Is Catholicism the ONLY right religion?

[Genesis315]

PopeInnocent:

How can anyone say that you have to belong to the Catholic Church to get to heaven? Didn’t Jesus say that “whoever believes in the Son (Jesus) has eternal life”? Quote from the gospel of John. He didn’t say "whoever believes in the Church or belongs to the Church has eternal life (=goes to heaven). By the way, Jesus never started any religion. Constantine started a religion. Jesus came to show the way to God. Mary didn’t start any religion either.

Those who are not Catholic reject part of Jesus’ Truth and therefore do not fully believe in Him. Now, if this is through no fault of their own, they have seeked with an open heart, and they believe what they can with the grace they have been given, then they may be saved . As for the rest of the comments, Jack Chick and the DaVinci Code are not legitimate historical sources. I would expect a pope to know better (even a not so great pope)

 

[PopeInnocent]

follow up on my last point…

At the urging of the heads of the Spanish church, Pope Sixtus issued a Papal Bull giving authority for an Inquisition. However, the authorization was actually given to the Spanish crown. They were to be the ones who would appoint the bishops to complete the Inquisition. Thus, the Spanish Inquisition was founded to purify the nation from heretics (Roth, 1964). Although purification was the original intent for the Inquisition, it came to have more materialistic, racial, and political motives, which led to the terror for which it is infamous.

 

[carol_marie]

Church Militant:

The difference is between ALL truth and just a piece of it. Which would you rather have?

This is so true! When I was a “Christian” it was as if I was looking a beautiful large fish tank. I could watch the fish swim around - it was great. Then God said to me, "You think that’s something… look at THIS: and now that I’m Catholic I’m snorkeling off the GREAT BARRIER REEF!!! It’s just so so so much more.

 

[Genesis315]

PopeInnocent:

follow up on my last point…

At the urging of the heads of the Spanish church, Pope Sixtus issued a Papal Bull giving authority for an Inquisition. However, the authorization was actually given to the Spanish crown. They were to be the ones who would appoint the bishops to complete the Inquisition. Thus, the Spanish Inquisition was founded to purify the nation from heretics (Roth, 1964). Although purification was the original intent for the Inquisition, it came to have more materialistic, racial, and political motives, which led to the terror for which it is infamous.

Only those posing as Christians (thus, a heretic) were subject to the Inquisition. If they were openly practicing another faith, why would they have to be investigated?? Actually records show criminals would blaspheme in the law courts because the Inquisition courts were more fair and the torture less harsh.

 

[Genesis315]

carol marie:

This is so true! When I was a “Christian” it was as if I was looking a beautiful large fish tank. I could watch the fish swim around - it was great. Then God said to me, "You think that’s something… look at THIS: and now that I’m Catholic I’m snorkeling off the GREAT BARRIER REEF!!! It’s just so so so much more.

What a great analogy!

 

[PopeInnocent]

The pope and church being always right?

…the Inquisition in Spain began in 1478 and officially ended in 1808. During that time, 323,362 people were burned and 17,659 were burned in effigy. It is one of the darkest periods in Spanish history.
The punishments and tortures used to gain confessions are the most famous parts of the Inquisition. Because the trials were for spiritual matters, the Church handled them. However, the punishments were usually very much physical, so they were handled by the state. There were many means of this physical torture for confession. The two most famous or infamous were the strappado or pulley, and the *aselli *or water torment. The strappado was a device that used ropes to strap a person in by their arms and legs, and then weights were attached to the ends of these ropes. The person was raised to a certain level and then the ropes were released. This created a situation where the body would be stretched painfully, sometimes enough to produce death.
**The tortures were used on old and young alike to get confessions and to learn of accomplices. In this way, the Spanish tried to ensure they would be pure.**The sentence of death was carried out as the accused was thrown into a fire as an auto de fe (act of faith). The fire was reserved for those who would not admit their heresy, those who relapsed in their heresies, and to other dissenters. The guilty were burned because the church believed they (the church) should not be a direct party in the shedding of blood. To remain free of blood, the church “relaxed” or handed over the guilty to the secular arm.

 

[tuopaolo]

PopeInnocent:

I must say this is a strange remark: “Outside the church is no salvation.”

Think of the Church as the cradle in which Mary or Jesus or the Holy Spirit holds us as their children. They keep us warm and safe. If we’re outside of this cradle then we will perish in the cold and darkness. Or you can think of it as a mother’s womb where we are nourished with the Bread of Life.

So you have to see the Church as more than an organization. She is an extension of Jesus. She is the house of the Father.

I guess that’s the basis for the sectarian non-tolerant approach the Church took in the Spanish Inquisition where thousands of Jews and non-Catholic Christians were killed by the Benedictine monks".

I don’t believe any monks killed anyone.

 

[Genesis315]

PopeInnocent:

The pope and church being always right?

No. You need to learn what infallibility really means and not confuse it with impeccability. Popes and bishops have definitely had their fair share of sins. The Church is never wrong when teaching the deposit of faith in her official capacity (magesterium). The Inquisition had nothing to do with the infallible teaching capacity of the Church.

 

[Fr_Ambrose]

Dear PopeInnocent,

How old are you? Are these some of the laws which you created? It must be if you are Innocent III and were at the Fourth Lateran Council?

ON INSURING SECULAR AUTHORITIES EXTERMINATE HERETICS
Secular authorities, whatever office they may hold, shall be admonished and induced and if necessary compelled by ecclesiastical censure, that as they wish to be esteemed and numbered among the faithful, so for the defense of the faith they ought publicly to take an oath that they will strive in good faith and to the best of their ability to exterminate in the territories subject to their jurisdiction all heretics pointed out by the Church; so that whenever anyone shall have assumed authority, whether spiritual or temporal, let him be bound to confirm this decree by oath.

ON SEIZING THE TERRITORY OF UNRESPONSIVE SECULAR RULERS
But if a temporal ruler, after having been requested and admonished by the Church, should neglect to cleanse his territory of this heretical foulness, let him be excommunicated by the metropolitan and the other bishops of the province. If he refuses to make satisfaction within a year, let the matter be made known to the supreme pontiff, that he may declare the ruler’s vassals absolved from their allegiance and may offer the territory to be ruled by Catholics, who on the extermination of the heretics may possess it without hindrance and preserve it in the purity of faith; the right, however, of the chief ruler is to be respected as long as he offers no obstacle in this matter and permits freedom of action. The same law is to be observed in regard to those who have no chief rulers (that is, are independent). Catholics who have girded themselves with the cross for the extermination of the heretics, shall enjoy the indulgences and privileges granted to those who go in defense of the Holy Land.

The full canons here:

www-rohan.sdsu.edu/~amtower/lateran4.html

 

[dcmac]

“Actually they were Christians.”
Actually, they were not in the strictest sense we are applying in this thread. They were by desire and the fullfilment of the ultimate sacrifice that the Hebrews were awaiting. There is a fine difference and I think we are dancing in a circle on this one.

“Consider Moses and Elijah who talked with Jesus – they were obviously Christians.”
Many people talked with Yeshua. That alone does not make them Christians.

“And the other saints of the Old Covenant became Christians at least when Jesus preached to them while they were in the Limbo of the Fathers.”
And this is by desire and fullfillment of the Covenant, not by the means we were relating to beforehand in this thread.

“The Church teaches that to go to Heaven one must die in the state of grace, possessing faith, hope and charity.Someone who doesn’t believe in God obviously doesn’t possess faith (belief in God), hope (desire for God and confidence in Him), and charity (love for God for His own sake).”
You do not know that. Their knowledge of God is obviously imperfect and seriously lacking, however even in the most rudimentary native religions of the Americas there was recognized an ultimate creator, but also other “gods”. While this is imperfect it does seek out in the best way they could the One True God. This knowledge is imperfect for no fault of their own and they are not held to the same level of responsibility on this issue as you and I – this the Church teaches.

“So those who die, not believing in God, do not go to Heaven.”
I refer you to the above.

 

[dcmac]

“popeinnocent”

These diatribes are tired and old… do not fooled into thinking that these Jack Chic (sp?) tracts are new on us here…

 

[BillyT92679]

The fullness of all faith is found in the Churches in Communion with the Apostolic See. These Churches form what is known as Catholicism, and the Church of Christ subsists in (“exists in”) Catholicism.

Do I think others can be saved? I would hope that all men would be saved… I think if one grew up without any notion of Christ, but had some type of faith and lived a holy life, I personally think the Merciful One would accept him into His Kingdom.

The only GUARANTEED way of Salvation is to follow the teaching of Catholcism, have faith, do good, and avoid evil.

 

[dcmac]

"The fullness of all faith is found in the Churches in Communion with the Apostolic See. These Churches form what is known as Catholicism, and the Church of Christ subsists in (“exists in”) Catholicism.
Do I think others can be saved? I would hope that all men would be saved… I think if one grew up without any notion of Christ, but had some type of faith and lived a holy life, I personally think the Merciful One would accept him into His Kingdom.

The only GUARANTEED way of Salvation is to follow the teaching of Catholcism, have faith, do good, and avoid evil."

**
AMEN!**
(emphasis mine)

 

[Fr_Ambrose]

PopeInnocent wrote wrongly:

in the Spanish Inquisition where thousands of Jews and non-Catholic Christians were killed by the Benedictine monks".

and tuopaolo replied correctly:

I don’t believe any monks killed anyone.

PopeInnocent, I don’t think you are a pope at all or you would know that it was not monks but Dominican friars.