Is Catholicism Dying?

[St_Donatus]

I don’t want to dwell much into it, and I haven’t read all of the thread so far, but I will give my 2 cents.

TC has a very good point, which is very sad. Not worrying, but sad. The more people away from Christ the more the world loses its way, as do those individuals.

Many people can call themselves Catholic (or Christian) but almost never pray, go to church, fast, read the Bible etc. Not much of a Catholic, are they? I find this is especially true in the US (no offense intended to Americans). I don’t want to sound like a conspiracy theorist or paranoid preacher, but what we are living in today is nothing short of an attack on spirituality, especially the Church. The agenda of our government’s is clear. They want world power, unmatched financial ability and the authority to ‘control’ people. Religion, or the Church, are the only things that stand in their way on the matter. It’s a classic case of taking out the competition.

It’s not hard to back this up either. It seems that everything being done is an organized attack on the church. Anytime there is a single hiccup inside the Church, it’s published and put all over the media like crazy. Yet when you have homosexual parades turning into violent discriminating protests (don’t be fooled, the homosexuals are NOT the victims), not a single mention of it reaches our media. We are seeing world leaders with little to no spirituality or faith in their thinking, which is quite contrary to many years ago.

Of course, it seems like every film or music creator has conveniently resorted to bashing the church as well. Here’s a perfect example I like to use. Watch the American Hollywood movie called Clerks II (I’m a bit of a movie buff, so my friend suggested this to me for a laugh, which I wish he hadn’t). I find it extremely convenient that the protagonist of the movie is clearly wearing a Christian crucifix for the entire movie, yet the movie is constantly talking about offensive and vulgar things, and at one point even makes extremely offensive references to Jesus Christ among other things. Clearly a tactic to downplay the relevance and appropriateness of the Church. It’s almost a form of subliminal messaging.

Of course, we must stay strong. Our Lady of Medjugorje has promised us a sign from above that will turn the world from it’s wicked ways.

You make a good point. Just this morning I heard the News anchor on ABC say that the Catholic Church can learn something by following the example of Penn State with regard to the Jerry Sandusky child abuse case. While the Catholic church was sending priests that had abused a child to treatment and therapy, Penn State was ignoring Jerry Sandusky while he raped many other young men. But like the media so many times does, it ignores the sins of its friends while publishing and trying to destroy its enemies for their sins.

 

[iloveangels]

You make a good point. Just this morning I heard the News anchor on ABC say that the Catholic Church can learn something by following the example of Penn State with regard to the Jerry Sandusky child abuse case. While the Catholic church was sending priests that had abused a child to treatment and therapy, Penn State was ignoring Jerry Sandusky while he raped many other young men. But like the media so many times does, it ignores the sins of its friends while publishing and trying to destroy its enemies for their sins.

Like ABC News knows anything about the Catholic church. Their pride is only outstripped by their big mouth.

Look, I’m no apologizer for the evil that happened in the Church, but sexual abuse goes on in schools and at summer camps and all over as well as in various churches including ours. People need to keep an eye on their kids and protect them from all the goofballs in society that would hurt them, wherever they’re found.

 

[St_Donatus]

Like ABC News knows anything about the Catholic church. Their pride is only outstripped by their big mouth.

Look, I’m no apologizer for the evil that happened in the Church, but sexual abuse goes on in schools and at summer camps and all over as well as in various churches including ours. People need to keep an eye on their kids and protect them from all the goofballs in society that would hurt them, wherever they’re found.

Good Point. Interestingly, I did some research on Sex Abuse and found that clergy were involved in this at a rate half what it is in general society and some say about 1% of the amount it happens in the public school system, but yet who does the media attack, the public schools, NO, they attack the Catholic Church. This begs the question, why?

I know that Satan hates the Catholic Church. Could Satan be behind this? The Bible and Mary at Fatima predicted just this kind of treatment in the last days. The church has been attacked before, but this attack has been extremely good! We see how the percentage of faithful going to church on Sundays in the US is falling. Could it be the predicted ‘falling away of the greater number’ the Bible predicts.

I don’t know, but it is time for all of us to examine ourselves and do what we can to stay faithful. Get to mass, confession, and pray.

 

[Domiy]

Donatus hit the nail on the head. Satan is a **** who will one day perish indeed in his own frustration of defeat, but until then he holds a comfortable position. Realistically, it isn’t ‘literally’ Satan publishing misconceived information and biased reports all over our media, it’s his followers, those that willingly or even unknowingly are grappled by his temptations of glory, pride, false victory and success. There exists a massive double standard against the Catholic Church. What we do is portrayed as an act of evil and burden, yet when opposing organizations (like our very government) who claim to work for the good of society do such things, it is not only void of criticism, it is applauded and praised.

No longer do people say “God Bless”, do a deed for another out of heart or simply treat people with respect as much as previously. When my parents first came to Australia as immigrants, they received a complimentary Bible from the government (pretty kickin, right?) Today our government is practically giving out contraceptives and things of such a nature. It’s almost as if whatever they do is conveniently the opposite of the views and desires of the Church. The world has become a rat-race, we are like ants competing for air in a tiny pod. Our air seems to be money and independence coupled with worldly wealth, and most people nowadays are interested in that alone. Never did I think society would become so stupid as to believe all the propaganda fed to them, and actually take an outlook of negativity and criticism on an organization that preaches and assists so heavily on forgiveness, charity and social justice.

We are indeed in the days so heavily matching the description of the Bible’s warnings. Those who hate us hated Jesus first, as already pointed out. A time of fightback is coming, and I eagerly await it’s arrival. Although it’s not traditional in our beliefs to have pride or hold feelings of a grudge or superiority over others, I’m sure we will be granted even the tiniest of abilities to shockingly make eye contact with others and give them a massive “I told you so” look. Only God can reward us, and only for that reward shall we eagerly wait.

But yeah, to answer the question, YES, Catholicism is dying out (or rather, our enemies are becoming stronger over us). Statistics of Christin adherents in countries such as Australia or USA are laughable to be fair. Australia is one of the largest atheist-Western styled societies you will find (I assume America is no different) and they each boast quite high Christian statistics. I guess another laughable flaw of our brainwashed society is that apparently a printed label on a document is more meaningful and accurate than one’s actions and practices.

 

[iloveangels]

…
But yeah, to answer the question, YES, Catholicism is dying out (or rather, our enemies are becoming stronger over us). Statistics of Christin adherents in countries such as Australia or USA are laughable to be fair. Australia is one of the largest atheist-Western styled societies you will find (I assume America is no different) and they each boast quite high Christian statistics. I guess another laughable flaw of our brainwashed society is that apparently a printed label on a document is more meaningful and accurate than one’s actions and practices.

So, the response to this bit of information is interesting. Catholics seem to have a bit of trouble dealing with this fact in any realistic manner. First we interpret and contemporize, then we have to call a bunch of people out for general stuff, and then we resign ourselves to the situation.

Why don’t we actually figure out & employ ways to make the situation better and stop or at least slow the decline?

There are some very good studies that have been done about why people leave. Why are Catholics not poring over those and trying to understand them?

Example, so it’s easier to get our heads around this idea:
We can’t change doctrine. We shouldn’t try. But it is not doctrine whether we have hot supper for members every 3 months or so. But most churches don’t do that, although many protestant churches do. So why can’t we choose to do something like that to get members to be more connected to the parish and happier? It does work. And instead of “hot supper” choose any one of a number of other possibilities that are happy and good and productive.

This is not doctrine. It’s also not rocket science. The lack of these sorts of things is one of the leading reasons people leave the Catholic church and join protestant churches. They do these things and they do them very well. People feel connected and cared about when things are going on and they are made to feel welcome.

 

[punisherthunder]

Of course Catholicism is dying. We are nearing the end times that is predicted in Revelations.

People are growing more and more hostile. Satan is loose in the Catholic Church and public perception from this is what’s causing the death of the Church today.

But we all know who wins in the end.

 

[St_Donatus]

Donatus hit the nail on the head. Satan is a **** who will one day perish indeed in his own frustration of defeat, but until then he holds a comfortable position. Realistically, it isn’t ‘literally’ Satan publishing misconceived information and biased reports all over our media, it’s his followers, those that willingly or even unknowingly are grappled by his temptations of glory, pride, false victory and success. There exists a massive double standard against the Catholic Church. What we do is portrayed as an act of evil and burden, yet when opposing organizations (like our very government) who claim to work for the good of society do such things, it is not only void of criticism, it is applauded and praised.

No longer do people say “God Bless”, do a deed for another out of heart or simply treat people with respect as much as previously. When my parents first came to Australia as immigrants, they received a complimentary Bible from the government (pretty kickin, right?) Today our government is practically giving out contraceptives and things of such a nature. It’s almost as if whatever they do is conveniently the opposite of the views and desires of the Church. The world has become a rat-race, we are like ants competing for air in a tiny pod. Our air seems to be money and independence coupled with worldly wealth, and most people nowadays are interested in that alone. Never did I think society would become so stupid as to believe all the propaganda fed to them, and actually take an outlook of negativity and criticism on an organization that preaches and assists so heavily on forgiveness, charity and social justice.

We are indeed in the days so heavily matching the description of the Bible’s warnings. Those who hate us hated Jesus first, as already pointed out. A time of fightback is coming, and I eagerly await it’s arrival. Although it’s not traditional in our beliefs to have pride or hold feelings of a grudge or superiority over others, I’m sure we will be granted even the tiniest of abilities to shockingly make eye contact with others and give them a massive “I told you so” look. Only God can reward us, and only for that reward shall we eagerly wait.

But yeah, to answer the question, YES, Catholicism is dying out (or rather, our enemies are becoming stronger over us). Statistics of Christin adherents in countries such as Australia or USA are laughable to be fair. Australia is one of the largest atheist-Western styled societies you will find (I assume America is no different) and they each boast quite high Christian statistics. I guess another laughable flaw of our brainwashed society is that apparently a printed label on a document is more meaningful and accurate than one’s actions and practices.

Well said. Thankfully, my church is a haven of Holiness where I feel like I am literally leaving this Earthly waste to visit God. At least we have the opportunity to make a small difference. Just saying ‘God Bless’ would make such a difference. This would be especially encouraging to other Catholics.

 

[iloveangels]

Well said. Thankfully, my church is a haven of Holiness where I feel like I am literally leaving this Earthly waste to visit God. At least we have the opportunity to make a small difference. Just saying ‘God Bless’ would make such a difference. This would be especially encouraging to other Catholics.

Well said. I can’t argue with this. One of the things that Catholics need to do is wake up and realize that we can’t keep driving people out by our stand-offish behavior and inactivity.

Honestly, our teachings are one thing and they’re fine. That’s not most of what’s causing people to leave anyway. In many cases, I’m convinced that’s an excuse. Rather, research says that one of the biggest drivers for people leaving is that they “just drift away.” They lose touch, they stop coming, and then they stop believing. Why is that?

 

[iloveangels]

Of course Catholicism is dying. We are nearing the end times that is predicted in Revelations.

People are growing more and more hostile. Satan is loose in the Catholic Church and public perception from this is what’s causing the death of the Church today.

But we all know who wins in the end.

How do you know all this?

I have to tell you that:
a) Scripture says that we do not know when the end will come.
b) People have said that we are in end times for 2000 years.

That this is the source of our problems prima facie is a pretty big assumption. And although it may be a pretty tempting idea that we can just throw up our hands and let things fall where they may, I think we have the obligation to at least consider the idea that this could just be a downturn and the earth may last just a little while longer.

 

[CrimsonThorn]

While Id like to believe that the pendulum of society’s morals will swing back and improve, I am highly doubtful of this. Society is becoming increasingly more desensitized, with future generations growing up in disorder and chaos and perversions, with the thought that this is all part of the norm- what will be the next more extreme perversion that they will be ready to OK?

Seems like all the stuff going on now is paving the way for things to get worse, and as far as morality and religion is concerned, it is being persecuted much more harshly than ever before, just in a more tactful and stealthy way.

I dont believe Catholicism will ever die. Although the the thought of these times being the new Sodom i cant seem to help but have. I think when it gets to the point where only handful of Christians will be left in the world before God just gets so fed up and decides to end it. But Catholicism never truly dies.

 

[St_Donatus]

Well said. I can’t argue with this. One of the things that Catholics need to do is wake up and realize that we can’t keep driving people out by our stand-offish behavior and inactivity.

Honestly, our teachings are one thing and they’re fine. That’s not most of what’s causing people to leave anyway. In many cases, I’m convinced that’s an excuse. Rather, research says that one of the biggest drivers for people leaving is that they “just drift away.” They lose touch, they stop coming, and then they stop believing. Why is that?

`

Having recently returned to the church after 30 years, I am very interested in encouraging my fellow Catholics at work. I tried to find information on how best to do this without making them feel guilty, yet still effective. I couldn’t find anything on this unless I was willing to buy some books.

To me this is a real problem. Somehow Catholics seem to have forgotten the ‘Great Commission’. We are to build new converts. We can do this in everything we do around others. As a Jehovah’s Witness, they drum this into you all the time. Their number one goal is to convert. Prayer, Love, Peace are not emphasized, what is emphasized is how many hours you put into converting others. As Catholics, we know that there is much more to being a Christian, but if we put more emphasis and resources into converting even lapsed Catholics, we would go a long way.

For one thing, wouldn’t it be an investment in the Church to make information about helping lapsed Catholics and encouraging fellow Catholics for free. Another thing that I think will help the church grow is to build more of a sense of community. I go to a very orthodox church and about 75% take advantage of the snack time after mass. Why, I am not sure. I know the priest is a hard line black and white priest who isn’t afraid to offend by telling us what is right and wrong, but he does it in a way that makes us want to do better. The first sermon I ever heard him say, half was on how each one of us needs to be welcoming to newcomers, and other ways we can improve ourselves. He was very stern about it as well. No, nicy, nicy, sweet talk. He came down hard and it worked.

 

[ejp123]

A lot of people have fallen into relativism. I believe the more we, as Catholics, are firm about what we believe – in other words, when we unabashedly are Catholic, and stand up for what believe, the fervor or our convictions will draw people back to Catholicism.

But that’s just me.

What role does the authority of the church play in the decline? If people are leaving I think the church authority needs to take a look at itself to see what contributions it might be making to this loss and take responsibility for what it owns. Leadership is powerful and a team is as good as its leader. Can’t just blame the sheep.

 

[iloveangels]

What role does the authority of the church play in the decline? If people are leaving I think the church authority needs to take a look at itself to see what contributions it might be making to this loss and take responsibility for what it owns. Leadership is powerful and a team is as good as its leader. Can’t just blame the sheep.

No, that’s the automatic answer. Dig deeper and think local. That’s what motivates people.

People don’t go down to the parish for a lot of reasons, the chief one being that the place is locked up most of the time and there’s nothing going on.

 

[furious_C]

I live in the U.S. It seems like out of all of the people I know, only 20% or so believe in Christ. Out of those 20% only 5% are Roman Catholic. The rest are from other Christian denominations but used to be Roman Catholic a few years ago. The other 80% are atheist.

This is very sad. Also, the media doesn’t help showing all the negative aspects of the Church, such as pedophile priests and more. There was a report last night about a priest stealing valuable things from a store, and caught on surveillance camera.

How do you all feel about this? Is this just in my head, or are we Roman Catholics becoming scarce?

I agree, it is very sad. I live in the mid south, and the majority of people I know are religious in one way or another. I am active in my church, so that helps too.
The church is definitely under attack from the media. You will see more and more that any flaws in the church will be magnified to add fuel to the fire of ridicule. Remember that large one page add about ‘you know it is time to leave the church when…’, well we will see lots more of that before things are finished. It is my understanding that we are not only to withstand this barrage but also take heart that persecution is a sign that we are on the right track.
If you are an active Catholic, I recommend you take the perspective of having a lot of work to do in bringing people to the church. It sounds like you live in a ‘target rich environment’ if you know what I mean. Also, when all news seems bad and the cause hopeless, thank God for giving you so much to pray about, and use it to get closer to him.
Hope something there helps…

 

[WingsOfEagles]

I’d say worldwide, it’s doing great. It’s not a popular religion in America, but it never has been. The Irish and Italians had a tough time when they came here.

 

[iloveangels]

I’d say worldwide, it’s doing great. It’s not a popular religion in America, but it never has been. The Irish and Italians had a tough time when they came here.

Worldwide, we’re doing great, because there are a lot of conversions right now in Africa & Asia. The faith is fresh and new there and there is zeal for it. However, Europe and North America aren’t doing so hot. In fact, Europe and North America are falling flat on their faces in public. Latin America is holding its own.

In the US, the Catholic Church became respectable in the mid-20th century, and many Catholics entered the cultural mainstream, but we haven’t done so well with that. It wasn’t really too bad until all the abuse scandals broke, which caused all our other corruptions & internal scandals to hit the fan and now the general population knows all about our troubles, internal points of strife, and organizational difficulties. And now that they know, we can be used as political pawns–and we are, as night follows day. We are now divide-and-conquer territory because there’s a political payoff; it was completely predictable.

It is going to take us decades to live this mess down in North America.

 

[punisherthunder]

How do you know all this?

I have to tell you that:
a) Scripture says that we do not know when the end will come.
b) People have said that we are in end times for 2000 years.

That this is the source of our problems prima facie is a pretty big assumption. And although it may be a pretty tempting idea that we can just throw up our hands and let things fall where they may, I think we have the obligation to at least consider the idea that this could just be a downturn and the earth may last just a little while longer.

C’mon, it is all around us. Homosexuals trying to legitimize their relationships amongst the faithful. Atheists growing in very large numbers every day. More and more priests accused of sexual misconduct. Humanity in general, trying to excuse bad behavior at every turn. As a child of the 1980s I can say with clear recollection that I did not know of any homosexual people and would never, EVER, think that one day they demand to be married in the Church. I also never thought that people would be disbelievers in God. To me, that would have been too much. As for priests, I never heard of sexual abuse like this on any level.

Warnings from Fatima and other Church approved sightings dictate that we are in End Times friends. Hold on…

 

[St_Donatus]

Worldwide, we’re doing great, because there are a lot of conversions right now in Africa & Asia. The faith is fresh and new there and there is zeal for it. However, Europe and North America aren’t doing so hot. In fact, Europe and North America are falling flat on their faces in public. Latin America is holding its own.

In the US, the Catholic Church became respectable in the mid-20th century, and many Catholics entered the cultural mainstream, but we haven’t done so well with that. It wasn’t really too bad until all the abuse scandals broke, which caused all our other corruptions & internal scandals to hit the fan and now the general population knows all about our troubles, internal points of strife, and organizational difficulties. And now that they know, we can be used as political pawns–and we are, as night follows day. We are now divide-and-conquer territory because there’s a political payoff; it was completely predictable.

It is going to take us decades to live this mess down in North America.

Yes, the problem is ’ Catholics entered the cultural mainstream, but we haven’t done so well with that’. Christians never want to be part of the ‘cultural mainstream’ because that means we have become part of the world. With most people believing that homosexual marriage is not a bad thing, 40% of children born outside of marriage, over 50% of people never marrying at all, why would we want to be part of the ‘cultural mainstream’. We should only worry about fitting in well with God and the saints.

 

[CrimsonThorn]

C’mon, it is all around us. Homosexuals trying to legitimize their relationships amongst the faithful. Atheists growing in very large numbers every day. More and more priests accused of sexual misconduct. Humanity in general, trying to excuse bad behavior at every turn. As a child of the 1980s I can say with clear recollection that I did not know of any homosexual people and would never, EVER, think that one day they demand to be married in the Church. I also never thought that people would be disbelievers in God. To me, that would have been too much. As for priests, I never heard of sexual abuse like this on any level.

Warnings from Fatima and other Church approved sightings dictate that we are in End Times friends. Hold on…

Im not one to be too quick to jump to conclusions myself, but all the things mentioned and more that is happening in human society, are too in your face to play off or ignore. There is a lot of serious distortion taking place, globally, all at the same time.

In La Salette, the Virgin speaks of how her Son’s hand was growing too heavy for her to hold back… and that was just due to people working on Sundays and taking His name im vain.

These days, that is happening to a greater degree WITH the added bonuses of rampant abortion, adultery, the normalizing of perversions, abandonment of the Churh, mockery and persecution of the Church, of God, etc…

Make of that what you will.

 

[dluna]

I do feel that Catholism seems to be dying. My friends question why I am in RCIA and why I can’t be Methodist or Presbytarian instead of pursuing the Catholic religion and the Christian denomination people think Catholism is ******** because of the wider belief in Mary and the patron saints. Well I also am not sure why there is a Pope, why he is so deeply respected, isn’t God supposed to be the ONLY one we worship and pray to? Why use the Rosary? So many questions. It’s only my first month of RCIA.