Is clapping okay after the priest declares that the mass is over?

[Seamus_L]

I positively detest clapping in God’s House. I can’t stop it from happening, but I’ll never participate in it either.

 

[slh3016]

Don Ruggero, I agree wholeheartedly with your comments. However, noting that the OP is rather new I wonder if perhaps by “auxiliary priest” he/she meant “assistant pastor” or “parochial vicar” rather than “auxiliary bishop.” Just for clarification and not that this would change anything you said.

Sorry for this confusion. I guess I don’t quite know the proper term for a retired priest from another diocese who now helps occasionally at our parish saying mass, etc. Our parish is blessed to have three full-time priests and this is a fourth priest. In my mind, two of the the full-time priests would be “assistants” and auxiliary is the only term I could think of to describe him

 

[slh3016]

I just want to thank everyone for your honest and kind answers. We are a family that is still learning as we go and always felt like that if we were imitating the gestures and body posture of those around us during mass that we were doing the appropriate thing.

We are just now starting to have that preconceived notion challenged in various ways (holding hands during the Our Father or not, receiving on the tongue instead of the hand like most everyone else in our parish does, extending hands when saying, “…and with Your Spirit.”, etc.). I honestly never knew there was debate with these issues until recently and it’s been awkward and a struggle trying to change myself and our children’s responses because we all thought we were “doing the right thing” before. Changing now, especially when everyone around us still maintains the other postures/gestures, seems very legalistic.

That’s why the whole clapping thing really bothered my son (and myself). No teenager wants to be chided/corrected by a peer in this setting as if he were doing something wrong when he wasn’t or be in the middle of something disruptive/disrespectful in this setting. My son is a good kid and does not like attention draw to himself.

Oh well, thankfully we are out for the summer and hopefully won’t be in this situation again since this particular kid is going to a Protestant school next year instead of being homeschooled or going to a Catholic school

 

[slh3016]

It is decidedly both disruptive and disrespectful.

A member of the congregation should not be acting as though they are some sort of liturgical policeman…and for a child to act that way in the presence of an adult is not acceptable in any fashion.

Yes, these were my thoughts as well. I like that term “liturgical policeman”

 

[EXdrinker]

I would explain to my own children in this way…
“Some people love the mass so much and hold it in such high regard that they believe that bringing a secular seeming sign, such as clapping, into it is an offense to the holiness of mass. These children are coming from a place of piety and reverence, they are not “bad people”. We should do our best to understand them and consider their point of view before dismissing it. What do you think about bringing secular things into mass? Personally I do not like it but for very rare circumstances and am happy that Father waited until after mass was done. Let’s not judge those children for their reverence even though we may disagree with how they reacted to your clapping or to Father’s suggestion to clap.”

Gets the children thinking for themselves and trying to understand the other children. My two cents.

 

[CB_Catholic]

Actually, I would have a respectful talk with the parents, and let them know this should never happen again – it is not their boys’ place to correct my children or lay hands on them, and then perhaps a talk with the Pastor about seeing that something is said to correct the behavior, seeing as these people are guests in your parish at his invitation and seem to be overstepping their bounds.

Sorry this happened to you. It is just plain rude.

 

[Glennon_P]

I would explain to my own children in this way…
“Some people love the mass so much and hold it in such high regard that they believe that bringing a secular seeming sign, such as clapping, into it is an offense to the holiness of mass. These children are coming from a place of piety and reverence, they are not “bad people”. We should do our best to understand them and consider their point of view before dismissing it. What do you think about bringing secular things into mass? Personally I do not like it but for very rare circumstances and am happy that Father waited until after mass was done. Let’s not judge those children for their reverence even though we may disagree with how they reacted to your clapping or to Father’s suggestion to clap.”

Gets the children thinking for themselves and trying to understand the other children. My two cents.

Perhaps the other parents should explain it to their children in this way…

“Some people love their priests so much and hold them in such high regard they believe that showing a sign of love and affection, such as clapping, is fitting and appropriate for the period immediately after the Mass. These children are coming from a place of reverence and appreciation for the priesthood, they are not “bad people”. We should do our best to understand them and consider their point of view before dismissing it, What do you think about showing a sign of love and affection for our priests? Personally I like it and am happy that Father asked us to do so following the Mass. Let’s not judge those children for their love and affection for the priests even though we may disagree with how they reacted by following Father’s suggestion to clap.”

Gets the children thinking for themselves and trying to understand the other children. My two cents.

 

[7_Sorrows]

I positively detest clapping in God’s House. I can’t stop it from happening, but I’ll never participate in it either.

+1

 

[felsguy]

Don Ruggero, I agree wholeheartedly with your comments. However, noting that the OP is rather new I wonder if perhaps by “auxiliary priest” he/she meant “assistant pastor” or “parochial vicar” rather than “auxiliary bishop.” Just for clarification and not that this would change anything you said.

Sorry for this confusion. I guess I don’t quite know the proper term for a retired priest from another diocese who now helps occasionally at our parish saying mass, etc. Our parish is blessed to have three full-time priests and this is a fourth priest. In my mind, two of the the full-time priests would be “assistants” and auxiliary is the only term I could think of to describe him

Don’t be embarrassed. The only reason I brought it up was to emphasize that I’m sure that it would be a well-received gesture of support and appreciation from the parishioners by any priest on his birthday and not just a bishop.

 

[Solomonson]

… (holding hands during the Our Father or not, receiving on the tongue instead of the hand like most everyone else in our parish does, extending hands when saying, “…and with Your Spirit.”, etc.)…

For far too many, these issues and others become the focus of their worship and not that of Jesus Christ and it’s terribly sad.

I’ve figured out “what I do during the Mass” at this point and I couldn’t care less what others do unless it personally impacts me and for the most part is does not.

If the priest tells people to clap I just ignore him AND I don’t show displeasure when most everyone else is clapping.

Some on these threads extol for instance, communion on tongue as if it’s actually superior (it’s not) while savaging praying in the organs configuration – and the exact opposite of course. I want none of it. One thing is for certain. The focus on each of these externals is from BOTH sides.

 

[Solomonson]

I would explain to my own children in this way…
“Some people love the mass so much and hold it in such high regard that they believe that bringing a secular seeming sign, such as clapping, into it is an offense to the holiness of mass. These children are coming from a place of piety and reverence, they are not “bad people”. We should do our best to understand them and consider their point of view before dismissing it. What do you think about bringing secular things into mass? Personally I do not like it but for very rare circumstances and am happy that Father waited until after mass was done. Let’s not judge those children for their reverence even though we may disagree with how they reacted to your clapping or to Father’s suggestion to clap.”

Gets the children thinking for themselves and trying to understand the other children. My two cents.

Is it possible they are coming from a place of ignorance and intolerance?

 

[buc_fan33]

For far too many, these issues and others become the focus of their worship and not that of Jesus Christ and it’s terribly sad.

I completely agree

I’ve figured out “what I do during the Mass” at this point and I couldn’t care less what others do unless it personally impacts me and for the most part is does not.

I’d challenge you to reread this statement though. To be frank, it sounds rather self-centered, not in the colloquial way in which we say, “You’re a self-centered person,” like a child who won’t share his toys, but self-centered in that you are primarily concerned with what impacts you. I think sometimes we can get in the tendency to think that Mass is just about “God and me.” “I’m worshipping God.” Think about the rationale that is usually offered as a reason to why we ought not hold hands at the Our Father. “This is a vertical prayer, between God and me. We ought not conflate it with the horizontal emphasis on the community.” It’s almost like there is an aversion in conservative Catholic circles to the word “community.”

But, there is nothing wrong with community. Indeed, I’d defy anyone to show me a saint who reached sanctity alone. Francis and Clare, Cyril and Methodius, Gregory of Nyssa and Gregory Nazianzus, John Vianney and Philomena, Benedict and Scholastica, Mary and Joseph, etcetera. It’s never just about “Jesus and me;” it’s ALWAYS “Jesus and we.”

If the priest tells people to clap I just ignore him AND I don’t show displeasure when most everyone else is clapping.

Is your ignoring not in and of itself a sign of displeasure? One of the key principles of the Theology of the Body, for instance, is that the body has a language. The body speaks, and as we all know, actions speak louder than words. In other words, to show displeasure, you don’t actually have to SAY anything.

Some on these threads extol for instance, communion on tongue as if it’s actually superior (it’s not) while savaging praying in the orans configuration – and the exact opposite of course. I want none of it. One thing is for certain. The focus on each of these externals is from BOTH sides.

I agree. Satan loves the constant bickering among ourselves. Every ounce of energy and minute of time we spend on these silly debates is an ounce and minute we don’t have to evangelize the culture, to pray and develop a closer relationship with the Lord Jesus, etcetera.

These debates often remind me of James and John arguing about who was the greatest.

 

[Don_Ruggero]

I would explain to my own children in this way…
“Some people love the mass so much and hold it in such high regard that they believe that bringing a secular seeming sign, such as clapping, into it is an offense to the holiness of mass. These children are coming from a place of piety and reverence, they are not “bad people”. We should do our best to understand them and consider their point of view before dismissing it. What do you think about bringing secular things into mass? Personally I do not like it but for very rare circumstances and am happy that Father waited until after mass was done. Let’s not judge those children for their reverence even though we may disagree with how they reacted to your clapping or to Father’s suggestion to clap.”

Gets the children thinking for themselves and trying to understand the other children. My two cents.

What the family who opposed the applause did was wholly and entirely wrong.

Applause is even called for in the liturgy…it is not an “offense to the holiness of the Mass”

 

[Don_Ruggero]

Yes, these were my thoughts as well. I like that term “liturgical policeman”

It is the fruit of dealing with the atrocious behaviour of many people across the decades who thought they had some prerogative to try to correct their parish priest…in all cases I dealt with, such people were summarily disabused of that illusion.

Unfortunately, you will encounter such people in the church.

We are just now starting to have that preconceived notion challenged in various ways (holding hands during the Our Father or not, receiving on the tongue instead of the hand like most everyone else in our parish does, extending hands when saying, “…and with Your Spirit.”, etc.). I honestly never knew there was debate with these issues until recently and it’s been awkward and a struggle trying to change myself and our children’s responses because we all thought we were “doing the right thing” before. Changing now, especially when everyone around us still maintains the other postures/gestures, seems very legalistic.

The most important advice I can give you as priest is this: do not allow these rigid people to lead you down the path of rigidity and legalism. You are uncomfortable for good reason: because they are wholly wrong.

You say that you have a good and holy priest…follow him and not these rigid people. These are the sorts of people who see liturgical abuse lurking everywhere. Such people are to be shunned, frankly.

• It is the communicant’s option to receive in the hand or on the tongue. It does not matter what the manner was 200 years ago…it only matters what the Church allows in the present age. And it allows for both methods. And gives the choice to the communicant.
• If you wish to hold hands during the Our Father and this is a custom in your parish, you may do so. Or you may choose not to do so. But the rubrics are silent on this. The last I knew, when I retired as a professor of liturgy, there was one and only one diocese out of almost 200 in the United States where the Bishop had made any particular law, which is his prerogative as diocesan Ordinary, about this gesture. For every other Bishop, they have not seen need to do so but rather they leave the laity free to choose the posture they wish to assume.

In short, you would do far better to be formed by your own parish priest and to follow your parish community and its ethos than these very unfortunate people with whom you fell in with.

 

[Don_Ruggero]

It’s almost like there is an aversion in conservative Catholic circles to the word “community.”

More than that, Father, it is a failure by such people to have internalised that the individual is a member of the liturgical assembly and that their full, conscious and active participation in the liturgy is as a member of the liturgical assembly…not as an individual and still less as a spectator or as an outsider seeking to commune with God apart from the liturgical assembly.

 

[Don_Ruggero]

I was sad he was Pope for such a short time. I entered the Church in 2008 so I am fond of Benedict XVI. It was a very sad day for me and disappointing when he said he was resigning.

Very few people realised the tremendous toll the workload was taking on him, physically…especially in those final months. Or the health challenges that were his, going back years…because he is a very private person who shields such things.

I am very happy for him that, after all these years, he is finally having the time of retirement he wanted and hoped for…and that for so long.

 

[Don_Ruggero]

Sorry for this confusion. I guess I don’t quite know the proper term for a retired priest from another diocese who now helps occasionally at our parish saying mass, etc. Our parish is blessed to have three full-time priests and this is a fourth priest. In my mind, two of the the full-time priests would be “assistants” and auxiliary is the only term I could think of to describe him

As someone else said, there is nothing to be embarrassed about.

In the clerical lexicon, the only “auxiliary” is an auxiliary bishop and it would be normal for the parish priest to be very much evidence on the occasion of the visit of the auxiliary bishop.

In any event, if this is a priest who is helping out, under whatever title, without being either the parish priest or a parochial vicar then, yes, all the more so gratitude and appreciation should be shown since he is generously helping out your priests when he could be elsewhere.

 

[7_Sorrows]

Very people realised the tremendous toll the workload was taking on him, physically…especially in those final months. Or the health challenges that were his, going back years…because he is a very private person who shields such things.

I am very happy for him that, after all these years, he is finally having the time of retirement he wanted and hoped for…and for so long.

I am as well. It brought joy to my heart and tears to my eye to see him celebrating his birthday recently. He is such a kind and sweet man. He always seemed to have a pure heart. I have 3 or 4 of his books and I have not had a chance to read
them yet. I am sure I will learn so much.

 

[pnewton]

In any event, if this is a priest who is helping out, under whatever title, without being either the parish priest or a parochial vicar then, yes, all the more so gratitude and appreciation should be shown since he is generously helping out your priests when he could be elsewhere.

We clap for our priest once a year, on the anniversary of his ordination. I think it important to have these milestones to remember to show appreciation in what we often take for granted.

Quick question. For you, would your anniversary or birthday be the best day to be honored by the parish? (though both would be a good idea)

 

[Don_Ruggero]

We clap for our priest once a year, on the anniversary of his ordination. I think it important to have these milestones to remember to show appreciation in what we often take for granted.

Quick question. For you, would your anniversary or birthday be the best day to be honored by the parish? (though both would be a good idea)

Oh, most definitely my anniversary of ordination. That relates to my priesthood. My birthday on the other hand is something I keep much more private and that is quite personal.