Is immortality a sin?

  • Thread starter Thread starter sergius89
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
S

sergius89

Guest
Recently in the news there was a story about a futurist convention. At said convention it was stated that at the current rate of scientific progress mankind will be functionally immortal by approximately 2045. This immortality did require the use of robotic avatars to carry our brains once our physical bodies wore out. Is this a sin? I know that the Church promotes human life but this seems to move human life into a new realm. Please let me know what you think.
 
Recently in the news there was a story about a futurist convention. At said convention it was stated that at the current rate of scientific progress mankind will be functionally immortal by approximately 2045. This immortality did require the use of robotic avatars to carry our brains once our physical bodies wore out. Is this a sin? I know that the Church promotes human life but this seems to move human life into a new realm. Please let me know what you think.
First, this is overly optimistic. The brain wears out too. Making cells reproduce without damage will require significant genetic tampering, and we simply don’t know if the resultant cell will function like the unmodified cell. We’re not even close to doing this.

Second, there would be nothing inherently immoral about immortality in and of itself if it occurred naturally. The significant modification of the DNA of the human species by man would be morally questionable.
 
Review the history of futuristic conventions. Whatever they say the future is going to be like, you can pretty much figure it is going to be something else. (Which is nice, because my husband and I wouldn’t look good at all in matching metallic jumpsuits.)
 
Recently in the news there was a story about a futurist convention. At said convention it was stated that at the current rate of scientific progress mankind will be functionally immortal by approximately 2045. This immortality did require the use of robotic avatars to carry our brains once our physical bodies wore out. Is this a sin? I know that the Church promotes human life but this seems to move human life into a new realm. Please let me know what you think.
When I attended a Libertarian convention, one of the attendees was obsessed with technological singularity. He literally wanted to be merged with a computer so he could live forever.

I never understood why someone would want that.
 
I want to be with Jesus! Everyone wants to get to heaven but no one wants to die to get there. No robot for me please.
 
Well, if our body is about to experience physical death and we decide to artificially keep our brain alive, that does not seem to be in conformity with God’s will. We sort of become the arbitrators of life and death, our own gods on this matter. I believe that we did not give life to ourselves, and thus we have no authority over it. As blessed Job said, "The Lord gave, and the Lord hath taken away; blessed be the name of the Lord.”
 
I want to be with Jesus! Everyone wants to get to heaven but no one wants to die to get there. No robot for me please.
The body is holy, an essential part of ourselves, and not to be discarded. While doctors can treat the loss of diseased or damaged portions, I cannot imagine that discarding one’s entire body in favor of a machine would be morally allowed. IOW, I would expect the Church to consider it morally different to transplant parts in than to attempt to transplant the brain out away from the body. The parallel would be comparing the use of external fertility treatments to achieve normal pregnancy vs.* in vitro* fertilization. There is also no reason to believe that the brain is infinitely durable, either, nor that its ability to repair itself would not be destroyed if it were separated from the rest of the body.

Still, if the brain were taken out of the body in order to achieve a surgical repair, with the rest of the body put on life support in the meantime, and the body were to die except for the brain, I would expect it morally acceptable to maintain the brain on life support, since it is morally OK to keep an organ alive after the death of the rest of the body. So what if the brain showed that human awareness can be confined to the brain only? That is by no means whatsoever a certainty (that awareness would not be interrupted or severely altered if the brain were separated from the body), but it is an interesting question.
 
The body is holy, an essential part of ourselves, and not to be discarded. While doctors can treat the loss of diseased or damaged portions, I cannot imagine that discarding one’s entire body in favor of a machine would be morally allowed. IOW, I would expect the Church to consider it morally different to transplant parts in than to attempt to transplant the brain out away from the body. The parallel would be comparing the use of external fertility treatments to achieve normal pregnancy vs.* in vitro* fertilization. There is also no reason to believe that the brain is infinitely durable, either, nor that its ability to repair itself would not be destroyed if it were separated from the rest of the body.

Still, if the brain were taken out of the body in order to achieve a surgical repair, with the rest of the body put on life support in the meantime, and the body were to die except for the brain, I would expect it morally acceptable to maintain the brain on life support, since it is morally OK to keep an organ alive after the death of the rest of the body. So what if the brain showed that human awareness can be confined to the brain only? That is by no means whatsoever a certainty (that awareness would not be interrupted or severely altered if the brain were separated from the body), but it is an interesting question.
An interesting situation you bring up. Could the brain then be transplanted into a person that is brain dead?
 
Review the history of futuristic conventions. Whatever they say the future is going to be like, you can pretty much figure it is going to be something else. (Which is nice, because my husband and I wouldn’t look good at all in matching metallic jumpsuits.)
:rotfl:

At the turn of the century PBS ran some old films from around 1950 “predicting” what life would be like in 2000. One of the things that was amusing was that children would be custom ordered - just put a coin in the machine and a baby comes down the chute! Takes all the fun out of making babies. 😃

And no one - not even sf writers - got it right about computers.
 
Even in Azimov’s Bicentennial Man the robot sought to be human, and he could only achieve this by overcoming his immortality and dying.
 
I don’t know if it is sinful, but there is an error in the way of thinking that death must be avoided, or that staying alive is the greatest good.
 
We’re already immortal, We won’t be un-created so for good or bad (depending on how you fare at the final judgement) we will exist forever with or without our bodies.
 
An interesting situation you bring up. Could the brain then be transplanted into a person that is brain dead?
Oh, wow, that gets totally tangled. If you take Person A’s brain and transplant it into Person B’s body (which, let us hope, would never be available unless Person B had been brain-dead), would the resulting person self-identify with Person A, Person B, or Person C? I would expect they would either feel like a Person C or else feel like Person A but seem like Person B to everyone else.

What kind of legal rights would the resulting person have? What about their spouses and children? Since Person A never became brain-dead, would s/he still own all their previous property? What about Person B’s property? Would they lose their property rights because their brain had died? What about if Person A and Person B both had living spouses? Would the spouse of Person B lose the right to consort? What would the status of either of the marriages be? It’s such an incredible can of worms, even from the prospective of civil law, I can’t even start to imagine it. In the absence of Constitution-level clarification by the legislative bodies, I think it would require the courts to decide if your rights resided in your living brain or in your living body or both or neither. That is a total guess, though. 🤷

In the case of Person B being killed before they were brain dead, wouldn’t the estate of B have right to sue the estate of A for damages? You could actually have two parties inhabiting one body, suing each other at the behest of one or both families.

I hope I never live to see this become a serious question.
 
Given the many different ways one can go about becoming immortal as long as it doesn’t require the deaths of many then I can live with it.

What fictionally makes us mortal as far as we know so far is that something is coded in our genetics to slowly stop the regeneration process of healing at the rates we are used to when young. This is noticeable when your in your 40+ when that cut that normally goes away in a few days now takes a week. Baring the mutation of cancer or accident the body just starts shutting down in an emergency attempt to repair damage however when the entire system is doing this at once there’s nothing left to keep you running.

We call it death.

Now that’s a very over simplification but the idea is the same.

What we need to do to encourage to genetic code to omit or not read the part instructing the body to slow down.

If this was done correctly we should level out in our late 20s and 30s forever.

All this speculation aside if there was a chance at immortality I’ll take it. The world is going to end someday so its not like I can flee death forever. I do not see there being anything morally wrong being immortal.

If God wanted me to die I would. A rock will fall or car will crash or my space suite will fail what have you.

I want to see how time changes all things and i want to see what the would would be like 50 100 1000 years from now.

Provided the end doesn’t come before then but hey curiosity isn’t a sin.👍
 
Oh, wow, that gets totally tangled. If you take Person A’s brain and transplant it into Person B’s body (which, let us hope, would never be available unless Person B had been brain-dead), would the resulting person self-identify with Person A, Person B, or Person C? I would expect they would either feel like a Person C or else feel like Person A but seem like Person B to everyone else.

What kind of legal rights would the resulting person have? What about their spouses and children? Since Person A never became brain-dead, would s/he still own all their previous property? What about Person B’s property? Would they lose their property rights because their brain had died? What about if Person A and Person B both had living spouses? Would the spouse of Person B lose the right to consort? What would the status of either of the marriages be? It’s such an incredible can of worms, even from the prospective of civil law, I can’t even start to imagine it. In the absence of Constitution-level clarification by the legislative bodies, I think it would require the courts to decide if your rights resided in your living brain or in your living body or both or neither. That is a total guess, though. 🤷

In the case of Person B being killed before they were brain dead, wouldn’t the estate of B have right to sue the estate of A for damages? You could actually have two parties inhabiting one body, suing each other at the behest of one or both families.

I hope I never live to see this become a serious question.
Either way, it might be interesting to explore in a SF novel
 
Baring the mutation of cancer or accident the body just starts shutting down in an emergency attempt to repair damage however when the entire system is doing this at once there’s nothing left to keep you running.
Interestingly enough, in order to be physically immortal, our normal cells would have to take on some of the characteristics of cancer cells.
 
Either way, it might be interesting to explore in a SF novel
One of my all-time favorite books, Altered Carbon, is set in a world where an individual’s conscience is stored in a digital device inside their body, and can be transferred to a different body (or sleeve) as easy as copying files between a computer.

Interestingly enough, the main plot revolves around the murder of a Catholic - the Catholics of the future are opposed to the digital rendering and reanimation of the “soul”.

Fair warning - it’s a dark book with adult themes.
 
Even in Azimov’s Bicentennial Man the robot sought to be human, and he could only achieve this by overcoming his immortality and dying.
I am of the opinion that the robot may have been mistaken in his goal. We always assume that human morality is the best morality and that any other being in the universe must obviously be striving to emulate said morality. If robots do one day evolve into conscious beings who is to say that they she act like humans. The would be an entirely new race with a completely new set of issues to deal with. It is the hubris of man that says all beings want to be like me.
 
I am of the opinion that the robot may have been mistaken in his goal. We always assume that human morality is the best morality and that any other being in the universe must obviously be striving to emulate said morality. If robots do one day evolve into conscious beings who is to say that they she act like humans. The would be an entirely new race with a completely new set of issues to deal with. It is the hubris of man that says all beings want to be like me.
The robot, named Andrew, wanted to be like his human “family.” He even went to court to ask to be declared human. The judgement was that in order to be human, he had to be mortal.

It is much more a story about how humans treat other humans and other species, than it was about a merely self-aware robot.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top