Is it right that priests go from vocation to vacation in retirement?

[Beautiful]

With a severe priest shortage that doesn’t seem to be getting any better around this neck of woods as priests continue to age and retire, I am beginning to wonder if it is right that priests retire at all. I’ve been looking at my own life and seeing that being a wife and mother since my tender early years of twenty-something my responsibility as a wife and mother has NOT subsided. It in fact has increased and is even multiplying with time due to marriages and births in the family. The last time I checked my husband was awake and shaving his morning stubble and will soon come into the kitchen for a breakfast-to-go and a filled lunch pail to take to work. And our parents are both quite aged and alive and kicking and still very much active parents, grandparents and even great-grandparents. And these aged folks are still in the loving and sometimes very trying difficult passage of life together as married people. There is no earthly time when a married couple can retire from being spouse and parent…ok…till death do we part.

Why do Catholic priests ‘retire’ away from being active in ministry - real ministry? Do they suddenly stop being responsible as priest? Does their vocation suddenly fade into thin air when they reach a magic number? This does not seem correct. I realize that some ‘retired’ priest end up residing and coexisting with another priest in some parishes but numbers suggest that most seem to disappear into the great vast land of retirement somewhere warm and sunny. What is up with this?

 

[puzzleannie]

With a severe priest shortage that doesn’t seem to be getting any better around this neck of woods as priests continue to age and retire, I am beginning to wonder if it is right that priests retire at all.
. . .
Why do Catholic priests ‘retire’ away from being active in ministry - real ministry? Do they suddenly stop being responsible as priest? Does their vocation suddenly fade into thin air when they reach a magic number? ?

a priest is a priest forever, and continues celebrating daily Mass as long as he can do it until he dies. I have been active in parish ministry for over 20 years in 4 dioceses, the last 10 yrs of that in full time paid lay ministry, and I have never met a “retired” priest in the sense of “does not live out his vocation any more and does not carry out any activie ministry” unless he is confined to a nursing home due to mental or physical disability. We have many retired priests who spend winters here, as do other Winter Texans from up north, and all participate in ministry to the extent they are able. One is a gifted retreat master, and in addition to assisting at the parish in which his retirement park is located, acts as chaplain to Catholics in the park, and offers retreats weekly around the diocese, including the priests’ retreat (week long) in February.

Most if not all provided much needed relief to pastors of parishes, who otherwise would not be able to take vacations at all, and spend their whole “vacation” moving from parish to parish. Others teach classes at the seminary or lay ministry institute, or in parishes. Others staff the confessionals at the basilica and parishes, are available for funerals and weddings, and on holy days for additional Masses, penance services etc.

As a wife and mother, my home duties have certainly diminished since my kids moved out and established their own families. I wish I lived nearer to grandkids, but even when I did, was not part of their daily lives, and we have found new ways in retirement to live out our marriage vocation, in service to children and families of this parish. It is the same for priests, nuns and other religious. They never really retire–much of the RE, spiritual direction, retreat work, social services, visiting the sick, etc etc etc in provided by “retired” religious. They retire, as in slack off, only when forced to by advancing age or infirmity, and then only with great reluctance.

if we are looking for someplace to put blame for the priest shortage, it is not on the shoulders of retired priests. We married persons should look closer to home, to Catholic couples who have contracepted two generations of priests and religious out of existence.

 

[Allen537]

With a severe priest shortage that doesn’t seem to be getting any better around this neck of woods as priests continue to age and retire, I am beginning to wonder if it is right that priests retire at all. I’ve been looking at my own life and seeing that being a wife and mother since my tender early years of twenty-something my responsibility as a wife and mother has NOT subsided. It in fact has increased and is even multiplying with time due to marriages and births in the family. The last time I checked my husband was awake and shaving his morning stubble and will soon come into the kitchen for a breakfast-to-go and a filled lunch pail to take to work. And our parents are both quite aged and alive and kicking and still very much active parents, grandparents and even great-grandparents. And these aged folks are still in the loving and sometimes very trying difficult passage of life together as married people. There is no earthly time when a married couple can retire from being spouse and parent…ok…till death do we part.

Why do Catholic priests ‘retire’ away from being active in ministry - real ministry? Do they suddenly stop being responsible as priest? Does their vocation suddenly fade into thin air when they reach a magic number? This does not seem correct. I realize that some ‘retired’ priest end up residing and coexisting with another priest in some parishes but numbers suggest that most seem to disappear into the great vast land of retirement somewhere warm and sunny. What is up with this?

Well, priest never retire from the vocation. They are always priests. But when they reach that magical age of 75, (or 70 in my order) they retire from active ministry. But, most I the retired priests I personally know are living in parishes and helping out when they can, but they are also enjoying their retirement. When they retire, neither they nor the church sees the transition as a “Pastor back to Parochial Vicar” where they are expected to keep the same hours and schedules as before.

I don’t think it is either fair or accurate to compare marriage to priesthood. Granted they are both vocations in the Church, but they are very, very different vocations. You cannot compare apples to oranges.

 

[PaulinVA]

I don’t begrudge a “retirement” to men who have sacrificed their entire life for their parishes and God’s people.

I also don’t know many priests taking cruises and such, unless it’s as the chaplain aboard the ship. Yes, there is a shortage of priests, but as you get older your energy level isn’t what it used to be. Helping out with Sunday masses and visits to hospitals in your seventies seems about right.

Do you have a specific priest in mind, or is this a general rant? Come on, I could be a married person at 75 shuffling off to take care of my spouse in the next room as best I can, but I can not put hours into an office job every day. In effect, that is what you are asking retired priests to do. Is that realistic?

 

[Beautiful]

We have many retired priests who spend winters here, as do other Winter Texans from up north, and all participate in ministry to the extent they are able.

if we are looking for someplace to put blame for the priest shortage, it is not on the shoulders of retired priests. We married persons should look closer to home, to Catholic couples who have contracepted two generations of priests and religious out of existence.

My experience here in the cold north east is that most of the retiring priests turn into permanent snowbirds in warmer sunnier climates. The few that stay tend to have blood ties anchoring them here.

And the greater question is ‘Why did two generations of couples contracept?’ Could it be there were priests that wanted to join the freedom train to retirement like the rest from those generations? Let us leave that for another thread topic.

 

[Beautiful]

I don’t begrudge a “retirement” to men who have sacrificed their entire life for their parishes and God’s people.

I also don’t know many priests taking cruises and such, unless it’s as the chaplain aboard the ship. Yes, there is a shortage of priests, but as you get older your energy level isn’t what it used to be. Helping out with Sunday masses and visits to hospitals in your seventies seems about right.

Do you have a specific priest in mind, or is this a general rant? Come on, I could be a married person at 75 shuffling off to take care of my spouse in the next room as best I can, but I can not put hours into an office job every day. In effect, that is what you are asking retired priests to do. Is that realistic?

Now don’t get me wrong - I am NOT begruding anyone a rest. I’m only asking why there is a magic age for retirement. Let us face the fact that people are living longer healthier lives and to continue to put a retirement age on priesthood is very obsolete.

I find words such as rant and comments like married 75 year olds shuffling off to take care of spouse rather offensive. Married 75 year old can do and are doing much more than shuffling from room to room these days!

 

[Beautiful]

I don’t think it is either fair or accurate to compare marriage to priesthood. Granted they are both vocations in the Church, but they are very, very different vocations. You cannot compare apples to oranges.

Actually I believe it is fair and that it isn’t at all like comparing apples oranges. Separating the objective of each is a critical mistake.

 

[Beautiful]

When the 5 clustered Faith community in a 2 county area is left with one of those retired sacramental priests (walks in for Mass and 30 minutes of weekly confession) and is headed by a pastoral assistant whose previous employment included custodial work in a park then tell me how you might sound?

 

[puzzleannie]

My experience here in the cold north east is that most of the retiring priests turn into permanent snowbirds in warmer sunnier climates. The few that stay tend to have blood ties anchoring them here.

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yes and as I said a great many of them come here, and to the retirement centers my friends and relatives, (also retired from their jobs and from active day to day involvement with their families), go to in Florida and Arizona. the ones I know, and I know most of them here, work at least 40 hrs a week in active ministry.

what do plan to do when you reach mandatory retirement age at your employer, or when you children are grown and no longer need you as their primary day to day care giver?

 

[puzzleannie]

When the 5 clustered Faith community in a 2 county area is left with one of those retired sacramental priests (walks in for Mass and 30 minutes of weekly confession) and is headed by a pastoral assistant whose previous employment included custodial work in a park then tell me how you might sound?

I thought you set ground rules we are not to speculate here on the reason for the priest shortage? are you aware that there is canon law that governs retirement age for priests?

I am compelled to add, since you are making the comparison, that most if not all of the retirees here, the “Winter Texans” participate in some form of volunteer service and spend more hours working for orphanages, Mexico mission work, tutoring in public schools, work in hospitals, hospicices, libraries, churches, parish work, social service agencies of all kinds. That kind of giving that characterizes the 500,000 retirees who swell our population in the winter is the norm, for retired married couples, as it is for priests and religious.

 

[puzzleannie]

Now don’t get me wrong - I am NOT begruding anyone a rest. I’m only asking why there is a magic age for retirement. s!

because it is canon law

do you have a particular reason for posting in this forum, rather than liturgy and sacraments?

my cousin, in a cold northern city, never got a chance to retire from the priesthood. He should have, and was ordered by doctors to do so after each heart attack, but until his dad died 5 years ago he was supporting him and taking care of his needs after stroke. My cousin dropped dead in the course of his priestly duties 5 months ago, 3 years past retirement age, but he felt the need and kept working.

 

[Beautiful]

yes and as I said a great many of them come here, and to the retirement centers my friends and relatives, (also retired from their jobs and from active day to day involvement with their families), go to in Florida and Arizona. the ones I know, and I know most of them here, work at least 40 hrs a week in active ministry.

what do plan to do when you reach mandatory retirement age at your employer, or when you children are grown and no longer need you as their primary day to day care giver?

Actually ~ One of my adult children told me how after one of her friends ( last of the children in family ) went off to college her folks sold the homestead and moved to Hawaii. Together my daughter and discussed how terribly inconvenient that made their children to go over the river and through the woods to grandmother’s house. I’m not saying that marrieds are innocent of shedding their skin for a sunnier easier life. This is very common among marrieds. And what do you think we’ll be seeing as our parents ( if yours are still here ) age and need. Is that something I am going to shuck for a easier life elsewhere? I pray not.

 

[jrabs]

My experience here in the cold north east is that most of the retiring priests turn into permanent snowbirds in warmer sunnier climates. The few that stay tend to have blood ties anchoring them here.

And the greater question is ‘Why did two generations of couples contracept?’ Could it be there were priests that wanted to join the freedom train to retirement like the rest from those generations? Let us leave that for another thread topic.

Those snow bird priests most often assist in the snowbird parish of their choice - administering to other numerous snowbirds.

Heavens - if you have ever been to a warm sunny winter vacation spot, you would see how the population just booms. The parish population where my parents spend the winter almost triples. I am betting retired priests keep themselves busy and warm.
Possibly good for their health and prolonging their lives in the process…just to continue to pitch in a few extra years as a result of spending their golden years in warmer places.

Quite honestly, your judgment of these retired priests is harsh - since you have no idea why some of them fly south for the winter. Sorry that your area is weakened by a lack of vacations. Adoration has been known to help this and increase vocations.

 

[Beautiful]

because it is canon law

do you have a particular reason for posting in this forum, rather than liturgy and sacraments?

my cousin, in a cold northern city, never got a chance to retire from the priesthood. He should have, and was ordered by doctors to do so after each heart attack, but until his dad died 5 years ago he was supporting him and taking care of his needs after stroke. My cousin dropped dead in the course of his priestly duties 5 months ago, 3 years past retirement age, but he felt the need and kept working.

I posted here because I thought it was a question of moral behaviour.

I am sorry to hear about the loss of your cousin. He looked beyong the question of his health. No one could stop him from doing what he felt was right. I think giving a set age for retirement is a license to cop out and many around here have leaving ‘clusters’ of parishes high and dry.

 

[jrabs]

I posted here because I thought it was a question of moral behaviour.

I am sorry to hear about the loss of your cousin. He looked beyong the question of his health. No one could stop him from doing what he felt was right. I think giving a set age for retirement is a license to cop out and many around here have leaving ‘clusters’ of parishes high and dry.

I do not believe it is a moral cop out. I am sorry your area is left high and dry. On the flip side, many of the parishes in warm climates would be left high and dry if some of the retirees did not do the seasonal migration.

Warm weather can be medically therapeutic for people with severe arthritis, respiratory problems, and numerous ailments that creep in with age.

 

[Beautiful]

Those snow bird priests most often assist in the snowbird parish of their choice - administering to other numerous snowbirds.

Heavens - if you have ever been to a warm sunny winter vacation spot, you would see how the population just booms. The parish population where my parents spend the winter almost triples. I am betting retired priests keep themselves busy and warm.
Possibly good for their health and prolonging their lives in the process…just to continue to pitch in a few extra years as a result of spending their golden years in warmer places.

Quite honestly, your judgment of these retired priests is harsh - since you have no idea why some of them fly south for the winter. Sorry that your area is weakened by a lack of vacations. Adoration has been known to help this and increase vocations.

And I’ve heard of those booming, blossoming parishes in those sunnier vacation places and the numerous priests serving there. What about those slogging away in the cold and gray clouds with a sacramental priest who is divided among multiple parishes and lay people giving homilies?

 

[TobyLue]

Some years back when I lived in a southern border town our next door neighbor was a “retired” priest. We would have him over for breakfast, lunch or dinner on occasion. He was retired only from the responsibility of running a parish due to his age. However, he still helped out at the parish with Sunday Mass, confessions, and during Christmas time the posadas there were held in the neighborhood. He did that till he regrettably got so feeble that he would forget many things. His eyesight was pretty bad that he could no longer drive but he kept up helping as best he could. One June I went over to his house, rang the doorbell several times, and when he came to open the door he apologized that he overslept and he knew he had to go celebrate Christmas Midnight Mass and would try to hurry up. I felt so bad for this good monsignor. May he rest in peace. Believe me they dont “retire” and go on vacation, and travel around the nation in their RV.

 

[Beautiful]

Quite honestly, your judgment of these retired priests is harsh - since you have no idea why some of them fly south for the winter. Sorry that your area is weakened by a lack of vacations. Adoration has been known to help this and increase vocations.

I sound harsh because the subject is harsh and thefeelings I have are painful when I look at the loss to those being left high and dry in the cold and clouds.

 

[Beautiful]

Believe me they dont “retire” and go on vacation, and travel around the nation in their RV.

I get your point and the point of some others. Many priests relocate upon a set age but don’t really retire. It doesn’t rest the fact that they leave. I could give you many examples of those who have sold out and left my diocese over the past 3 decades I have been alive and aware. I don’t see any Texan, California or Florida priests flying here.

 

[PaulinVA]

I find words such as rant and comments like married 75 year olds shuffling off to take care of spouse rather offensive. Married 75 year old can do and are doing much more than shuffling from room to room these days!

Well, your mileage may vary. My mom died at 80 and was very frail. My dad is still going strong. My point is that living out one’s vocation into old age is different for married people than it is for priests. Priests have a public ministry, and marrieds have , in effect, a private ministry.

Actually ~ One of my adult children told me how after one of her friends ( last of the children in family ) went off to college her folks sold the homestead and moved to Hawaii. Together my daughter and discussed how terribly inconvenient that made their children to go over the river and through the woods to grandmother’s house. I’m not saying that marrieds are innocent of shedding their skin for a sunnier easier life. This is very common among marrieds. And what do you think we’ll be seeing as our parents ( if yours are still here ) age and need. Is that something I am going to shuck for a easier life elsewhere? I pray not.

It looks like you have some strong views about retirement that other people might not share.