Is Birth Control Christian?

[catharina]

Don’t believe me then. I don’t care. I am not here to change your mind.

I was charged with disrespecting Christians. The charge is false.

**It means that over 50% of Catholics (in the US) disagree with the Catholic prohibition on birth control. And many many many practice artificial birth control or other forms of sex primarily for pleasure. They also get surgical sterilization. I don’t care if you don’t believe this or won’t look the stuff up yourself. I consider it (many polls on this topic) common knowledge. The Church is opposed, but many Catholics do differently in practice. **

That is what I mean. It seemed pretty clear to me.

Bolded above: if that’s what you meant, why didn’t you say so?

BTW, such facts still do NOT make birth control “Christian.”
Instead, it might be said that many Christians have fallen into this particular sin.

When you hide what you mean in tiny jabs, one will guess as to your intent.
That’s why I asked my question re any anti-Christian attitude.
OTOH, when you state what you mean, I can say and do say:
such practices still do NOT make birth control a Christian practice.

The topic: “Is Birth Control Christian?”
The answer: “NO.”

PS -

speaking of accuracy …
I didn’t charge you with disrespecting Christians.
I asked: “Do you hold a BIG disrespect for Christians or what?”

Now, who is being “so sensitive?”

 

[catharina]

I have my question solved and of course I thank you all of you for the answers, viewpoints and of course, a reason why being Pro-Life is a good choice. Thank you all.

Thank you for the “thank you.”
I’m very glad that your found answers here.

Yes, Pro-life is an excellent cause/goal.
(Its opposite, pro-death … who needs that?)

 

[larkin31]

PS -

speaking of accuracy …
I didn’t charge you with disrespecting Christians.
I asked: “Do you hold a BIG disrespect for Christians or what?”

haha

and they say that liberals speak with forked tongues…

 

[larkin31]

…It means that over 50% of Catholics (in the US) disagree with the Catholic prohibition on birth control. And many many many practice artificial birth control or other forms of sex primarily for pleasure. They also get surgical sterilization. I don’t care if you don’t believe this or won’t look the stuff up yourself. I consider it (many polls on this topic) common knowledge. The Church is opposed, but many Catholics do differently in practice.

That is what I mean. It seemed pretty clear to me.

no reply to this? This is actually on the topic…

 

[Ravemacneil]

A Catholic/Christian might use artificial birth control, but this is not following Christian teachings.

Using artificial birth control does not make a person non-Christian. But using artificial birth control is a grave sin.

As humans, none of us is perfect, and sin doesn’t make a person non-Christian. Otherwise, only those in Heaven could truly be Christian.

Some sins can cause a person to be excommunicated, unable to receive sacraments, etc. But a person can always repent/confess the SIN (act of contrition) and be welcomed back.

Kind thanks for this and many of the other answers on this thread which have increased the light in my life by steering me towards a less offensive option.

Could any of you recommend good links/resources to help me stop this sin and understand NFP? Previous to this thread, I think I believed it to be just the “rhythm” method.

I’d be very grateful.

Yours in Christ†
RMN

 

[Rence]

Originally Posted by larkin31
…It means that over 50% of Catholics (in the US) disagree with the Catholic prohibition on birth control. And many many many practice artificial birth control or other forms of sex primarily for pleasure. They also get surgical sterilization. I don’t care if you don’t believe this or won’t look the stuff up yourself. I consider it (many polls on this topic) common knowledge. The Church is opposed, but many Catholics do differently in practice.

I’ll try to reply But I didn’t see a question in your post, so if I don’t hit the mark, ask.
I’m not sure what kind of reply you wanted to your post. The fact is, most Catholics don’t understand the Church’s teaching on artificial birth control, and that hinders their compliance. What adds to the equation is that they are ignorant of NFP to space out or prevent pregnancies. That doesn’t make it right. It only means they’re not following the rules.

People are afraid to have more children than they can afford, and are ignorant of Natural Family Planning, and go on birth control. People are afraid to have more children due to medical reasons, and are afraid to get pregnant, and afraid to trust the efficacy of NFP, and go on birth control instead — resulting in even more health concerns. People also get frustrated listening to the hot air blown by scrupulous Catholics, and instead of researching and learning, they give up and succumb to the easy way out that is birth control. That doesn’t make them good Catholics, that just means they are noncompliant with the Church’s teachings. And then there are some who were taught that the use of birth control is a matter of concience and use their conscience to dictate their decision.

Your statistics are true, but that only means that the Catholics using artificial birth control are either purposely using birth control with the knowledge that it is forbidden and know they are in mortal sin; or they are ignorant of the reasons why the Church forbids artificial birth control. People just are not educated about Catechism anymore.

I am 40 years old and it wasn’t until I joined this forum that learned the reasons WHY the Church forbids artificial birth control, and that the Church allows married couples to use Natural Family Planning (which is NOT the old rhythmn method) to space out, or delay indefinitely, pregnancies. That’s pretty sad since I went to Catholic schools from 5th grade through college. I had a completely different perspective of ABCs before I came here.

I have found that the majority of Catholics do not know WHY artificial birth control is against the rules of the Church. When most people that I encounter IRL learn that artificial birth control causes abortions, they seriously reconsider it. I don’t know what they do about it after that, I but do know they are shocked to learn that it does, and become aware of the rules of the Church and why they are made rules. Most people also don’t understand the unitive requirement for the marital embrace. I admit, the unitive aspect of the marital embrace and the rationale given by the Church that ABCs of any kind hinder the unitive aspect doesn’t sell me. In fact, I think it’s utter nonsense. But the thing about being Catholic is that you need to follow the rules as best you can despite disagreeing or not understanding the rules. It won’t be the first or the last teaching of the Church that I either don’t get or disagree with. But I try my best to follow the teachings.

I also find that no one else that I know IRL knows what Natural Family Planning is, which is pretty sad because in my “other” life, I was surrounded by Catholics. But when I explain NFP to them, they are intrigued because NO ONE I know IRL likes ABCs. They go from the Pill, to the diaphragm, to others, to back to the pill, etc. Because they don’t like the side effects and other problems. The older we get the more NFP is a rational option due to the health risks. Religious teaching aside, I think it is a grave injustice to women not to educate them about NFP.

As to using ABCs NOT being Christian, I already answered that and said I didn’t agree with it. Many other denominations, and even the Jewish religion, allow birth control. So if someone is faithfully following their faith (which the Catholic Church acknowledges), one can’t say that they are not being Christian because of it because they are in fact following their faith, and not breaking the rules of their faith. The Catholic Church is the most strict regarding this matter, and can’t expect people of different faiths to be just as strict when their religion allows more leniency. It’s just an unreasonable expectation. They don’t have the same knowedge that Catholics are supposed to have. That’s why my original answer was stated as it was.

 

[larkin31]

I’ll try to reply But I didn’t see a question in your post, so if I don’t hit the mark, ask.
I’m not sure what kind of reply you wanted to your post. The fact is, most Catholics don’t understand the Church’s teaching on artificial birth control, and that hinders their compliance. What adds to the equation is that they are ignorant of NFP to space out or prevent pregnancies. That doesn’t make it right. It only means they’re not following the rules.

People are afraid to have more children than they can afford, and are ignorant of Natural Family Planning, and go on birth control. People are afraid to have more children due to medical reasons, and are afraid to get pregnant, and afraid to trust the efficacy of NFP, and go on birth control instead — resulting in even more health concerns. People also get frustrated listening to the hot air blown by scrupulous Catholics, and instead of researching and learning, they give up and succumb to the easy way out that is birth control. That doesn’t make them good Catholics, that just means they are noncompliant with the Church’s teachings. And then there are some who were taught that the use of birth control is a matter of concience and use their conscience to dictate their decision.

Your statistics are true, but that only means that the Catholics using artificial birth control are either purposely using birth control with the knowledge that it is forbidden and know they are in mortal sin; or they are ignorant of the reasons why the Church forbids artificial birth control. People just are not educated about Catechism anymore.

I am 40 years old and it wasn’t until I joined this forum that learned the reasons WHY the Church forbids artificial birth control, and that the Church allows married couples to use Natural Family Planning (which is NOT the old rhythmn method) to space out, or delay indefinitely, pregnancies. That’s pretty sad since I went to Catholic schools from 5th grade through college. I had a completely different perspective of ABCs before I came here.

I have found that the majority of Catholics do not know WHY artificial birth control is against the rules of the Church. When most people that I encounter IRL learn that artificial birth control causes abortions, they seriously reconsider it. I don’t know what they do about it after that, I but do know they are shocked to learn that it does, and become aware of the rules of the Church and why they are made rules. Most people also don’t understand the unitive requirement for the marital embrace. I admit, the unitive aspect of the marital embrace and the rationale given by the Church that ABCs of any kind hinder the unitive aspect doesn’t sell me. In fact, I think it’s utter nonsense. But the thing about being Catholic is that you need to follow the rules as best you can despite disagreeing or not understanding the rules. It won’t be the first or the last teaching of the Church that I either don’t get or disagree with. But I try my best to follow the teachings.

I also find that no one else that I know IRL knows what Natural Family Planning is, which is pretty sad because in my “other” life, I was surrounded by Catholics. But when I explain NFP to them, they are intrigued because NO ONE I know IRL likes ABCs. They go from the Pill, to the diaphragm, to others, to back to the pill, etc. Because they don’t like the side effects and other problems. The older we get the more NFP is a rational option due to the health risks. Religious teaching aside, I think it is a grave injustice to women not to educate them about NFP.

As to using ABCs NOT being Christian, I already answered that and said I didn’t agree with it. Many other denominations, and even the Jewish religion, allow birth control. So if someone is faithfully following their faith (which the Catholic Church acknowledges), one can’t say that they are not being Christian because of it because they are in fact following their faith, and not breaking the rules of their faith. The Catholic Church is the most strict regarding this matter, and can’t expect people of different faiths to be just as strict when their religion allows more leniency. It’s just an unreasonable expectation. They don’t have the same knowedge that Catholics are supposed to have. That’s why my original answer was stated as it was.

I appreciate this thoughtful response. I will respond more fully to it a bit later (gotta go mow before the rain!)…

 

[Rence]

Kind thanks for this and many of the other answers on this thread which have increased the light in my life by steering me towards a less offensive option.

Could any of you recommend good links/resources to help me stop this sin and understand NFP? Previous to this thread, I think I believed it to be just the “rhythm” method.

I’d be very grateful.

Yours in Christ†
RMN

The CCC and Humanae Vitae are good starts.
vatican.va/holy_father/paul_vi/encyclicals/documents/hf_p-vi_enc_25071968_humanae-vitae_en.html

Here are some links for NFP:
www.nfpandmore.org/
ccli.org/
usccb.org/nfp

If you go to the Family Living section of this forum, you’ll find a lot of members swear by NFP and they can explain why. It’s not an easy thing to do (I don’t want to lie to you), there IS an abstinence period, which is hard for some folks. But this is the method that the Church allows to space out or prevent pregnancy – and mind you, it’s not a free ticket, you have to have “grave reasons” to use it, because Catholic married couples are obligated to have children. But this is the method approved to do this.

 

[Ravemacneil]

no reply to this? This is actually on the topic…

Forgive me, but how is it you equate doing something with the disagreement that it is a sin?

Your entire point seems to rest on you personally conflating the commitance of sin with the idea that such an act means the actor disagrees that it is or should be a sin.

"It means that over 50% of Catholics (in the US) disagree with the Catholic prohibition on birth control." No it doesn’t. It means that they sinned. How is it you psychically determined they didn’t feel sinful or used BC because they don’t agree they should not have?

"I don’t care if you don’t believe this or won’t look the stuff up yourself." I’ve done things in life I knew I should not have done. I’m fairly certain the onus is on you to prove this strange assertion that doing something is the same as agreeing with it.

You think every person who ever drove drunk thinks there shouldn’t be a law against it? Seriously?

Because they did it themselves you think they thus believe it’s perfectly fine for people to drive drunk? Honestly?

"The Church is opposed, but many Catholics do differently in practice." I do it. My actions certainly don’t reflect on the soundness of the Church’s theology. Isn’t that what you are saying? If I use BC, I believe the Church is wrong? I don’t. I hope to get my behaviour better in line and joined here for help in doing that. You seem to gloss over the fact that looking up statistics isn’t the same as interviewing those people - something you’d have to do to make the claims you do. Else why assume they are different from me: Engaging in the practice while agreeing with the Church and hoping to change?

I truly miss the point of how behaviour equates to principle or moral disagreement with the Church’s position.

Peace of Christ†
RMN

p.s. If XX% of Catholics have lustful thoughts, that somehow means they disagree with the Church? If I yell at my wife, that means I disagree you should treat your spouse with the respect accorded God? The examples are endless…

 

[mark_a]

Based on the answers that I got I can say that and agree that Birth Control is not Christian in anyway. Thank you all for the answers. But again another statement from my mom arose telling me this: “A woman has the right to choose if she wants to have the kid, abort it, or even take birth control. **God HATES **someone has too many kids and can’t maintain them.”

Any opinions on this? I know God loves everyone, and He gave us those gifts, but God hating when people over-reproduce? Is this some blasphemy?

In my opinion, it sounds as if you have touched a raw nerve. Think of some possible scenarios that could have caused this reaction from her and proceed with extreme caution.

 

[larkin31]

Forgive me, but how is it you equate doing something with the disagreement that it is a sin?

I don’t “equate” them. But there is a link between repeated transgression and the view that perhaps it is not a transgression at all.

"It means that over 50% of Catholics (in the US) disagree with the Catholic prohibition on birth control." No it doesn’t. It means that they sinned. How is it you psychically determined they didn’t feel sinful or used BC because they don’t agree they should not have?

This poll was about whether they believed that ABC was a “sin” and whether they agreed with the Church. It was not about “practice.” But the poll was about a year ago, so maybe the numbers have changed.

"I don’t care if you don’t believe this or won’t look the stuff up yourself." I’ve done things in life I knew I should not have done. I’m fairly certain the onus is on you to prove this strange assertion that doing something is the same as agreeing with it.

I am not trying to “prove” anything. This is just a conversation. Like I said, I don’t care if you believe it or not.

You think every person who ever drove drunk thinks there shouldn’t be a law against it? Seriously?

Does the RCC think that drunk-driving is a “sin”? Isn’t “sin” what were are discussing?

Because they did it themselves you think they thus believe it’s perfectly fine for people to drive drunk? Honestly?

“Perfectly fine”?? I doubt it. But not a “sin”? Sure.

I truly miss the point of how behaviour equates to principle or moral disagreement with the Church’s position.

Ok. It wasn’t even my point. But whatever. I wouldn’t “get” that point either, if you made it.

 

[larkin31]

I’ll try to reply But I didn’t see a question in your post, so if I don’t hit the mark, ask.
I’m not sure what kind of reply you wanted to your post. The fact is, most Catholics don’t understand the Church’s teaching on artificial birth control, and that hinders their compliance. What adds to the equation is that they are ignorant of NFP to space out or prevent pregnancies. That doesn’t make it right. It only means they’re not following the rules.

People are afraid to have more children than they can afford, and are ignorant of Natural Family Planning, and go on birth control. People are afraid to have more children due to medical reasons, and are afraid to get pregnant, and afraid to trust the efficacy of NFP, and go on birth control instead — resulting in even more health concerns. People also get frustrated listening to the hot air blown by scrupulous Catholics, and instead of researching and learning, they give up and succumb to the easy way out that is birth control. That doesn’t make them good Catholics, that just means they are noncompliant with the Church’s teachings. And then there are some who were taught that the use of birth control is a matter of concience and use their conscience to dictate their decision.

This seems to be a fair summary of much of the case today. Except that you are leaving out the many modern Catholics who feel that the church is outdated in their approach to reproductive control or, worse, hypocritical in their view toward various “artificial” medical services in effecting the lives of humans, reducing misery, aiding happiness and independence. Especially for women.

Your statistics are true, but that only means that the Catholics using artificial birth control are either purposely using birth control with the knowledge that it is forbidden and know they are in mortal sin; or they are ignorant of the reasons why the Church forbids artificial birth control. People just are not educated about Catechism anymore.

Yes. Or are ignoring what they are beginning to perceive as antiquated, or hypocritical.

…I have found that the majority of Catholics do not know WHY artificial birth control is against the rules of the Church. When most people that I encounter IRL learn that artificial birth control causes abortions, they seriously reconsider it. I don’t know what they do about it after that, I but do know they are shocked to learn that it does, and become aware of the rules of the Church and why they are made rules. Most people also don’t understand the unitive requirement for the marital embrace. I admit, the unitive aspect of the marital embrace and the rationale given by the Church that ABCs of any kind hinder the unitive aspect doesn’t sell me. In fact, I think it’s utter nonsense. But the thing about being Catholic is that you need to follow the rules as best you can despite disagreeing or not understanding the rules. It won’t be the first or the last teaching of the Church that I either don’t get or disagree with. But I try my best to follow the teachings.

Thanks for your sincerity here. I will remember your honesty and openness.

… The older we get the more NFP is a rational option due to the health risks. Religious teaching aside, I think it is a grave injustice to women not to educate them about NFP.

I agree entirely.

As to using ABCs NOT being Christian, I already answered that and said I didn’t agree with it. Many other denominations, and even the Jewish religion, allow birth control. So if someone is faithfully following their faith (which the Catholic Church acknowledges), one can’t say that they are not being Christian because of it because they are in fact following their faith, and not breaking the rules of their faith. The Catholic Church is the most strict regarding this matter, and can’t expect people of different faiths to be just as strict when their religion allows more leniency. It’s just an unreasonable expectation. They don’t have the same knowedge that Catholics are supposed to have. That’s why my original answer was stated as it was.

I agree, and thank you again for your thoughtfulness and sharing.

 

[Ravemacneil]

Ok. It wasn’t even my point. But whatever. I wouldn’t “get” that point either, if you made it.

My apologies if I misinterpreted your statement. It seemed obvious to me that your sentence/point:
“It means that over 50% of Catholics (in the US) disagree with the Catholic prohibition on birth control.”

is you stating your opinion that the statistic means that they disagree with the teaching.

I fail to see how you equate the two. As I tried pointing out, I practice BC. In no way does this mean I think the Church is wrong. To the contrary, I’m the one in the wrong.

So all I meant to point out to you is that it seems the idea that one equals the other is your idea, not something logically contained in the statistics.

If over 50% of Catholics said specifically that they disagree with the Church, I apologize, seriously, for the haste of my post.

If over 50% of Catholics merely said they’ve used birth control, and it’s your inference that this means they disagree, then it certainly was “your” point, and I urge to re-read what I said about my own actions.

In good faith,
RMN

 

[edwest2]

In 1968, when Pope Paul VI had Humanae Vitae published, he knew what was going on. The Pill was approved by the FDA in 1960 but was only becoming widely available around that time. He warned anyone who would listen that there would be an increase in promiscuity and that there would be less regard for the person who was the love of your life if people used artificial birth control.

Some theologians took out a full page ad in the New York Times at the time, denouncing this document. Somehow, in the 1970s, seminarians were taught that ABC was a personal choice dependent on the individual’s conscience. The true teaching was buried under a loose consideration.

Meanwhile, to help make sure the weaker sex got the wrong ideas about their wives and girlfriends, Adult Bookstores and topless bars opened in the 1970s. Hippies and others encouraged cohabitation with sex. Those who fought these assaults on common decency and morality were denounced as censors and enemies of the First Amendment. Organized crime and highly paid lawyers fought for the right to sell graphic images of prostitutes.

God bless,
Ed

 

[larkin31]

In 1968, when Pope Paul VI had Humanae Vitae published, he knew what was going on. The Pill was approved by the FDA in 1960 but was only becoming widely available around that time. He warned anyone who would listen that there would be an increase in promiscuity and that there would be less regard for the person who was the love of your life if people used artificial birth control.

Some theologians took out a full page ad in the New York Times at the time, denouncing this document. Somehow, in the 1970s, seminarians were taught that ABC was a personal choice dependent on the individual’s conscience. The true teaching was buried under a loose consideration.

Meanwhile, to help make sure the weaker sex got the wrong ideas about their wives and girlfriends, Adult Bookstores and topless bars opened in the 1970s. Hippies and others encouraged cohabitation with sex. Those who fought these assaults on common decency and morality were denounced as censors and enemies of the First Amendment. Organized crime and highly paid lawyers fought for the right to sell graphic images of prostitutes.

God bless,
Ed

Thus is the price of freedom under our Constitution. Pope Benedict calls “freedom” one of the two most important elements of “Natural Law” in God’s creation.

And there it is.

 

[edwest2]

A lack of self control is not freedom but slavery.

catholicnewsagency.com/news/true-freedom-is-in-acknowledging-dependence-on-god-says-archbishop-dolan/

Sex is out of control at the present time. Addiction to pornography is one example.

God bless,
Ed

 

[larkin31]

A lack of self control is not freedom but slavery.

catholicnewsagency.com/news/true-freedom-is-in-acknowledging-dependence-on-god-says-archbishop-dolan/

Sex is out of control at the present time. Addiction to pornography is one example.

Addiction to anything is unfortunate and imprisoning.

But I was commenting on the freedoms of speech and the legal changes that you mentioned. My point was that these “freedoms” are a package deal in this country and are to be valued. The Pope, in fact, values them as well. I read about this today thanks to one of your fellow Catholic posters who shared the link.

Eden was a “free” place too, and was a package deal.

 

[TheQuestioner]

God allows the natural consequences of our actions. If you are going to say that God specifically willed this child to exist, requiring the parents’ grave sin of fornication, you are embracing a false teaching.

By your logic, God wills rapes in cases where the woman becomes pregnant. Which is of course not true. God is all good. One may never do evil so that good may come from it.

Sometimes good-- a baby-- is **allowed **to come from an evil act. But, God does not **will **it.

Just to correct you, what God willed was the good thing, in spite of the bad, not in conjunction with it. God wills that good should come out of evil, though He does not will that evil happen. In the same way God willed for the conception of the child, even though He didn’t will for the parents to do evil.