Is it all right to simply trust my priest?

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Athanasius

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I have a problem with scrupulosity…is it simply all right for me to ask questions of my priest, and trust whatever he tells me, when there isn’t any sure sin? I have a hard time trusting him, because there are liturgical abuses during Mass, but I haven’t heard anything in the confessional I knew for sure to contradict church teaching*. That being the case, can I simply ask him questions, and trust him, and if he gives me wrong answers, it is not my responsibility?

If yes, then what if I did hear him contradict church teaching at any point? Would it be wrong or sinful for me to ask him any further questions? And would it be all right for me to trust his answers from the past? Or would I have to re-ask all of those?

Also, I have been seeing a couple of counselors to help me with my scrupulosity…during the course of my conversations with one of them at least (and perhaps both), I explained to them that I have a hard time trusting my priest. I stated it was because he is not always faithful to the Church’s teaching, but I misspoke. What I meant to say is that he is not always faithful to the Church’s worship rules (like I said, there are some liturgical abuses during Mass). But I can’t recall him ever stating anything I knew for sure to contradict the Church’s teaching. I simply misspoke

Anyway, I wish to correct that misstatement, but is it obligatory for me to do it as soon as possible? Or could I wait until my next regular appointment with them (the latter of the two is on the 25th)
  • My priest has recently stated that he will only hear my confession once a month and no more. I don’t know if that is acceptable or not, but…
 
Obedience is like spiritual magic (in a good sense). Whenever you obey your legitimate spiritual superior (regardless of that person’s personal holiness or lack thereof), you please God. It doesn’t matter if the superior gives good advice or bad, or even ridiculous, like standing on your left foot while you pray. If you obey, you please God. ALL the responsibility for the advice rests upon the superior. If he tells you something wrong, it’s between him and God. If you obey, you please God. PERIOD.

You, Athanasius, as a scrupulous person, have a strong tendency to worry about the actions of others - your priest, your family, etc. None of this is your responsibility. Your responsibility is to find out the will of God FOR YOU and do it. That’s it. And the surest way is obedience.

Your priest, because he knows your scrupulous tendencies, has told you that you may confess your sins only once a month. This is standard advice for people with your struggles. Several people have given you links to the Ten Commandments for the Scrupulous, and other similar items. Have you read them? If you have read them, do you reject them out of hand for some reason - like the advice is too lenient for you? If they only understood the gravity of your sins they wouldn’t advise you thus? This is typical scrupulous thinking, and the only way to get over it (you do want to get over it, don’t you??) is to take the advice of the experts and your spiritual superiors, even (especially!) if it seems wrong to you. Your conscience is severely disordered, and the cure is not what you would expect.

So, to answer your original question, YES, you MUST trust your priest.

Betsy
 
Athanasius said:
I have a problem with scrupulosity…is it simply all right for me to ask questions of my priest, and trust whatever he tells me, when there isn’t any sure sin? I have a hard time trusting him, because there are liturgical abuses during Mass, but I haven’t heard anything in the confessional I knew for sure to contradict church teaching*. That being the case, can I simply ask him questions, and trust him, and if he gives me wrong answers, it is not my responsibility?

If yes, then what if I did hear him contradict church teaching at any point? Would it be wrong or sinful for me to ask him any further questions? And would it be all right for me to trust his answers from the past? Or would I have to re-ask all of those?

Also, I have been seeing a couple of counselors to help me with my scrupulosity…during the course of my conversations with one of them at least (and perhaps both), I explained to them that I have a hard time trusting my priest. I stated it was because he is not always faithful to the Church’s teaching, but I misspoke. What I meant to say is that he is not always faithful to the Church’s worship rules (like I said, there are some liturgical abuses during Mass). But I can’t recall him ever stating anything I knew for sure to contradict the Church’s teaching. I simply misspoke

Anyway, I wish to correct that misstatement, but is it obligatory for me to do it as soon as possible? Or could I wait until my next regular appointment with them (the latter of the two is on the 25th)
  • My priest has recently stated that he will only hear my confession once a month and no more. I don’t know if that is acceptable or not, but…
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As I have told you before my friend, you need to stop doubting God and his love for you. You keep looking here for re-enforcement for some excuse to keep up your old behavior. Just trust in and believe in Gods love for you, thats really all you have to do.
**
WHY IS THAT SO HARD FOR YOU TO DO**?
 
You will never be free of your problem if your only source of information is the internet forum. There are as many opinions as there are people posting them. It will add greatly to your continual confusion as often as you read these conflicting threads.

Until you are healed and firm in your faith, the best source of help to know all of the Church’s teachings is the Catechism. You can read it at this site if you don’t already have your own personal copy. It is simple to type in the search line whatever you are wanting to learn.
 
I apologize for my continuance for asking questions here. But before I can start asking my priest, I need to know that it woul be all right…even if later on I discover my priest teaching something that contradicts church teaching, I don’t wish to have to worry about doubting everything he has told me and having to re-ask it elsewhere. Hence, my questions.

I thank-you for the answers given so far. If someone could please answer all of my questions, including the ones concerning my counselor, from above, I would greatly appreciate it.
 
Athanasius said:
I have a problem with scrupulosity…is it simply all right for me to ask questions of my priest, and trust whatever he tells me, when there isn’t any sure sin?
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Yes. Keep in mind, he has spent many years studying Doctrine and Liturgy.
I have a hard time trusting him, because there are liturgical abuses during Mass, but I haven’t heard anything in the confessional I knew for sure to contradict church teaching*.
Click to expand...
Are you quite certain that he is not making use of permitted variations of the Mass, or that he does not have good pastoral reasons for “breaking the rules?” (Good pastoring is above “the rules” because our greatest law is the law of love.)
That being the case, can I simply ask him questions, and trust him, and if he gives me wrong answers, it is not my responsibility?
Click to expand...
It is not your responsibility if he gives you the wrong answers.
If yes, then what if I did hear him contradict church teaching at any point? Would it be wrong or sinful for me to ask him any further questions? And would it be all right for me to trust his answers from the past? Or would I have to re-ask all of those?
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Your entire education isn’t up to your priest. If you read something in the Catechism that contradicts what he has told you in the past, simply mention to him that you read something in the Catechism that seems to contradict this specific teaching, and ask him to explain further.

But you can believe the Catechism, and you don’t have to subject your priest to a Holy Inquisition every single time you find out something from a different source.

Simply trust his answers until you find out differently, and mention to him that you found out something different, but you don’t have to re-ask every single question you have ever asked him before.
Also, I have been seeing a couple of counselors to help me with my scrupulosity…during the course of my conversations with one of them at least (and perhaps both), I explained to them that I have a hard time trusting my priest. I stated it was because he is not always faithful to the Church’s teaching, but I misspoke. What I meant to say is that he is not always faithful to the Church’s worship rules (like I said, there are some liturgical abuses during Mass). But I can’t recall him ever stating anything I knew for sure to contradict the Church’s teaching. I simply misspoke
Click to expand...
Anyway, I wish to correct that misstatement, but is it obligatory for me to do it as soon as possible? Or could I wait until my next regular appointment with them (the latter of the two is on the 25th)
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You can mention it the next time the subject comes up.
  • My priest has recently stated that he will only hear my confession once a month and no more. I don’t know if that is acceptable or not, but…
Click to expand...
obey him in this and in all things - it will be to your spiritual benefit.

My husband is a non-Catholic, but I obey him in all things, including things I disagree with and/or don’t want to do, and I have found that God has given me many graces and blessings because of this. I also obey my priest even when he is rude to me, and the same thing happens; blessings accrue and build up, and are overflowing in my life, because of this, so I encourage you to develop a habit of humble obedience - the spiritual benefits are totally amazing. 🙂
 
Athanasius said:
I have a problem with scrupulosity…is it simply all right for me to ask questions of my priest, and trust whatever he tells me, when there isn’t any sure sin? I have a hard time trusting him, because there are liturgical abuses during Mass, but I haven’t heard anything in the confessional I knew for sure to contradict church teaching*. That being the case, can I simply ask him questions, and trust him, and if he gives me wrong answers, it is not my responsibility?

If yes, then what if I did hear him contradict church teaching at any point? Would it be wrong or sinful for me to ask him any further questions? And would it be all right for me to trust his answers from the past? Or would I have to re-ask all of those?

Also, I have been seeing a couple of counselors to help me with my scrupulosity…during the course of my conversations with one of them at least (and perhaps both), I explained to them that I have a hard time trusting my priest. I stated it was because he is not always faithful to the Church’s teaching, but I misspoke. What I meant to say is that he is not always faithful to the Church’s worship rules (like I said, there are some liturgical abuses during Mass). But I can’t recall him ever stating anything I knew for sure to contradict the Church’s teaching. I simply misspoke

Anyway, I wish to correct that misstatement, but is it obligatory for me to do it as soon as possible? Or could I wait until my next regular appointment with them (the latter of the two is on the 25th)
  • My priest has recently stated that he will only hear my confession once a month and no more. I don’t know if that is acceptable or not, but…
Click to expand...
You are suppost to.
a priest is suppost to be christ’s persona on earth.
but now adays, buyer beware.
and I feel bad as a priest to say this.
 
Athanasius said:
I apologize for my continuance for asking questions here. But before I can start asking my priest, I need to know that it woul be all right…even if later on I discover my priest teaching something that contradicts church teaching, I don’t wish to have to worry about doubting everything he has told me and having to re-ask it elsewhere. Hence, my questions.

I thank-you for the answers given so far. If someone could please answer all of my questions, including the ones concerning my counselor, from above, I would greatly appreciate it.
Click to expand...
You never give up do you? No matter what happens, no matter what you are told, you just cannot accept the truth can you?

You know what you remind me of, the man that when he leaves his girlfriends house sits outside waiting to see if someone else shows up, that when she doesn’t answer the phone goes to her house to see who she is with, and if shes not at home looks for her everywhere endlessly, Thats because they have no trust inside of them.

And neither do you. You just don’t have trust inside you for God or anybody or anything else …

I feel sorry for you, I really do. I hope and pray that one day you Open your eyes heart and soul to Gods love and grace. I really do.

I’ll keep praying for you friend, I will.
 
Athanasius said:
I have a problem with scrupulosity…is it simply all right for me to ask questions of my priest, and trust whatever he tells me, when there isn’t any sure sin? I have a hard time trusting him, because there are liturgical abuses during Mass, but I haven’t heard anything in the confessional I knew for sure to contradict church teaching*. That being the case, can I simply ask him questions, and trust him, and if he gives me wrong answers, it is not my responsibility?

If yes, then what if I did hear him contradict church teaching at any point? Would it be wrong or sinful for me to ask him any further questions? And would it be all right for me to trust his answers from the past? Or would I have to re-ask all of those?

Also, I have been seeing a couple of counselors to help me with my scrupulosity…during the course of my conversations with one of them at least (and perhaps both), I explained to them that I have a hard time trusting my priest. I stated it was because he is not always faithful to the Church’s teaching, but I misspoke. What I meant to say is that he is not always faithful to the Church’s worship rules (like I said, there are some liturgical abuses during Mass). But I can’t recall him ever stating anything I knew for sure to contradict the Church’s teaching. I simply misspoke

Anyway, I wish to correct that misstatement, but is it obligatory for me to do it as soon as possible? Or could I wait until my next regular appointment with them (the latter of the two is on the 25th)
  • My priest has recently stated that he will only hear my confession once a month and no more. I don’t know if that is acceptable or not, but…
Click to expand...
Athanasius,

You need to stop asking questions about matters of conscience here in this forum. Instead, speak to your priest and trust him, or if you think you must, go to another priest as confessor. But whatever you do, go to one priest, stick with him, and trust him COMPLETELY.

If you think you want to go to confession more than once a month, I think that that is reasonable. Can you find another priest who you could go to for confession more than once a month? If you can, go to him and ask him to help you through the scrupulousity in confession and, again, stick with one priest and trust him completely.

And you have to stop thinking scrupulous thoughts; completely stop thinking them - like about about misspeaking. Such thoughts are scrupulous and must be banished from one’s mind, like temptations from the devil.

You are in my prayers.

In Christ.
 
People,

I don’t mean to complicate things, but priests are fallible. I’ve know a priest who said that contraception was OK and you just need to follow your conscience. As far as I know, it’s the Bishop that we need to obey, not the priest - I think. Sorry if I have this wrong.

Athanasius,
the thing to do is to inform your conscience by reading the catechism and live accordingly. Scrupolosity just causes anxiety and stress. Trust in God and just do you very best to live according to the commandments as interpreted in the catechism!

God bless,
Noel.
 
jmcrae said:
Are you quite certain that he is not making use of permitted variations of the Mass, or that he does not have good pastoral reasons for “breaking the rules?” (Good pastoring is above “the rules” because our greatest law is the law of love.)

I find the variations, legitimate or not, to be distracting. That is what has been lost since the Latin Mass was retired.

In TLM, I could focus on the meaning of what was going on. Now, at least with our current parish priest, every shortcut is taken. Every “optional” prayer has been dropped.

When I watch a Mass on EWTN, usually always every component is there, except EWTN Masses don’t have the Sign of Peace, ever, which is OK with me.

When I hear this “pastoral reasons” argument, I wonder how the average priest arrives at these “reasons” to do better than Rome on standardizing the Mass.

I grew up with TLM, and there wasn’t any dumbed-down version for kids. I don’t understand (and don’t accept) that the Mass has to be taken down to the level of a 5-year-old. People were catechized before, and they understood the Mass. Now, the default assumption is that nobody understands anything and that the Mass has to be made “relevant” to the most marginal Catholics.

I don’t like it. I don’t like it.

I’ve been looking at the changes in the Mass for forty years, and you know what? Nobody ever asked me about anything. The changes are apparently to satisfy somebody else, but never me. And, that burns me up, too. When do I get the Mass “my” way?
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Crumpy;

Let’s try to focus on helping Athanasius overcome his scrupulousity.

What if he decides to take your advice to go to a TLM, and there is a fat woman sitting next to him, or the priest mispronounces a word, or the altar server is sleepy?

Having been implicitly promised that the TLM is “perfect” he might come to total despair, which is what we are desperately trying to avoid, here - instead, he needs to come to realize that imperfection is okay, and that he is not going to go to Hell for someone else’s imperfection.

By the way I sympathize with you about every shortcut being taken - I find that very annoying, too, since the Pauline Mass could be very, very beautiful, if people would just take the time to implement all of its advantages.
 
nkelly said:
People,

Athanasius,
the thing to do is to inform your conscience by reading the catechism and live accordingly. Scrupolosity just causes anxiety and stress. Trust in God and just do you very best to live according to the commandments as interpreted in the catechism!

God bless,
Noel.
Click to expand...
One cannot just tell that to a guy who is scrupulous; his conscience is out of kilter. One must focus on helping him overcome his scrupulosity. The other posters are correct. Because a scrupulous person’s conscience is faulty, it is imperative that he obey his confessor in EVERY SINGLE THING. If the confessor imposes one Hail Mary for adultery, then the scrupulous person must say that one Hail Mary and not question the propriety of the penance. Obedience is the one thing needed to cure scrupulosity.

Those of us whose consciences are well-formed have the luxury of assessing a priest’s advice or orthodoxy, but even then, that is not recommended.

Everyone should be very careful before lecturing to scrupulous persons.
 
Athanasius said:
I have a problem with scrupulosity…is it simply all right for me to ask questions of my priest, and trust whatever he tells me, when there isn’t any sure sin? I have a hard time trusting him, because there are liturgical abuses during Mass, but I haven’t heard anything in the confessional I knew for sure to contradict church teaching*. …
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it is critical to your spiritual health.
unless you have been appointed director of liturgy for your diocese whether or not liturgical abuses are occuring is not your responsibility, so relinquish it at once for your own peace of mind.

You will not ever be able to over come scrupulosity unless and until you learn to confess to one priest, to confess when, how and where he instructs you to confess, and to accept the healing grace of this sacrament in full and to trust in Jesus Christ, acting through your priest.

Rejection of your priest’s advice is rejection of Christ. Monday-morning quarterbacking your confession is rejection of the sacrament itself and denial of its graces.

You must also cease, for your spiritual health, in asking these questions about your confessions from third parties, particularly on an anonymous internet forum. That advice has been given many times here.

You are endangering your spiritual health if you continue to discuss your spiritual issues with anyone other than the priest who is your confessor and spiritual director.

That is the classic advice of orthodox spiritual direction, not my personal opinion.

You should also limit your spiritual reading, your devotional practices, and your participation in internet religious sites according to the advice of your spiritual director.

please take what has been discussed here to your priest, ask his advice and follow it.
 
Hi Athanasius,

I feel your anxiety. I’m not sure, but I think I suffer from some degree of scrupulosity. As the other posters have said, obedience to your confessor is the key to getting over this problem. BUT…I know exactly how you feel about trusting your priest. There’s nothing like walking out of confession wondering whether you’re being scrupulous or he’s being lax (your fear of his laxity being based on observations of how he conducts the Liturgy and/or preaches)! I’ve had that feeling before with a certain priest, and it’s simply awful!

My advice is to find a priest whom you trust so that you can confidently obey him in every way. Until then, FrCorey is right: beware!

Maria
 
  1. yes.
  2. do a search on CAF for scrupulousity. There are a number of recommendations such as visiting Scrupulous Anonymous and getting their free monthly newsletter. As I recall, back issues are available on line.
 
Crumpy said:
jmcrae;1792739:
Are you quite certain that he is not making use of permitted variations of the Mass, or that he does not have good pastoral reasons for “breaking the rules?” (Good pastoring is above “the rules” because our greatest law is the law of love.)

I find the variations, legitimate or not, to be distracting. That is what has been lost since the Latin Mass was retired.

In TLM, I could focus on the meaning of what was going on. Now, at least with our current parish priest, every shortcut is taken. Every “optional” prayer has been dropped.

When I watch a Mass on EWTN, usually always every component is there, except EWTN Masses don’t have the Sign of Peace, ever, which is OK with me.

When I hear this “pastoral reasons” argument, I wonder how the average priest arrives at these “reasons” to do better than Rome on standardizing the Mass.

I grew up with TLM, and there wasn’t any dumbed-down version for kids. I don’t understand (and don’t accept) that the Mass has to be taken down to the level of a 5-year-old. People were catechized before, and they understood the Mass. Now, the default assumption is that nobody understands anything and that the Mass has to be made “relevant” to the most marginal Catholics.

I don’t like it. I don’t like it.

I’ve been looking at the changes in the Mass for forty years, and you know what? Nobody ever asked me about anything. The changes are apparently to satisfy somebody else, but never me. And, that burns me up, too. When do I get the Mass “my” way?
Click to expand...
The only place you get it your way is Burger King. The OP has a confessor and there are some of you on this thread who instead of helping are helping to further destroy his trust in a priest. Its nasty but he has been told and told and told and he just doesn’t want to accept the solution. Someone should tie his typing fingers behind his back.
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Al_Masetti said:
  1. yes.
  2. do a search on CAF for scrupulousity. There are a number of recommendations such as visiting Scrupulous Anonymous and getting their free monthly newsletter. As I recall, back issues are available on line.
Click to expand...
I think just a yes answer isn’t sufficient but everyone has given good advice. I told my priest that I had read some horoscope mags at work and wondered if it was a sin. He said if I didn’t believe them and put my total trust in them it was ok to read them. This is not what I expected but it makes sense as i was not buying them and when I thought about it on my own they aren’t true and just trying to get my money. I think my priest could have used more words to counsel me and comfort me but they usually have a line waiting. To the OP even if you are still reading this your priest is probably trying to get you to have confidence that you are hearing the right voice from the Holy Spirit and need to make more decisions on your own or you will stay on milk so to speak and need to learn that you may make a mistake but it won’t be the end of the world. You are trying to be too perfect and maybe looking to close like through a magnifing glass. When I get this way my priest just tells me to say I confess all sins known and not known this week. That clears up it all. It is ok to allow some change in your life. By the way when father said I could read those mags I didn’t want to anymore. I guess he knows me better than I do and that is the way God’s Spirit and the Shepherd works.
dessert
 
For the OP: yes, trust your priest.

You might also benefit from reading the text of this homily given by the late John Cardinal O’Connor the year before he passed on from this world. God bless you with your struggles.
 
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