G
Ghosty
Guest
MichaelLewis: Well, in technical Thomistic language, rationality is not a property of God or angels because rationality comes from the Latin “to consider”, and God and angels don’t have to “consider” thing in order to know them. Basically, rationality is the process of abstraction, review, and conclusion, and since angels and God would not require either, as everything they know is known immediately (though angels know in time, while God knows eternally), they wouldn’t be considered “rational” in the philosophical sense. In that way, “rational” is actually a limitation on the power of the mind.
With that said, a mind is not necessarily a “thinking” thing, because that would limit the mind to only what certain humans are capable of, but rather the mind is a “knowing” thing. More importantly, the mind is an immaterial “knowing” thing, as opposed to the senses which are material “knowing” things. Thinking seems to be too tightly bound by the concept of rationality to truly apply to angels and God, not because they are “unthinking”, but more accurately because they are beyond thinking.
For example, if you were to play a chess match with an angel, even the lowest, you would invariably lose. They know everything they know immediately, without consideration, so they know all possible moves on the chess board at any given moment, and don’t require any time or focus to do so. It’s simply all there. It’s impossible for material creatures, even the fastest computer, to do that because of the limitations of requiring material consideration. Every time you made a move, the angel would instantly, and without needing to consider, make the perfect counter move.
It’s impossible for us to imagine what it would be like to “think” like an angel, but it’s not impossible for us to imagine that something COULD think like an angel. This is because all it requires is to take what we know about our minds insofar as information is contained in them, and remove the factor of having to consider data. It’s like seeing the whole reel of film laid out in front of you rather than watching it go frame-by-frame.
The reason we’re able to imagine such a mind as the angels’ is because it’s not fundamentally unlike ours, except that ours has an added filter to pass through first, namely material consideration. God’s “mind”, however, is fundamentally impossible for us to understand by our own power, because it’s not merely one grade of inhibition and perfection above ours within the same fundamental category, like the ocean to a rain drop, but rather it functions on an entirely different level.
We can apply “traits” to God by way of Divine revelation and negative consideration, but we can’t really understand what it means to have those “traits” unless God shares them with us to some degree by Grace (which is what Catholics believe occurs to all who are Graced). We know that God is eternal, for example, but what that means is that God is fundamentally outside of time, such that everything we call time is but a single “moment” to God. We can know this through philosophy, but we’ve also received it by Divine revelation through many passages of Scripture and the words of the Prophets. We can’t really comprehend such a thing with our natural powers, but we can speak of it by remotion just as I have, by saying things like “outside” and “time as a single moment”. We can speak of it, and even apply certain logical formulas to it, but it remains fundamentally beyond our grasp, just like the color of an apple to a blind person who knows its red, and that red is the same color as of fire engines and hot coals, but can’t see it.
Unless God gives us His own vision, as those in Heaven receive with the Beatific Vision, it’s impossible for us to truly understand. And even were we to receive such Vision, we would not know it precisely the way God does, because we would know it by sharing, and He knows it by His very essence.
Hope that helps a little bit!
Peace and God bless!
With that said, a mind is not necessarily a “thinking” thing, because that would limit the mind to only what certain humans are capable of, but rather the mind is a “knowing” thing. More importantly, the mind is an immaterial “knowing” thing, as opposed to the senses which are material “knowing” things. Thinking seems to be too tightly bound by the concept of rationality to truly apply to angels and God, not because they are “unthinking”, but more accurately because they are beyond thinking.
For example, if you were to play a chess match with an angel, even the lowest, you would invariably lose. They know everything they know immediately, without consideration, so they know all possible moves on the chess board at any given moment, and don’t require any time or focus to do so. It’s simply all there. It’s impossible for material creatures, even the fastest computer, to do that because of the limitations of requiring material consideration. Every time you made a move, the angel would instantly, and without needing to consider, make the perfect counter move.
It’s impossible for us to imagine what it would be like to “think” like an angel, but it’s not impossible for us to imagine that something COULD think like an angel. This is because all it requires is to take what we know about our minds insofar as information is contained in them, and remove the factor of having to consider data. It’s like seeing the whole reel of film laid out in front of you rather than watching it go frame-by-frame.
The reason we’re able to imagine such a mind as the angels’ is because it’s not fundamentally unlike ours, except that ours has an added filter to pass through first, namely material consideration. God’s “mind”, however, is fundamentally impossible for us to understand by our own power, because it’s not merely one grade of inhibition and perfection above ours within the same fundamental category, like the ocean to a rain drop, but rather it functions on an entirely different level.
We can apply “traits” to God by way of Divine revelation and negative consideration, but we can’t really understand what it means to have those “traits” unless God shares them with us to some degree by Grace (which is what Catholics believe occurs to all who are Graced). We know that God is eternal, for example, but what that means is that God is fundamentally outside of time, such that everything we call time is but a single “moment” to God. We can know this through philosophy, but we’ve also received it by Divine revelation through many passages of Scripture and the words of the Prophets. We can’t really comprehend such a thing with our natural powers, but we can speak of it by remotion just as I have, by saying things like “outside” and “time as a single moment”. We can speak of it, and even apply certain logical formulas to it, but it remains fundamentally beyond our grasp, just like the color of an apple to a blind person who knows its red, and that red is the same color as of fire engines and hot coals, but can’t see it.
Unless God gives us His own vision, as those in Heaven receive with the Beatific Vision, it’s impossible for us to truly understand. And even were we to receive such Vision, we would not know it precisely the way God does, because we would know it by sharing, and He knows it by His very essence.
Hope that helps a little bit!
Peace and God bless!
