetic Botox ***don’t even know ***that animals die for their choice of this injection. Did you know this before this thread??? The company has alternatives, and the HSUS among other groups is putting pressure on this manufacturer, but what incentive do they have to change the ways that they are doing things??? The consumer keeps buying the product, the sales are booming–and all because the CONSUMER IS NOT AWARE of the situation. If all cosmetic Botox users boycotted the product for just a few short months–the company would change its ways in a hurry.

hsus.org/animals_in_research/animals_in_research_news/the_hsus_continues_to.html

There is restylane and some sugar solution stuff that are good alternatives to botox.

 

[Marfran]

I didn’t specifically know that Botox was tested on animals. Should it be tested on humans? Or not tested?

I think it is safe to see a judgmental tone when posters say that there is no need for Botox, because it is mainly cosmetic.

By the way, proctor and gamble, hasn’t done any animal testing for a decade. It only took a few minutes to research. They makwe cosmetics, laundry detergent, lots of things.

Is the topic of the thread somewhat a moot point? And ironic, considering “embryonic research” is still legal.

I specifically did not know that Botox was tested on animals either, until severus68 started this thread. The thing with the Botox is, that unlike other drugs that go through a test period before they are allowed on the market, all batches of Botox are tested on animals after they are made–the testing didn’t end after initial testing for clearance.

There is nothing wrong with caring about one’s appearance (a little vanity) but in the extreme, vanity hurts people and animals.

I would have no problem with someone having a cosmetic Botox injection (they actually aren’t that expensive), and would place it in the category of a haircut/style or perm/coloring etc., but because animals are killed and injured for it, that puts it into a different category. And I have a feeling that maybe perms and colorings are tested on animals. Someone will have to research that. I know that some colorings contain more natural ingredients (like henna) as opposed to extreme chemicals.

I’m glad you looked up Proctor & Gamble–see that’s all we have to do–learn and make informed choices.

And this is a different issue, but how many people do not understand or are aware of embryonic research and where this research is applied??? This too goes to being informed and learning, and using that information.

 

[Mary_Gail_36]

I specifically did not know that Botox was tested on animals either, until severus68 started this thread. The thing with the Botox is, that unlike other drugs that go through a test period before they are allowed on the market, all batches of Botox are tested on animals after they are made–the testing didn’t end after initial testing for clearance.

Because Botoix uses an altered bacterium, each batch needs to be tested, because bacteria can change gentically on its own

There is nothing wrong with caring about one’s appearance (a little vanity) but in the extreme, vanity hurts people and animals.

I would have no problem with someone having a cosmetic Botox injection (they actually aren’t that expensive), and would place it in the category of a haircut/style or perm/coloring etc., but because animals are killed and injured for it, that puts it into a different category. And I have a feeling that maybe perms and colorings are tested on animals. Someone will have to research that. I know that some colorings contain more natural ingredients (like henna) as opposed to extreme chemicals.

I’m glad you looked up Proctor & Gamble–see that’s all we have to do–learn and make informed choices.

And this is a different issue, but how many people do not understand or are aware of embryonic research and where this research is applied??? This too goes to being informed and learning, and using that information.

 

[Marfran]

There is restylane and some sugar solution stuff that are good alternatives to botox.

Actually restylane is a filler. Botox is a muscle relaxant. They don’t work the same way, not used for the same problems/areas of the face. I don’t know what restylane is made of, have to look it up. Some of the facial fillers are made from animal collagens.

 

[severus68]

You responded to my post, and ignored the medical uses of Botox.

My apologies. I had respoded earlier on its use for migraines. Botox is actually a poison and can kill. The use of botox is risky. There can be permanent nerve damage for example. I am not sure why they need to test on animals and how they test since botox is injected. Let me do some more research and revert.

 

[Marfran]

Because Botoix uses an altered bacterium, each batch needs to be tested, because bacteria can change gentically on its own

Thanks!!! Great research!!! Like it or not, we (on this thread) are becoming knowledgable about Botox!!! I did not imagine I would start my day learning about Botox!!!

 

[Graubo3]

And this is a different issue, but how many people do not understand or are aware of embryonic research and where this research is applied??? This too goes to being informed and learning, and using that information.

Many non-profit organizations do, even the best known.
Embryonic stem cell breakthroughs can become patentable, where as adult stem cells can not. Follow the money.
How many know of cosmetic injections much like Botox, utilizing aborted babies? Big money in former Soviet countries.

Peace, Graubo

 

[Marfran]

Actually there are also tests done on humans, was on one for a new drug. Animal testing of drugs does not always help humans.

Why do you need to drip shampoo into the eye of a rabbit with its head clampd until the eye ulcerates? I is obvious that some substances should not form part of the ingredients of a shampoo when shampoo des get into eyes. What is the point? How do some companies manage to produce good shampoo without such testing?

Yes, exactly. OK–we put too much CHEMICAL X into the shampoo–look how it burned that (living, breathing) rabbit’s eye out. We’ll get sued by the human who washes his eye with it, so we better cut back on that chemical…

 

[Marfran]

You responded to my post, and ignored the medical uses of Botox.

The vast majority of Botox use is for cosmetic reasons. Many, many, animals die in LD-50 tests for cosmetic Botox, other uses only comprise a fraction of the supply.

So the question is: If it is not essential to your health, should you have a Botox injection for cosmetic reasons, or should you boycott the product and let the company know that you will try their product when they utilize an alternative to the LD-50 tests.

 

[severus68]

Actually restylane is a filler. Botox is a muscle relaxant. They don’t work the same way, not used for the same problems/areas of the face. I don’t know what restylane is made of, have to look it up. Some of the facial fillers are made from animal collagens.

The fillers ae much less dangerous. They are mostly used for the lines from the sides of the nose to the sides of the mouth. Botox is also used for those lines and for lips. There are non animal substitutes available. Collagen is also used to plump up lips

 

[gurneyhalleck1]

Here is my opinion: If something like shampoo, drugs, medical procedures etc. needs to be tested, then it is much more ethical to test it on animals then humans. (You better not disagree on that…) But to feed an animal oven cleaner like Marfran said seems unethical.

“seems?” jee, do ya think!? Of course it is!!

 

[Marfran]

Use of Botox could be used to create more symmetry in the faces of stroke victims, it is still used for migraine treatment. It is used to treat incontinence, hyperhydrosis.

You responded to my post, and ignored the medical uses of Botox.

And how do the medical uses of Botox prevent the manufactuer from finding alternatives to the LD-50 tests??? If there were no such alternatives, HSUS would not be stating that there are, and pressuring the company to change it’s practices.

 

[gurneyhalleck1]

Many non-profit organizations do, even the best known.
Embryonic stem cell breakthroughs can become patentable, where as adult stem cells can not. Follow the money.
How many know of cosmetic injections much like Botox, utilizing aborted babies? Big money in former Soviet countries.

Peace, Graubo

I actually haven’t heard anything about this. I’d like to know more…

 

[gurneyhalleck1]

We know drugs, skin care and beauty products and even shampoo are tested on animals before being sold to the public. Is all this testing necessary? Is testing of drugs on animals valid and accurate when animal physiology is different from ours? Can we justify causing suffering for the sake of beauty and vanity? The Cathechism teaches that we should not cause unnecessary suffering. I would like to know what others think. Thank you.

Severus, I want to thank you for such a thoughtful, compassionate post. I DETEST animal research and needless suffering brought to animals in such an inhumane and unncecessary way. I applaud you for exposing the question to people and for your common sense. We can be Catholics, human beings, kings of the food chain, and still compassionate and loving to the creatures God placed below us. Great thread and posts… God bless you!

 

[severus68]

And how do the medical uses of Botox prevent the manufactuer from finding alternatives to the LD-50 tests??? If there were no such alternatives, HSUS would not be stating that there are, and pressuring the company to change it’s practices.

There are altenative, more accurate non animal ests available.