Is Islam really monotheistic?

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cestusdei:
. There is a subtle racism in Islam
Dear cestusdei:

Is that’s the reason, Honorable Malcolm X left his Christianity and embraced Islam ?

Please re-read the following testimony of Hon. Malcolm X (from Letter from Mecca, April, 1964):

America needs to understand Islam, because this is the one religion that erases from its society the race problem. Throughout my travels in the Muslim world, I have met, talked to, and even eaten with people who in America would have been considered ‘white’–but the ‘white’ attitude was removed from their minds by the religion of Islam. I have never before seen sincere and true brotherhood practiced by all colors together, irrespective of their color.

You may be shocked by these words coming from me. But on this pilgrimage, what I have seen, and experienced, has forced me to re-arrange much of my thought-patterns previously held, and to toss aside some of my previous conclusions. This was not too difficult for me. Despite my firm convictions, I have always been a man who tries to face facts, and to accept the reality of life as new experience and new knowledge unfolds it. I have always kept an open mind, which is necessary to the flexibility that must go hand in hand with every form of intelligent search for truth.

During the past eleven days here in the Muslim world, I have eaten from the same plate, drunk from the same glass, and slept in the same bed (or on the same rug)–while praying to the same God–with fellow Muslims, whose eyes were the bluest of blue, whose hair was the blondest of blond, and whose skin was the whitest of white. And in the words and in the actions in the deeds of the ‘white’ Muslims, I felt the same sincerity that I felt among the black African Muslims of Nigeria, Sudan, and Ghana.

We were truly all the same (brothers)–because their belief in one God had removed the white from their minds, the white from their behavior, and the white from their attitude.

I could see from this, that perhaps if white Americans could accept the Oneness of God, then perhaps, too, they could accept in reality the Oneness of Man–and cease to measure, and hinder, and harm others in terms of their ‘differences’ in color.

With racism plaguing America like an incurable cancer, the so-called ‘Christian’ white American heart should be more receptive to a proven solution to such a destructive problem. Perhaps it could be in time to save America from imminent disaster–the same destruction brought upon Germany by racism that eventually destroyed the Germans themselves.

For full testimony:

malcolm-x.org/docs/let_mecca.htm
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Faith101:
We do not worship the Kaaba. We are commanded by ALLAH, to pray in the *direction *of the Kaaba, as a unifying point…so all 1 billion + of us are not praying in different directions.

As Muslims we believe among the most rightly guided people are the ones who learned directly from the Prophet, which are the prophet’s companions. So what did they think about the “rock”

Umar ibn alkhattab said “I know that you are a stone and can neither benefit nor harm. Had I not seen the Prophet (pbuh) touching (and kissing) you, I would never have touched (and kissed) you”.
Why did Muhammad pray towards Jerusalem for the first 5 years of his prophethood, and later redirect his prays towards Mecca? And did Jesus pray towards Mecca or Jerusalem 5 times a day?
 
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inJESUS:
so because he is the “last prophet”, allah grants him money, women , more importance and a whole soura called “mohammad”…mmmm seems like allah thinks in human terms…but Jesus who is born miraculously, who did miracles, who is called “God’s spirit” and “God’s word”, who is not dead and who will come back again had neither money nor women nor a title like i believe in God and Jesus is His prophet…mmmm sounds a very inconsistent deity and very discrimitating…will God fall to the level of granting women as “privileges” on earth and virgins in heaven? a person who gives women to men as “privileges” has a well-known adjective and by no means respects women but considers them as “reward”. Indeed, this is the projection of a sinful mind.
there are entire Suras dedicated to Maryam, Jona, Joseph, Abrahm (pbut) as well… how old are you?
 
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Muslim:
there are entire Suras dedicated to Maryam, Jona, Joseph, Abrahm (pbut) as well… how old are you?
did they all have the privileges of mohammad? you were the one who gave importance to mohamad being the “last prophet”…did these people as well get the privileges mohammad took? lets see the verse when allah gave women as privilege “ony” to mohammad and not to the other believers…did this apply to all prophets or only to mohammad?
 
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inJESUS:
did they all have the privileges of mohammad? you were the one who gave importance to mohamad being the “last prophet”…did these people as well get the privileges mohammad took? lets see the verse when allah gave women as privilege “ony” to mohammad and not to the other believers…did this apply to all prophets or only to mohammad?
what the hell are you talking about? and how old are you?
 
freedomm said:
With racism plaguing America like an incurable cancer, the so-called ‘Christian’ white American heart should be more receptive to a proven solution to such a destructive problem
. Perhaps it could be in time to save America from imminent disaster–the same destruction brought upon Germany by racism that eventually destroyed the Germans themselves.[/INDENT]

For full testimony:

malcolm-x.org/docs/let_mecca.htm
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so this guy converted as a reaction to white american racism? where does he find this in the Bible? does he follow God or people? if this is the reason, then he is as shallow as could be…if for any other reasons then it’s up to him.
 
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Muslim:
what the hell are you talking about? and how old are you?
am talking about this :

O Prophet! We have made lawful to thee thy wives to whom thou hast paid their dowers; and those whom thy right hand possesses out of the captives of war whom Allah has assigned to thee; and daughters of thy paternal uncles and aunts, and daughters of thy maternal uncles and aunts, who migrated (from Makkah) with thee; and any believing woman who gives herself to the Prophet if the Prophet wishes to wed her;- **this only for thee, and not for the Believers (at large); ** We know what We have appointed for them as to their wives and the captives whom their right hands possess;- in order that there should be no difficulty for thee. And Allah is Oft-Forgiving, Most Merciful. Thou mayest defer (the turn of) any of them that thou pleasest, and thou mayest receive any thou pleasest: and there is no blame on thee if thou invite one whose (turn) thou hadst set aside. This were nigher to the cooling of their eyes, the prevention of their grief, and their satisfaction - that of all of them - with that which thou hast to give them: and Allah knows (all) that is in your hearts: and Allah is All- Knowing, Most Forbearing. It is not lawful for thee (to marry more) women after this, nor to change them for (other) wives, even though their beauty attract thee, except any thy right hand should possess (as handmaidens): and Allah doth watch over all things.

Narrated Qatada:
Anas bin Malik said, “The Prophet used to visit all his wives in a round, during the day and night and they were ELEVEN IN NUMBER.” I asked Anas, “Had the Prophet the strength for it?” Anas replied, “We used to say that the Prophet was given the strength of thirty (men).” And Sa’id said on the authority of Qatada that Anas had told him about nine wives only (not eleven). (Sahih al-Bukhari)

Against this to normal muslims:
If ye fear that ye shall not be able to deal justly with the orphans, marry women of your choice, two or three or four; but if ye fear that ye shall not be able to deal justly (with them), then only one, or (a captive) that your right hands possess, that will be more suitable, to prevent you from doing injustice.

On the other hand, mohammed had much more than 4 wives and could marry anyone he wanted since it was an honor for a woman to be his wife. lets see the situation when mohammed went to see Zeid and he was not home but his wife was there and appeared at the door in a light garment …mohammed was overwehlmed by her beauty and exclaimed, “praise be Allah who changeth the hearts of men!” …Zainab heard these words, told her husband who came to divorce her so that mohammed could marry her…t he possibility of scandal arose in the situation but mohammed had a revelation from allah condoning his action. Sura 33:37: “When thou saidst to him whom God had blessed and thou hadst favoured, ‘Keep thy wife to thyself, and fear God’ and thou wast concealing within thyself what God should reveal, fearing other men; and God has better right for thee to fear Him. So when Zaid had accomplished what he would of her, then We gave her in marriage to thee, so that there should not be any fault in the believers, touching the wives of their adopted sons, when they have accomplished what they would of them, and God’s commandment must be performed.” The response of Aisha was “Truly thy Lord makes haste to do thy pleasure”.

Am old enough to diffirenciate between the Holiness of God and the projection of a sinful mind.

No one of older prophets had these privileges…and polygamy is a sin…Solomon was punished for having mutiple wives …
 
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Muslim:
what the hell are you talking about? and how old are you?
Why are you interested in a member’s age? What’s that got to do with the explanation. Please just address the post and leave the person alone.
 
In the Old Testament:
Isaac Had Only One Wife
JACOB: One Wife After Conversion
David REPENTED of Polygamy

Abraham had one ne wife, Sarah.

Adam and Eve:
God created Adam, and provided for him a single wife. He did not provide multiple wives for him, nor do we have any evidence that Adam ever had another wife. This original marriage relationship powerfully exposes God’s intent for mankind’s marriage relationships.

Noah:
Called a “preacher of righteousness” [2 Peter 2:5], Noah was the only family head who was spared during the destruction of the Great Flood. He had but one wife.

Job:
Though Job was very rich and considered “the greatest man among all the people of the East”, he had only one wife.

Isaac:
The child of the promise had but one wife, Rebekah.

Moses:
Of all the Old Testament saints, Moses was the closest to God. He spoke to God face to face as a man speaks with his friend [Exodus 33:11]. Moses is also regarded as the greatest of the Old Testament prophets. God Himself even singled out Moses as a special prophet since He spoke to him face to face rather than revealing Himself in visions [Numbers 12:6-8]
Moses had only one wife, Zipporah [Exodus 2:21]

Joseph and Mary:
The Lord’s earthly parents are a prime example of a monogamous relationship.

Scriptural monogamy:
"Each man should have his own wife (singular word), and each woman her own husband (singular word). *

"When thou art come unto the land which the Eternal thy God giveth thee, and shalt possess it, and shalt dwell therein, and shalt say, I will set a king over me, like as all the nations that are about me. . . . Neither shall he multiply wives to himself, that his heart turn not away"

But mohammad had 9 as a reward and what your hand possesses??*
 
i have a question that hasn’t been answered already : what is meant by quran written on a tablet in heaven ?
 
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inJESUS:
i have a question that hasn’t been answered already : what is meant by quran written on a tablet in heaven ?
A big tablet?
 
I can’t believe that this thread even exists.

Seeing Catholics accuse Muslims of not being monotheistic is one of the most ludicrous sights I’ve yet seen on the Internet.

Note: this is not an attack on Catholicism. I approve of the cult of the saints in Catholicism. But it’s at least as problematic for claims of monotheism as anything in Islam.

Personally, I don’t see what’s the point in arguing over who is “monotheistic.” My faith is not in monotheism, but in the one living God–Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. Muslims and Jews think this is not monotheistic. Why should I argue?

If cestusdei’s point was simply that Islam also contains things that could be seen to nuance monotheism–in other words, that pure monotheism really doesn’t exist in any religion–then I think that’s a worthwhile argument. Otherwise this entire thread is a complete waste of time.

Edwin
 
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inJESUS:
so this guy converted as a reaction to white american racism? where does he find this in the Bible? does he follow God or people? if this is the reason, then he is as shallow as could be…if for any other reasons then it’s up to him.
Dear inJESUS;

People of different faith find the Truth of Islam from different channels, reasons, sources and ways. Sometimes the cruelty such as what Serbs did to Bosnians, makes Muslims grow more than ever in their faith and it increases the passion and curiousity to know Islam in sincere truth seeking non-Muslims.

In the case of Malacolm X, it was worst kind of slavery, practiced in white Christian America, for centuries up until 1960s. Though still there are traces of it and it is not compeletely ended/eradicated in White America and White Europe.

Are you denying that there was no slavery in America? Are you also denying that there were/are no seperate White Churches and Black Churches for White Christians and Black Christians?
 
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Contarini:
I can’t believe that this thread even exists.

Seeing Catholics accuse Muslims of not being monotheistic is one of the most ludicrous sights I’ve yet seen on the Internet.
Dear Contarini:

Because most Catholic participants of this thread who think that Islam is not a monotheistic religion, are not really aware of their own Catholic Church’s stance towards Islam, let alone Islamic pure Monotheism. Thus these Catholic participants of this thread, are making fool out of themselves and allowing knowledgeable people to laugh at their evident ignorance.

At least they should see what their own Father Sidney Griffith has to say, in this regard when he was asked:

Q: **What do you think attracts Western converts to Islam? **

Father Sidney Griffith: There are many factors involved in the attraction of Islam to religious seekers in the West.

Positively, Islam is a compelling, reasonable, uncompromising monotheism with a biblical flavor. It provides a compelling moral code, which many moderns and postmoderns view as both realistic and honorable. The Koran’s prophetology provides a congenial estimation of what it perceives to be the positive factors in earlier revelations, along with reasons why earlier peoples failed to heed them faithfully.

Islamic history and tradition in various times and places have produced societies with many admirable intellectual and scientific accomplishments. Many Westerners find Islamic mysticism attractive; others see in Islam an effective religious answer to what they view as the ills of the modern Western world.

On the negative side, many Christians who are attracted to Islam lack an adequate understanding of the history and teachings of the Church, and are easily deceived by the many hostile attacks on the Church’s doctrines, practices and historical record.

They are unaware of the Church’s answers to Islam’s critique of Christianity. The shortcomings and moral failures they perceive in Christian communities sometimes dismay them. Often they are unaware of comparable problems in other communities of faith, including the Muslims.

The prevalent materialism and secularism of Western society has in many instances convinced potential converts to Islam that only in Islam can they find an effective antidote to it.

Sometimes potential converts to Islam are overcome in their own efforts faithfully to live the Christian life and, failing to find effective pastoral care from fellow Christians, or failing to follow it, they receive moral guidance and support from pious, observant Muslims.​

[A Look Inside the Koran and the Bible (Part 2) - Featured Today - Catholic Online]](http://www.catholic.org/featured/headline.php?ID=1189])​
 
Freedom,

That being said, I think the valid point here is that all monotheistic religions nuance their monotheism in some way. The “pure monotheism” of Islam does have room for a lot of stuff one might not think.

Of course the Wahhabi movement has reduced many of these elements. A good case can be made that historically Sufism, with its saint cults etc., is the mainstream form of Islam. Much of what passes for orthodox Islam today seems to derive from the equivalent of Protestant fundamentalism–a purist attempt to get back to an “original” Islam (I’m not just talking about the militants who are often referred to as “Islamic fundamentalists”).

I’m just beginning to learn about a lot of this stuff, so I may be getting a great deal wrong and welcome correction. But increasingly this is how it looks to me. (Much the same is true of Judaism–Kabbalah is not some exotic, marginal form of Judaism, but for centuries was an intrinsic part of Orthodox Judaism. And Kabbalah has some really interesting riffs on monotheism–it’s not pure monotheism at all.)

More and more, I tend to think that “uncompromising monotheism” is rare or nonexistent. And when it does exist, I think it’s false and destructive. There is one God. But this statement is not as simple as it sounds, and mainstream traditions of all the great monotheistic religions bear witness to this.

Edwin
 
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freedomm:
Dear inJESUS;

People of different faith find the Truth of Islam from different channels, reasons, sources and ways. Sometimes the cruelty such as what Serbs did to Bosnians, makes Muslims grow more than ever in their faith and it increases the passion and curiousity to know Islam in sincere truth seeking non-Muslims.

In the case of Malacolm X, it was worst kind of slavery, practiced in white Christian America, for centuries up until 1960s. Though still there are traces of it and it is not compeletely ended/eradicated in White America and White Europe.

Are you denying that there was no slavery in America? Are you also denying that there were/are no seperate White Churches and Black Churches for White Christians and Black Christians?
so the guy converted because of slavery…thx
 
Will anyone explain what is meant by : the quran was written on a tablet in heaven??
 
freed,
Malcom X himself evidenced reverse racism for much of his life. In Saudi Arabia those with dark skin are the descendents of slaves. They were freed about 50 years ago. They live in poverty to this day. In Sudan the black people tend to be Christian and are persecuted by the northern Arab tribes who are…Muslim.

contrari,
Part of the point of the thread was to make muslims think a bit. Also to point out what’s its like when we get accused of not being monotheists due to the Trinity. I thought they would enjoy being on the other side for once. They don’t seem to like it. Wonder of wonders. Of course in their countries I would already be dead for even asking the question.
 
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inJESUS:
Will anyone explain what is meant by : the quran was written on a tablet in heaven??
i dont know i cant find more info on it… where did you find out about this info?
 
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