Is it a sin or sinful to smoke marijuana?

[krispy]

I have to admit that I have not heard of the condition of scrupulosity, and as I inferred in my post I cannot think of any reasonable scenario where this situation might apply, so perhaps that is a rather more esoteric area, the discussion of which is more academic and less likely to be of relevance to modern life than that of the original scenario.

However, whilst broadly agreeing with your interpretation of the difference between objective evil and subjective sin, it prompts me to ask how much authority you recognise the church has when it pronounces on the evil or otherwise of a particular act or belief. In clear cut cases of wrongdoing, such as murder, theft, dishonesty etc. I think very few people would have a problem with the Church’s view of such matters as evil. However, bear in mind that the Church, through the person of the Pope, only claims infallibility in a very few narrowly defined issues and as far as I know has not made any infallible pronouncement on, say, artificial contraception. So the validity of the Church’s pronouncement of something as intrinsically evil is not normally impacted by any consideration of papal infallibility, whether one accepts that concept or not. Therefore it is entirely possible that the Church’s condemnation as evil of something less clear cut than say theft or dishonesty is misguided. So, because the Church condemns something such as artificial contraception as intrinsically wrong, doesn’t necessarily mean it is wrong, which is where it is necessary to inform and exercise one’s conscience.

 

[krispy]

I have to admit that I have not heard of the condition of scrupulosity, and as I inferred in my post I cannot think of any reasonable scenario where this situation might apply, so perhaps that is a rather more esoteric area, the discussion of which is more academic and less likely to be of relevance to modern life than that of the original scenario.

However, whilst broadly agreeing with your interpretation of the difference between objective evil and subjective sin, it prompts me to ask how much authority you recognise the church has when it pronounces on the evil or otherwise of a particular act or belief. In clear cut cases of wrongdoing, such as murder, theft, dishonesty etc. I think very few people would have a problem with the Church’s view of such matters as evil. However, bear in mind that the Church, through the person of the Pope, only claims infallibility in a very few narrowly defined issues and as far as I know has not made any infallible pronouncement on, say, artificial contraception. So the validity of the Church’s pronouncement of something as intrinsically evil is not impacted by any consideration of papal infallibility, whether one accepts that concept or not. Therefore it is entirely possible that the Church’s condemnation as evil of something less clear cut than say theft or dishonesty is misguided. So, because the Church condemns something such as artificial contraception as intrinsically wrong, doesn’t necessarily mean it is wrong, which is where it is necessary to inform and exercise one’s conscience.

 

[Madolaina]

Well, since I don’t believe it’s wrong to murder someone and take all of their money, can I come over?

Since it’s not a sin (since I don’t believe it’s wrong), God has no problem with it by your logic.

Specious argument…10 commandments…trump …

 

[Madolaina]

I AGREE

I DO NOT AGREE

LilyM - I see that you accept that responsible drinking of alcohol can be therapeutic and thus morally OK. I’m not sure how you take the leap to say that ANY and ALL use of marijuana is not morally OK because people do not smoke it for therapeutic reasons, but for the purpose of getting high. Your logic doesn’t hold water. First of all, some states have legalized the use of marijuana for MEDICINAL purposes. While I know that you suspect the intent of those using it for other reasons than medicinal (for the purpose of getting high) - you don’t have any right to make that judgement. Let me put it in a very simple formula for you to understand:

MEDICINAL = THERAPEUTIC

Please don’t judge everyone that has a doctor’s prescription to use marijuana that they are using it ONLY to get high. While I agree with you that one of the BENEFITS of smoking marijuana responsibly is a certain psychological euphoria, there are those who use marijuana for it’s Medicinal effects (ie - glacoma, Ana’s story).

Just because alcohol is explicity endorsed by Christ in the scriptures and marijuana is not, you act like a PROTESTant to infer that it is NOT ok.

I know I like to have a drink or two of wine or beer not only because of the taste and social setting, but also because of the way it makes me feel and helps me to relax after a long day at work. Thus drinking of alcohol in my opinion has a therapeutic effect. I also think that the responsible and moderate use of marijuana for the purpose of getting a physical and psychological effect (high) can also be THERAPEUTIC.

The CCC says that drugs should be used for therapeutic reasons.
Please use some common sense when you interpret the Catechism. I drink coffee not just because of the taste, but because of how coffee effects me. My basic premise is that responsible and moderate use of marijuana (just as the consumption of alcohol) can be used THERAPEUTICALLY - which means getting a high or “buzz”. When I drink alcohol it has the same THERAPEUTIC effect - a high or buzz. I don’t drink it just for the taste. In other words, the high of marijuana can and does have a therapetic effect just as an alcohol high. Again, this does not endorse drunkiness or immoderate use of marijana.

What seems to be very clear here is that your understanding about the use of marijuana is from books and other articles and not personal experience.

Your conclusion that moderate and responsible use of marijuana cannot be THERAPEUTIC does NOT hold water.

O K …taking an alternate path here. The part about the CC stating ‘drugs should be used for theraputic purposes’ and several posts refering to the use of both alcohol (wine from the biblical text) and marijuana to ‘relax’ in social settings as well as to release the stress of a particularly trying day have brought to mind the exponential increase in perscriptions for paxel,xanex,prozac,etc for those same reasons. (Back in the 60;s and 70’s it was vallium). Even amongst teens (and younger children) learned doctors are perscribing said medications for people suffering great anxiety. Without these medications these people are so deeply depressed as to cause physical and phsycological maladies. The general public are even encouraged to ‘self-medicate’ with st.john’s wart and other natural herbs to (name removed by moderator)rove feelings of well being…and I might add the citizenry does not condemn these uses. WHY then marijuana? I have often wondered what makes this herb the target of such ridicule and skeptism. Here I would like to reiterate previous posts:: It is not the herb itself that is inherantly sinful or the simple use of it but the fact that some wish to relinquish self controll and subsequently become dependent on it.

 

[LilyM]

MEDICINAL = THERAPEUTIC

Your conclusion that moderate and responsible use of marijuana cannot be THERAPEUTIC does NOT hold water.

I never said it’s impossible for it to be therapeutic. I said it’s doubtful, and I also said that even if it’s advocated by the medical community and IS therapeutic doesn’t automatically make it morally OK.

See, there are doctors out there who will tell you birth-control and other immoral medical treatments (sterilisation for example) are ‘therapeutic’ too - that they can ‘free’ a couple of unwanted ‘stress’ about pregnancy and help them … well, relax. Just like you say alcohol and marijuana help you to do. Their approval doesn’t make these ‘therapeutic’ procedures OK.

Ever since the 1960s Timothy Leary and other doctors have advocated LSD use as ‘theraputic’, and continued to do so well after its many harms were well established. So the mere fact that even medical doctors (some or many) may approve doesn’t make a particular medical course of action morally correct.

My sister the doctor puts it this way - you ingest alcohol and, assuming your liver is normal and you don’t drink bucketloads, it is ALL gone from your system within six hours of your last drink. Every last particle. Again, if your system is normal and you haven’t drunk to excess, zero harm. Some brain cells maybe, but we only use 10% of our brain max anyway, so we can afford to lose just a couple.

You ingest an antidepressant, St John’s Wart or whatever - it may last 12-16 hours maximum, and when you cease taking them they may stay in your system a little longer. Two or three days.

You ingest marijuana, it stays in your system for two or three MONTHS. Doing goodness knows what while it’s in there - we just don’t know all its effects.

And imagine how it must build up in your system if you toke with any sort of frequency during those two or three months - it’d be like having drink on top of drink on top of drink and just not ever being completely sober for 60 days. Try doing THAT and seeing how healthy it is for you!

And for the poster who mentioned Zanax, St John’s Wort etc - they’re not usually prescribed willy-nilly either. These days doctors are a lot more careful in choice of drug and type of patient they prescribe them to than they were in times past.

And usually recommend counselling, exercise, meditation, or other non-drug treatments along with the drug as appropriate, with the aim of the patient NOT taking the drug permanently if possible, but getting off it as soon as practicable and as much as possible using non-pharmaceutical means of controlling their stress.

This happens because they RECOGNISE now that drugs of any kind AREN’T the ideal way to treat stress!

 

[LeroyCRHP]

Pretty amazing how we apply our belief systems to this relatively simple question.

[SIGN]YES[/SIGN] for me.

But we all have free choice. See where the pot smokers end up after a few years. Doesn’t seem to be a path to respect, improving my salvation, helping others, or help for the poor.

Doesn’t pot and many other “vices” fall into that category of yes it’s bad, but I think I can do just a little and be fine?

 

[fbl9]

My sister the doctor puts it this way - you ingest alcohol and, assuming your liver is normal and you don’t drink bucketloads, it is ALL gone from your system within six hours of your last drink. Every last particle. Again, if your system is normal and you haven’t drunk to excess, zero harm. Some brain cells maybe, but we only use 10% of our brain max anyway, so we can afford to lose just a couple.

You ingest an antidepressant, St John’s Wart or whatever - it may last 12-16 hours maximum, and when you cease taking them they may stay in your system a little longer. Two or three days.

You ingest marijuana, it stays in your system for two or three MONTHS. Doing goodness knows what while it’s in there - we just don’t know all its effects.

!

not getting down on you for this post but taking how long a drug stays in your system has no relationship to how harmful it is…take cocaine for example within two-three days or less there is no trace of it in one’s system same goes for other “hard” drugs…

 

[LilyM]

not getting down on you for this post but taking how long a drug stays in your system has no relationship to how harmful it is…take cocaine for example within two-three days or less there is no trace of it in one’s system same goes for other “hard” drugs…

Well it allows for phenomenal levels of build-up of the drug in the system as I said, which in a narcotic drug like cannabis can’t possibly be a good or safe thing, put it that way.

 

[fbl9]

Well it allows for phenomenal levels of build-up of the drug in the system as I said, which in a narcotic drug like cannabis can’t possibly be a good or safe thing, put it that way.

point taken…
do you have any info on just what these negative effects are?
most users would say that one builds immunity to the stuff,…that’s because there is so much in the system…

 

[LilyM]

point taken…
do you have any info on just what these negative effects are?
most users would say that one builds immunity to the stuff,…that’s because there is so much in the system…

Well, it DOES destroy brain cells. Alcohol does too, of course, which is why we need to handle IT with care too. It exacerbates, if not actually causing, mental disease which pre-exists in a surprisingly high percentage of the population already to at least some degree.

If smoked, it has the same ill effects as any smoking - the resultant cancers, lung disease and so on.

It may affect fertility but I haven’t checked the research on that one in a while, so don’t quote me.

As for immunity to drugs - well, a drunk may after a while grow accustomed enough to his liquor to stop slurring and staggering, but all his ‘immunity’ sure won’t stop him getting cirrhosis of the liver or kidney disease.

So really there is no ‘immunity’ from most of the harms any drug causes.

 

[fbl9]

Well, it DOES destroy brain cells. Alcohol does too, of course, which is why we need to handle IT with care too. It exacerbates, if not actually causing, mental disease which pre-exists in a surprisingly high percentage of the population already to at least some degree.

If smoked, it has the same ill effects as any smoking - the resultant cancers, lung disease and so on.

It may affect fertility but I haven’t checked the research on that one in a while, so don’t quote me.

As for immunity to drugs - well, a drunk may after a while grow accustomed enough to his liquor to stop slurring and staggering, but all his ‘immunity’ sure won’t stop him getting cirrhosis of the liver or kidney disease.

So really there is no ‘immunity’ from most of the harms any drug causes.

sorry these are the effects that are caused immediatley i was asking as to the effects of the build up…
i didn’t intend to mean that one becomes immune to health effects rather to the effect of the thc…

 

[DaMooksta]

I don’t think it’s a mortal sin. It does, however, fall squarely in the category of Things That Are Very Bad Ideas, like speeding and Ugg boots.
My friend, we will call him Mr. Potato Head, smokes pot.
He also drinks.
And on this particular night, he was also on Vicodin.
And I said, ‘Mr. Potato Head, you’re already drunk and high, what does the Vicodin do for you?’
And he said ‘Well, being drunk and high is like two PLUS two, but being drunk and high and on Vicodin is like two TIMES two.’
Sigh.

lol! that was good

 

[DaMooksta]

Well, it DOES destroy brain cells. Alcohol does too, of course, which is why we need to handle IT with care too. It exacerbates, if not actually causing, mental disease which pre-exists in a surprisingly high percentage of the population already to at least some degree.

If smoked, it has the same ill effects as any smoking - the resultant cancers, lung disease and so on.

It may affect fertility but I haven’t checked the research on that one in a while, so don’t quote me.

As for immunity to drugs - well, a drunk may after a while grow accustomed enough to his liquor to stop slurring and staggering, but all his ‘immunity’ sure won’t stop him getting cirrhosis of the liver or kidney disease.

So really there is no ‘immunity’ from most of the harms any drug causes.

yea but when u go swimming and go underwater 2 hold ur breath that also kills brain cells…

 

[RubyT]

Reepicheep;4528547:

So,…for a pothead the sin would be smoking shwag?
:hey_bud:

ha ha ha ha I needed a good laugh.

Seems to me that any substance that dulls the senses would dull the Holy Spirit in us thus causing us to separate from God.

weed, pot, grass, bones, doobie, spleefs, blunts, dope, ganja, loco weed, reefer, maryjane, cannabis or maui wowie, would not be considered a sin as long as it is used occasionally.

Now Alcohol - thats the devils brew. :tanning:

 

[RubyT]

not getting down on you for this post but taking how long a drug stays in your system has no relationship to how harmful it is…take cocaine for example within two-three days or less there is no trace of it in one’s system same goes for other “hard” drugs…

Check out this dude he has been smokin > :takeoff:

An interesting fact:

Marijuana stays in the system for approximately one month (depending on its potency). The reason is because it is stored in the fat cells in our bodies which take longer to remove through osmosis since there is less water in these cells.

Now cocaine and opiate derivitives are stored in our cells which contain water with little to no fats and this allows for faster osmosis of the drug.

I am a clinical scientist and do drug tests on urine and blood at work. Yep, they drug test me too, so don’t even go there. npatrol:

 

[RubyT]

I AGREE

I DO NOT AGREE

LilyM - I see that you accept that responsible drinking of alcohol can be therapeutic and thus morally OK. I’m not sure how you take the leap to say that ANY and ALL use of marijuana is not morally OK because people do not smoke it for therapeutic reasons, but for the purpose of getting high. Your logic doesn’t hold water. First of all, some states have legalized the use of marijuana for MEDICINAL purposes. While I know that you suspect the intent of those using it for other reasons than medicinal (for the purpose of getting high) - you don’t have any right to make that judgement. Let me put it in a very simple formula for you to understand:

MEDICINAL = THERAPEUTIC

Please don’t judge everyone that has a doctor’s prescription to use marijuana that they are using it ONLY to get high. While I agree with you that one of the BENEFITS of smoking marijuana responsibly is a certain psychological euphoria, there are those who use marijuana for it’s Medicinal effects (ie - glacoma, Ana’s story).

Just because alcohol is explicity endorsed by Christ in the scriptures and marijuana is not, you act like a PROTESTant to infer that it is NOT ok.

I know I like to have a drink or two of wine or beer not only because of the taste and social setting, but also because of the way it makes me feel and helps me to relax after a long day at work. Thus drinking of alcohol in my opinion has a therapeutic effect. I also think that the responsible and moderate use of marijuana for the purpose of getting a physical and psychological effect (high) can also be THERAPEUTIC.

The CCC says that drugs should be used for therapeutic reasons.
Please use some common sense when you interpret the Catechism. I drink coffee not just because of the taste, but because of how coffee effects me. My basic premise is that responsible and moderate use of marijuana (just as the consumption of alcohol) can be used THERAPEUTICALLY - which means getting a high or “buzz”. When I drink alcohol it has the same THERAPEUTIC effect - a high or buzz. I don’t drink it just for the taste. In other words, the high of marijuana can and does have a therapetic effect just as an alcohol high. Again, this does not endorse drunkiness or immoderate use of marijana.

What seems to be very clear here is that your understanding about the use of marijuana is from books and other articles and not personal experience.

Your conclusion that moderate and responsible use of marijuana cannot be THERAPEUTIC does NOT hold water.

There are many Therapeutic uses for marijuana:

Cancer patients use it after chemotherapy treatments to relieve nautiousness and enable them to eat food without barfing.

AIDS patients also use it to get an appetite after the many prescription drugs they are on which cause lack of appetite.

With severe arthritis it relaxes the patients muscles and this helps the joints (no pun intended) have less pain.

There are many more but you get the point.

 

[jkiernan56]

There are many Therapeutic uses for marijuana:

Cancer patients use it after chemotherapy treatments to relieve nautiousness and enable them to eat food without barfing.

AIDS patients also use it to get an appetite after the many prescription drugs they are on which cause lack of appetite.

With severe arthritis it relaxes the patients muscles and this helps the joints (no pun intended) have less pain.

There are many more but you get the point.

I saw on the news last week that marijuana may also be good for those with Alzheimers or preventing Alzheimers:

telegraph.co.uk/scienceandtechnology/science/sciencenews/3485163/Marijuana-may-improve-memory-and-help-fight-Alzheimers.html

news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/health/4286435.stm

Even if it doesn’t help Alzheimer patients to minimize the loss of memory, it certainly will help their appetite!!!

 

[jkiernan56]

I am a clinical scientist and do drug tests on urine and blood at work. Yep, they drug test me too, so don’t even go there. npatrol:

So you know how to get around the tests eh? LOL … just kidding

 

[ericka1701]

This is a question for RubyT, as a clinical scientist… drug testing for marijuana test for all cannabinoids, not just TCH specifically. The TCH (what makes people high) is metabolized within a few hours and is metabolized, and it’s in fact the (inactive) metabolites that get stored in the fat cells. So just because there are cannaboinoids in the system doesn’t mean the person is under the effects of the drug? Please correct me if I’m wrong.

Also, the whole mental illness/marijuana debate, I feel, is a case of which came first, chicken or the egg. I know one or two people who actually use it for treatment of bipolar disorder, and I have seen quite a few more anecdotes of people using this for the treatment of severely med-resistant forms of mental illnesses. I think those who happen to be more depressed, anxious, or even manic tend to gravitate towards marijuana as a means of self-medication. Yes, marijuana can cause episodes of psychosis (can’t alcohol do the same, as well?) but I’ve only seen that in “newbies”. People who first drink alchohol also tend to have a more drastic reaction than those who drink it regularly. There are also those who, for many reasons such as being “lightweights” and can’t moderate, cannot drink alchohol. As with any substance… It can be used in moderation, and if eaten, with less side effects than alchohol…

Just my :twocents: …
God Bless!
Ericka

 

[CWBetts]

They declared religion illegal in Soviet Russia, does that make religion sinful?

Render unto Ceasar what us Ceasar’s, render unto God what is God’s" translation: we are to obay the legal authorities under which we live, unless doing so puts us in direct opposition with the commands of God. For example, if we lived in a land that required us to worship the Flying Spaghetti Monster, then we would be obliged to violate this law, because it is in direct opposition to the law of God. since we are not commanded to smoke pot, we must obey the law of man that forbids it.