Is it immoral to hire an illegal immigrant?

[TheAdvocate]

I used to be quite judgmental of illegal immigrants until I visited the old country of my parents in Eastern Europe. There I learned that my cousins were illegals in many countries of Western Europe. After I saw how deplorable their living conditions were, I became much less judgmental.

Now I have a landscaping job that would be quite expensive for me to complete, and money is tight–but it has to be done. Would it be wrong for me to dig up some illegals? It would help them, it would help me. Win/win–unless it’s immoral. Is it?

 

[CB_Catholic]

I used to be quite judgmental of illegal immigrants until I visited the old country of my parents in Eastern Europe. There I learned that my cousins were illegals in many countries of Western Europe. After I saw how deplorable their living conditions were, I became much less judgmental.

Now I have a landscaping job that would be quite expensive for me to complete, and money is tight–but it has to be done. Would it be wrong for me to dig up some illegals? It would help them, it would help me. Win/win–unless it’s immoral. Is it?

No, it’s not win/win because it is illegal, and if you were caught, money might become even tighter for you. And exactly how is it moral to deliberately break the laws of the country you are living in? Our immigration laws are not unjust laws, and there is no moral reason to break them.

This has nothing to do with the plight of illegal immigrants in this country, and everything to do with your moral obligation as a citizen of this country to abide by and uphold the laws of your country, even if it is inconvenient for you.

 

[StrawberryJam]

I used to be quite judgmental of illegal immigrants until I visited the old country of my parents in Eastern Europe. There I learned that my cousins were illegals in many countries of Western Europe. After I saw how deplorable their living conditions were, I became much less judgmental.

Now I have a landscaping job that would be quite expensive for me to complete, and money is tight–but it has to be done. Would it be wrong for me to dig up some illegals? It would help them, it would help me. Win/win–unless it’s immoral. Is it?

You need to consult an attorney about your liability if you do not have evidence of your employee having a right to work here. You must re-consider posting such a topic on an online forum like this, as it could be tracked back to you as an individual.

It may be a good idea to let this thread die.

 

[TheAdvocate]

You need to consult an attorney about your liability if you do not have evidence of your employee having a right to work here. You must re-consider posting such a topic on an online forum like this, as it could be tracked back to you as an individual.

It may be a good idea to let this thread die.

Nah, I’ll make it even easier for them to catch me. I live in Southern California and the first three numbers of my social security number are 011.

Liability could become an issue if someone were to get injured. But the project only involves pulling weeds in the backyard of my white house with a brown roof.

 

[DebChris]

As a business owner, you need to check a person’s right to work. You could face fines for knowingly hiring an illegal alien. Moreover paying less to an illegal alien than you would to citizens in need of work further contributes to exploitation of both the alien and American citizens living in poverty. As a landscaping company, do you have work that older teenagers and young adults can do? They could use the experience.

 

[TheAdvocate]

As a business owner, you need to check a person’s right to work. You could face fines for knowingly hiring an illegal alien. Moreover paying less to an illegal alien than you would to citizens in need of work further contributes to exploitation of both the alien and American citizens living in poverty. As a landscaping company, do you have work that older teenagers and young adults can do? They could use the experience.

In this case, I am not a business owner. I just need some yard work done in my own home. As far as the illegals being exploited, I don’t think so, because they cross the border and take the money home, where it is worth a lot more; more, relatively speaking, than I would have paid an American worker here.

 

[Cristiano]

As a business owner, you need to check a person’s right to work. You could face fines for knowingly hiring an illegal alien. Moreover paying less to an illegal alien than you would to citizens in need of work further contributes to exploitation of both the alien and American citizens living in poverty. As a landscaping company, do you have work that older teenagers and young adults can do? They could use the experience.

Are you saying that regular homeowners should ask for the social security number and/or other forms of ID from any kid that is willing to mow their lawn? I am not sure, but I thought that the law grants some exemptions on temporary and short term jobs.

 

[DebChris]

Are you saying that regular homeowners should ask for the social security number and/or other forms of ID from any kid that is willing to mow their lawn? I am not sure, but I thought that the law grants some exemptions on temporary and short term jobs.

I never worried about the local kid who offered to shovel my sidewalk or is willing to mow my lawn. Even kids who are under legal work age (16) want to earn money. It’s one of the ways they develop a positive work ethic.
There was a news report about a health department that closed a kids lemonade stand because it didn’t meet restaurant standards or have the appropriate business license. Imagine the public outcry.

On the other hand, I worked for a business that fired a group leader, and the INS notified, when it was discovered that he was selling forged documents. There was also forewarning, as the economy dipped, of an upcoming INS raid so that anybody who was not legal could turn in their company IDs and “quit.”

 

[Cristiano]

I never worried about the local kid who offered to shovel my sidewalk or is willing to mow my lawn. Even kids who are under legal work age (16) want to earn money. It’s one of the ways they develop a positive work ethic.
There was a news report about a health department that closed a kids lemonade stand because it didn’t meet restaurant standards or have the appropriate business license. Imagine the public outcry.

On the other hand, I worked for a business that fired a group leader, and the INS notified, when it was discovered that he was selling forged documents. There was also forewarning, as the economy dipped, of an upcoming INS raid so that anybody who was not legal could turn in their company IDs and “quit.”

I was thinking about double standards. One is the legal aspect and the other is the moral one. Honestly, when not held by specific legal requirements, I would rather offer a job to someone that is in clear need of a job over a kid that just wants to make a few extra bucks.

 

[DebChris]

I was thinking about double standards. One is the legal aspect and the other is the moral one. Honestly, when not held by specific legal requirements, I would rather offer a job to someone that is in clear need of a job over a kid that just wants to make a few extra bucks.

Kids requesting work is normally only a one time event. You don’t see as often any more the kid who pushes his lawn mower from house to house asking if he can mow the lawn.
For a more long term situation, I agree with giving the job to somebody in need. When I owned my own home, I had a couple who checked regularly to see if my grass needed mowing or my sidewalk needed to be shoveled. They were paid for each time they mowed my lawn or shoveled my sidewalk. I learned quickly that I could maintain either the inside of the house or the outside of the house by myself, but not both. When I rented, I generally shoveled my own sidewalk or paid the kid who asked if he/she could.

When I owned a vehicle, I used the car wash run by Malachi House which helps men overcome their addictions. I hired Delaney Street to move my furnishings. Yes, I removed all wine and other liquor before they arrived.

I will not say that I always look for fair trade labels on goods that I buy, but I do notice them in the same way that I use cloth bags for shopping when I remember to bring them. I also tend to avoid automatic check out lines.

 

[Psalm_51]

A very good and thought-provoking thread on illegal immigration:
forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=478819

 

[apym]

Yes, it is immoral. It is also illegal. It is immoral because it is illegal. It is also immoral to hire illegals rather than our own countrymen. If one wants yard work done, we have traditionally hired neighborhood kids. That helps everyone out. I further believe the Church has the obligation to uphold the laws of the USA. Hence, the Church should take a public stand against illegal immigration. If the Church wants to help people out, they should do so through legal channels. As it stands, I am suspicious of people in our parish who refuse to attend American mass or learn English. The Church could help everyone out by teaching English to legal immigrants and helping send the others home. That would relieve much suspicion and help legal immigrants and thus our whole country.

 

[puzzleannie]

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Now I have a landscaping job that would be quite expensive for me to complete, and money is tight–but it has to be done. Would it be wrong for me to dig up some illegals? It would help them, it would help me. Win/win–unless it’s immoral. Is it?

if it is illegal where you live, yes it would be sinful, and incidentally the fundamental contributor to the problem this country is having with illegal immigration. If employers did not hire them they would not come (except the drug dealers, and they already have “employers”). If the same penalties were lodged against the employers of illegals as against the migrantes themselves the problem would go away over night.

 

[jimcintosh]

This has nothing to do with the plight of illegal immigrants in this country, and everything to do with your moral obligation as a citizen of this country to abide by and uphold the laws of your country, even if it is inconvenient for you.

We are, as is often the case, torn between the laws of the country and God’s law.

The laws of the country tell us that abortion is a constitutional right. God’s law tells us differently.

The laws of the country tell us that divorce is legal. God’s law (Mark 10:2-12 and Luke 16:18) tells us that it is not.

The laws of the country tell us not to care for the alien among us. God’s law (cf Lv 19:10; 23:22; Dt 14:29; 24:19-20; 26:11-12; Ex 23:9 cf Ex 22:21; Dt 24:14, 15; Lv 24:22; Dt 1:16; 24:17: 27:19; Lv 19:33-34 cf Dt 10:19; and Lk 10:25-37) is again in opposition. In Matthew 25, we are even told that at the final judgement, one criteria will be how we welcome the foreigner!

Ordinarily, the laws of the land should be obeyed. When they conflict with God’s law, however, they must be disobeyed.

‘For the Lord your God is God of gods and the Lord of lords, the great God, mighty and awesome, who shows no partiality and accepts no bribes. He defends the cause of the fatherless and the widow, and loves the alien, giving him food and clothing.’ (Dr 10:17-18)

 

[puzzleannie]

if it is illegal where you live, yes it would be sinful, and incidentally the fundamental contributor to the problem this country is having with illegal immigration. If employers did not hire them they would not come (except the drug dealers, and they already have “employers”). If the same penalties were lodged against the employers of illegals as against the migrantes themselves the problem would go away over night.

OP made it sound like you have a landscaping business, was that deliberate?
the law covers such situations as temporary or casual labor, and who is exempt from this an other laws such as tax withholding. my advice still stands, if it is illegal it is also sinful, check the law in your area and specific to your situation. Obeying your country’s laws in this matter is about respect for God-given authority and the plight of the immigrant is neither here nor there, just a red herring. You are not making a judgment about an individual or class of individuals when you comply with labor and tax laws. this is not about divorce laws, so don’t throw in unrelated topics. This is not even about laws defining who is or is not an illegal immigrant, that also is another topic. OP asked specifically about the morality of hiring someone in defiance of labor and tax laws, so let’s stick to cases, shall we?

if you want to throw bible quotes around it also says the laborer is worthy of his hire. OP proposes hiring an illegal precisely because he plans to pay them less than a documented worker, and that is the heart of the immorality, the exploitation.

 

[John_Pascendi]

I used to be quite judgmental of illegal immigrants until I visited the old country of my parents in Eastern Europe. There I learned that my cousins were illegals in many countries of Western Europe. After I saw how deplorable their living conditions were, I became much less judgmental.

Now I have a landscaping job that would be quite expensive for me to complete, and money is tight–but it has to be done. Would it be wrong for me to dig up some illegals? It would help them, it would help me. Win/win–unless it’s immoral. Is it?

…its always good to use buzz words like ‘judgemental’ the implies one is cruel and mean-spirited etc…my parents came over from southern Italy ,the poorest of the poor and they could not wait to learn english,go to nite school and become citizens…they were proud to be part of the system not use the system! I pay Fed,State,County,Town,school and property taxes,a medical plan,children I sent to Catholic schools for the local public school is a sick joke. Thus I had to still pay school taxes for seats my children did not sit in! I can only work on a scale that gives me a chance to pay the above plus get some food for the table…illegals like you want to hire put me out of work…how quaint!Also people who sneak into a country may bring diseases like TB etc that once we wiped out …oh its a lotta fun to destroy a nation…and if one objects one is…just use the words quoted above…rascist is always on hand in case one is bored.the question is …why would the establishment want this nation to be invaded by hordes of people cheating…this must be an advantage for them…our rulers…lets wait and see what we can believe…shhhhhhhh

 

[havana1]

There’s an Hispanic woman, primary language Spanish, who I sometimes hire to clean my apt when it gets too messy and have no qualms whatsoever about calling her back to dust and vacuum and clean. I would never ask for her ID. (And I seriously doubt she would have any legal or obligation to comply with such a request, since I’m a private citizen - not a law enforcement professional.) That would be extremely rude and uncharitable, particularly after a ‘services rendered’ relationship has already been established.

 

[1catholic]

I used to be quite judgmental of illegal immigrants until I visited the old country of my parents in Eastern Europe. There I learned that my cousins were illegals in many countries of Western Europe. After I saw how deplorable their living conditions were, I became much less judgmental.

Now I have a landscaping job that would be quite expensive for me to complete, and money is tight–but it has to be done. Would it be wrong for me to dig up some illegals? It would help them, it would help me. Win/win–unless it’s immoral. Is it?

money is tight? higher illegals?

 

[havana1]

,why would the establishment want this nation to be invaded by hordes of people cheating…this must be an advantage for them…our rulers…lets wait and see what we can believe…shhhhhhhh

“Invaded?” Oh, and that’s not a buzzword, too?

Invade (verb): to enter forcefully as an enemy; go into with hostile intent.

Migrants crossing miles of desert, often with no sign of water anywhere in sight, are entering our country forcefully? Riiiiiight.

 

[Stylites]

No, it’s not immoral to hire an undocumented immigrant, and it’s not your job to vet the status of any casual laborer you might hire, and it’s always good to engage your neighbors in commerce.

Be advised, though, that undocumented labor does not come cheap. These fellows know what they are worth, and after trying to get the EDD referrals and kids to do an honest days’ work, you’ll be happy getting the job done quickly and fairly with any of these hard-workers, even though you’ll have to pay more for it.