Is anything more important than the fate of your immortal soul?

[IanM]

Is anything more important than the fate of your immortal soul? I would be very interested if anyone might have identified some such thing, so if so, please let us know!

If anyone thinks that nothing is of greater importance than the fate of your immortal soul, please could he or she explain why teaching one of the most most important doctrines of Holy Mother Church (in my opinion at least) and rooted in Sacred Scripture, Sacred Tradition and the Magisterium of the Church, commonly known as The Four Last Things (Death, Judgment, Heaven and Hell) seems to have become conspicuous by its absence?

I will add that I cannot remember ever hearing any sermon regarding this doctrine other than at an EF Mass which I recently attended in the UK. All my understanding of the doctrine is from self study of St. Alphonsus Liguori (Preparation for Death: Considerations on Eternal Truths 1st Edition ) and various editions of Church Catechisms.
Links to various sources:

https://www.amazon.com/Preparation-...&sprefix=peparations+for+death,aps,316&sr=8-1

I also read this translation of Liguori which does not exclude the harsher components in his work which are excised to presumably avoid upsetting modern sensibilities.
“Preparation for Death” Paperback – November 19, 2014

https://www.amazon.com/Preparation-...&sprefix=peparations+for+death,aps,316&sr=8-2

 

[Nik]

It’s coming up in my RCIA schedule soon!

Also haven’t specifically heard a homily preached on The Four Last Things per se but there has definitely been ones on death, heaven, hell and judgement.

 

[EndTimes]

Is anything more important than the fate of your immortal soul?

No. Ultimately … If one does not wind up in Heaven one winds up in Hell

 

[midori]

I’m currently reading “The Difference Between Temporal and Eternal” (Nieremberg, c. 1640). There was a nice little bit that went

Truly it is a thing of great amazement, that being in great expectation of two such extremes as eternal glory and torments without end, we live as if there were neither.

 

[EndTimes]

Truly it is a thing of great amazement, that being in great expectation of two such extremes as eternal glory and torments without end, we live as if there were neither.

Nieremberg’s ‘we’ is way too all-encompassing aka painted with an ambiguous broad-brush… .

FOR - Some do indeed - and with God’s Grace and Mercy - successfully strive for HIS Kingdom

 

[Magnanimity]

Is anything more important than the fate of your immortal soul? I would be very interested if anyone might have identified some such thing, so if so, please let us know!

:raising_hand_man:t2: Off the top of my head, I can think of two!

“You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart, with all your soul, with all your mind, and with all your strength.”
“You shall love your neighbor as yourself. There is no other commandment greater than these.” -Mark 12:30-31

Loving God and everyone is vastly more important than trying to check all the right boxes to secure and safeguard one’s immortal soul. Being Catholic for the purpose of hedging one’s bets or purchasing ‘fire insurance’ to escape Hell is paltry, pathetic, and so very pitiable.

Not that I’m describing you. I don’t know you. But the world today has little need of the person who is “so heavenly minded that he’s of no earthly good.”

 

[TheMortenBay]

This line from the Litany of Humility comes to mind:

That others may become holier than I, provided that I may become as holy as I should,
Jesus, grant me the grace to desire it.

 

[midori]

Nieremberg’s ‘we’ is way too all-encompassing aka painted with an ambiguous broad-brush… .

FOR - Some do indeed - and with God’s Grace and Mercy - successfully strive for HIS Kingdom

Um, that’s one sentence out of about 400 pages…

Obviously, the “we” does not refer to the people who actively strive for God’s kingdom. The paragraph itself is talking about people who are so caught up in the things of this world, they don’t pay attention to the dangers of ignoring the eternal, even though in the back of their head, they may have been taught something about it. I’d say that’s a very accurate observation, which is why I bothered to dig it up and type it out.

But then again, it just got finished talking about various individuals who were so overwhelmed by the concept of eternity, that they were incapacitated, because they were given the grace to actually comprehend what eternity was, and they understood eternity despite the limits of their physical natures, and it was a physically overwhelming comprehension---- I wouldn’t be so quick to group myself in the group of “strivers”. Because “strivers” has a very purposeful connotation, where every move you make is a deliberate action in quest of a particular goal, and I know I’m more at a vague amble in what I hope is the right direction.

 

[EndTimes]

Um, that’s one sentence out of about 400 pages…

Obviously, the “we” does not refer to the people who actively strive for God’s kingdom. n---- I wouldn’t be so quick to group myself in the group of “strivers”. Because “strivers” has a very purposeful connotation, where every move you make is a deliberate action in quest of a particular goal, and I know I’m more at a vague amble in what I hope is the right direction.

Number of pages does not discount the ambiguity of Nieremberg’s ‘we’
And Why Not? be a Striver for Heaven?
That’s our calling; is it not?

 

[TheLittleLady]

As Scripture tells us, do not fear those who kill the body but those who kill the soul.

 

[JimG]

But the world today has little need of the person who is “so heavenly minded that he’s of no earthly good.”

On the other hand I would not wish to discourage those men and women monastics who spend their entire life praying earnestly for all the rest of us. I think they probably get a lot of people into heaven and keep a lot of people out of hell.

 

[PetraG]

Just out of curiosity, OP, did you expect to get someone here to disagree with your major premise?

I heard about the Four Last Things last weekend. The essential premise was that if we have a proper horror of offending the Author of Love and Mercy in the least way, simply because He deserves to be loved without reservation, as the recognized Saints did, we need not fear the fate of those who deliberately and without repentance offend Him gravely.

In other words, if all you’re worried about is that you yourself don’t go to Hell, you may be saved from Hell but in the end you’re going to live in this life as a rather crummy saint. Purgatory can make a crummy saint into the fully-formed specimen intended by God, but we weren’t given the Gospel to be crummy saints in this life. God has a lot more in mind for us than keeping our moral noses above the water line until we can get the real transformation of Purgatory.

That is not to say we ought to be presumptuous. It is to say that the oft-repeated “Be not afraid” is believable and ought to be believed by those who are devoted to pleasing the Most High.

 

[JimG]

The last time I actually heard the four last things mentioned during a Mass was quite a few decades ago while attending Mass at a church located near a popular tourist area. At the end of the homily the priest mentioned that the collection would now be taken up, and he said something like this:

“Now remember that this church serves probably five times as many people during the summer months as it does during the rest of the year. But we have to maintain the parish all year long and we do have a regular congregation. So–I don’t want to hear the clink of coins dropping into the collection basket. I want to hear the rustle of paper! If I hear nothing but coins, I’m going to stop right there, go back and lock the door, and give a sermon on Death, Judgment, Heaven and Hell, which might go on for a long time.”

 

[englands123]

Is anything more important than the fate of your immortal soul?

There is something more important , to love our Lord with all our heart , soul , mind & strength.

If you only love the Lord to protect ones own soul this isn’t loving God and he will know that. As he sees everything.

 

[Magnanimity]

On the other hand I would not wish to discourage those men and women monastics who spend their entire life praying earnestly for all the rest of us.

Undoubtedly, their work is indispensable to the church and, I am compelled to believe, to the entire world, which God loves.

As I’m sure it was plain from my whole reply above, I was contrasting the self-interested vantage-point of the OP with the 2 great commandments. There is no 3rd great commandment to take care of ourselves and make sure we get our golden ticket into paradise. Possibly, such self-love (self-obsession?) is in fact at odds with the 2 great commandments.

 

[VanitasVanitatum]

The nobler thing is to not be self-interested in anything. Since God wants us in heaven that should be the only motive to be there.

 

[PetraG]

The nobler thing is to not be self-interested in anything. Since God wants us in heaven that should be the only motive to be there.

OK, to take the other side, it really is “both and” and not “either or.”
All this I do for the sake of the gospel, so that I too may have a share in it… I drive my body and train it, for fear that, after having preached to others, I myself should be disqualified. 1 Cor 9: 23,27

By “both and”, though, it is both try to increase our closeness to God and help others to increase theirs. We don’t get there by self-interest, you are right. Having said that, the idea of self-interest is not out of place when the self-interest is avoiding eternal death. Nowhere does anyone make others into saints without taking care for their own friendship with God. As the airlines put it, it is foolish to help others with their oxygen masks without making sure there is oxygen flowing into your own.

 

[VanitasVanitatum]

Having said that, the idea of self-interest is not out of place when the self-interest is avoiding eternal death. Nowhere does anyone make others into saints without taking care for their own friendship with God.

God’s will already encompasses it so self-interest is an impediment to having a pure love for God,

 

[PetraG]

God’s will already encompasses it so self-interest is an impediment to having a pure love for God,

I don’t think the plain meaning of the Gospel supports that view. Both St. Paul and Our Lord talked to people in terms of choosing actions that would lead to the salvation of their hearers. They never said that this would in any way impede helping anybody else or that wanting to come into salvation would in any way sully the purity of one’s love for God. God does not expect us to love him to the point of not caring if we are eternally separated from God’s love.

That kind of doesn’t make sense, if you think about it, unless of course you are only talking about people who fall into self-righteousness or thinking they’ve earned God’s love.

 

[Vico]

Is anything more important than the fate of your immortal soul? …The Four Last Things (Death, Judgment, Heaven and Hell) seems to have become conspicuous by its absence?
…

Catechism of the Catholic Church

460 The Word became flesh to make us " partakers of the divine nature ": 78 “For this is why the Word became man, and the Son of God became the Son of man: so that man, by entering into communion with the Word and thus receiving divine sonship, might become a son of God.” 79 “For the Son of God became man so that we might become God.” 80 “The only-begotten Son of God, wanting to make us sharers in his divinity, assumed our nature, so that he, made man, might make men gods.” 81

1037 God predestines no one to go to hell; for this, a willful turning away from God (a mortal sin) is necessary, and persistence in it until the end. …

1861 Mortal sin is a radical possibility of human freedom, as is love itself. It results in the loss of charity and the privation of sanctifying grace, that is, of the state of grace. If it is not redeemed by repentance and God’s forgiveness, it causes exclusion from Christ’s kingdom and the eternal death of hell, for our freedom has the power to make choices for ever, with no turning back. However, although we can judge that an act is in itself a grave offense, we must entrust judgment of persons to the justice and mercy of God.

1864 “Therefore I tell you, every sin and blasphemy will be forgiven men, but the blasphemy against the Spirit will not be forgiven.” 136 There are no limits to the mercy of God, but anyone who deliberately refuses to accept his mercy by repenting, rejects the forgiveness of his sins and the salvation offered by the Holy Spirit. 137 Such hardness of heart can lead to final impenitence and eternal loss.

1994 Justification is the most excellent work of God’s love made manifest in Christ Jesus and
granted by the Holy Spirit. It is the opinion of St. Augustine that “the justification of the wicked is a greater work than the creation of heaven and earth,” because “heaven and earth will pass away but the salvation and justification of the elect . . . will not pass away.” 43 He holds also that the justification of sinners surpasses the creation of the angels in justice, in that it bears witness to a greater mercy.