Is Freud's pleasure principle descriptively true?

[JaredR]

Is it true that humans as a default seek pleasure and avoid pain? From my own experience I assume this is true, and I call this descriptive hedonism. Is it true though, or does the Church have an alternate view of natural motivation? Please note that I’m asking about what we do as fallen creatures, not what what we should do as the redeemed.

 

[snarflemike]

Is it true that humans as a default seek pleasure and avoid pain? From my own experience I assume this is true, and I call this descriptive hedonism. Is it true though, or does the Church have an alternate view of natural motivation? Please note that I’m asking about what we do as fallen creatures, not what what we should do as the redeemed.

I think Freud’s view is pretty much a tautology. If I return $100,000 in small bills that I found, because my conscience dictates it, a Freudian could argue that I was seeking the pleasure of doing a good deed, and avoiding the pain that would be inflicted by my conscience otherwise.

 

[meltzerboy]

I think Freud’s view is pretty much a tautology. If I return $100,000 in small bills that I found, because my conscience dictates it, a Freudian could argue that I was seeking the pleasure of doing a good deed, and avoiding the pain that would be inflicted by my conscience otherwise.

Freud believes there is an intrapsychic conflict between the id (pleasure principle) and the superego (morality principle), and the ego (reality principle) attempts to resolve the conflict with the necessary but temporary help of the ego defense mechanisms. Freud’s theories have no basis in the scientific method and are virtually untestable although there have been a few efforts with dubious results.

 

[RPRPsych]

Freud believes there is an intrapsychic conflict between the id (pleasure principle) and the superego (morality principle), and the ego (reality principle) attempts to resolve the conflict with the necessary but temporary help of the ego defense mechanisms. Freud’s theories have no basis in the scientific method and are virtually untestable although there have been a few efforts with dubious results.

Amen!

In fact, one of the main criticisms of Freud’s theories is that - because they can be used to “explain away” any psychological phenomenon - they cannot be falsified. Since one of the key features of a scientific theory is that it can be falsified, Freud’s theories are often relabelled “philosophical” or “metaphysical”, rather than scientific, by contemporary critics.

As for the OP’s question, what Freud did (as he often does) is to bury a sound observation under a monument of theorizing and jargon.

All of us have an instinct of self-preservation, and try to avoid pain unless a greater good (physical, mental or moral) is involved; properly directed, this is the virtue of prudence, and taken to excess, this is cowardice. Similarly, all of us have “appetites” that need to be satisfied - and if we go overboard with them, then the sins of gluttony and lust come into the picture. To reduce this complex set of phenomena - which has biological, social and spiritual dimensions - to a “pleasure principle” is to oversimplify the issue.

 

[FaithInTheSon]

No. I know the answer to this one. It can be merged with religion but it’s more of a proof than a foundation of knowledge. It’s people without faith confirming what people with faith already knew, and they are confirming it in a very primitive way.

 

[Marc_Anthony]

Thomas Aquinas said said something similar thousands of years ago-it’s the basis of natural law theory.

 

[Shlomo]

It is absolutely true as everybody want to arrive to Heaven and not to Hell.

 

[Robert_Sock]

Freud’s notion of the id, ego, and superego is brilliant in my estimation. If you listen inwardly, you should be able to pick-up on each of these.

 

[clem456]

Is it true that humans as a default seek pleasure and avoid pain? From my own experience I assume this is true, and I call this descriptive hedonism. Is it true though, or does the Church have an alternate view of natural motivation? Please note that I’m asking about what we do as fallen creatures, not what what we should do as the redeemed.

I believe we are wired to seek the good, which may be pleasure, may not be, as martyrdon illustrates. In my mind, the trick is to detach from the base sources of pleasure and become attached to the higher sources of Joy and Peace. But yes, we are wired to seek the good (could be pleasure, depending on where you’re at).