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MaggieOH
Guest
Mohammed was a terrorist. He encouraged terrorism.
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MaggieOH
Guest
After a conversation that I had with a Coptic husband and wife I decided to look up information on how they are treated in Egypt. I was shocked by what I discovered. I have no doubt that what you say is true about who the murderers of that family might be.
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Catholic29
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Here is what the Coptic Christians are facing in Egypt in regard to discrimination copts.net/detail.asp?id=580
For sure Islam has a strange sense of social justice, or lack there of, whether their Allah is represented by a person of our Trinity or not. That Islam worships the same God as Jews and Christians is a hard pill for me to swallow.
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Franze
Guest
It isn´t a peaceful religion, in my country there were 192 deaths in the name of islam, and none sunni cleric has said, they weren´t muslims, they were kaffirs, no, anyone, they were muslims.
But like in Europe none matters religion, the islamic virus is spreading, it´s time for converting europeans because it´s the unique way to converting muslims, neither war nor anything, only if we love so much our religion like they love theirs. Greetings
But like in Europe none matters religion, the islamic virus is spreading, it´s time for converting europeans because it´s the unique way to converting muslims, neither war nor anything, only if we love so much our religion like they love theirs. Greetings
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A.Pelliccio
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NOPE
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Tlaloc
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Witness christians who kill abortion doctors. You can always find a lunatic fringe among a sizable population.
Big words considering the US spends so much on warfare and so little on humanitarian aide. We spend almost half of the total *world *expenditure on armaments. Yet our humanitarian giving is on the order of a percent of GNP.
Both religions (and Judaism too) have fanatics willing to kill in the name of a peaceful religion. Take a look at my “Christian and Pro-war” thread to see the rationalizations people use why Jesus is cool when they kill someone.
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abcdefg
Guest
not that hard to swallow, they simply didn’t get the nature of God right.
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Jermosh
Guest
This is not true. You need to give some level of facts to make that statement true. Plus please keep in mind terrorism is a farely new concept to the world. It was really only invented about 100 years ago in russia.
Islamic hunns of the crusade days were not terrorizing anybody, they would just desimate the whole town or nation that got in there way. That is not terrorism.
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Franze
Guest
In the XVII century many muslims ships were in England, Ireland and the Netherlands and many european were sold, 300 years ago, children, women and men are being fatted for being sold in Alger like onions, when they went in the european town, wasn´t it terror? I think so, when In Italy a turkish garrison invaded an italian town and slavised all the town´s people, or the sclavised serbs being converted to muslims and prepared like jenizars. But this wasn´t terrorism, was kisses, and wasn´t made in the name of Islam, the sultan wasn´t a religious figure( I have said all of this ironiccally).
Now In Sudan, Tanzania and other places muslims sell people and there weren´t islamic anti-sclavists-organisation becaus this religion allows it.
Now In Sudan, Tanzania and other places muslims sell people and there weren´t islamic anti-sclavists-organisation becaus this religion allows it.
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Jermosh
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Catholic church allowed slaves until a few centurys ago as well. It condemed certain aspects but it never outlawed it till late 18th century.
When the Americas were being explored, indians were forced to become christians under the threat of death as well.
Any no that is not a case of terrorism. Terrorism is a specific fighting technique that is new to the world, it was invented in russia about 100 yrs ago as a way of displaceing Czar rule.
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MaggieOH
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Terrorism is not a fairly new concept. It is as old as Adam and Eve. Terrorism in the form of wars has always been with us. The Assyrians were terrorists when Sennacharib went from country to country causing devastation amongst the people that were taken captive. Pharoah, that is the one who opposed Moses was a terrorist too, because he treated the people with cruelty.
The difference between these ancient terrorists and modern terrorists is the methods that they employ.
Now that takes me to Mohammed and the terrorism that he employed to ensure that the people converted to his “religion”. This is from the Koran:
“God has promised you many spoils to take…”
“The likeness of those who have been loaded with the Torah, then they have not carried it, is as the likeness of an *** carrying books… You of Jewry, if you assert that you are the friends of God apart from other men, then do you long for death, if you speak truly… Surely death from which you flee shall encounter you; …”
These are the veiled comments that one finds in the Koran.
Mohammed ruled by the sword, and anyone who would not converted was murdered.
Jerusalem was sacked by Mohammed and his followers and they killed thousands of Jews, and it was only then that the Crusaders came to take back the Holy Land so that it was not descrated.
No Islam is not a peaceful religion and its history of a reign of terror in Europe belies any attempt to claim that it is peaceful.
Maggie
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SPH1
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There is an article here at Catholic Answers, “Endless Jihad”. I discovered it last night. Pretty good read.
catholic.com/library/endless_jihad.asp
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catholic.com/library/endless_jihad.asp
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Jermosh
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No your still not getting it, those are not definitions of terrorism. Please look Here it gives a history and definiton of what terrorism is.
The Bible is just as explicit in terms of violence as well when taken out of context. But I think you know this already, again its context.
Jeruslem was not sacked it was taken over. There is a differance, and it is no more differant then when Christians took over Spain from peacefull Moors.
That said you need to also bring in culture. Some Islamic cultures are very peaceful, and history shows there were even attacked by islamic Hunns.
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RPC717
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I only know a little about Islam as a religion, and less about its sects, but it seems to me that most of the time when you hear about violence incited by muslims, it is “Islamic fundamentalists” (sound familiar?). I would think that these are the same as Christian fundamentalists - self-interpreters of scripture who read what they want to read, believe what they want to believe and then find scripture to back it up. There are probably orthodox muslims who follow the faith as originally intended (scripture + Tradition) who don’t get in as much trouble and therefore don’t get as much press. Surely they are persecuted by the fundamentalists (sound familiar?) just as much as the rest of the enemies of Islam, i.e. everyone in the world who isn’t muslim.
I’ve heard that Islam is sweeping through Europe. A few years ago you never heard about muslims in Spain, France, or Italy, but these days they make the news. How this anti-Chrisitian message is gaining such popularity when the saving gospel of Jesus Christ is so clear and so fulfilling is a mystery to me.
BTW, the word terrorism may only be a couple of hundred years old, but the practice is timeless.
I’ve heard that Islam is sweeping through Europe. A few years ago you never heard about muslims in Spain, France, or Italy, but these days they make the news. How this anti-Chrisitian message is gaining such popularity when the saving gospel of Jesus Christ is so clear and so fulfilling is a mystery to me.
BTW, the word terrorism may only be a couple of hundred years old, but the practice is timeless.
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Cubsfan
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First, the Koran is not an inspired document it is a compilation of various sermons from Mahound (This is how G.K. Chesteron refers to Mahommed in his Poem “Lepanto”) if you try to read the Koran it is akin to reading stereo instructions; ther is no historical flow it is all over the place. Later some of the works and legends were modified by his followers after his death to provide an answer to Christianity. The night flight to Jerusalem is an exampel of this, there is no record that Mahound ever went to Jerusalem and he never was atop the temple mount, however, this story allows the Moslem the ability to stake their claim on Jerusalem.
Second, the history of Islam starting with Mahound was one of war and conquest. It has remand so all these many centuries.
That said…blasting moslems with the truth is not the way to convert them just make them harder to eventually try and convert. We have to make the truth evident through faith, and prayer. By the way this in no way does not mean that we are not to defend ourselves from terrorists.
Second, the history of Islam starting with Mahound was one of war and conquest. It has remand so all these many centuries.
That said…blasting moslems with the truth is not the way to convert them just make them harder to eventually try and convert. We have to make the truth evident through faith, and prayer. By the way this in no way does not mean that we are not to defend ourselves from terrorists.
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nicole_german
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Uranage
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No.
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daisydots
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Islamic hunns of the crusade days were not terrorizing anybody, they would just desimate the whole town or nation that got in there way. That is not terrorism.
Have I understood you correctly? Are you saying that to decimate a town/nation is not terrorism??? The people of Italy lived for centuries in terror of the waves of Saracens (their name for Muslims) who would periodically come over from North Africa!
North Africa was once Catholic, and its peoples were gradually islamicised through terror: that is, a) they converted because threatened with death by invading Arab armies unless they converted or b) those who refused conversion were killed and their children taken on as slaves or **c) **they fled to other countries in order to save themselves and their Faith or **d) **they converted through despair under the more “moderate” invaders, who allowed them to practice Christianity so long as new churches were not built and existing churches could not be repaired, and they were not able to obtain work other than menial jobs, (except with rare exceptions; I have read that Suleman the Great employed a few Christians in responsible positions). Today, in Turkey, the old psychological torture of not allowing new churches to be built nor existing ones repaired continues, and in Saudi Arabia no churches have been built since Islam arrived there.
I have read more than once that converted Muslims say the original Arabic is more explicitly violent towards non-Muslims and that scholars deliberately change the meanings in order to deceive others - though the scholars do not see their actions as deception, but self-defense, for the Koran clearly states that Muslims do not lie when they “lie” to a non-Muslim for no sin has been committed. When I read this phrase with my own eyes, I realised I could never fully trust a muslim, never, not even one who seemed to be good. When, from the mouth of the second in command of the UN on the TV, I heard of the scandalously low sums of money offered by the muslim nations to the peoples devastated by the tsunami, I was not surprised.
I lived in Saudi for eleven years, I have read the Koran and books that try to explain Islam from many points of view. As far as I am concerned, if a religion is from God, it will consistently teach brotherly love, charity, etc., etc. The Koran is not consistent. Muslims will permit a Christian to criticise the Koran, supposedly God’s Word, but will kill the same Christian for criticising Mohammed, a mere man! Is that consistency? Why would God have sent the Angel Gabriel to Mary to announce the birth of the Messiah through her, and then send the same angel to Mohammed 700 years later with a totally different version of Christ’s life? More inconsistency.
If the Koran is the third and last testament, as Muslims insist, it ought to quote the Old and New Testaments just as they are, but it changes them completely in the few passages where they are mentioned. In so doing, does it not therefore imply that the previous books are untrue? Hardly a peace-bearing attitude.
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BulldogCath
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They dont recognize our Lord as savior and messiah…so why are we even discussing them on Catholic forum? Let them do their own thing and so be it. Vatican II asks for us to find some beauty in Islam, I wonder if that was some Moslem cleric who wrote that, as it was an ecumenical council and maybe the Cardinals wanted to make nice at the time with them in the 60’s, but I cant see them as peaceful, as it was the Moslems who CAUSED the crusades, but we are taught as Catholics to always reach out and Love our neighbor, and that is all nice.
But, it must and should be said, that the Moslems have a very good reason for hating the West and our undying support of Israel. Here we are a country that is at war for terrorism, and we support Israel, who after WWII with the flag of Zionism, were terrorists themselves, killing and bombing the British and Palestinians, and then, with American , British and French support, allowed them to throw out the Palestinians off the land they held since the year 70AD. How can you not expect them to be hateful? And for what reason, to support Israel where the Christian population has dwindled and where radical Orthodox jews call for the death of all non-Jews?
But, it must and should be said, that the Moslems have a very good reason for hating the West and our undying support of Israel. Here we are a country that is at war for terrorism, and we support Israel, who after WWII with the flag of Zionism, were terrorists themselves, killing and bombing the British and Palestinians, and then, with American , British and French support, allowed them to throw out the Palestinians off the land they held since the year 70AD. How can you not expect them to be hateful? And for what reason, to support Israel where the Christian population has dwindled and where radical Orthodox jews call for the death of all non-Jews?
JesseJr said:
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Jermosh
Guest
Yes you did hear me correctly. Terrorism is the act of changing political governing agendas by sending indiscriminate small attacks on a small amount civilians with little technoligy or effort and is run by political activist civilian group. Desimating a town is a act of war, it envolves a army of some sort.
Your 2nd example can be reversed to what Christians did to the new world, or even europe. Millions were killed by Christian groups trying to get gold for “God and State”. Mind explaining the differance?
Yes you will never find a shread of peaceful islam in the middle east. Go to Morroco, Turkey, Indonesia and you will.
Your 2nd example can be reversed to what Christians did to the new world, or even europe. Millions were killed by Christian groups trying to get gold for “God and State”. Mind explaining the differance?
Yes you will never find a shread of peaceful islam in the middle east. Go to Morroco, Turkey, Indonesia and you will.
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