Is it really "natural"...To stop masturbating?

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=) Thanks! Let’s just hope I can go that long.
If I may interject… and please forgive me if I this is out of place… but I really strongly believe that it is very difficult to kick the habit by taking longer and longer breaks from it. What this does–or at least did for me–was to make me think after a particularly long period that I had done well so far, and can’t be expected to go any longer without doing it–after all, I had never gone this long before, and, frankly, I had earned it! (You see all the different lines of attack my temptation used).

Consider, at least, making your thinking this way: “My streak of being free from this sin is already this long. If I fail now, I must start over, I will be back to square one. Let’s keep this streak going.”

I certainly cannot claim this will work for everyone, but I really wonder if I would be free of the sin today had I planned on taking longer and longer breaks from it. The hesitation to breaking my now-very-long streak is now often what saves me. Just a thought!
 
Good point. Also try to pray often (Rosary, Chaplet of Divine Mercy, Angelus) and if you used to masturbate at a certain time (before school, after school, before bed) instead plan to pray during that time. I found it much more difficult to perform an act that I knew was wrong when I had just prayed.
 
Please name some of these animals that are homosexuals. You will find that none of them engage in homosexual sex. Two males or two females may work or live together for a time, but their is reason for it, namely to preserve their species. Also, in Genesis we know two things: That God created male and female and only a man and a woman can unite as one; second that animals are less than humans, because humans were created in Gods image. To compare us to animals doesn’t make sense on so many levels. Animals act on instinct, they kill each other without remorse, infanticide, etc.

God did make anyone gay. There is no gay gene. The human genome project is complete and no gay gene was found. As hard as it is to except, being gay is a choice. It may not seem like one, because of the way society influences us, but it is. You can be “homosexual” and still go to heaven, so long as you do not engage in homosexual behavior, this is just like any other sin. The desire of Lust may appear when I see an attractive woman, but I know I am to push those feelings down. If I act on my desire, then I have sinned.
Zing! You sure told them! I don’t think I can argue your points… Ha! Just kidding!

Ever been present when Mitch the dog tried, you know… with Marly the dog?
We are animals and do all the things stated for “lower” animals as well.
Genetic imprinting doesn’t require a specific gene. There is no gene that generates
alcoholics but the offspring of boozer parents are likely to sire boozing kids. (Studies with twins confirmed this point.)
It’s okay to believe what the Church says, live long and prosper I say. But realize it is a minority opinion that is not supported by real-world experience.

Blessed be, Dousias
 
I honestly hope it’s not too late to talk about the original topic of this thread.

Dan: I feel your pain. I can’t say I know exactly what you’re going through, but I hope that I can help in some way by sharing what I’ve gone through with masturbation. I’m sixteen. I don’t know if that makes what I have to say more relevant or not, but I’m throwing that out there anyway.

I found out masturbation was a mortal sin a looooong time ago, back in the Seventh Grade, when I’d already gotten used to doing it on a daily basis. I did try to quit after I found out, but my first (pathetic) attempt lasted less than twenty-four hours. I gave up after that for years. I even tried to rationalize my way into thinking masturbation was fine–I said stuff like “Well, the pope never said it was mortal sin while speaking ex cathedra, so I don’t have to believe it is.” Of course, as time passed and I learned more and more about the nature of the church and the doctrinal continuity it validly claims from antiquity, I slowly realized that there was no rationalizing my way out of the sinfulness of masturbation.

I decided to quit back in June, when I was still fifteen. It was hard, and I messed up a couple of times after deciding to quit. But I’ve been “clean” for over five months now. So, what I’d like to say is that it isn’t impossible to kick the habit. You can expect to still feel sexual desires and urges constantly, but whatever. You learn to brush them aside. That’ll probably come off sounding like nonsense, and I get it. It’s hard to retrain yourself to think in less sexual ways, especially when you’re sixteen (and I don’t think being one year older would make much of a difference). And the urges themselves never go away, but the way your respond to them–by learning to brush them aside–can indeed change.

Of course, I guess your situation is complicated by the whole being gay thing. In the end, it doesn’t really make a difference, because we’ll (hopefully) all be in Heaven, and there’s no such thing as sex up there. But here it does. Knowing you won’t be able to marry or have a family or sex… That has to be awful. If you’ve already guessed, I’m straight, so I probably do have some trouble imagining how deep the implications of being gay are for a Catholic. But you just have to pull through in that situation, as others have to when faced with difficult situations as well. That’s a lot easier said than done, but “God will not allow you to be tempted beyond your strength,” and resistance is possible. Humans always seek love, and I get that. I want a girlfriend and stuff like that. But we have to remember that we as human beings seek love only because we are ordered towards the ultimate love, God. It is in Him that we find fulfillment in that regard.

I said before that I probably do have some trouble imagining how deep the implications of being gay are for a Catholic. Actually, I’m not too oblivious in that regard. You said before that you “realized that [you] liked guys around the saaaame time every other guy knew they liked girls.” Actually, I sort of went through the same thing. I remember back in Sixth or Seventh grade, when every other guy I knew started becoming infatuated with girls, I was being drawn towards guys. Sure, I said I was straight, but it felt like a denial. I was sure that at some point, I’d have to admit that I liked guys and was gay. And heck, this feeling persisted until the time I turned fifteen or so. I don’t know exactly what happened, but since then I became largely uninterested in guys and increasingly more attracted to girls, to the point where I can now say I’m straight and definitively mean what I’m saying. Every time I said it before felt like a lie. From what you’ve said, I don’t expect that a similar thing will happen to you, so I only say this to illustrate that I sort of (and only sort of) get what it means to be gay and Catholic, because previously I became convinced that I’d end up gay. But I would like to say that our obligation is first and foremost towards God, and that, despite who we’re attracted to, we don’t know what he holds for us in the future. We just have to trust that he’ll see that things work out.
 
But realize it is a minority opinion that is not supported by real-world experience.
Oh we Catholics are very aware that our opinions are in the minority. Truth, of course, is not determined by the swaying pendulum of public opinion. And of course, any “real-world experience” can be seen as subjective, irrelevant to discussion on matters of fundamental and objective truth, especially in regards to objective morality. And don’t worry, we’re quite experienced with holding the minority opinion. Way back before Constantine came along, a lot of us died for adhering to that minority opinion, and the Church suffered greatly for the sake of Truth.

“[The Catholic Church] is the only thing that frees a man from the degrading slavery of being a child of his age.” - GK Chesterton
 
phoenix, you sound like a level headed and very intelligent 16 year old. If you did not say you were 16 I would have never guessed you were not an adult.
 
phoenix, you sound like a level headed and very intelligent 16 year old. If you did not say you were 16 I would have never guessed you were not an adult.
Eh, I like to think I have a way with words. I’m planning to be an English major.
 
Hats off to Phoenix for the excellent post.

To Pfeffer:

It does not really matter what caused homosexuality: the main thing that matters is that we know that the lust connected to it can never be morally acceptable.

And remember to view chastity not only by means of “abstinence”, i.e. saying “no” to sex, but deciding for something greater. Suppressing urges will probably just lead to a building up of pressure and will lead to something bad the sooner or later.
I can speak of experience since I have come to value chastity. Though it’s not always easy, I do know what freedom and peace one gets from it: and that peace is much better than any sexual activity.

As a person attracted to persons of the same sex, just view your life as a more direct preparation for heaven where there is no marriage or sex at all. Don’t view it as tyranny, but a chance given to you to make a great good out of your sacrifice.

😉
 
I think that telling gay people that the only way they can be right in the eyes of God is by denying themselves a way to show love promotes self hate and will likely lead to hatred of the Catholic Church. And to be honest, if I was gay, I would say good riddance and be done with the church. It is like a black man wanting to stay with the KKK. Jesus never said anything about masturbation or homosexuality. It was barely mentioned in the rest of the NT. Yet it is such a big sin. In my opinion the Church’s view on homosexuality is despicable and doesn’t reflect Jesus’ teachings.
 
I think that telling gay people that the only way they can be right in the eyes of God is by denying themselves a way to show love promotes self hate and will likely lead to hatred of the Catholic Church. And to be honest, if I was gay, I would say good riddance and be done with the church. It is like a black man wanting to stay with the KKK. Jesus never said anything about masturbation or homosexuality. It was barely mentioned in the rest of the NT. Yet it is such a big sin. In my opinion the Church’s view on homosexuality is despicable and doesn’t reflect Jesus’ teachings.
You are allowed to think what ever you want. I can think the earth is flat, or at the center of the universe, but that doesn’t change the truth.

To be right in the eyes of God is to follow His commands, not our own. This seems to be a fundamental concept you are struggling with. You can either submit to God’s will and follow his commands, or rebel.

Comparing the church to the KKK is disingenuous. The KKK hates black people and wants to murder them. God and Church have an unending love for mankind, even though we are sinners.

Please stop claiming that simply because Jesus did not mention it, or only mentioned it once, means that it must be okay. The lack of Jesus teaching something neither proves it is okay, nor does it prove it is not okay. Christians look to the bible (Old and New Testament) as well as tradition to figure out what Jesus meant in His teachings as well as those things which He did not explicitly teach about. The Old Testament is very clear on homosexuality. The New Testament only reaffirms this teaching.

"…Male and female He created them. And God blessed them, and God said to them, “Be fruitful and multiply…” Gen 1:27-28

And we have Jesus Himself saying, “…Have you not read that he who made them from the beginning made them male and female, and said, ‘For this reason a man shall leave his father and mother and be joined to his wife, and the two shall become one’? So they are no longer two but one.” Matt 19:4-6

We also see their is something very special about marriage, a mystery as the church calls it, “The two become one.” This is central to why God created us. Homosexuals can not achieve this, it is impossible.
 
"…Male and female He created them. And God blessed them, and God said to them, “Be fruitful and multiply…” Gen 1:27-28

And we have Jesus Himself saying, “…Have you not read that he who made them from the beginning made them male and female, and said, ‘For this reason a man shall leave his father and mother and be joined to his wife, and the two shall become one’? So they are no longer two but one.” Matt 19:4-6

We also see their is something very special about marriage, a mystery as the church calls it, “The two become one.” This is central to why God created us. Homosexuals can not achieve this, it is impossible.
Those two quotes that you say condemns sexuality condemn celibate priests just as much. And I don’t know how you could argue that to be honest, because the quotes are saying that men and women should join to become one. Well gay people as well as priests don’t do that.

Also, what does “The two become one” have to do with gender? How is it impossible for a man to become one with another man?
 
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Therefore, God handed them over to degrading passions. Their females exchanged natural relations for unnatural,
27
and the males likewise gave up natural relations with females and burned with lust for one another. Males did shameful things with males and thus received in their own persons the due penalty for their perversity.

Saint Paul, Romans chapter 1, discussing sin.
 
Those two quotes that you say condemns sexuality condemn celibate priests just as much. And I don’t know how you could argue that to be honest, because the quotes are saying that men and women should join to become one. Well gay people as well as priests don’t do that.

Also, what does “The two become one” have to do with gender? How is it impossible for a man to become one with another man?
Truly this demonstrates your lack of understanding on Catholic teachings about sex (I am not saying this in a bad way, I lacked just as much understand no more than a few months ago.)

First: How does what I say “condemn sexuality”?

I can not do justice to the subject on a forum. This is not a cop-out. It would be like you asking me to explain Calculus. I can teach you it, but not in the next 10 min.

As for homosexuals being one, it is just not possible given the complementary nature of man and woman. How exactly is it possible for two males (or females) to become one? I say it is possible for a male and female through sexual intercourse. This physical act is part of becoming one. There is also a spiritual union when a man and woman have sex as well.

Seriously, I paid $4 for the book in my signature. It can explain everything. You could probably read it in a day or two. But it, read it, then you will understand the Churches teaching, and then we can debate.
 
26
Therefore, God handed them over to degrading passions. Their females exchanged natural relations for unnatural,
27
and the males likewise gave up natural relations with females and burned with lust for one another. Males did shameful things with males and thus received in their own persons the due penalty for their perversity.

Saint Paul, Romans chapter 1, discussing sin.
Thank you. I bolded the important part. This isn’t talking about monogamous, loving, homosexual relationships. This is talking about people lusting.
 
Truly this demonstrates your lack of understanding on Catholic teachings about sex (I am not saying this in a bad way, I lacked just as much understand no more than a few months ago.)

First: How does what I say “condemn sexuality”?

I can not do justice to the subject on a forum. This is not a cop-out. It would be like you asking me to explain Calculus. I can teach you it, but not in the next 10 min.

As for homosexuals being one, it is just not possible given the complementary nature of man and woman. How exactly is it possible for two males (or females) to become one? I say it is possible for a male and female through sexual intercourse. This physical act is part of becoming one. There is also a spiritual union when a man and woman have sex as well.

Seriously, I paid $4 for the book in my signature. It can explain everything. You could probably read it in a day or two. But it, read it, then you will understand the Churches teaching, and then we can debate.
I meant condemns homosexuality.
 
Truly this demonstrates your lack of understanding on Catholic teachings about sex (I am not saying this in a bad way, I lacked just as much understand no more than a few months ago.)

First: How does what I say “condemn sexuality”?

I can not do justice to the subject on a forum. This is not a cop-out. It would be like you asking me to explain Calculus. I can teach you it, but not in the next 10 min.

As for homosexuals being one, it is just not possible given the complementary nature of man and woman. How exactly is it possible for two males (or females) to become one? I say it is possible for a male and female through sexual intercourse. This physical act is part of becoming one. There is also a spiritual union when a man and woman have sex as well.

Seriously, I paid $4 for the book in my signature. It can explain everything. You could probably read it in a day or two. But it, read it, then you will understand the Churches teaching, and then we can debate.
Men have anal sex. They are “one” just as much as men and women having heterosexual sex. 2 women can be inside each other too. I mean you guys think oral sex IS sex, but it isn’t when it is 2 guys or 2 girls doing it?
 
Originally Posted by GeorgeSword View Post
26
Therefore, God handed them over to degrading passions. Their females exchanged natural relations for unnatural,
27
and the males likewise gave up natural relations with females and burned with lust for one another. Males did shameful things with males and thus received in their own persons the due penalty for their perversity.
Saint Paul, Romans chapter 1, discussing sin.
Thank you. I bolded the important part. This isn’t talking about monogamous, loving, homosexual relationships. This is talking about people lusting.
But I have highlighted the other important part 😃
 
Men have anal sex. They are “one” just as much as men and women having heterosexual sex. 2 women can be inside each other too. I mean you guys think oral sex IS sex, but it isn’t when it is 2 guys or 2 girls doing it?
Nope, we do not think oral sex is sex. We think it can be part of sex, but by itself it is unnatural.

Anal sex is also unnatural and while not condemned by the church for males and females, the church does make some strong arguments against it. First it is dirty, literally. All kinds of medical problems can come about from it. Second, why have sex that way when you have another more natural way?

Also be aware that the church says a male MUST ejaculate inside of the female vagina. So if a guy is have anal sex with woman, he still need to have vaginal sex. This is pretty gross.

Same-sex sex is not the same “oneness” as male and female sex simply because God created us this way.
 
Did you watch the video I posted? It is a documented fact that both males and females in the animal kingdom have homosexual sex. It is on VIDEO. And it isn’t just to get rid of old sperm. Please watch the video.
Sorry to go back to an old post but…

Who cares what animals do? Animals kill and eat each other. Some animals kill and eat their own young. Does that mean it’s ok for us to do the same?

Why do people seem to think sex is the only or best way to show and experience love? Jesus is the most loving human possible (also divine of course) and he never experienced any form of sex.

Dan: Keep it up, good job! I’m at 6.5 weeks now myself. I’ve started going to confession to confess lustful thoughts and such, to stop it before it goes any further. It helps a lot.
 
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