Is it a sin to want to be wealthy?

[wcknight]

It’s interesting to read one of the Psalms (or maybe it was in Solomons). It seems to ask God for great wealth, fame, fortune and influence, BUT it then goes on to say that he wants wealth in order to help the needy, feed the poor, and overcome injustice.

IF you strive for wealth for yourself it is selfish and greed BUT if you use your wealth to help others, it is a service to God and mankind.

I’ve always been afraid to become wealthy because most teachings says the rich already have their reward, blessed are the poor, money is the root of all evil, wealth equals power and power corrupts… etc etc.

Jesus tells us it is tougher for a rich man to get to Heaven than it is for a camel to get through the eye of a needle…

At first this seems to say it is impossible, BUT Jesus also says with God everything is possible… AND the eye of the needle is NOT the eye of a sewing needle. Back then, the eye of the needle was a hole in the wall of a city, where camels had to crawl through to get into the city. It was difficult but not impossible.

What I’ve decided is that it’s okay to become wealthy but you have far greater responsibility to help others than if you remain poor. Somewhere I heard it said that it is okay to be rich but it is NOT okay to die rich. We need to use our wealth to help the poor and the further the greater glory of God.

 

[wcknight]

BTW when you place God first, you can never go wrong. The key to getting wealthy is simple. After you have given to the Church and poor what is due them, simply spend much less than what you make. For some this may sound very difficult or impossible, but everyone can make ends meet if they budget and plan accordingly.

Invest the difference wisely and after 30 years or so, you will have accumulated a hefty sum.

People with 6 digit incomes are not necessarily wealthy, especially if their life style has managed to exceed their income.

Expenses and income is like clutter to an empty shelf. Clutter always manages to over come available shelf space. And expenses always managed to outdistance our income. What we have to control is our desire to obtain the latest and greatest gadgets and things, at least until they become much more affordable.

There are ways to live more cheaply, such as keeping a car for a long as possible, car pooling or staying in a home much longer than the usual 7 years when everyone moves on average, eating out less and so on…

 

[Eireann]

I’ve always been afraid to become wealthy because most teachings says the rich already have their reward, blessed are the poor, money is the root of all evil, wealth equals power and power corrupts… etc etc.

Actually I heard a priest on EWTN preach that the Bible does not say “money is the root of all evil” he said “the Love of money was the root of all evil” big difference.

Sorry I’m not checking you on this, just pointing it out, I’ve heard Catholic and non-catholics quote this over here many times. (Ireland)

Douay Rheims Saint Paul To Timothy
6:10
For the **desire of money **is the root of all evils; which some coveting have erred from the faith, and have entangled themselves in many sorrows.

RSV 6:10 For the** love of money **is the root of all evils; it is through this craving that some have wandered away from the faith and pierced their hearts with many pangs.

I think a word in the wrong place or worse still left out, can be very misleading.

 

[wcknight]

I would love to have enough money to give a lot of money away…

There used to be tv show in the 50’s (i think it was called “The Millionaire”), where a messenger gave away a million $ each show. It was all fake but it made for some interesting tv.

 

[Jay2]

Interesting thought…

I’m one of a 6 member crew. We’re all Union, all the same scale & wage…(what this means is I make exactly the same dollar amount per hour as the other five guys.) Overtime excepted the six of us make nearly the exact income per year. Overtime would skew this +/- $5K a year.

I’m considered the “rich” one… I’ve got no credit debt, I’m 7 years from owning my (50 year old) home, have 3 vehicles that are paid in full (less than 4years old each), own free & clear a lake/vacation home/property (according to my last tax assessment worth 3/4 Million with all the inclusive toys… a ski-boat, sailboat, and “stuff”)…

I’m/We’re not “wealthy” - just financially “smart”. Our driveway is a wreck. The $14K for replacement isn’t in the works right now (read that as I’ve not found the right deal yet). We’re watching my wife’s college TV set in the family room (it was the “cast off” unit 20 years ago when she went to school - the thing won’t die!) - read that as plasma displays are dropping 2K a year and we’ve got a functional TV).

We work the financial “system” to our advantage, rather than the usual way that it’s marketed towards the desperate.

I’m not wealthy in “cash assets”… but maybe so in tangible assets…and I’ll “work” these to be able to retire at 55, or 60, or whenever I don’t want to work anymore… My signature says it all.

 

[Al_Masetti]

Another issue is “how far are you willing to go to get that wealth?”

Steal the property of others? If someone has a software program that he doesn’t want to sell to you, so you take it without his permission and change one letter on it and then resell it for a billion dollars? Is that ok?

Perform “servile work” on Sunday?

On the other hand, would you pray to the Holy Spirit constantly for direction and guidance?

 

[Jennifer_J]

The title of his book is “Happy are you poor” not “be you poor” as I said earlier.

Our mom’s book group just read this, and while it was eye opening to a certain extent, I was disappointed that more real life examples for families weren’t offered. I think that the Saints’ lives he offered we so extreme as to mean very little to my family of 7 (soon to be 8). I also think that he took several biblical verses out of context about money and a few of his saint examples were a bit strange (St Thomas Moore was wealthy and bought extravegant gifts for his children, but because he prayed and had evening devotions, that’s okay??? I was confused here, I’ll admit.) However, that being said, it does make me pause before we buy something–is it truly needed or just wanted…food for thought, for sure.

Jennifer

 

[queenofmycastle]

Wealth is partly a mindset. You often find that people from rich backgrounds who become poor don’t think of themselves as poor, but as a temporarily embarrassed rich person. Of course this is partly rational. Someone who has been brought up in a sink estate and ends up in the homeless shelter will probably stay on the margins of society for the rest of their lives. Someone from Eton who loses all their money and winds up in a homeless shelter will probably only spend a few weeks there before he persuades some old schoolfriend to try the next dodgy business venture.

You are “comfortable”. You can sustain yourself as a member of society. However you are not wealthy in that there is not a lot of spare money to throw around.

Your priority should be to discharge your obligations to God. However, having done that, you can do what you want with the rest of your time and resources.** That includes trying to make a lot of money. The important thing is that it must be a subsidiary goal. You cannot serve two masters.** However you can, for example, run a business and be a Catholic in perfectly good standing.

Ok, but how do you find balance between the two?

 

[queenofmycastle]

It’s interesting to read one of the Psalms (or maybe it was in Solomons). It seems to ask God for great wealth, fame, fortune and influence, BUT it then goes on to say that he wants wealth in order to help the needy, feed the poor, and overcome injustice.

IF you strive for wealth for yourself it is selfish and greed BUT if you use your wealth to help others, it is a service to God and mankind.

I’ve always been afraid to become wealthy because most teachings says the rich already have their reward, blessed are the poor, money is the root of all evil, wealth equals power and power corrupts… etc etc.

Jesus tells us it is tougher for a rich man to get to Heaven than it is for a camel to get through the eye of a needle…

At first this seems to say it is impossible, BUT Jesus also says with God everything is possible… AND the eye of the needle is NOT the eye of a sewing needle. Back then, the eye of the needle was a hole in the wall of a city, where camels had to crawl through to get into the city. It was difficult but not impossible.

What I’ve decided is that it’s okay to become wealthy but you have far greater responsibility to help others than if you remain poor. Somewhere I heard it said that it is okay to be rich but it is NOT okay to die rich. We need to use our wealth to help the poor and the further the greater glory of God.

I agree. For a long time I’ve felt afraid to be wealthy for the reasons you describe. And I felt like I didn’t deserve to have any. I’m slowly starting to come to the realization that money is not the problem, it is what you do with it. I would definately want to help those around me, starting with my family if the had the resources (money!) to do so.

 

[wcknight]

The way I look at money is that it is a necessity. I need money to survive day to day, to pay the bills now and in the future. I need money to have a reasonable retirement. I do not need money to buy an expensive fancy car or boat or expensive tv.

I do not strive to become super wealthy because chances are I would probably blow it on useless frivolous things (I could become a philantropist but odds are I would also become complacent and do some silly things with it).

My goal is Heaven first, foremost, and always. Hitting the lottery and getting megabucks won’t make me happy (except maybe for the brief euphoria in finding about it - with my luck, I’d probably die from a heart attack at the shock and excitement). Afterwards, I would probably be too worried about getting robbed or figuring out what to do with it.

We’ve lived in the same house for 25 years and I hope to live there for the next 50 if God gives me that long (I’d be over a 100 !). We have added onto it substantially and just by default the value has risen to astromonical proprotions. IF we were in the market today, we would not be able to afford to buy our own current home. It would be too expensive.

God has been extremely generous with us. We make a good living, have a nice home, have 3 wonderful kids (now almost adults) and I know God could have just as easily made us poor and destitute. Everything I have comes from God. He gave my wife and I the intelligence and good health to hold down good jobs, and He has provided whatever our family needs. He could just as easily take it all away.

By many folks standards we could be considered wealthy. We take a vacation once or twice a year usually to fairly nice places. We go out to eat fairly often, and we even go to sporting events fairly frequently. We save (at least we used to- insanely high tuition payments have pretty much ended that when the kids were/are still in college) and we have investments probably enough to retire comfortably in a year or two (when our youngest graduates).

To give a perspective on wealth, a few years ago, I was heading out from work to go on a vacation. I happened to be in the elevator with the building maintenance worker, and I asked where he was planning to go on vaction this year. He sort of chuckled and said he plans on staying home for a week as usual, he could not afford to go anywhere. Poor people don’t go to nice places for vacation.

I felt really guilty because we were heading off to Disney World (for our 3rd or 4th time in 15 years). I wish I had enough money to send all folks who have never been to a trip to Disney World at least once.

 

[Agnieszka]

I felt really guilty because we were heading off to Disney World (for our 3rd or 4th time in 15 years). I wish I had enough money to send all folks who have never been to a trip to Disney World at least once.

Have you ever considered going to a poorer nation for a holiday?

 

[wcknight]

Not to a really really poor nation, but we have been to some countries and areas that were really improverished.

Seeing folks living under the bridges and in shacks in Hong Kong was quite revealing. My kids did some service work in the Domincan Republic and in Trinidad.

What I/we have considered is spending a year or two doing charity work in a poor country. God has given so much to us that we feel a bit obligated to help out else where

 

[queenofmycastle]

The way I look at money is that it is a necessity. I need money to survive day to day, to pay the bills now and in the future. I need money to have a reasonable retirement. I do not need money to buy an expensive fancy car or boat or expensive tv.

I do not strive to become super wealthy because chances are I would probably blow it on useless frivolous things (I could become a philantropist but odds are I would also become complacent and do some silly things with it).

My goal is Heaven first, foremost, and always. Hitting the lottery and getting megabucks won’t make me happy (except maybe for the brief euphoria in finding about it - with my luck, I’d probably die from a heart attack at the shock and excitement). Afterwards, I would probably be too worried about getting robbed or figuring out what to do with it.

We’ve lived in the same house for 25 years and I hope to live there for the next 50 if God gives me that long (I’d be over a 100 !). We have added onto it substantially and just by default the value has risen to astromonical proprotions. IF we were in the market today, we would not be able to afford to buy our own current home. It would be too expensive.

God has been extremely generous with us. We make a good living, have a nice home, have 3 wonderful kids (now almost adults) and I know God could have just as easily made us poor and destitute. Everything I have comes from God. He gave my wife and I the intelligence and good health to hold down good jobs, and He has provided whatever our family needs. He could just as easily take it all away.

By many folks standards we could be considered wealthy. We take a vacation once or twice a year usually to fairly nice places. We go out to eat fairly often, and we even go to sporting events fairly frequently. We save (at least we used to- insanely high tuition payments have pretty much ended that when the kids were/are still in college) and we have investments probably enough to retire comfortably in a year or two (when our youngest graduates).

To give a perspective on wealth, a few years ago, I was heading out from work to go on a vacation. I happened to be in the elevator with the building maintenance worker, and I asked where he was planning to go on vaction this year. He sort of chuckled and said he plans on staying home for a week as usual, he could not afford to go anywhere. Poor people don’t go to nice places for vacation.

I felt really guilty because we were heading off to Disney World (for our 3rd or 4th time in 15 years). I wish I had enough money to send all folks who have never been to a trip to Disney World at least once.

Nice post. It’s funny that you do not consider yourself wealthy, but I could definately consider you to be wealthy. At least wealthier than me. Which brings me back to the point about wealth being relative…

 

[queenofmycastle]

Another issue is “how far are you willing to go to get that wealth?”

Steal the property of others? If someone has a software program that he doesn’t want to sell to you, so you take it without his permission and change one letter on it and then resell it for a billion dollars? Is that ok?

Perform “servile work” on Sunday?

On the other hand, would you pray to the Holy Spirit constantly for direction and guidance?

Good points. Well, stealing is definatly out of the question. I think that a person resorts to stealing to get money, perhaps that can be filed under “the love of money being the root of all evil.” But, what if that person is stealing because they are homeless and they are doing it to merely survive? Not to dreail the original topic of this thread, but I have pondered that.

 

[Al_Masetti]

Good points. Well, stealing is definatly out of the question. I think that a person resorts to stealing to get money, perhaps that can be filed under “the love of money being the root of all evil.” But, what if that person is stealing because they are homeless and they are doing it to merely survive? Not to dreail the original topic of this thread, but I have pondered that.

… to acquire WEALTH…???

 

[wcknight]

Good points. Well, stealing is definatly out of the question. I think that a person resorts to stealing to get money, perhaps that can be filed under “the love of money being the root of all evil.” But, what if that person is stealing because they are homeless and they are doing it to merely survive? Not to dreail the original topic of this thread, but I have pondered that.

I suppose there are degrees of wealth, my DW and I are fairly well off, but we still have to work for a living. We have assets (mostly tied up in our home) but we have big debts (mostly our mortgage) as well.

Our spending and expenses have mostly risen to the standard of living that we have become accustomed to. We are very frugal (AKA cheap) but we also appreciate sports and the arts and dining out. We do a lot of charity work and we make our fair share in donations.

When we were younger (much younger) we were even more frugal and we saved and invested fairly well. We have no fancy cars, no boats. We buy stuff to get around not to show off. A lot of folks would say we’re wealthy, but for the most part we live pay check to pay check. We do have savings so that if something were to happen to either one or both of us, we would survive.

We do have pension plans so, we can retire in a few years. I suppose a lot of folks would love to be in the position we’re in. But I also think there are many folks our age who are also in similar financial shape or even better. And unfortunately many folks who can’t afford to retire very soon or maybe never.

The thing about this country is that there are many levels of living standards, and it is within the reach of anyone to move up (or down). My parents never retired. They passed away working a small grocery store. They never accumulated much in savings, rarely dined out, but they were very happy and satisfied with their standard of living.

My DW and I have pretty much reached the standard of living that we are happy with. In a few years we hope to both retire and persue charity work or whatever else that will keep us active. We can’t throw money away, but we will have some descretionary funds that we can spend or donate to whatever causes that we like. It’s what we hope will be a comfortable retirement.

 

[Al_Masetti]

Has anyone on this thread defined “wealth”?

 

[Agnieszka]

Has anyone on this thread defined “wealth”?

Wealth is anything other than poverty. (financially speaking of course) You are wealthy when you have adequate shelter, when you have enough to eat, when you can clothe yourself and your family, when you can educate your children by sending them to school and when you can afford medication. Sorry, but i think its as simple as that. Then you have degrees of wealth, but in any event you are wealthy in the eyes of Jesus if you are not poor.

 

[wcknight]

Has anyone on this thread defined “wealth”?

Some would say wealth is what the other guy has, that I wish I had.

I would agree with Agnieska. Most folks in the US and the first world countries are relatively weathy. IF you can clothe and feed yourself and have a reasonable roof over your head, you are better off than most in poor countries.

If you can’t afford to feed yourself or your family regularly or clothe them or need assistance (on welfare) on a regular basis then you are poor.

I think in the US we tend to think of ourselves as poor relative to the super rich. We don’t own a yacht or a mansion or multiple homes so we think we are not rich but by most of the worlds standards most American are quite wealthy. Our standard of living is so high that we become short sighted.

My wife still thinks of us as poor but even by US standards, we are quite well off. We’re not multi millionarires, but we are far from struggling. We’ve never gone hungry and never had to do without.

If you want to see real wealth, go to a casino and watch some of the “high rollers”. Some folks are betting hundreds or even thousands of $ on each roll of the dice. But the thing is anyone who can afford to walk into the casino and make a minimum bet is far wealthier than the folks who struggle to have to feed themselves.

 

[Sr_Sally]

And as to why I want wealth? Well, I want to make more money, so that I can quit my part time job and be a full time mother again. Also, if we had more money coming in, it would mean my husband won’t have to work so much if any overtime every week so that he can spend more time with me and the kids instead of being a slave to his job just so we can pay the bills. We have blessed with two children and want to have at least two more . We have seriously considered homeschooling and would like to do it, but it would be very hard with our current circumstances.

It sounds like your first step should just be to get your finances in some order. I know that math, budgeting, investing
can be scary and people think it is too hard, but the first step is pretty easy. Simply tracking exactly how you spend your money.

Then once you and hubby have decided on some priorities–ie, homeschool materials over eating out, you can begin to make a budget.

Of course, there are truly poor people in the US. But most financial advisors (Dave Ramsey is a great one) find that families in good health with one parent at a reasonable paying job can do fine.

As others have said, it is a matter of setting priorities and not being swayed by advertisers, friends, etc to spend above your means.

I like Finances for Today’s Catholic Family by Philip Lenahan. It has all the same debt reduction advice but uses language (virtues etc) that we are more familar with.

May you be blessed to be a blessing!