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followingtheway
Guest
I’m not abused or married (I’m a minor 
) but is it?
) but is it?
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Bezant
Guest
The Church’s opinion is that civil divorces are acceptable, but sacramental marriages cannot be broken–although they can be annulled under certain circumstances after review.
As a personal opinion, however, I don’t think annulment does enough for an injured spouse in this situation. There’s so many demands on a Catholic marriage and the temptation to sin is very strong if couples don’t qualify for an annulment.
As a personal opinion, however, I don’t think annulment does enough for an injured spouse in this situation. There’s so many demands on a Catholic marriage and the temptation to sin is very strong if couples don’t qualify for an annulment.
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PerfectTiming
Guest
Legally they can get divorced and take other appropriate measures to keep themselves from harm. That is not sinful. But sacramentally they are still married and both parties must conduct themselves as such. Legally separating to prevent oneself or one’s children from harm is perfectly licit. The parties can seek an annulment if they wish but that is given based on circumstances at the time of the marriage, not what transpires since.
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Ninian29
Guest
Temptation to sin is very strong?could you elaborate on that a bit?
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Bezant
Guest
No prob.Temptation to sin is very strong?could you elaborate on that a bit?
To be fair, there’s a possible temptation to sin with any prohibition.
Well, if after your appeal(s) you don’t qualify for an annulment, what can you do?
Unless the abusive spouse changes enough that reconciliation is possible, you’re stuck in a sacramental marriage. Meaning you can’t remarry until your spouse’s death. Neither can you pursue a new relationship – besides being semi-fruitless, it would also be adulterous.
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Pfaffenhoffen
Guest
What about treating the abuser? Such a persons is not a normal person…I myself would never beat a woman, even if I were beaten by her…And I am 6’2’’I’m not abused or married (I’m a minor
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joanofarc2008
Guest
Hate to tell you but in the cases of most abusive marriages chances are there is something going on there that will render that marriage invalid. This is mainly my personal opinion from experience. After all psychological issues withheld at the time of marriage are cause for decree of nullity. Intent against permanence are cause. Intent against fidelity. Intent against children. These are all things that typically go into an abusive marriage. Only rarely are at least one of these components not present. This is just from talking to a few people who have been around the block. You may wish to look up a statement by the USCCB called “When I Call for Help” on this very subject.
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Bezant
Guest
The problem would be proving one of the disqualifying factors you listed, existed.
In any case, what if a factor was known to both spouses–like psychological issues–at the time of marriage, but the problem worsened after marriage? Or, what if one spouse was sane before marriage, and became mentally disturbed after marriage?
Of course, that’s why Catholic marriages are very serious and couples are grilled before the wedding, but some people may end up stuck.
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joanofarc2008
Guest
Have you been through the process or are you speaking theoretically? The process is not that hard once you get the experts and the witnesses etc reviewing the testimony especially once it has escalated to the level of abuse. I have yet to meet someone who has been in an abusive marriage who has not been able to meet this standard. I will ask a bigger sampling though if you need.
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thistle
Guest
A valid marriage cannot be rendered invalid by anything.
What determines if a marriage is invalid or valid is what is known/happens PRIOR to the marriage. What happens after the marriage has taken place is not relevant to any annulment process other than possibly supporting claims about something known prior to the marriage.
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joanofarc2008
Guest
Excuse me I did not mean to say render invalid my apologies I should have said would result in the marriage being found invalid - furthermore - yes it is possible to have events within the marriage used as evidence of conditions present at time of marriage.
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Ninian29
Guest
They are many types of abuses in Marriage,so it may depend on that too.Physical violence is not the only abuse out there.There is verbal,mental and even sexual which is harder to prove as they are rarely witness to those.Sticky area for the church the deal with
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Bezant
Guest
For the most part, I’m speaking theoretically, although I know Catholics who are separated because of spousal abuse.
Is it really that easy to prove that abuse went on and it’s legit grounds for annulment? And even so, there’s still the problem of what sort of abuse is acceptable grounds.
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ConstantineTG
Guest
Yes. The Church teaches that if a spouse needs to defend him/herself through separation, then they can seek it. Of course this means that the person needs to remain chaste their entire lives as their marriage is not dissolved Sacramentally, unless of course the spouse dies first.I’m not abused or married (I’m a minor
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joanofarc2008
Guest
Once you are talking about the type of abuse that has reached the level where separation is licit then yes it is for the most part generally speaking IMO to find witnesses that these types of problems existed. Again it is not the abuse that would be the grounds it is the intent against fidelity, or the intent against children, or the intent against permanence, or the psychological problems that tend to go along with these issues. I think that since you are speaking theoretically you may not have a full grasp on what it is that makes up an abusive relationship or what the proper Canons are that may cover these things. I would suggest again that you start at the USCCB statement - you can read between the lines there. Also you may wish to take a look at the Canons for marriage and decide for yourself if an abuser is really ABLE to consent to marriage.
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wayman
Guest
In the Catholic faith there is no such thing as a divorce. There are only valid marriages and ones that were not valid to begin with. If one is validly married in the Church it’s a sacrament that lasts until one or both die. However, in cases of spousal abuse the two can physically separate, but they will always be considered married even though living separately if the marriage was a valid one. This means that, in a valid marriage, if one attempts to remarry while the other is still alive it’s adultry even if the reason for separating was spouse abuse.
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jwinch2
Guest
One can be in a sacramental marriage and seek annulment due to abuse.
USCCB:
The cycle is so often hard to break. The woman I am referring to above told my wife and I when we first confronted her about her situation that her father physically abused her mother as well.
Anyone who is in an abusive situation should contact the civil authorities immediately upon experiencing the abuse, get medical care as needed, and from there, contact their pastor and appropriate counseling as needed. More than likely, the pastor will know a good counselor who can help the person through their situation.
I would also call on people not to ignore it and think that someone else is taking care of it. The girl I spoke of above had been going through her situation for several years and I can’t begin to believe that we were the first people to notice it. Turning a blind eye to thing like this only makes it worse.
Sorry for going on, this topic makes me angry…
USCCB:
One of the women who went through RCIA with us was in an abusive marriage. She showed up multiple times to class with bruises on her face, etc. She was able to get an annulment within a couple of months time frame.
The cycle is so often hard to break. The woman I am referring to above told my wife and I when we first confronted her about her situation that her father physically abused her mother as well.
Anyone who is in an abusive situation should contact the civil authorities immediately upon experiencing the abuse, get medical care as needed, and from there, contact their pastor and appropriate counseling as needed. More than likely, the pastor will know a good counselor who can help the person through their situation.
I would also call on people not to ignore it and think that someone else is taking care of it. The girl I spoke of above had been going through her situation for several years and I can’t begin to believe that we were the first people to notice it. Turning a blind eye to thing like this only makes it worse.
Sorry for going on, this topic makes me angry…
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joanofarc2008
Guest
You are correct. The issue is that often times people act on what they think the Church does believe or will do rather than what She does do or will do. Sometimes things take time - in this situation I am pretty sure from what I know that she would have bumped up due to the fact that she was entering the Church and the decree of nullity may have had some bearing on her ability to do this (assumption but yes I know for a fact that dioceses do this)- but honestly while things are taking time it is a good time to heal. I have been through this myself and I know many women who have both online and in real life. I also have learned that most people that are most critical have very little experience with it.
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wayman
Guest
Where exactly is the quote you cited from? What document?
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