Is Double Predestination compatible with a belief in purgatory

[Latin]

Latin:

I believe MT you are correct, but do you know MT the way our free will works that we are able to choose the good?

Yes Latin I do, we have already been over this many times in the past on both of your accounts.

You know I will just point out that you are picking and choosing from Catholic teaching to believe what you want to believe and at times you will take things farther than the Catholic Church intended them to go.

Do you really want to go through this again a forth time?

God Bless

Thank you for your post MT.

Just one subject at the time.

Do you believe MT that our predestination to heaven is God’s choice and if a predestined to heaven would reject God’s call to everlasting life/ heaven or if would die in the state of mortal sin and end up in hell God would lose His omniscience?

Do you believe the above statement MT, if not what do you believe?

God bless.

 

[MT1926]

Do you believe MT that our predestination to heaven is God’s choice and if a predestined to heaven would reject God’s call to everlasting life/ heaven or if would die in the state of mortal sin and end up in hell God would lose His omniscience?

I believe the predestined to heaven are God’s Choice sure.

I also believe the Chruch’s teaching…

CCC [1993] Justification establishes cooperation between God’s grace and man’s freedom . On man’s part it is expressed by the assent of faith to the Word of God, which invites him to conversion, and in the cooperation of charity with the prompting of the Holy Spirit who precedes and preserves his assent:

When God touches man’s heart through the illumination of the Holy Spirit, man himself is not inactive while receiving that inspiration, since he could reject it; and yet, without God’s grace, he cannot by his own free will move himself toward justice in God’s sight.42

I also believe, which we have already discussed several times, that there is absolutely no way any of us can claim to be one of the predestined.

If you were to reject God’s call, even 20 years from now, He would have already known that you will one day reject Him call and therefore through His omniscience He would not have predestined you in the first place.

God can’t lose His omniscience, because He already knows if and when you will accept or rejected Him. Trying to say a predestined person can reject God is a straw man argument. Because there is no way to prove who the predestined person is.

God Bless

 

[Roseeurekacross]

No, you did not answer my question.
Because I did not ask one.

Not everyone will be saved. Jesus died for many, not all.

https://cruxnow.com/vatican/2017/11/03/pope-francis-sides-benedict-says-christ-shed-blood-many/

“The phrase “for many,” used both in the Gospel of Mark (14:24) and Matthew (26:28), has been debated repeatedly over the past two decades by liturgists, theologians, and others. Used in the Roman Mass during the Eucharist prayer with reference to the blood of Christ, its Latin original is “pro multis.”

 

[Latin]

I believe the predestined to heaven are God’s Choice sure.

I also believe the Chruch’s teaching…

CCC [1993] Justification establishes cooperation between God’s grace and man’s freedom . On man’s part it is expressed by the assent of faith to the Word of God, which invites him to conversion, and in the cooperation of charity with the prompting of the Holy Spirit who precedes and preserves his assent:

When God touches man’s heart through the illumination of the Holy Spirit, man himself is not inactive while receiving that inspiration, since he could reject it; and yet, without God’s grace, he cannot by his own free will move himself toward justice in God’s sight.42

There are INITIAL JUSTIFICATION and PROGRESSIVE JUSTIFICATION, the two are NOT the same!
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CCC 1993 Speaking Progressive Justification when the elect actively cooperating with the graces of God which graces sometimes the elect can resist/reject which negatively effects the elect’s glory and position in heaven, but cannot effect their salvation because the elect at their Initial Justification irrevocably saved.

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To do any supernatural work or to make any supernatural decision (say yes to God’s call to heaven), FIRST we need Initial Justification which puts us into the state of grace.
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Strictly speaking only a person in the STATE OF GRACE can merit, as defined by the Church (Denzinger 1576, 1582).

Until we are in the state of grace, we cannot make supernatural act or to make supernatural decision.
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Our Initial justification is an instant event, entirely the works of God by grace alone.

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COUNCIL OF TRENT Session 6 Chapter 8

… We are therefore said to be justified freely, because that none of those things which PRECEDE justification-whether faith or works-merit the grace itself of justification.

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Initial Justification is an instant event, followed by Progressive Justification which is a life time event after baptism until we die.
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No elect can reject Initial Justification for many reasons, one is it is an instant event and solely God’s work, furthermore every elect irrevocable saved at their Initial Justification (DE FIDE).
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God Bless.

 

[Latin]

If you were to reject God’s call, even 20 years from now, He would have already known that you will one day reject Him call and therefore through His omniscience He would not have predestined you in the first place.

God can’t lose His omniscience, because He already knows if and when you will accept or rejected Him. Trying to say a predestined person can reject God is a straw man argument. Because there is no way to prove who the predestined person is.

God Bless

MT in your above statement you are overlooking an INFALLIBLE teachings of the Trent and the same FORMAL teachings of the Catholic Church, which is; God’s special grace THE GIFT OF FINAL PERSEVERANCE.

In Catholic Soteriology there is no salvation without God’s special grace, The Gift of Final Perseverance.
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So, God does NOT looking who will persevere to the end, because without God’s special grace The Gift of Final Perseverance EVERYONE would end up in hell. – Infallible teachings of the Trent and Formal teachings of the Catholic Church.
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With Initial Justification and with His special grace The Gift of Final Perseverance, God infallible saves His elect, the question is: How many elect God has, the entire human race or only a few? – The decision is God’s.
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God bless.

 

[Latin]

Not everyone will be saved. Jesus died for many, not all.

https://cruxnow.com/vatican/2017/11/03/pope-francis-sides-benedict-says-christ-shed-blood-many/

“The phrase “for many,” used both in the Gospel of Mark (14:24) and Matthew (26:28), has been debated repeatedly over the past two decades by liturgists, theologians, and others. Used in the Roman Mass during the Eucharist prayer with reference to the blood of Christ, its Latin original is “pro multis.”

Thank you for your post Roseeurekacross.

If we take out Mark 14:24 and Matt.26:28 from the context of the Scripture, we can conclude; Jesus died for many, not all.
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Let’s see what the context of the Scripture has to say about it.

1 Cor.15:22; For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ all will be made alive.
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2 Pet.3:8; … not wishing for any to perish but for all to come to repentance.
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1 Tim.2:4; Who wants all people to be saved …
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Mark 14:24; This is my blood of the covenant, which is poured out for many, he said to them.
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Matt.26:28; This is my blood of the covenant, which is poured out for many for the forgiveness of sins.
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Rom.5:18-19; Consequently, just as one trespass resulted in condemnation for all people, so also one righteous act resulted in justification and life for all people.
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19 For just as through the disobedience of the one man the many were made sinners, so also through the obedience of the one man the many will be made righteous.
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Eph.1:10; In the dispensation of the fullness of the times He might gather together in one all things in Christ, both which are in heaven and which are on earth—in Him.
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CONCLUSION

Probably Rom.5:18-19 and Eph.1:10 are the best illustrations that the Bible writers interchangeably used the phrases “for all” and “for many,” and both phrases EQUALLY referring to entirety/ totality, the entire human race.
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1 John 2:2; He is the atoning sacrifice for our sins, and not only for ours but also for the sins of the whole world.
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God bless.

 

[Roseeurekacross]

Let’s see what the context of the Scripture has to say about it.

Let’s see what Sacred Tradition says, and we did.

The Catholic Church does not work on orphaning passages of scripture .
It has Sacred Scripture and Sacred Tradition.

Your conclusion is wrong, why? Because you have done what Catholics do not do.

 

[Latin]

Latin:

Let’s see what the context of the Scripture has to say about it.

Let’s see what Sacred Tradition says, and we did.

The Catholic Church does not work on orphaning passages of scripture .
It has Sacred Scripture and Sacred Tradition.

Your conclusion is wrong, why? Because you have done what Catholics do not do.

My conclusion described in 1 John 2:2 and in Rom.5:18, etc. so how can be my conclusion wrong? - The Bible cannot be wrong.

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I LOVE TO STUDY CATHOLIC TEACHINGS AS WELL.

The Catholic Understanding of the Bible by Fr. John Harden SJ.

The Scriptures are holy because their main author is the all-holy God. But they are also holy because they are able to sanctify those who read the Bible as NO OTHER LITERATURE in the world is capable of doing.

St. Thomas does not hesitate to speak of the Scriptures as a KIND OF SACRAMENT.

SIMULAR to what happens when we receive BAPTISM or the EUCHARIST.

The same Holy Spirit who first inspired the Bible CONTINUES TO ENLIGHTEN those who now READ the Bible.” Emphasise mine.

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[CCC 108]; Still, the Christian faith is not a “religion of the book.”

Christianity is a religion of the “Word” of God, “not a written and mute word, but incarnate and living.”

If the Scriptures are not remain a dead letter, Christ, the eternal Word of the living God, must, through the Holy Spirit, “open [our] minds to understand the Scriptures.” End quote.
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I believe we Catholics should read and study the Bible every day.
I love both the Bible and I love Catholic teachings, in particular Catholic Soteriology.
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God bless.

 

[StAugustine]

The Roman Catholic Church believes and teaches double predestination. Synod of Valence, Sources of Catholic Dogma-

SourceURL:Denzinger - English translation, older numbering

322 Can. 3. But also it has seemed right concerning predestination and truly it is right according to the apostolic authority which says: “Or has not the potter power over the clay, from the same lump, to make one vessel unto honor, but another unto dishonor?” [Rom. 9:21] where also he immediately adds: “What if God willing to show His wrath and to make known His power, endured with much patience vessels of wrath fitted or prepared for destruction, so that He might show the riches of His grace on the vessels of mercy, which He has prepared unto glory” [Rom. 9:22 f.]: faithfully we confess the predestination of the elect to life, and the predestination of the impious to death; in the election, moreover, of those who are to be saved, the mercy of God precedes the merited good. In the condemnation, however, of those who are to be lost, the evil which they have deserved precedes the just judgment of God. In predestination, however, (we believe) that God has determined only those things which He Himself either in His gratuitous mercy or in His just judgment would do * according to Scripture which says: “Who has done the things which are to be done” [ Is. 4 5:11, LXX]; in regard to evil men, however, we believe that God foreknew their malice, because it is from them, but that He did not predestine it, because it is not from Him. (We believe) that God, who sees all things, foreknew and predestined that their evil deserved the punishment which followed, because He is just, in whom, as Saint Augustine* says, there is concerning all things everywhere so fixed a decree as a certain predestination. To this indeed he applies the saying of Wisdom: “Judgments are prepared for scorners, and striking hammers for the bodies of fools” [Prov. 19:29]. Concerning this unchangeableness of the foreknowledge of the predestination of God, through which in Him future things have already taken place, even in Ecclesiastes the saying is well understood: “I know that all the works which God has made continue forever. We cannot add anything, nor take away those things which God has made that He may be feared” [ Eccles. 3:14]. “But we do not only not believe the saying that some have been predestined to evil by divine power,” namely as if they could not be different, “but even if there are those who wish to believe such malice, with all detestation,” as the Synod of Orange, “we say anathema to them” [see n. 200].

The difference between the heretical Predestinarian sense of Double predestination and the Catholic sense is that the heretical sense says two things, each erroneous about both the elect and the reprobate-

1.That it is impossible for those who God has willed to save to resist his grace.
2. That God has predestined the sinfulness of the reprobate.

 

[StAugustine]

It’s pretty simple- The elect are those whom God has chosen to grant the grace of justification and final perseverance. They are predestined to this end simply on account of God’s goodness. They retain the capacity to resist the will of God, but in fact will not to the end.

The reprobate are those whom God has not chosen to elect to final perseverance and salvation. On account of their OWN SINFULNESS, God has predestined for them punishments fitting their crimes.

There is no need for God to predestine anyone to sin because Man is such that he cannot NOT sin. He will always sin, and the only thing that belongs to fallen man apart from grace IS sin; even the natural good of the Pagans is Gods gift of restraining their degree of depravity.

 

[Roseeurekacross]

Are you forgetting Catholics don’t live on Sacred Scripture alone, we have Sacred Tradition

 

[Latin]

Are you forgetting Catholics don’t live on Sacred Scripture alone, we have Sacred Tradition

I know Sacred Tradition is important and I know some teachings on Tradition, but the truth is I’m practically a really new Catholic.

Until my 71 years of age I was an Evangelical Christian, then I moved to an area where there is only Catholic Church, so I started RCIA three years ago and now I’m a Catholic.

When I started to study Catholic teachings, in particular Soteriology I realized, Catholic Soteriology is better then the others combined together. – Only my opinion.
Now I thanking God for moved me to an area where is only Catholic Church.

I have to confess, when I read your post 28 Roseeurekacross as follows: (Your conclusion is wrong, why? Because you have done what Catholics do not do.) I thought, wow I’m glad I didn’t born in the middle-ages.

I agree, Catholics do not do what I did (in my above post 27).

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I still thinking about:
Rom.5:18-19; Consequently, just as one trespass resulted in condemnation for all people, so also one righteous act resulted in justification and life for all people.

19 For just as through the disobedience of the one man for many were made sinners, so also through the obedience of the one man for many will be made righteous.
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I still wish to know, in v. 18 “for all” is it an equal number with v. 19 “for many” or v. 19 “for many” is a lesser number then v. 18 “for all”?

What is your opinion on Roseeurekacross, in v. 18 “for all” is it an equal number with v. 19 “for many” or v. 19 “for many” is a lesser number then v. 18 “for all”?

Thank you Roseeurekacross for your answer in advance.
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God bless

 

[Roseeurekacross]

I know Sacred Tradition is important and I know some teachings on Tradition, but the truth is I’m practically a really new Catholic.

Until my 71 years of age I was an Evangelical Christian, then I moved to an area where there is only Catholic Church, so I started RCIA three years ago and now I’m a Catholic.

Congratulations on becoming Catholic. It will take a while for you to get the hang of things. I thought you might be a convert based on how you were using Scripture.

When I said you are doing what Catholics don’t do, its taking Scripture like you are and saying well there you go, here it is.

There are a couple of great books on how to read the Bible, that also cover hermeneutics and exegesis in a user friendly way.

Reading the Bible edited by Maurice Ryan

How to read the Bible for all it’s worth. By Gordon Fee and Douglas Stuart.

What is your opinion on Roseeurekacross, in v. 18 “for all” is it an equal number with v. 19 “for many” or v. 19 “for many” is a lesser number then v. 18 “for all”?

It doesn’t matter what my opinion really is. I go to the Catechism of the Catholic Church and on Papal encyclicals. Someone lots cleverer then me has worked out if it’s all or many , and the Magisterium gets the word out.

http://www.vatican.va/jubilee_2000/magazine/documents/ju_mag_01041998_p-24_en.html

http://www.vatican.va/archive/ccc_css/archive/catechism/p122a4p2.htm

http://www.vatican.va/archive/ccc_css/archive/catechism/p123a12.htm#V

 

[Latin]

Latin:

I know Sacred Tradition is important and I know some teachings on Tradition, but the truth is I’m practically a really new Catholic.

Until my 71 years of age I was an Evangelical Christian, then I moved to an area where there is only Catholic Church, so I started RCIA three years ago and now I’m a Catholic.

Congratulations on becoming Catholic. It will take a while for you to get the hang of things. I thought you might be a convert based on how you were using Scripture.

When I said you are doing what Catholics don’t do, its taking Scripture like you are and saying well there you go, here it is.

There are a couple of great books on how to read the Bible, that also cover hermeneutics and exegesis in a user friendly way.

Reading the Bible edited by Maurice Ryan

How to read the Bible for all it’s worth. By Gordon Fee and Douglas Stuart.

What is your opinion on Roseeurekacross, in v. 18 “for all” is it an equal number with v. 19 “for many” or v. 19 “for many” is a lesser number then v. 18 “for all”?

It doesn’t matter what my opinion really is. I go to the Catechism of the Catholic Church and on Papal encyclicals. Someone lots cleverer then me has worked out if it’s all or many , and the Magisterium gets the word out.

http://www.vatican.va/jubilee_2000/magazine/documents/ju_mag_01041998_p-24_en.html

http://www.vatican.va/archive/ccc_css/archive/catechism/p122a4p2.htm

http://www.vatican.va/archive/ccc_css/archive/catechism/p123a12.htm#V

Thank you Roseeurekacross for your answer.

Now go into the texts and start to study, I love it.

God bless

 

[MT1926]

Our Initial justification is an instant event, entirely the works of God by grace alone.

Yes this is by Grace alone. However, you are skipping over the teaching that…

CCC [2002] God’s free initiative demands man’s free response , for God has created man in his image by conferring on him, along with freedom, the power to know him and love him. The soul only enters freely into the communion of love. God immediately touches and directly moves the heart of man. He has placed in man a longing for truth and goodness that only he can satisfy. The promises of “eternal life” respond, beyond all hope, to this desire:

This is in the section on Grace speaking of how man comes into and stays in Grace with God. It doesn’t just apply to what you call progressive justification. Sure Grace is entirely a work of God, I agree with you on this point, but what you are ignoring is that God demands that we freely accept or reject His free gift of Grace.

COUNCIL OF TRENT Session 6 Chapter 8

… We are therefore said to be justified freely, because that none of those things which PRECEDE justification-whether faith or works -merit the grace itself of justification.

Yes but I think you are bolding the wrong text. The word you need to be honing in on is the word “FREELY”. It doesn’t say anywhere here that it is God’s choice and we have no say in the matter. If God doesn’t give us the choice to accept or reject His free gift of Grace then we aren’t doing it freely.

No elect can reject Initial Justification for many reasons, one is it is an instant event and solely God’s work, furthermore every elect irrevocable saved at their Initial Justification ( DE FIDE ).

Where did you get this from? The Church does not teach this, because the Church does not teach one can know with infallible certainty that they are among the elect.

I think the proper way to state this would be that the elect predestined by God were the ones that He foreknew would not reject His call.

God Bless

 

[MT1926]

MT in your above statement you are overlooking an INFALLIBLE teachings of the Trent and the same FORMAL teachings of the Catholic Church, which is; God’s special grace THE GIFT OF FINAL PERSEVERANCE.

No I am not overlooking this teaching. What I am doing is taking all of Her teachings as a whole and not picking and choosing which ones I will accept and which ones I will ignore.

The same council also teaches…(from this website)

That we can never in this life be certain of our final perseverance is defined by the Council of Trent, Sess. VI, can. xvi: “Si quis magnum illud usque in finem perseverantiae donum se certo habiturum, absoluta et infallibili certitudine dixerit, nisi hoc ex speciali revelatione didicerit, anathema sit”. What places it beyond our meriting power is the obvious fact that revelation nowhere offers final perseverance, with its retinue of efficacious graces and its crown of a good death, as a reward for our actions, but, on the contrary, constantly reminds us that, as the Council of Trent puts it, “the gift of perseverance can come only from Him who has the power to confirm the standing and to raise the fallen”. However, from our incapacity to certainly know and to strictly merit the great gift, we should not infer that nothing can be done towards it. Theologians unite in saying that final perseverance comes under the impetrative power of prayer and St. Liguori (Prayer, the great means of Salvation) would make it the dominant note and burden of our daily petitions. The sometimes distressing presentation of the present matter in the pulpit is due to the many sides of the problem, the impossibility of viewing them all in one sermon, and the idiosyncrasies of the speakers. Nor should the timorousness of the saints, graphically described by Newman, be so construed as to contradict the admonition of the Council of Trent, that “all should place the firmest hope in the succour of God”. Singularly comforting is the teaching of such saints as St. Francis de Sales (Camus, “The Spirit of St. Francis de Sales”, III, xiii) and St. Catherine of Genoa (Treatise of Purgatory, iv). They dwell on God’s great mercy in granting final perseverance, and even in the case of notorious sinners they do not lose hope: God suffuses the sinners’ dying hour with an extraordinary light and, showing them the hideousness of sin contrasting with His own infinite beauty, He makes a final appeal to them. For those only who, even then, obstinately cling to their sin does the saying of Ecclus., v, 7, assume a sombre meaning “mercy and wrath quickly come from him, and his wrath looketh upon sinners”.

God doesn’t have to look to see who will and won’t persevere, another straw man argument. He doesn’t, He always knew if you would reject him before you were born. All moments of time are present to God in the Forever Now.

God Bless

 

[Usagi]

As I understand it (and please feel free to gently correct any inadvertent heresies, as this is a complicated topic on which, AFAIK, the Church has not made a final determination as to which hypothesis on the relationship of God’s will and foreknowledge to our freedom is correct):

Jesus died for all in that the atonement was not limited. There is no human for whom Jesus did not die, that God created entirely for damnation with no desire (even one that He allows to be thwarted by creaturely freedom) that that person be saved.

Jesus died for many in the sense that God has known from all eternity that not all would take advantage of His offered grace, and thus there is a smaller subset of humans than “all” for whom the salvation won by Jesus will actually be effective.

The words of consecration were changed back to “for many” as part of the general attempt to better reflect the Latin in the 2011 revision —but not because “for all” is theologically wrong.

The Catholic Church does teach predestination in some sense, in accordance with Scripture and Tradirion, but is careful not to state that anyone is predestined to damnation. I am not entirely certain how God’s actually choosing (not just foreknowing about) the elect does not mean that everyone not so chosen is effectively predestined to damnation, but I presume that greater minds than mine have worked it out.

 

[Latin]

Latin:

Our Initial justification is an instant event, entirely the works of God by grace alone.

Yes this is by Grace alone. However, you are skipping over the teaching that…

CCC [2002] God’s free initiative demands man’s free response , for God has created man in his image by conferring on him, along with freedom, the power to know him and love him. The soul only enters freely into the communion of love. God immediately touches and directly moves the heart of man. He has placed in man a longing for truth and goodness that only he can satisfy. The promises of “eternal life” respond, beyond all hope, to this desire:

This is in the section on Grace speaking of how man comes into and stays in Grace with God. It doesn’t just apply to what you call progressive justification. Sure Grace is entirely a work of God, I agree with you on this point, but what you are ignoring is that God demands that we freely accept or reject His free gift of Grace.

I SHOW FOR YOU MT THE WAY OUR FREE WILL WORKS.

St. Thomas teaches that all movements of will and choice must be traced to the divine will: and not to any other cause, because Gad alone is the cause of our willing and choosing. CG, 3.91.

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CCC 2022; “The divine initiative in the work of grace PRECEDES, PREPARES, and ELICITS the free response of man. …”
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Because God is the cause of action in every agent, even man’s free will determination to do good comes from God. ST, Pt I, Q 23, Art 5.
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Thomas Aquinas, S. Th.II/II 4, 4 ad 3: God effects everything, the willing and the achievement. …

Phil.2:13; For it is God who works in you both to will and to act in order to fulfil his good purpose.
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Jesus said: … Without Me you can do nothing (John 15:5). .
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God bless

 

[MT1926]

I SHOW FOR YOU MT THE WAY OUR FREE WILL WORKS.

Why are you yelling at me for pointing out what the Catechism says?

CCC 2022; “The divine initiative in the work of grace PRECEDES, PREPARES, and ELICITS the free response of man. …”

and the rest of that brief summary states…Grace responds to the deepest yearnings of human freedom, calls freedom to cooperate with it, and perfects freedom.

We aren’t puppets, we still have the freedom to cooperate with or go against the supernatural push of God’s Grace.

I think the problem you are having is you are skimming what the Catechism teaches, because it seems like you only ever quote from the summery sections of the Catechism. CCC 2022 is from the “In Brief” section of the CCC. The definition of in brief means in a few short words. Basically this section of the Catechism is a highlight but not the in depth teaching needed to fully understand the true meaning.

I don’t think anyone here is arguing that we accept grace on our own will. What we are saying is we agree that God is the cause ( the divine initiative) that pushes us to accept grace. However, we still have free will and can push back. If we do not have the free will to accept or push away God’s Grace than that means He also pushes some away against their will that actually wanted to accept His free gift of Grace.

Nothing you say here is contrary to what I believe. It’s your own added interpretations of what you think these statements mean that push it too far that is contrary to the Catholic Faith.

I’m not really sure why you are so hung up on predestination. Maybe you should try sending an email to Tim Staples or Dr. David Andres or Jimmy Akin and post their responses here for us all to read.

God Bless

 

[Latin]

Latin:

COUNCIL OF TRENT Session 6 Chapter 8

… We are therefore said to be justified freely, because that none of those things which PRECEDE justification-whether faith or works -merit the grace itself of justification.

Yes but I think you are bolding the wrong text. The word you need to be honing in on is the word “FREELY”. It doesn’t say anywhere here that it is God’s choice and we have no say in the matter. If God doesn’t give us the choice to accept or reject His free gift of Grace then we aren’t doing it freely.

I SHOW YOU MT WITH CATHOLIC TEACHINGS THAT IT IS GOD’S CHOICE.

The grace of God’s Justification CCCS 1990-1991; Justification is God’s free gift which detaches man from enslavement to sin and reconciles him to God.

Justification is also our acceptance of God’s righteousness. In this gift, faith, hope, charity, and OBEDIENCE TO GOD’S WILL are given to us.

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The Grace of God’s Call CCCS 1996-1998

Justification comes from grace (God’s free and undeserved help) and is given to us to respond to his call.

This call to eternal life is supernatural, coming TOTALLY from God’s decision and surpassing ALL power of human intellect and will. End quote.
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John 15:16; You did not chose Me, but I chose you.

Acts 13:48; … As many as were ordained to eternal life believed.

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I hope MT now you believe it, it is God’s choice and we FREELY SAY YES to it because in His gift includes faith, hope, charity, and OBEDIENCE TO GOD’S WILL.
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We are not puppets because God enlightens our mind end we freely choose the good.
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God bless