Is it reasonable to have a dress code for liturgical ministers?

[Duesenberg]

And some people will always think that:

Their ideas are the only ideas that constitute the “good.”

Their ideas are as easy to implement as breathing.

Their ideas are always worthy of the cost involved to OTHERS!

Anyone who disagrees with their brilliance are unworthy of ministry, and obviously too thick, too self-centered, or too obstinate to see the beautiful simplicity of it all.

Thanks for trying to help me with that speck in my eye, though.

Time to move on, I think.

Just remember… When it was someone else’s idea, you were ready to leave your parish. When it was your idea, it was “Obedience is a blessed thing.” That really was a discussion ender.

 

[Gertabelle]

Gertabelle:

Look, my point is that I would seriously question the judgment of a pastor who required the ministers at mass to look like they were putting on some kind of performance. That’s just what black and white represents to me.

Mass is not a performance.

If you really feel that way and were faced with a dress code requirement then it would be best for you to find a new parish, rather than stay and attempt to cause problems.

Now, if he wanted us all to wear choir robes, I would absolutely HATE it, but of course I’d do it. Obedience is a blessed thing.

Absolutely fascinating how you state “Obedience is a blessed thing” when it’s your idea! Talk about transparent!

How do you ever manage to come up with things like this! What on earth on you talking about???

 

[Duesenberg]

Modest white top, plain black slacks or skirt and plain black dress shoes.

The choir gets it. It’s not difficult.

Done deal.

 

[DarkLight]

My only objection to this is “modest” and “white top” are a pretty impossible combination around here. There’s a reason I don’t wear white.

If the goal is to have people wear something suitable, asking for solid colors would likely suffice.

 

[Duesenberg]

My only objection to this is “modest” and “white top” are a pretty impossible combination around here. There’s a reason I don’t wear white.

If the goal is to have people wear something suitable, asking for solid colors would likely suffice.

I appreciate your comments – and of course adjustments could be made, so long as they are simple and uniform. "Modest white top, black pants or skirt and plain black shoes (no sneakers) appeals to me because it would be very simple and inexpensive to replicate for everyone.

The goal would be to have people wear clothes that are modest, appropriate (e.g. no Jack Daniel t-shirts or torn jeans) and simple to police. Jesus Christ, and those attending His sacrifice to His Father deserve that.

I’m curious, why is “modest” and “white top” a pretty impossible combination where you are?

 

[DarkLight]

Women’s clothing tends to be very thin, and white in particular has issues with being see-through for many women. Especially if, like me, button-down tops don’t really work well - they’re difficult to fit for women who are either much more or much less busty than standard. Darker solid colors are easier to find in garments that don’t show one’s bra through the top.

Tank tops are a solution, but they’re hot if the church has no a/c (I’ve been to several) and they often don’t cover bra straps very well.

 

[Duesenberg]

Women’s clothing tends to be very thin, and white in particular has issues with being see-through for many women. Especially if, like me, button-down tops don’t really work well - they’re difficult to fit for women who are either much more or much less busty than standard. Darker solid colors are easier to find in garments that don’t show one’s bra through the top.

Tank tops are a solution, but they’re hot if the church has no a/c (I’ve been to several) and they often don’t cover bra straps very well.

My brother’s Protestant parish has a simple solution. They have very nice embroidered pullovers, dress shirts and polo shirts for men and women for sale in their parish bookstore at cost. They are all wine/maroon in color. On Sundays if you’re in ministry (from a Sr. Pastor to a Jr. Usher) you wear one of their tops and Khaki pants or for women, khaki skirts is an option. Mr. & Mrs, MacLeod wear khaki kilts, but they are “special.” I works out very well.

A fair number who are not in ministry buy (they are very inexpensive) the regalia and wear it anyway on Sundays.

 

[Gertabelle]

My brother’s Protestant parish has a simple solution. They have very nice embroidered pullovers, dress shirts and polo shirts for men and women for sale in their parish bookstore at cost. They are all wine/maroon in color. On Sundays if you’re in ministry (from a Sr. Pastor to a Jr. Usher) you wear one of their tops and Khaki pants or for women, khaki skirts is an option. Mr. & Mrs, MacLeod wear khaki kilts, but they are “special.” I works out very well.

A fair number who are not in ministry buy (they are very inexpensive) the regalia and wear it anyway on Sundays.

Oh good grief! Now you want everyone wearing matching shirts?

Last I checked, the Catholic Church is not a cult, nor is it a superstore.

For what it’s worth, our confirmation class (100+ kids) has a t-shirt that they usually wear when they attend mass together. And lots of parishioners have that t-shirt as well.

So you see people all over the church wearing their “Catholic and Proud” t-shirt with jeans and sneakers… and sometimes a chapel veil.

And when any of the volunteers for the confirmation class (that takes place right after mass) are also ministers at mass, they’ll also be wearing that t-shirt and jeans as they serve on the altar.

It’s sad that some people might be completely distracted by the appearance of these parishioners serving at mass, and might not even notice the piety and faithfulness of the community.

 

[Duesenberg]

The dress code has been part of EMHC / Lector training for as long as I’ve worked for different parishes.

I’ve seen a pastor tell a woman that her top was too revealing and that she could not act as an EMHC that day.

Good for him. The female EMsHC at the Saturday Vigil Mass at my parish seem to have a contest as to who can wear the most inappropriate cocktail dress. It’s wrong.

 

[Katie777]

Having a white and black dress code does not insure modesty. Cocktail dresses, come in black and white. So you will perhaps still have the same issue as you are just changing the color, even if guidelines are set. People in your parish are disregarding them anyway.

And because of this, if a parish uses donations set aside for other needs to distribute clothing to lay ministers, it is hurting other areas. Simple budgeting, not an excuse.A few bucks does not purchase a quality outfit either.

And upthread dusenburg, your reply to me was uncharitable…and undeserved. I was sharing perspective. Perhaps your parish has an abundance of money for this, but many dont.

This is one reply and my last. So in all charity, who is the person on this thread that is squabbling?

If the question was, do u think a back and white dress code would give a more formal appeal to the mass, my answer may have been different.

 

[Proverbs]

OK, I am a little confused here.
Are you implying that because I (and others) don’t agree with you, that we are “part of the problem” and should not be allowed to be in any ministry.

And then you go on to say that some people just want to fight and that they want to control others?!
Really?!

Pot meet kettle.

 

[Duesenberg]

Having a white and black dress code does not insure modesty. Cocktail dresses, come in black and white. So you will perhaps still have the same issue as you are just changing the color, even if guidelines are set. People in your parish are disregarding them anyway.

Sure it does if you use the wording as I noted above (emphasis added):

"Modest white top, black pants or skirt and plain black shoes (no sneakers)

And because of this, if a parish uses donations set aside for other needs to distribute clothing to lay ministers, it is hurting other areas. Simple budgeting, not an excuse.A few bucks does not purchase a quality outfit either.

Absolutely not. There are people in my parish that would gladly fund this need – as they already fund other needs. You’re trying to sell a zero sum game – one side wins, one side loses and that’s simply not how it is. People do that all the time when a new church is built – “how many people could that money have fed” and it’s simply not true.

 

[Wendy1989]

Perusing through this thread leads me to say “yeash”! My parish doesn’t have a dress code for liturgical lay ministers. Whenever the subject of clothing for lay ministers is brought up, the conversations are pretty much what is being said on this thread. I just pray for common sense to prevail!

Not wearing flip-flops or ‘mule’ sandals are more for safety reasons. Catch the sandal on the edge of a step and the Precious Blood could be spilled everywhere! Not to mention the servers with flaming candles. This also goes for heels that are too high (think stiletto) and loosing footing. Nothing more embarassing than tripping and being splayed out on the floor!

There is the modesty issue with short skirts and short-shorts. When bowing to the altar, too much of what is private can show. I was just snarky enough to tell a young lady that her lacy panties were adorable. She said “I didn’t think my skirt was see-through!” I told her it wasn’t - her skirt rode up in the back as she bowed toward the altar before stepping up to do the readings. Next time she read, she decided to wear a maxi skirt.

Now to the blue jeans - khakis or chinos are a good substitute.

I was reminded of the way I dress at Mass (even just sitting in a pew) by a homeless person. This man knew where he was and made the appropriate adjustments to his attire. I saw this man enter the men’s room in a t-shirt and looking dishevelled. He was carrying his world in a duffle bag. He emerged from the men’s room wearing a pair of chinos and a long-sleeved shirt with a collar. He still had his duffle bag. This was a daily Mass - not Sunday but he knew where he was and what was going on. The Holy Spirit showed me my attitude about being at Mass needed a wardrobe adjustment.

 

[Duesenberg]

Perusing through this thread leads me to say “yeash”! My parish doesn’t have a dress code for liturgical lay ministers. Whenever the subject of clothing for lay ministers is brought up, the conversations are pretty much what is being said on this thread. I just pray for common sense to prevail!

Not wearing flip-flops or ‘mule’ sandals are more for safety reasons. Catch the sandal on the edge of a step and the Precious Blood could be spilled everywhere! Not to mention the servers with flaming candles. This also goes for heels that are too high (think stiletto) and loosing footing. Nothing more embarassing than tripping and being splayed out on the floor!

There is the modesty issue with short skirts and short-shorts. When bowing to the altar, too much of what is private can show. I was just snarky enough to tell a young lady that her lacy panties were adorable. She said “I didn’t think my skirt was see-through!” I told her it wasn’t - her skirt rode up in the back as she bowed toward the altar before stepping up to do the readings. Next time she read, she decided to wear a maxi skirt.

Now to the blue jeans - khakis or chinos are a good substitute.

I was reminded of the way I dress at Mass (even just sitting in a pew) by a homeless person. This man knew where he was and made the appropriate adjustments to his attire. I saw this man enter the men’s room in a t-shirt and looking dishevelled. He was carrying his world in a duffle bag. He emerged from the men’s room wearing a pair of chinos and a long-sleeved shirt with a collar. He still had his duffle bag. This was a daily Mass - not Sunday but he knew where he was and what was going on. The Holy Spirit showed me my attitude about being at Mass needed a wardrobe adjustment.

Excellent posting. I don’t know where the erroneous notion came from that liturgical ministers have the “right” to dress as they please – no matter how inappropriately it might be. I don’t know why some get so defensive about how some liturgical ministers dress? I’m sure it’s a psychological projection of some sort.

I remember growing up that “no blue jeans” was actually one dress code. It not only meant no jeans, it meant a button-up shirt or a sweater, no sneakers, etc. The good old days.

It’s nice that homeless gentleman provided a good example for all…