Is Heaven Populated Chiefly by the Souls of Embryos?

[jmcrae]

Why does the Catholic Church encourage baptism at the earliest reasonable opportunity?

Because the family should be united in faith, and there is no reason for the youngest members to remain pagans for any longer than necessary.

 

[oneofmany]

The “quack” is:

Pediatrics - Professor
Human Genetics - Adjunct Professor
Obstetrics/Gynecology - Adjunct Professor
Pathology - Adjunct Professor

At the University of Utah

His board certifications are:

American Board of Medical Genetics (Clinical Genetics)
American Board of Pediatrics (Pediatrics)

He was born in Germany, and he received his medical eduction and training in Iowa and Wisconsin.

I hope this satisfies you to substantiate his quackery.

What are your qualifications in this area of expertise?

I’d like to know how he got the percentage? Of course, for those who are practicing artificial BC one could conclude zygotes are lost a lot of times. Many are relieved to know those do not implant. It would depend on how fertile the couple is in the first place to know how many zygotes are “flushed out” and lost.

I still say quack since it seems to be a push to support embryo experiments. Saying millions of potential babies are lost so why worry about the baby until it can survive outside the womb. That seems to me where the info is going. Like the argument, what difference does it make?

 

[epan]

Because the family should be united in faith, and there is no reason for the youngest members to remain pagans for any longer than necessary.

Thanks for the clarification. I thought that it was a sacrament that has something to do with cleansing away the “original sin”. I didn’t know that it is no more than an initiation ritual now.

Has the Church changed its doctrine on this?

 

[jmcrae]

Thanks for the clarification. I thought that it was a sacrament that has something to do with cleansing away the “original sin”. I didn’t know that it is no more than an initiation ritual now.

Has the Church changed its doctrine on this?

It’s both. And we need to be careful not to treat the Sacrament as if it were a protection spell. It cleanses original sin in order to initiate us into the Church. That we also get to go to Heaven is an added bonus, but not the primary purpose, when talking about infants. We aren’t expecting them to die; rather we are expecting them to live the life of faith.

 

[epan]

It’s both. And we need to be careful not to treat the Sacrament as if it were a protection spell. It cleanses original sin in order to initiate us into the Church. That we also get to go to Heaven is an added bonus, but not the primary purpose, when talking about infants. We aren’t expecting them to die; rather we are expecting them to live the life of faith.

Those tiny pagans can be so irksome.

What I am wondering is, what is the significance of “original sin” with respect to salvation? As a child, I was taught that without baptism, damnation was inevitable. Where the good nuns misinformed?

 

[jmcrae]

Those tiny pagans can be so irksome.

What I am wondering is, what is the significance of “original sin” with respect to salvation? As a child, I was taught that without baptism, damnation was inevitable. Where the good nuns misinformed?

Rather than try to give a soundbite answer to such an important question, what I recommend as a starting point would be to read Lumen Gentium. I’m on my phone so I can’t make a double window to copy paste the link, but go to Vatican.va and enter that onto the search window to get to it. It’ll explain the Church’s teachings on this issue.

When explaining to a child we teach more simply than to an adult, so the nuns weren’t wrong but it was an incomplete answer.

 

[thinkandmull]

Pope St. Leo the Great, Letter 16, Oct. 21, 447, #6: “Wherefore, as it is quite clear that these two seasons [Easter and Pentecost] of which we have been speaking are the rightful ones for baptizing the chosen in Church, we admonish you, beloved, not to add other days to this observance. Because, although there are other festivals also to which much reverence is due in God’s honour, yet we must rationally guard this principal and greatest sacrament as a deep mystery and not part of the ordinary routine: not, however, prohibiting the license to succor those who are in danger by administering baptism to them at any time. For while we put off the vows of those who are not pressed by ill health and live in peaceful security to those two closely connected and cognate festivals, we do not at any time refuse this which is the only safeguard of true salvation to anyone in peril of death, in the crisis of a siege, in the distress of persecution, in the terror of shipwreck.”

This is clearly not infallible, and the Church has taught in the Canon Law of 1917, the new CCC, and Vatican II that adults can have baptism of desire. most recently the Holy Office has argued that even infants perhaps can have a baptism of desire applied to them by those who pray for their admittance to the beatific vision

 

[nothingclever]

In a way they’re lucky to grow up free from suffering and this horrible planet, In a way we’re lucky to have the opportunity to carry our cross and follow Jesus. I firmly believe God doesn’t give us ore than we can handle. Perhaps those embryos had such a sensitive soul they needed to grow up directly in the presence of God, I can say the selfish part of me would’ve preferred to grow up in the embrace of our mother. Why not ask them to pray for you so they have an opportunity to take part in your battle? Don’t let there death go to waste. Maybe I’m wrong, but it seems more positive than being sad about it.

 

[nothingclever]

The children king herod (ain’t going to capitalize his name) killed have a feast day, Implying they’re in heaven. Why would God only allow those unbaptized children into heaven? I think God’s more of a spirit of the law, rather than letter of the law kind of guy. Wouldn’t want to worship a lawyer now would we?

 

[ajecphotos]

Blimey people, only God knows where those souls go! Baptised or not, God has a plan for them, i am sure!

 

[savedbygrace71]

I’m definitely confused, because in one of our RCIA classes the priest said the one of the recent Popes said that aborted babies are definitely in heaven. I will have to google to see who said it, in what context. I think that my understanding of original sin was, oddly, somehow in the birth process which sounds a little silly now that I type it. But that it was associated in my mind with Eve/apple/birth pains… right?

 

[on_the_hill]

I’d like to know how he got the percentage?

It’s done through the dark magik called “Statistics.”

Yes, it’s true When medical scientists study women’s reproductive systems they observe all sorts of things. They are able to translate their observations into a strange code of numbers and symbols to make predictions and forecasts.

Sorry to be a snit about it, but it was too much fun to pass up.

Bottom line is: statisticians are able to make extremely accurate predictions for stuff like this.

That’s why a researchers can survey a couple thousand people and get an accurate picture of how millions of people would vote in an election, for example.

 

[Hoosier_Daddy]

I’m definitely confused, because in one of our RCIA classes the priest said the one of the recent Popes said that aborted babies are definitely in heaven. I will have to google to see who said it, in what context. I think that my understanding of original sin was, oddly, somehow in the birth process which sounds a little silly now that I type it. But that it was associated in my mind with Eve/apple/birth pains… right?

I can save you the Google. It never happened.. The CCC explains original sin very well.

 

[oneofmany]

Personally, I think anyone who is killed is given special credit with God. They could do nothing to help themselves get to heaven. It’s not the babies’ fault their mothers choose to kill them.