Is arguing healthy for a marriage?

  • Thread starter Thread starter Jack_Black
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
J

Jack_Black

Guest
There is a lot of background here, but I am going to try and cut to the chase. Hopefully this will be clear without too much history info.

We have been married almost 10 years. My wife has very little patience and a very short temper. She is quick to start an argument at the slightest problem.

Most of our arguments result from her criticizing me and my defending myself. And because I recognized this, I make sure that I never criticize her in the slightest way and I never put her down or talk condescendingly to her. I praise her often. I compliment her a lot. And I know her criticism of me largely comes from a problem of low self esteem (on her part). I know this because she told me so. So I often find myself trying to boost her self esteem, but that is an endless battle in itself.

About 6 months ago, I really started to question why we argue so much as she had stepped up her aggression and I was growing increasingly tired of it. So I read a few books on the matter (both catholic and non-catholic) and something finally clicked in me and I realized that if I was unhappy in the situation I was in, I had to change myself. I can’t change her or her personality. I can only change myself. So I did. I simply decided to stop arguing with her.

This is where the problem lies. It seems to enrage her even more.

I decided that whenever she criticizes me, I wouldn’t let it bother me. Where possible I would just ignore it and when pressed by her for a response I simply ask why she is criticizing me. She really doesn’t like my non-response to her accusations. She now accuses me of thinking I’m better than her and the sarcasm level goes through the roof.

Now I am being told (from multiple directions) that I am the one who is wrong and that arguing is healthy for a good strong marriage. I’m sorry, but I have to disagree. So many secular sources tout that arguing is good and healthy for a marriage and couples should engage in constructive arguing and try not to tear each other down… blah blah blah.

Now I know I am not Jesus, by a long shot, but if I am trying to be true to my Catholic beliefs and teachings, I need to strive to be as Christ like as I can be each and every day. And I simply can not see Jesus arguing with anyone or telling someone that arguing is good and healthy for a marriage. In fact I read only the opposite in the Bible.

I realize that good communication is one thing and every marriage needs it, but arguing is a wholly different matter and should never be considered part of a strong and healthy relationship.

Am I totally off base here, or I am correct in my thinking?

Thanks.
 
Dear Jack, from what you have written, it sounds like you are in an abusive relationship. I suspect that low self-esteem is not your wife’s problem, but rather that she is a very controlling personality. I think you need to pursue marriage counseling with a Catholic therapist. Have you discussed this with your priest? I will pray for you. Debbie
 
***So, you do everything right, and she is always in the wrong? 😃 Okay. 😉

I’m joking around with you, but there are two sides to every story.

But, going with what you post here…no, your wife’s temper sounds a bit unhealthy. I do think however, that ‘conflict resolution’ can be healthy. Especially when kids see mom and dad have a spat…and they both apologize…and then life goes on again…forgiving and forgetting. My husband and I try to live by that. We hadn’t fought in a loooong time, until last night. I was pretty angry. 😦 But, again…we worked it out…apologized…and now, it’s forgotten. (sorta :p)

But, it sounds like your wife ‘starts’ arguments perhaps to gain attention, also perhaps as a misplacement of real anger towards something else that she never dealt with properly…maybe something from her past? Her childhood? I am not sure. But, to always be brow beaten as you sound like to be, that is NOT healthy for a marriage. It’s not healthy for your wife to be angry so much…from also a physical/health standpoint.

I would see if she would be interested in counseling…and also retrouvaille is a retreat type experience that is supposed to do wonders for marriages that have some issues. It isn’t a cure-all, but I think that it could help.

But, your wife needs to hear you out, and not drown you out. You matter. I would tell the same thing, to a woman going through something like this. You matter. If you continue to sweep your feelings under the rug, your marriage will not be better for it. She needs some counseling, if in fact, she is angry ‘most’ of the time, for very seemingly minor things. Plus, if you have kids, they will learn that being angry all the time is normal.

I dare say she could be verbally abusive…I mean, when men cut down women, it is often the reply on here…but, I don’t know enough of what your wife actually says to you, to make that leap.

I will be praying for you and her…please try to resolve this with her, you both are on the same team…she needs to look at you as her partner, not her enemy. Once you get to the heart of why she does view you that way, you will be a mile ahead. :o***
 
In most cases, arguing is healthy for a marriage. It helps with respect for one another and helps the bond grow stronger and deeper. However, in your case, this is not healthy. It isn’t healthy to always want to pick a fight or criticize the other. You said you are trying to let your wife criticize and not let it bother you. It might work now, but there will come a point where it will bother you and cause you to question yourself, her, and the marriage. I would normally suggest the two of you work this out on your own, however in this case I agree conseling is best. Get someone who is neutral and won’t take sides.

Good luck and God bless! 👋

:manvspc:
 
Thanks for the replies. Like I said, I don’t want to get into too much history since it tends to gets off the topic, but we have been to several marriage counselors. One was a catholic counselor, the others were not. They were all ineffective.
 
Jack_Black said:
Thanks for the replies. Like I said, I don’t want to get into too much history since it tends to gets off the topic, but we have been to several marriage counselors. One was a catholic counselor, the others were not. They were all ineffective.
Click to expand...
What are you going to do?
 
Well, are times when I have picked fights with my fiance and he chooses to ignore me. It drives me absolutely mad! I get louder and angrier, then frustrated, then I feel sorry for myself … eventually I realize that he was right in ignoring me because I was nagging him over something petty and I really just wanted attention. It’s really hard for me to realize that until I calm down, and I can’t calm down until we stop arguing so, in the end, I’m glad that he doesn’t engage when I’m being irrational. But this doesnt happen all the time and you’re saying it happens in your marriage more often and that seems unusual.

You mentioned your wife has low self-esteem - perhaps these fights she starts with you are just to get your attention? You wrote that you try to give her compliments and such - does she accept them? Perhaps marriage counseling hasn’t yet worked because she needs one-on-one counseling to deal with her internal struggles before she can add you to the equation? Is that something she’d be willing to try & you’d feel comfortable with?

–
 
It does seem she wants attention. People who don’t have the attention they need, become prone to outburts over little things. Basically, if you’re being neglected, you get a short fuse. I see that in myself, too, so it’s not just women who do it.

I don’t think arguing is all that healthy, but conflict resolution is indeed healthier than avoidance. Arguing goes the bad way, rather than the merits, but avoidance skips the merits altogether. And maybe she wants the merits addressed?

It seems to me you and your wife may not fully understand each other’s conflict solving style. For example, it seems to me that you’re more of a compromiser (of the reasonable kind of compromisers), whereas your wife seems more of an asserter, except her low self-esteem undercuts her certainty and she can’t assert effectively, which frustrates her.

It reminds me of an army situation (not like I’ve ever been in the army), where you need to make a noob trooper a full-fledged squad member. It’s not gonna happen until you let the newbie take responsibility for the whole squad or he otherwise pulls his buds out of some trouble. Basically, responsibility seems to me to be the way out of self-esteem. Give her some opportunity to show her value?

As for some other things you mentioned, she may see them as appeasement, which may remind her of her problems and make her feel that while she’s getting her basic needs unmet, she’s the one judged and cast out on the account of her strong emotional reaction, which is caused by her desperate situation, so again she’s not guilty but stuff’s making it look like she is. I hate that kind of situations myself, too.

If it were my situation, I’d try to make her feel responsible and important. But before you implement anything of what I said, you may want to ask a therapist or a psychologist. I’m a lawyer. I’ve learnt some conflict solving but not therapy.
 
I don’t want to deter too much away from the reason I came here, which was to get opinions on arguing, and I’m not trying to see whose right and whose wrong in these situations, but to address you comments;

WhateverGirl: I don’t know what I am going to do. I wish I knew. I’ve been trying to figure that out for years now. I’ve chosen this non-confrontational point of view for the present time and I like it a lot better than arguing. I think I will stick with it for a while. She may not like it, but then again, she doesn’t like most things that I do.

To address your response and Embee’s; She has been to at least 4 psychiatrist / psychologists over the years. None of them seemed to have helped her very much. She is currently in therapy (once a week). She likes this person a lot. Maybe they can help. She has a lot of baggage from childhood to deal with.

She does get a lot of attention from me. Unless you’ve ever been in a relationship with someone who has low self esteem, you don’t know how hard it is to raise their level of self respect. They have to want it. I have gone to the extremes to praise her, compliment her, boost her up as high as I can. It all seems to fall on deaf (or closed) ears. Nothing I do helps, although I keep trying.
 
Hey Jack_Black 🙂

Do it get worse around her time of the month? My moods are out of this world when I am about to start and all the things I have been frustrated about in the last month are blown way out of proportion. Every.little.tiny.thing sets me off when I am PMS-ing plus the things that normally don’t bother me.

Just something to think about. If it is 100% of the time, just ignore this!
 
Finding a qualified professional that you like is extremely important (and sometimes takes a few tries), so I’m glad that your wife likes the one she has now. Us women tend to need to talk and talk (and talk some more) about stuff before we feel better. I have no other advice than just for you to keep trying and not give up on her. You seem to already be doing this, so I’ll pray that you guys can continue making progress together.

–
 
Could she perceive your (non)actions as stonewalling? Basically, as shutting her and your relationship’s problems out?

I think Dr. John Gottman’s research might be useful for you. He deals a lot with how to handle conflict in a healthy way. Look up his books and check them out - that’s my advice. Yes, his writing is secular, but he believes strongly that the research shows that it is better for a marriage to stay together.

According to his research, arguing is not critical for a relationship, but complaining is healthy for a relationship. Criticism and defensiveness are not healthy, of course. Contempt and stonewalling are also dangerous. Although complaining is healthy, it is important to maintain an overall positive atmosphere - 5 positive interactions for each negative one.

If you think she might be perceiving your non-action as shutting her out (and getting even more upset and emotional is the normal response to stonewalling - trying to break through the wall with even more force - so this seems likely), try to let her know that you care about her concerns but can’t handle the stress of an argument.
  • Ask to schedule a time to discuss it - pick a time when you should both be relaxed and try and make the atmosphere relaxing (DH and I make hot drinks with whipped cream on top - chai for him, a mocha or hot chocolate for me).
  • If, during a discussion, you find things are feeling like an argument, let her know that you are feeling like things are getting too intense and ask for a few minutes break to go calm down.
Unfortunately, that’s most of what I remember from the books. The key thing is to find a way to listen to what she is saying without getting defensive, and to give yourself the space you need so that her emotional behavior doesn’t leave you feeling overwhelmed with stress.

The books also have advice for dealing with criticism and contempt, which it sounds like you are getting from your wife.

I really think Dr. John Gottman’s books might be a big help in your situation. They are very readable. I hear the more recent one, “The 7 Principles for Making Marriage Work” is more readable and includes more information than the first book (I read the first one, called “Why Marriages Suceed and Fail”).
 
Oh, yeah, on the arguing thing - Dr. Gottman found that arguing more or less doesn’t really indicate the health of the marriage. How the couple handled conflict did.

He found three common stable styles of relationships. I forget their names, but it comes down to couples that argue a lot (but have a lot of really strong positive interactions as well, so things are overall happy), couples that use good communication skills and discussions to resolve their problems, and couples that avoid conflict. All three of these can work out. He talks more about which kinds of people tend to have which style in his books.
 
I’d say the answer to the OP depends on the kind of arguing. If it quickly deteriorates into screaming & yelling w/ no resolution, just resignation and/or avoidance - its bad. However, if its normal discourse on hot topics - complete w/ raised voices & what-not - but progresses to resolution - its ok.

Believe it or not I have the opposite problem as your wife. I have low self-esteem, but it makes me more compliant to whatever my husband wants. Our priest (the one that married us) counselled me to stand up for myself & let my husband know when something bothered me. My husband even agreed w/ him. I’m working on it & it does seem like we argue more often now, but I’m not sitting around feeling pushed around all the time either. Its all about balance.

In your situation, as described, it sounds like there is significant imbalance that needs to be addressed somehow. I’m sure you’re already doing this, but continue to pray for yourself & her as well as your relationship. Continue to seek professional help if possible. Good luck!
 
Defending yourself against her constant criticism is not what I would call really arguing. Not responding to the criticism, is not really arguing either. I know she is under professional care, but what is SHE doing to help the situation?
 
No, I don’t believe arguing is healthy for a marriage.

Have you considered the possiblility that there is unresolved sin in her life? Or perhaps people she has not forgiven? :confused: There is a prayer method to pray for generational sin - sin repercussions handed down through family, and other prayers to break ties with family members who are into unhealthy religions. She should make a formal prayer of forgiveness of specific people instead of just sort of thinking about it.

You should first pray that you learn what to pray for her. That way you can then focus all your prayer and those of friends in a concentrated direction.

Consider hunting for a charismatic priest who could guide you.

Of course, if sin or unforgiveness is the problem, she might not want to forgive or leave her sin. She has free will. And that will be your cross.
 
What was her family’s conflict resolution method? Maybe she grew up with pots and pans being thrown and everyone got it out in the open and then moved on.

Or maybe that’s all she knows is that marriage = arguing. 😦

If two people agree on everything, only one person is doing the thinking. I find that to be true.

Since you don’t give us any clues as to what the arguing is about… sex, money, everything? we can’t help much.

It’s good to clear the air. Some people let things fester and say nothing till one day, kablooey! It all blows up.

She lets off steam. A lot.

How you handle that can difuse the situation or make it go kablooey. Walking away and disengaging is somewhat passive aggressive. You are telling her that her issues don’t matter. You are dismissing her. She who will not be ignored is going to become angry at that.

You both need to take a communication class. Maybe if she has an issue, you can find a way to resolve it in writing.

Instead of her saying YOU ALWAYS LEAVE THE TOOTHPASTE CAP OFF. YOU DON"T LOVE ME OR YOU’D CLEAN UP AFTER YOURSELF! (or whatever…) instead of walking away, or yelling that it’s not your job to clean the house…
  1. Look her in the eye. Say: I hear you state the problem that I am leaving a mess for you and that upsets you.
  2. Ask her: What action do you want me to take to fix the situation? Listen while she states it. Keep it on subject. “No, we’re not talking about the laundry right now. What about the toothpaste tube?”
  3. Apologize for making her feel like the maid.
  4. Now cooperate and put the toothpaste cap on.
If it’s issues like that, there is no fight if you can discuss actions and resolutions and put them in practice without a power struggle.

If you don’t want to be the victim of her verbal abuse (which is what it is, if her attempt to get the cap on the toothpaste involves her listing how much your parents suck and all the sins you’ve committed for 5 years and how horrible you are) then you have to confront that.

“Please, remember I have feelings. If there is something I can do to fix this specific problem, let’s work on it one problem at a time. But I don’t call you names. So please don’t call me names.”

Maybe if you both took a communication course. Does she get along with everyone like this or just you?

When you argue back, do you go for the jugular? Is the only time you talk to her when she brings up an issue? Do you ever talk to her for fun?

Arguing isn’t the problem. It’s a symptom of a problem. It’s a symptom of an underlying anger and unresolved issues. You need to make a list of issues you both want resolved in your marriage, exchange lists and write down under each issue what you both are willing to do to fix that.

Sometimes when you have to think and write rather than speak and not think it’s easier to see the real issues and not get swept away in the verbiage.

What you are doing now isn’t working.

Healthy marriages aren’t marked by constant arguing any more than healthy people have persistent fevers.

Ask yourself when the arguing started, what the issues are that spark them. Is it the same three or four problems?

Until she sees you as someone who can help her with her problems instead of being one of her problems, she’s going to argue with you.

Or she can be just plain crazy and a narcissist and to her arguing is like sex and the only emotion she is in touch with is her own anger. But you haven’t given us much info here.

It’s a range from poor parent models and she can overcome that to hopeless case. Why did you marry an argumentative person with no patience to begin with? For ten years you have defended yourself against character attacks?

You can’t change her. You can only change how you react to her. If you react right and she is sane, she will grow to trust you and your judgment and not see you disagreeing with her as an insult to her character or intelligence. You need to learn to disagree without being disagreeable. "Yes, dear, I might have been inconsiderate when I closed the garage door while you were outside. I’m sorry. "

Or maybe “Yes, I know I’m a horrible excuse for a man and a liar and a cheat with no chance of real success in life. By the way, why DID you marry me?”

If she reverts to sarcasm to get you to respond, then obviously your ignoring her is coming off as very highhanded. Just be clear and honest: "Dear, why do you constantly say things that hurt me? Do you want me to think you are mean? Because I used to think you were nice. But ten years of being told how horrible I am takes a toll on me too. "

You haven’t given enough information to know how this fits into her life as a whole. Are you replaying her mom and dad’s script? Are you seriously irritating and incompetent and she’s angry she can’t count on you for anything? Are you passive aggressive and playing the good guy and she gets to play the role of the harpie who only gets what she wants if she screams loud enough and you become the victim in this game?

More details needed.

But again, no, constant fighting is not good for the soul or the marriage. My xh loved nothing more than to fight about everything. But he didn’t go to counseling to fix himself. He sent me because he was sure I was the problem. He’ll argue with a fence post and say the fence post started it.

Ten years of that and I was ready for the loony bin. Only so many times you can hear how worthless you are before you begin to believe it. Some people can’t function in peace and quiet. They have to ruin it in order for their world to feel “normal.”

What would SHE say is her side of the story about YOUR behavior?
 
Well, I would say, it is not a question of whether you argue or how often you argue, but how you both choose to argue. Some of what you describe doesn’t even sound like “arguing” but rather just nastiness with no real goal in mind. But, there are two sides.

I try to keep myself in check by asking myself- What is the “goal” of this debate? If I can’t figure that out, then it may be that I should figure out what it is I am so upset about before I open my mouth! We are only human. We get frustrated, hurt, sad, fearful, lonely, and more and take it out on our poor family and friends sometimes without ever really communicating what is actually wrong.

Your wife sounds like she is hurting an awful lot from something, and may be taking it out on you? You don’t have to engage in verbal abuse, but she may end up feeling isolated even more (or ignored) by what you are doing now.

Have either of you spoken about how you would like to air your complaints to each other? How you can make your own outline for conflict resolution that involves no name calling, No YOU statements, only “I” statements so there’s no finger pointing? Ok, I tried this and got cut down, but maybe with the help of a counselor that can “teach” you both some new things, it can work. Adapt a conflict resolution method together.

Here’s an example of how things go usually: Scenario: Husband is boisterously laughing and chatting with a buddy about goings on in his day that wife is excluded from. He gets off the phone, his demeanor changes, and he wants to know the same ol “Whats for dinner” routine. She is upset that he seems to live this other life that he never shares with her. In a word, she feels excluded. Lonely. Isolated. She wants to know her husband. She wants him to share his day, but he doesn’t. When she asks, “How was your day”, she gets “Fine”. So, instead of telling him all that and that she misses him and feels left out, she becomes bitter and resentful. “Do you have to talk so loud with your friends? That is so obnoxious.” What she really could say that would help is:

You barely talk to me. I over hear you telling this great story on the phone to someone, and you never share it with me. I feel so lonely. Why don’t you tell me what happened in your day, b/c I would love to hear it. I miss you.

Why don’t we do this? Lots of hurt builds up over time, and we don’t want to be vulnerable.

Keep looking for a counselor. Barnabas Centers are usually good sources. Best wishes, and be open to thinking you may be doing a lot of things to contribute to the problems that you don’t even realize or don’t want to admit.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top