Is it really "natural"...To stop masturbating?

[fbl9]

Sorry to go back to an old post but…

Who cares what animals do? Animals kill and eat each other. Some animals kill and eat their own young. Does that mean it’s ok for us to do the same?

Why do people seem to think sex is the only or best way to show and experience love? Jesus is the most loving human possible (also divine of course) and he never experienced any form of sex.

Dan: Keep it up, good job! I’m at 6.5 weeks now myself. I’ve started going to confession to confess lustful thoughts and such, to stop it before it goes any further. It helps a lot.

and another:thumbsup: for the last of the post.

 

[Prodigal_Son]

Touche! I just don’t know though! I told you the facts, and everything I said was true…But what I don’t know is exactly when it started or why I’m like this. Gosh, the mysteries of life.

Dan,

As I mentioned earlier, I went through much the same thing you’re going through, although I developed a much stronger addiction than you seem to have. When I was your age, I was terrified that I would either live my life lonely or enter the gay lifestyle, neither of which appealed to me. At any rate, as you’re discussing why God would put you through this, I thought I might share with you some of my reflections from years ago. If they help, great. If not, no biggie.

My mind is clever enough to invent ten thousand reasons for my development, but my reasons are of no account. Only God knows the true reason. Only God knows the secret workings of the sublime but deceitful human heart.

And that’s where the trouble comes in. God is the problem. God is the thorn in my side. For whatever I experience in this life has been either ordained or permitted by Him. He had many options as far as what kind of life to give me, and He chose to create me and to create the world in such a way that I would experience the strong and forbidden attractions that I feel. If they are perversions, I can understand that and cope with that intellectually, but my intellect has nothing to do with how I feel.

I feel betrayed.

The God I know, the God I need, the God I long for—He is loving. He is constantly blessing us, and His grace makes each and every ounce of evil in the world irrelevant. He does not give us what we deserve, but rearranges the fabric of the universe that we might be drawn into meaningful relationship with Him. He is all good; he is the definition of good; there is no good apart from Him.

And yet I suffer. The cause of my suffering was never chosen by me—I never chose to feel homosexual attractions. Nor, so far as I can tell, was I born with them. They developed.

I am forced to the conclusion that God intended such a development. God could have averted me from them, but He chose not to.

More has been written about homosexuality—from every conceivable perspective—than could possibly be read in a lifetime, but very little of it is of any real use to a person in my position. Almost everything about the topic is up for debate, and being debated passionately, as if people’s lives depended on it. And, I suppose, people’s lives do depend upon—and perhaps their eternal souls depend on it (which is a very sobering thought).

And yet, despite all this sound and fury, there is very little that is obviously known about the subject. I figure that before I dive headlong into what you and I can do about it—how we will prevail in this battle we are fighting—we should grasp on to what we do know. Once we find our bearings there, we can and must venture into the unknown.

Firstly, we know that homosexuality is a modern invention. Men and women have sought out sexual partners of the same sex throughout documented history, but concept of fixed “homosexuality” is a new one, and largely a political development. The homosexual movement began as a shocking (and therefore magnetic) subculture through the late 19th and early 20th centuries, and defined itself in opposition to the newly invented “heterosexual” majority.

Secondly, we know that it is common for people to have attractions to people of their own sex. (Notice I say “common,” not “normal.”) I am not here to quote statistics, and existing statistics about this are so biased they’re not worth quoting. Suffice it to say that many, many people experience these attractions—and even more extreme, more “perverse” attractions. Although not universal, they are “common to man,” as even the Bible acknowledges (1 Cor 10:13).

Thirdly, we know that these attractions are usually not exclusive. Just because I feel sexually attracted to a man once or twice does not make me “gay.” I may often experience more intense sexual feelings toward people of my own sex, but that does not invalidate my feelings of sexual attraction to the opposite sex. Most self-defined “gay” people are technically “bisexual,” feeling attractions to people of both sexes, although the one attraction may be more intense.

Fourthly, we know that feelings of sexual attraction are—at least to some degree—fluid and changeable. A fetish, for example, is not an inborn behavior, but a learned behavior. People can be taught—or can teach themselves—to associate certain types of individuals or certain objects with their own sexual gratification. This is why a disproportionate number of sexually abused boys become homosexual—against their own volition, their sexual gratification has become associated with close contact with men.

Finally, we know that—although the object of sexual desire can be changed—such changes are extraordinarily difficult once a powerful initial attraction is established. It is extremely unlikely that a person who experiences an almost exclusive attraction to men today will have completely eliminated such attractions entirely in five or ten years—no matter how hard he might try. Sexual desire may be fluid, but it is not shallow, and it cannot simply be tossed aside.

 

[Prodigal_Son]

Continued…

And, since it cannot be tossed aside, it must be dealt with. (This, by the way, is where we enter the unknown.) At first, it might seem that this is an easy decision. I feel attractions toward people of the same sex. Therefore, I will either accept and pursue these attractions, becoming “gay,” or I will reject these attractions and pursue something else—whether it be marriage or some sort of single vocation.

Simple enough, right?

Wrong. Think about it. What if I decide to pursue a gay lifestyle and undertake the painful task of coming out, only to discover that I am still just as miserable? Or what if I get married, only to discover that my same-sex desires only intensify, and I am making my wife miserable? Or what if I stay single, and I have to live with this terrible feeling of loneliness forever?

The decisions I am faced with are anything but simple. They are horribly complicated, and quite perplexing. There is no easy way out, only arduous and uncertain ones. When you take into account the extreme nature of the decisions I am faced with, it should hardly be surprising that I will choose—at least temporarily—to delay my decision, to stall for more time. I am Hamlet: given the choice between killing my uncle, killing myself, or forgiving us both, I choose to wait and see.

In the meantime, I must distract myself from my decision. I live in Limbo, and I make the best of it. Sometimes I succumb to temptation; sometimes I resist. I feel rightly guilty for the anguish I am causing myself, but I misdirect my guilt.

I begin to hate myself. I am terribly ashamed of my attractions, but my shame has no effect on my actions. If anyone knew everything about me, they would hate me. And even if they didn’t hate me, they should. I have such potential, yes, but it is all for naught. I am eternally deserving of my own hatred.

This is the fundamental lie the devil uses to deceive us into sin. The Bible tells us to hate what is evil. We see evil inside ourselves, and we hate ourselves. But there is a flaw in our thinking. For, however we may contain evil, we are fundamentally good, and no amount of sin will ever take that away. True, we may not be worthy of love, but God has chosen to love us. And if I say that I will not love what God loves, then I am placing my opinion over His, and I am wrong to do so.

I may or may not deserve hatred. Be that as it may, I must choose to love myself—that is the only way.

Choosing love instead of hate is a difficult call. I cannot pick and choose which parts of me I am going to love and which parts I am going to hate. Hatred is a poison; if I hate one aspect of myself, I will gradually come to hate every other aspect. Love is a catalyst; if I really love one portion of myself, I will gradually come to love myself entirely. Hook, line, and sinker.

Even the portions I don’t like. It came as such a tremendous revelation to me that I must love the part of me that feels homosexual attractions. I cannot emphasize this enough. I had spent so much of my life rejecting these attractions on the one hand, and giving in to them on the other. This led me to self-hatred.

When I began to truly love myself, I realized that I must accept my sexual desires as a part of me—a part that I would now begin the work of loving. This acceptance is a truly revolutionary influence on the human soul.

Don’t get me wrong: accepting desires does not mean acting on them. There is a tremendous difference between the person who wants another person’s wife and an adulterer, between the person who feels the urge to steal and a thief. It is not necessary—in fact, it is counterproductive—for a person to deny what it is they want. But it is often very necessary and productive indeed for a person to deny themselves the carrying out of their desire.

It is freeing to live in a world where I can feel an attraction toward another man and be OK with it. In the long term, I may want these attractions to go away. I may even seek out ways of eliminating them. But in the short term, I will not let the devil lead me down the wide and easy path of self-hatred. I may not like everything about who I am, but I am who I am, and loving myself for who I am where I am is the first step on the road to freedom.

~ ~ ~

Once I have taken the daring step of loving myself, then I am more firmly positioned to face up to my decisions. Back when I hated myself, what reason was there to face this decision? None. I could continue in a sort of neurotic fashion to move between extremes of self-indulgence and self-loathing. I could repent a thousand times, and sin a thousand and one. There was no impetus to define who I was, because I already knew all there was to know. Or so I thought.

Now I know that I am basically good. I have things about myself which confuse me and make my future uncertain. As long as I allow myself to remain in confusion and uncertainty, I will be lonely, and I will immerse myself in the misery of an aimless life. Now that I love myself, I cannot allow this situation to go on unresolved. I must make a decision, perhaps not a simple decision, but a decision that will give my life meaning and direction. A decision that will allow me to be me.

If you are faced right now with this decision, I want you to know that I am right here beside you. I am terribly afraid, I admit. And yet I have some degree of confidence. Because it seems to me that an almighty and a loving God would never lead sincere people like you and me into a place where they could not choose wisely. Still, God never promised our decisions would be easy.

 

[StillWondering]

It is about saying Yes to God through what Christ teaches through the apostles to us.

 

[fbl9]

Prodigal son: that was a very excellent post no doubt about it.
How many yrs did it take you to come to your understanding.
My struggle with mb and porn has led me to feel the way you exspressed in your post,the self hatred,loathing,…anguish , repentence…why God? what is wrong with me?
why can’t you just take this desire away from me,why can’t i just chop off the part that i hate, since starting to thank God for my “drive” has the “pressure” started to ease.and without the hatred of that part my marital relations are more enjoyable…it took me about 2.5yrs to stop throwing my desire at God’s feet saying take it , i don’t want it.

 

[Prodigal_Son]

Prodigal son: that was a very excellent post no doubt about it.
How many yrs did it take you to come to your understanding.
My struggle with mb and porn has led me to feel the way you exspressed in your post,the self hatred,loathing,…anguish , repentence…why God? what is wrong with me?
why can’t you just take this desire away from me,why can’t i just chop off the part that i hate, since starting to thank God for my “drive” has the “pressure” started to ease.and without the hatred of that part my marital relations are more enjoyable…it took me about 2.5yrs to stop throwing my desire at God’s feet saying take it , i don’t want it.

Well, I had a major shake-up in my life about seven years ago, when I was 24. I ended up in counseling, and I opened up about my struggle to my family. Shortly after all that, I wrote the above journals – and actually quite a few more. (At the time, I had the idea to write a book. The best laid plans…)

Once I stopped judging myself for my attractions and my brokenness, I still had a major decision to make. I had stopped feeling guilty for being attracted to men, and I felt a tremendous freedom. I realized, in my bones, the difference between being tempted and sinning. It became easier to resist the lure of pornography. Unfortunately, I let down my guard some time after this realization, and the addiction came back, although in a weaker form.

A year and a half later, I got married. Now, three children later, I am finally in a place where I feel powerfully freed from sexual sin. And it was just like that, simple as pie, one day I just wanted to show my devotion to my family more than I wanted to indulge my flesh. I still deal with temptation, but my life has been blessed abundantly.

Interesting detail, though: battling sin, and failing, kept me from seeking God. Since I have been freed, I have questioned God more, and felt more lost sometimes. But I am free from the self-hatred and division that acting out brought upon me. This freedom is a testament to the faithfulness of God, certainly not to my own efforts.

 

[prettylarge]

Well, I had a major shake-up in my life about seven years ago, when I was 24. I ended up in counseling, and I opened up about my struggle to my family. Shortly after all that, I wrote the above journals – and actually quite a few more. (At the time, I had the idea to write a book. The best laid plans…)

Once I stopped judging myself for my attractions and my brokenness, I still had a major decision to make. I had stopped feeling guilty for being attracted to men, and I felt a tremendous freedom. I realized, in my bones, the difference between being tempted and sinning. It became easier to resist the lure of pornography. Unfortunately, I let down my guard some time after this realization, and the addiction came back, although in a weaker form.

A year and a half later, I got married. Now, three children later, I am finally in a place where I feel powerfully freed from sexual sin. And it was just like that, simple as pie, one day I just wanted to show my devotion to my family more than I wanted to indulge my flesh. I still deal with temptation, but my life has been blessed abundantly.

Interesting detail, though: battling sin, and failing, kept me from seeking God. Since I have been freed, I have questioned God more, and felt more lost sometimes. But I am free from the self-hatred and division that acting out brought upon me. This freedom is a testament to the faithfulness of God, certainly not to my own efforts.

Are you more attracted to your wife than you are to males?

 

[Prodigal_Son]

Are you more attracted to your wife than you are to males?

Gee, that’s an appropriate question, isn’t it?

Sometimes yes, sometimes no. On a purely visual level, there are quite a number of men and women that I might find more attractive than my wife. No one I’ve ever met fills up my soul and my senses like my wife; she is my lover, and when I give her myself in the gift of sexuality, I gain much more back in the gift of her whole self to me.

 

[Pons]

Those two quotes that you say condemns [homo]sexuality condemn celibate priests just as much.

Regarding celibacy, Jesus also said in Matthew 19:12 (from the same chapter):

“For there are eunuchs, who were born so from their mother’s womb: and there are eunuchs, who were made so by men: and there are eunuchs, who have made themselves eunuchs for the kingdom of heaven. He that can take, let him take it.” (Douay-Rheims translation)

Some are incapable of marriage because they were born so; some, because they were made so by others; some, because they have renounced marriage for the sake of the kingdom of heaven. Whoever can accept this ought to accept it." (New American Bible translation)

All kinds of extramarital sexual acts (as others have said in other words, fornication is fornication whether “straight” or “gay”) are not in sync with God’s plan.

Men have anal sex. They are “one” just as much as men and women having heterosexual sex. 2 women can be inside each other too.

This is just the physical act. It’s not complete; the humans engaging in them are not truly one until God has united them.

 

[Shlomey]

Thank you. I bolded the important part. This isn’t talking about monogamous, loving, homosexual relationships. This is talking about people lusting.

This is just so wrong!

Noone says that homosexuals cannot love. What is condemned by the Church is the sexual activity which IS done ALWAYS WITH LUST.

One can love a person without having sex, you know. At least it would be nonsensical to assume that a man not having had sex with his wife in spe did not love her prior to marriage, but does so just due to the marital act.

Christianity clearly condemns any culpable lustful thought or deed amongst homosexuals.

I am really getting annoyed of people trying to equate love with sex.

If you want to argue for love: do so, just stop trying to inject immoral lust into it!

 

[Shlomey]

Men have anal sex. They are “one” just as much as men and women having heterosexual sex. 2 women can be inside each other too. I mean you guys think oral sex IS sex, but it isn’t when it is 2 guys or 2 girls doing it?

By that token, you can also “be one” with any animal or object that has a hole fitting for your phallus.

And no, I do not think that oral sex is sex. I think it is an abuse thereof.

 

[aries13]

I am a cradle Catholic – There are many things the church teaches that I find it extremely difficult to accept. Last year I assisted with the RCIA group at my parish and it raised more questions for me – and even has made me wonder If I really believe what the church teaches. Masturbation is a normal, health expression of our human sexuality. There is no danger of going insane, or growing hair on the palms of your hands. When I was in school the nuns always told us that if we touch our selves, or have impure thoughts we were going straight to hell. There is no way I can accept that. The past several months I have been attending services with my girlfriend at a non-denominational church and for the first time in many years I really feel the Spirit.

God Bless!

Wow…Where do I begin. I see this thread taking a different direction…So let’s start with this.

So, are you saying that every divorced Catholic that gets remarried, and is living a complete, impure lifestyle…goes to hell? That is a looooot of people.

And now this.

Yes. But priests choose to live that lifestyle. Priests choose to live alone, without a lifelong companion (Let’s just call it a wife). I didn’t choose this. I didn’t choose to be gay. So I’m basically doomed to live a completely sexless life? Yeah, I’ll just be open and honest, I’m calling it doomed. And I don’t really want to hear anyone shun me for calling it that, unless they’re gay, or for some other reason cannot have sex.

Yeah, but trying isn’t really good enough, is it.

 

[OraLabora]

If you love someone, you should show your love. God wants everyone to be happy, and he made you how he made you. There is nothing wrong with a loving relationship between two people of the same sex. Don’t let the church tell you otherwise.

I agree completely. You can show your love by buying a thoughtful gift, or sharing a meal, or doing activities together such as sports, going to a museum, for walks, etc.

Indeed there is nothing wrong with a loving relationship between two people of the same sex. My spiritual director taught me that. He is a man (same sex!) that I love dearly. But like the loving father that he is towards me.

Love needs to be expressed. Absolutely agree with that. But it does not need to be expressed by having sex.

Don’t let anyone con you into believing that “love” always has to mean “having sex with”. Our popular media would have us believe that. But there are times when “having sex with” shows the exact opposite of love.

 

[chessmane4e5]

I am a cradle Catholic – There are many things the church teaches that I find it extremely difficult to accept. Last year I assisted with the RCIA group at my parish and it raised more questions for me – and even has made me wonder If I really believe what the church teaches. Masturbation is a normal, health expression of our human sexuality. There is no danger of going insane, or growing hair on the palms of your hands. When I was in school the nuns always told us that if we touch our selves, or have impure thoughts we were going straight to hell. There is no way I can accept that. The past several months I have been attending services with my girlfriend at a non-denominational church and for the first time in many years I really feel the Spirit.

God Bless!

I am sorry you had some bad experiences growing up. The nuns were wrong to say you would go “straight to hell.” Often times it is easier to say “Don’t do it because you will go to hell if you do” then to take the time to explain why. If you know that the Church says it is a sin, but do it anyway and never repent, then you are risking going to hell.

The issues of sex (everything from masturbation to contraception to homosexuality) is really quite a big one. It can not be explained in 5 minutes or less. I would suggest the book in my signature (or actually reading the entire Theology of the Body by John Paul II). While it might be true that there are no visible consequences to masturbation, it is still a sin. Going to a different church is not going to change that. The best you can do is try to educate yourself on why the Church teaches it is a sin. If you still disagree, then that is your choice.

 

[OraLabora]

Men have anal sex. They are “one” just as much as men and women having heterosexual sex. 2 women can be inside each other too. I mean you guys think oral sex IS sex, but it isn’t when it is 2 guys or 2 girls doing it?

No. There is a fundamental difference between anal sex, and normal intercourse in which procreation is not artificially barred.

In the latter case, both are “one” in that they form a single, physiological, reproductive unit. In fact in humans and all other creatures that reproduce sexually, it is the only physiological process that requires two individuals to accomplish. As such, for the purposes of the sex act, two people engaging in intercourse do in fact form a single biological unit, or process. The process cannot happen on its own, two participants are needed.

On the other hand, anal sex does not have any physiological purpose. It is not necessary for life or for the propagation of life. Life must be sustained by breathing, eating and drinking (which only requires one individual), and procreation (which requires two people).

So two men having anal sex are not “one” at all from a natural or biological standpoint. They are two individuals even though one’s genitals are inside the other’s anus. They are serving no higher purpose other than their own gratification. They are not sustaining or nurturing life in any way. They are instead misusing a faculty.

 

[Pfeffer102]

I agree completely. You can show your love by buying a thoughtful gift, or sharing a meal, or doing activities together such as sports, going to a museum, for walks, etc.

Indeed there is nothing wrong with a loving relationship between two people of the same sex. My spiritual director taught me that. He is a man (same sex!) that I love dearly. But like the loving father that he is towards me.

Love needs to be expressed. Absolutely agree with that. But it does not need to be expressed by having sex.

Don’t let anyone con you into believing that “love” always has to mean “having sex with”. Our popular media would have us believe that. But there are times when “having sex with” shows the exact opposite of love.

Okay, well this is what I’ve been asking for like, 2 pages of posts now!
So it would be okay, then, in your opinion, to have a relationship with another guy, if I found someone who felt the same thing as me? Meaning to remain chaste. Because that would make my life a whole, heck of a lot less awful. If I knew I didn’t have to be completely miserable and lonely forever.

And don’t anybody say anything to deny that! If you’re gay, and attempting to do the right thing and live a chaste life, then please, feel free to give your (name removed by moderator)ut on anything. But if you’re straight, I don’t want to hear “it doesn’t *have *to be miserable.”

Please. Spare me the annoyance.

I wanted to thank two people for their EXCELLENT posts: phoenix and Prodigal Son.
It’s overdue, but I haven’t been on here in a while.

Phoenix, It’s great to hear how well you’re doing. And thank you so much for your (name removed by moderator)ut.
Prodigal Son, your story really inspired me; it said some of the many things I’ve thought in my head that I couldn’t put into words. So thanks for that.

And now…

Day 25.
I reached my 21 day goal Saturday. They say you break a habit after 21 days, and boy are they wrong. Because Monday was AWFUL. Because I saw one of those stupid ads that said “Get ripped in a bajillion weeks!” or whatever, and I almost completely lost it right there. I don’t know how long it actually does take to break a habit; it probably doesn’t even happen. I just need to deal with it forever.
It doesn’t matter how good I live. It doesn’t matter how much I pray. It doesn’t matter how much I serve God. One time doing it, and it’s over. Mortal sin. Done.
So what’s the point.
That’s the thinking I’ve been having for the past couple weeks.
You probably won’t convince me away from it, but you can try.

I’m starting to also think you can’t be gay and Catholic. I mean, you could. In theory. Priests have to abstain from everything. But God is their life. And how great that must feel. He’s in mine too, but I have work, and school, and my extracurriculars that keep me from praying constantly to Him.

I was having a talk to my mom about this. Not about m, about being gay. and she said that she wouldn’t be surprised if I was some super, anti-Catholic liberal within a few years. Usually I’d argue with a statement like that. But unfortunately, I just told her, “I 'm not even going to deny that.”

I’m not going to deny it to you people either. I will always stay close to God. But it’s hard, and when things get hard, I quit. Call me lazy, I don’t mind, I accept that. I take the easy way out. I still will not have sex with another man. That’s just repulsive to me. I will not have sex with a woman. That’s even *more *repulsive to me. But I don’t want to be unhappy and confined forever. So I guess I just need answers on the relationship thing. Because I don’t know how much longer I’m going to last.
Why does the “One, Holy, Catholic, and Apostolic Church” have to have to many rules…
Hm.

But thanks for everyone’s prayers and support. I know you’re counting on me.
-Dan

 

[Bbigam]

Okay, well this is what I’ve been asking for like, 2 pages of posts now!
So it would be okay, then, in your opinion, to have a relationship with another guy, if I found someone who felt the same thing as me? Meaning to remain chaste. Because that would make my life a whole, heck of a lot less awful. If I knew I didn’t have to be completely miserable and lonely forever.

And don’t anybody say anything to deny that! If you’re gay, and attempting to do the right thing and live a chaste life, then please, feel free to give your (name removed by moderator)ut on anything. But if you’re straight, I don’t want to hear “it doesn’t *have *to be miserable.”

Please. Spare me the annoyance.

I wanted to thank two people for their EXCELLENT posts: phoenix and Prodigal Son.
It’s overdue, but I haven’t been on here in a while.

Phoenix, It’s great to hear how well you’re doing. And thank you so much for your (name removed by moderator)ut.
Prodigal Son, your story really inspired me; it said some of the many things I’ve thought in my head that I couldn’t put into words. So thanks for that.

No offense, but it sounds a little bit like you were just waiting for someone to give you the answer that you wanted to hear. Several other people have given you answers but they were ones that suggested you shouldn’t have such a relationship. I note that OraLabora said that he loves this spiritual director “like the loving father that he is towards me.” I may be misreading him but it doesn’t sound romantic - but I’m not clear if you are looking for romantic or just a really a close friendship. I know you said you will not have sex with another man - that’s great! But does the other man need to have same-sex attraction? Please be careful!

I will say this - I hope and pray that you can be faithful and happy and not miserable and lonely!

And now…

Day 25.
I reached my 21 day goal Saturday. They say you break a habit after 21 days, and boy are they wrong. Because Monday was AWFUL. Because I saw one of those stupid ads that said “Get ripped in a bajillion weeks!” or whatever, and I almost completely lost it right there. I don’t know how long it actually does take to break a habit; it probably doesn’t even happen. I just need to deal with it forever.
It doesn’t matter how good I live. It doesn’t matter how much I pray. It doesn’t matter how much I serve God. One time doing it, and it’s over. Mortal sin. Done.
So what’s the point.
That’s the thinking I’ve been having for the past couple weeks.
You probably won’t convince me away from it, but you can try.

I’m starting to also think you can’t be gay and Catholic. I mean, you could. In theory. Priests have to abstain from everything. But God is their life. And how great that must feel. He’s in mine too, but I have work, and school, and my extracurriculars that keep me from praying constantly to Him.

I was having a talk to my mom about this. Not about m, about being gay. and she said that she wouldn’t be surprised if I was some super, anti-Catholic liberal within a few years. Usually I’d argue with a statement like that. But unfortunately, I just told her, “I 'm not even going to deny that.”

I’m not going to deny it to you people either. I will always stay close to God. But it’s hard, and when things get hard, I quit. Call me lazy, I don’t mind, I accept that. I take the easy way out. I still will not have sex with another man. That’s just repulsive to me. I will not have sex with a woman. That’s even *more *repulsive to me. But I don’t want to be unhappy and confined forever. So I guess I just need answers on the relationship thing. Because I don’t know how much longer I’m going to last.
Why does the “One, Holy, Catholic, and Apostolic Church” have to have to many rules…
Hm.

But thanks for everyone’s prayers and support. I know you’re counting on me.
-Dan

21 days is great, congrats. I think it can be a little like alcoholism - many sober alcoholics will tell you that they have to decide each day, each time they are around alcohol, that they will remain sober - a daily battle. And most are glad that they keep fighting. Yes, some fall sometimes, unfortunately. But they pick themselves back up and keep going, and some eventually remain sober for the rest of their lives. Keep it up!

 

[Prodigal_Son]

Hi, Dan!

Thanks for the kind words. My prayer is that the Holy Spirit might speak to you through my words, and the words of the other posters here.

I reached my 21 day goal Saturday. They say you break a habit after 21 days, and boy are they wrong. Because Monday was AWFUL. Because I saw one of those stupid ads that said “Get ripped in a bajillion weeks!” or whatever, and I almost completely lost it right there. I don’t know how long it actually does take to break a habit; it probably doesn’t even happen. I just need to deal with it forever.

Well, there’s good news and bad news, here. Habits eventually do get broken, and for long periods of time you don’t even think about caving into temptation. But this can also lure you into a false sense of security, which can set you up for a fall. Remaining in Jesus and His Word can provide security, however.

It doesn’t matter how good I live. It doesn’t matter how much I pray. It doesn’t matter how much I serve God. One time doing it, and it’s over. Mortal sin. Done.

This sounds to me like scrupulosity, but I could be wrong. Virtue is a fruit of a dedicated life. You can’t obtain it by trying, and yet (paradoxically) we are commanded to try to be perfect. You might want to look at 1 John, or Hebrews. The goal is that God would transform us, from the inside out. When we are transformed, we will still be tempted, but we won’t *want *to sin. We’ll want God more.

God isn’t sitting up there with a tally sheet, chomping at the bit to send us to hell. Rather, He is constantly providing us with grace to overcome the world. He does not just forgive our sins – He forgets them. “As far as the east is from the west, so far has He cast away our sins”! And if God forgets something, doesn’t it cease to exist?

I’m starting to also think you can’t be gay and Catholic. I mean, you could. In theory. Priests have to abstain from everything. But God is their life. And how great that must feel. He’s in mine too, but I have work, and school, and my extracurriculars that keep me from praying constantly to Him.

Priests have those types of things, too. But remember: service, done in the right way, is a form of prayer. Study, in the right way, is a form of prayer. God is in the details of our lives.

I was having a talk to my mom about this. Not about m, about being gay. and she said that she wouldn’t be surprised if I was some super, anti-Catholic liberal within a few years. Usually I’d argue with a statement like that. But unfortunately, I just told her, “I 'm not even going to deny that.”

Honesty is a good sign here, actually. But you are free to choose God. Keep yourself that way.