Is it even possible for women to be priests?

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dennisknapp

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Is it even possible for women to become priests given what the Cathechism teaches:

CCC 1577 states, “Only a baptized man (vir) validly receives sacred ordination. The Lord Jesus chose men (viri) to form the college of the twelve apostles, and the apostles did the same when they chose collaborators to succeed them in their ministry. The college of bishops, with whom the priests are united in the priesthood, makes the college of the twelve an ever-present and ever-active reality until Christ’s return. The Church recognizes herself to be bound by this choice made by the Lord Himself. For this reason the ordination of women is not possible.”

One has said on this forum, “I obey the magesterium (I have never consecrated a woman to be a priest).** I also strongly oppose this policy at every opportunity**.” Is this not Protestant in nature?

You can’t have your cake and eat it too.

I read this great quote resently. It said, “To be married to the spirit of the age is to be soon widowed.”

Also, in order for the Church to “change” on this point means going against 2000 years of established teaching. This it can not do and remain the Apostolic Church.

So, again…is it possible?
 
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dennisknapp:
Is it even possible for women to become priests given what the Cathechism teaches:

CCC 1577 states, “Only a baptized man (vir) validly receives sacred ordination. The Lord Jesus chose men (viri) to form the college of the twelve apostles, and the apostles did the same when they chose collaborators to succeed them in their ministry. The college of bishops, with whom the priests are united in the priesthood, makes the college of the twelve an ever-present and ever-active reality until Christ’s return. The Church recognizes herself to be bound by this choice made by the Lord Himself. For this reason the ordination of women is not possible.”

One has said on this forum, “I obey the magesterium (I have never consecrated a woman to be a priest).** I also strongly oppose this policy at every opportunity**.” Is this not Protestant in nature?

You can’t have your cake and eat it too.

I read this great quote resently. It said, “To be married to the spirit of the age is to be soon widowed.”

Also, in order for the Church to “change” on this point means going against 2000 years of established teaching. This it can not do and remain the Apostolic Church.

So, again…is it possible?
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No it is not possible and will never be possible.
 
No it is not nor would it ever be,Jesus Himself set up the male structure that can not be changed.Married priest can be changed,but NOT women priests.God Bless
 
being a priest is to be another Christ. and being a priest is to be married to the church. both of which would take a male.

all for JESUS!!
lonnie
 
If it is then NOT possible then why do some in the Church think that it is?

Is it just wishful thinking?

Peace
 
**If you dont think the movement is on, try this on for size: **
Welcome to the largest international website on the ordination of women

We are Roman Catholic theologians who firmly believe that the discussion on women priests should be left open.

We love our family, the Catholic Church. We fully accept the authority of the Pope. We respect his personal integrity as an outstanding spiritual leader. But we are convinced that the Pope and his advisors in Rome are making a serious mistake by dismissing women as priests. We feel obliged in conscience to make our carefully considered reasons known. “All the faithful, both clerical and lay, should be accorded a lawful freedom of inquiry, freedom of thought and freedom of expression” Gaudium et Spes, no 62.

We offer over 1000 documents in English relevant to the ordination of women. They cover decrees of councils and synods, statements by the Fathers of the Church and medieval theologians, historical records, contemporary articles, classical publications, discussions on scripture, tradition and the teaching authority, picture galleries and much more.

Nine out of ten Catholic scholars in the world support the ordination of women.

Read here the complete texts of more than 130 contemporary Catholic theologians who give their reasons in favour of women priests.Our site is unique in providing all Roman documents that ban the ordination of women in full.

Judge for yourself the arguments of the Congregation for Doctrine in Rome.womenpriests.org/images/hans8.gif
Overall responsibility for this website lies with John Wijngaards.

You can view our introductory pages in two modes
 
Theologeons can believe whatever they want,but they have NO authority to change anything:mad: Co-Priestess!Oh,how I wish Mother Angelica was feeling better, I would personally drive her to that service so she could show thenm what a righteous Italian fit is:banghead: This is what the so-called catholics for choice has been trying to achieve for a long time.:mad:
 
CrusaderNY said:
**If you dont think the movement is on, try this on for size: **

Welcome to the largest international website on the ordination of women

We are Roman Catholic theologians who firmly believe that the discussion on women priests should be left open.

We love our family, the Catholic Church. We fully accept the authority of the Pope. We respect his personal integrity as an outstanding spiritual leader. But we are convinced that the Pope and his advisors in Rome are making a serious mistake by dismissing women as priests. We feel obliged in conscience to make our carefully considered reasons known. “All the faithful, both clerical and lay, should be accorded a lawful freedom of inquiry, freedom of thought and freedom of expression” Gaudium et Spes, no 62.

We offer over 1000 documents in English relevant to the ordination of women. They cover decrees of councils and synods, statements by the Fathers of the Church and medieval theologians, historical records, contemporary articles, classical publications, discussions on scripture, tradition and the teaching authority, picture galleries and much more.

Nine out of ten Catholic scholars in the world support the ordination of women.

Read here the complete texts of more than 130 contemporary Catholic theologians who give their reasons in favour of women priests.Our site is unique in providing all Roman documents that ban the ordination of women in full.

Judge for yourself the arguments of the Congregation for Doctrine in Rome.womenpriests.org/images/hans8.gif
Overall responsibility for this website lies with John Wijngaards.

You can view our introductory pages in two modes
Click to expand...

You can think what ever you want, but this does not mean it is Truth. And just because someone abuses the Litergy does not show movement anywhere.

The OFFICIAL teaching states:

CCC 1577 states, “Only a baptized man (vir) validly receives sacred ordination. The Lord Jesus chose men (viri) to form the college of the twelve apostles, and the apostles did the same when they chose collaborators to succeed them in their ministry. The college of bishops, with whom the priests are united in the priesthood, makes the college of the twelve an ever-present and ever-active reality until Christ’s return. The Church recognizes herself to be bound by this choice made by the Lord Himself. For this reason the ordination of women is not possible.”

If this is a problem you will have to take it up with Christ. He is the one responsible for the current situation.
 
No. I used to think that over time the Catholic church would find out they needed the women to keep up the numbers. However, that was before I understood that the Catholic church can’t change. When it does, it is the Protesant Chruch. It is as simple as that.
 
This is almost as nutty as some of those “One True Mass” websites…

CrusaderNY said:
**If you dont think the movement is on, try this on for size: **

Welcome to the largest international website on the ordination of women

We are Roman Catholic theologians who firmly believe that the discussion on women priests should be left open.

We love our family, the Catholic Church. We fully accept the authority of the Pope. We respect his personal integrity as an outstanding spiritual leader. But we are convinced that the Pope and his advisors in Rome are making a serious mistake by dismissing women as priests. We feel obliged in conscience to make our carefully considered reasons known. “All the faithful, both clerical and lay, should be accorded a lawful freedom of inquiry, freedom of thought and freedom of expression” Gaudium et Spes, no 62.

We offer over 1000 documents in English relevant to the ordination of women. They cover decrees of councils and synods, statements by the Fathers of the Church and medieval theologians, historical records, contemporary articles, classical publications, discussions on scripture, tradition and the teaching authority, picture galleries and much more.

Nine out of ten Catholic scholars in the world support the ordination of women.

Read here the complete texts of more than 130 contemporary Catholic theologians who give their reasons in favour of women priests.Our site is unique in providing all Roman documents that ban the ordination of women in full.

Judge for yourself the arguments of the Congregation for Doctrine in Rome.womenpriests.org/images/hans8.gif
Overall responsibility for this website lies with John Wijngaards.

You can view our introductory pages in two modes
Click to expand...
 
I don’t think it should be changed, Jesus started the church, and I don’t think it’s up to us to change it.
 
No, and it is my understanding that theological discussion on the matter is officially closed by Rome. A few dissenters in this matter should not be of concern. The church has ruled and I would not by into the lie that there are all these theologians (9 out of 10???:rotfl: ) out there to force the issue.
 
Some are either fooled by those who know better that want to subvert or they just won’t accept the teachings of the Church themselves. This is nothing to get hysterical about. It can’t and never will happen.
 
No,I am on your side, just saying that there are forces at the church and seminary level and also at the grass roots level pushing for and paving the way for woman ordination. Any time you read about the sexual abuse scandal, and especially with groups such as the Voice of the Faithful, who among other items they stand for, is interwined woman ordination and married priests. Ask any VOF person, as they stand outside my church ever so often and this is part of thier charter, whether writting into it or by word of mouth
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Franciscum:
This is almost as nutty as some of those “One True Mass” websites…
Click to expand...
 
Angry Catholics challenging church

,

The Buffalo News, Dec. 11, 2002
buffalonews.com/
By JAY TOKASZ

Gail Cronin didn’t want to read about the sexual abuse scandal in the Catholic Church, and she didn’t want to hear about it.

Then, on Holy Thursday in March, Cronin’s parents were on the phone, apologizing to their daughter for not believing her. A newspaper reported that the priest Cronin’s friends had accused of molesting them was removed as a pastor in the Diocese of Rockville Center, two decades after the diocese first learned of abuse allegations.

Enraged, Cronin couldn’t ignore the scandal any longer. But instead of leaving the church, as she had for a short time following her graduation from college, she vowed to stay and change it.

"Cronin signed up with Call to Action, a national organization pushing for married priests, ordained women and a greater role in decision making for lay people in the Catholic church.**
**
Call to Action, which has been around since 1976, attributes much of its membership growth in the past year - an additional 2,300 people nationwide to 25,000 members - to frustration over the church crisis.

"**Another lay group, Voice of the Faithful, formed in January in Wellesley, Mass. It already counts 25,000 members and operates a sophisticated Web site. ****
**
Lay groups questioned

Other Catholics are skeptical about the value of greater lay involvement.

William Donahue, president of the Catholic League for Religious and Civil Rights in New York City, accused some groups of taking advantage of the scandal to promote radical changes in the church.

"Like sharks in the water, they smell blood," said Donahue. “They don’t believe a word that the church teaches on sexual ethics. It’s a smoke screen to say they want a greater role for the laity.”**
**
“Any bishop looking at the laity as lambs in the pews is making a huge mistake,” he said.

Mansell has been less enthusiastic about the Call to Action chapter that formed in Western New York in 1997. Then, the bishop said the group’s members should find better ways to spend their time.

“What am I going to do about woman’s ordination? The pope has been very clear on it,” said Mansell. “I just thought they could spend their time in better ways.”

**Orgren, the mailing list of the local group has grown to about 260, including a handful of priests and nuns who support the work of the organization.
**

"Love-hate’ relationship

They listened to a cassette recording of a speech by the Rev. Thomas Doyle, the priest who has become a cult hero to some Catholics for his criticism of the bishops and the Vatican.

**Lonergan has long been frustrated with the church hierarchy for refusing to ordain women and for what she calls its abandonment of divorced people.
**

Radicalism denied

“We’ve been accused of promoting abortion, which is absolute nonsense,” said James Orgren, a former Trappist monk and retired astronomy professor.

“They go to Mass daily. They’re wonderful people. They’re very dedicated people,” he said.

Some local members of Call to Action serve as Eucharistic Ministers, volunteer on parish councils and help teach religion classes.

Instead of being radical, Orgren said the Call to Action group is in line with the thinking of most mainstream American Catholics, as detailed in survey after survey, on issues such as birth control, priestly celibacy and the ordination of women.

The pope’s decree, said Orgren, is an example of how the church hierarchy, to maintain its authority and power, relies on secrecy and silence - the same elements that fueled the coverup of abusive priests. “It’s the culture that is right at the root of it,” he said.

Secular culture

Others argue that American secular culture contributed more to the problem than the way the Catholic church is structured.

Donahue, of the Catholic League, acknowledges that some bishops badly mishandled cases of abuse.

But he also blames dissent by American Catholics for undermining the authority of the church and fostering an environment of sexual promiscuity.
 
A bishop cannot stretch out his hands over a rock and sea water, say the words of consecration, and confect the Sacrifice. Neither can he lay hands on a woman and ordain her a priest. In both cases, he lacks proper matter. The Church cannot do it, not because She is unwilling (though She is unwilling!), but because She simply can’t. The Pope also used the words “to remove all doubt” in his final pronouncement against the possibility of ordaining women. To me, if that ain’t invoking Peter’s charism of infalliblity, well…
 
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JKirkLVNV:
The Church cannot do it, not because She is unwilling (though She is unwilling!), but because She simply can’t.
Click to expand...
Good point. Subjective desire and special interest agendas can’t overrule reality.
 
Hi, my first post here.

My thought is condensed this way.

The refered teaching CCC 1577 is indeed the churches current position but it is not bound to it since it is not a dogma.

Only dogmas are truely immuable truths that can’t ever change.

The question whether it is “possible” must then be yes.

God Bless
 
Vandaler, how does dogma get defined? Either by Council, ex cathedra teaching, or the constant teaching throughout time of all the bishops united with Rome. Given JP2’s strong language in Ordinatio Sacerdolitis (I’m not looking up the spelling - you get the idea), claiming to speak a) as successor to Peter b) in a matter of faith to c) all Christians everywhere to d) “remove all doubt” about the matter… well, if that isn’t an ex cathedra pronouncement, it’s at least a statement of the ordinary magisterium of the Church through the bishops united to the seat of Peter. It’s dogma. At minimum, its in the same level of teaching with things like “abortion is wrong” or the idea of double effect. Like it or not, it’s about as solid as things get.
 
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