Is it safe to learn about the occult?

[MtnDwellar]

Shielding, which is an energy directing technique that is the first thing a wiccan should learn, has been sufficient to protect me in the cases ive run into something bad. after that a ton of cleansing; grounding (another energy technique), cleansing rituals, burning things like sage and (to take a page out of the christian anti-demon playbook) spread around some consicrated water or salt.

thankfully ive never encountered anything that those didnt handle, if i ever encountered anything bigger id probably try to get a coven to cleanse me or something, strength in numbers. the only angry spirits ive encountered have been through a Ouija board (its like dialing a random phone number) and when i was trying to astral project in a place with a lot of bad energy, that was a terrible idea on my part.

Shielding? So you raise your vibration level, do some energy balancing, and project your energy to form a shield against malevolent spirits? Do you cast it into a circle? We all know that circles are almost impenetrable by evil spirits. Does your cleansing involve sage, flat cedar and sweet grass? Those things will stop a demon dead in his tracks - right?

Do you know what really helps and almost never fails? Visualize white light. How about creating a thought form? Those little babies are like watch dogs. They will never let a demon get to you.

Demons have been alive since before the universe was created. That makes them very old. They are so immense that we cannot even imagine them. They exist outside of time and space. Anything that you do today cannot be effective. They can attack you starting yesterday. The only protection that we have against them is the Holy Spirit. Your protection comes from your Baptism and because they have no interest in you.

 

[AlanFromWichita]

More seriously, I can plainly see that Alan is at least tempted into hubris. I compare his flip attitude to juggling a couple of test tubes full of swine flu virus in an epidemiology lab while wearing a red rubber clown nose. Or whatever.

Nice touch, the rubber clown nose. Closest I came was when I first presented my radar tester “TMATS” (Transmitter/Modulator Assembly Test Set) for the B-52 radar transmitter for first article test, I brought a little toy dog with a battery and wire that barked, to celebrate the successful test. The technician was blown away. My design was the first he’d ever seen with every single wire correct the first time it was built. The shop manager, Air Force master sergeants and their bosses, two levels of engineering bosses, cheered and applauded when I placed the dog on the test shelf after successful power up and made it bark. But what did I know? I was just a young punk engineer, 23 years old and my first design was accepted by the Air Force (I worked in Boeing Military) in 6 days instead of 10 months like the previous " experienced designers’ " messed up project “SAT” System Avionics Tester. See, I learned about engineering the same way as the spirit world – had to learn how wrong things were so I could correct them – and in my engineering mode, design antidotes for future problems.

So yeah, when I know what I’m doing others may think I have missed something. I am the most anal-retentive person on the planet – if you try me I just might demonstrate. I bet I can be more serious and freaked out than anybody else here. Want a contest? That’s the kind of stuff that attracts and feeds demons, I’d guess. What do I know, though, right? I don’t wear a certain hat and I don’t use five-syllable words so how can I be trusted with my own soul? Probably not, says the majority. Oh well Jesus told us where the majority is going.

Alan

P.S. Please keep up the armchair psychological and spiritual evaluations. I just might print some of it out to have a chuckle with my pastor and with my psychiatrist next time I see them. This pastor and this psychiatrist are the best, and they have great senses of humor.

P.P.S. BTW the fact the I Love to Laugh is a result of my healing, not a cry of distress!

 

[Hunter24]

Shielding? So you raise your vibration level, do some energy balancing, and project your energy to form a shield against malevolent spirits? Do you cast it into a circle? We all know that circles are almost impenetrable by evil spirits. Does your cleansing involve sage, flat cedar and sweet grass? Those things will stop a demon dead in his tracks - right?

Do you know what really helps and almost never fails? Visualize white light. How about creating a thought form? Those little babies are like watch dogs. They will never let a demon get to you.

Demons have been alive since before the universe was created. That makes them very old. They are so immense that we cannot even imagine them. They exist outside of time and space. Anything that you do today cannot be effective. They can attack you starting yesterday. The only protection that we have against them is the Holy Spirit. Your protection comes from your Baptism and because they have no interest in you.

think what you want, but it is effective. also, spirits range in size and power, we are like flies to immense spirits, if one of them wanted to there would be no stoping it from destroying peoples lives, but why dosnt that happen? because emensely powerful entitys wouldnt gain anything. how do people in non-chirstian countrys preform exorcisms? they’ve been doing it effectively for thousands of years. why isnt the non-christian portions of the world just riddled with possesed people?

 

[MtnDwellar]

think what you want, but it is effective. also, spirits range in size and power, we are like flies to immense spirits, if one of them wanted to there would be no stoping it from destroying peoples lives, but why dosnt that happen? because emensely powerful entitys wouldnt gain anything. how do people in non-chirstian countrys preform exorcisms? they’ve been doing it effectively for thousands of years. why isnt the non-christian portions of the world just riddled with possesed people?

I think that possession is a big problem.

You raise a valid point. How do pagans perform exorcisms? The answer is simple. God loves pagans too.

Witchcraft is not effective. I have been there and done that. Do you belong to a coven or associate with other like-minded people? Have you noticed that there are no senior citizens at the gatherings? When I go to church I see people of all ages. I have never met an old witch. Why is that? I am sure that there are some exceptions, but, in general witches are young. The reason is because it is a false teaching. Most people figure it out and stop practicing.

The reason I wrote my last post is because when witchcraft is exposed to the light of day it pales in comparison to Christianity. It really seems weak. Can you tell a bunch of right minded people that you danced sky clad around a fire while bathing in the moonlight and still keep your dignity? It is really hard to do. LOL

And BTW I love witches. One of my close friends is a famous witch, teacher, and author. She refers to herself as an eclectic pagan. She is kind, loving, very funny, and also all screwed up.

 

[Hunter24]

I think that possession is a big problem.

You raise a valid point. How do pagans perform exorcisms? The answer is simple. God loves pagans too.

Witchcraft is not effective. I have been there and done that. Do you belong to a coven or associate with other like-minded people? Have you noticed that there are no senior citizens at the gatherings? When I go to church I see people of all ages. I have never met an old witch. Why is that? I am sure that there are some exceptions, but, in general witches are young. The reason is because it is a false teaching. Most people figure it out and stop practicing.

The reason I wrote my last post is because when witchcraft is exposed to the light of day it pales in comparison to Christianity. It really seems weak. Can you tell a bunch of right minded people that you danced sky clad around a fire while bathing in the moonlight and still keep your dignity? It is really hard to do. LOL

And BTW I love witches. One of my close friends is a famous witch, teacher, and author. She refers to herself as an eclectic pagan. She is kind, loving, very funny, and also all screwed up.

Im a solitary but ive met with several groups, all but one included people over 50. the reason elderly wiccans are uncommon is because the relligion is growing extreamly fast via young new members, so old people are a much smaller percentage.

also, I dont do skyclad or even magic much, i usualy just meditate and sometimes i astral project.

and personaly ya i think it does fine next to Christianity, im form a very catholic area and know plenty of catholic theology. im not wiccan because i want some sort of power, i am because it makes sense to me.

edit: PS. nice to know theres a few people on here who actualy understand Wicca haha

 

[MtnDwellar]

Im a solitary but ive met with several groups, all but one included people over 50. the reason elderly wiccans are uncommon is because the relligion is growing extreamly fast via young new members, so old people are a much smaller percentage.

also, I dont do skyclad or even magic much, i usualy just meditate and sometimes i astral project.

and personaly ya i think it does fine next to Christianity, im form a very catholic area and know plenty of catholic theology. im not wiccan because i want some sort of power, i am because it makes sense to me.

edit: PS. nice to know theres a few people on here who actualy understand Wicca haha

I think you may wrong about the reason for the uneven age distribution. Tell me, why do you think that a disproportionate amount of young are joining? If Wicca was truth, shouldn’t it appeal to all ages? AND - over 50 is not senior citizens!!! LOL

Astral projection is not what you think it is. I used to go astral without even trying. I would go to familiar places and also places previously unknown. Demons would take me to the The Sabbat annually. Astral projection does not actually happen. The spirit only leaves a body at death. It can be no other way. Our bodies are animated by our spirits. The only rare exception might be NDE’s. I don’t know. It has never happened to me.

What we call astral projection is actually manipulation of our memories by demons. Our spirits do not separate from our bodies. We are given memories there of.

 

[Hunter24]

I think you may wrong about the reason for the uneven age distribution. Tell me, why do you think that a disproportionate amount of young are joining? If Wicca was truth, shouldn’t it appeal to all ages? AND - over 50 is not senior citizens!!! LOL

Astral projection is not what you think it is. I used to go astral without even trying. I would go to familiar places and also places previously unknown. Demons would take me to the The Sabbat annually. Astral projection does not actually happen. The spirit only leaves a body at death. It can be no other way. Our bodies are animated by our spirits. The only rare exception might be NDE’s. I don’t know. It has never happened to me.

What we call astral projection is actually manipulation of our memories by demons. Our spirits do not separate from our bodies. We are given memories there of.

Well whitchcraft bears a certain stigma that obviousely turns alot of people off. also there are unfortunately a ton of young people who join simply because of magic (and i hate to say it but yes maybe even harry potter) but they dont last long from what ive seen. also there is no drive (in my experience atleast) to go out and spread wicca, so the people usualy come to it on their own, and older people usualy dont go church searching in my experience.

as for your statement on astral projection, thats what Christianity teaches but i dont believe that. you believe what you do and i believe what i do. when we die we will find out which of us is right (or Hel, maybe we are both wrong)

 

[MtnDwellar]

as for your statement on astral projection, thats what Christianity teaches but i dont believe that. you believe what you do and i believe what i do. when we die we will find out which of us is right (or Hel, maybe we are both wrong)

I didn’t know that Christianity teaches that astral projection is manipulation of our memories. I thought it was only me who taught it. Thanks. Now I don’t feel so alone.

Have you heard this: “A fully developed Catholic mystic can obtain anything he desires through prayer”?

 

[AlanFromWichita]

Have you heard this: “A fully developed Catholic mystic can obtain anything he desires through prayer”?

I haven’t heard that specifically, but in one sense I’m ok with it and in one I’m not.

To the non-mystic, this may sound like a mystic can just “get anything whatever.” Just pray and voila! New car, promotion at work, whatever.

But to the mystic, this statement can make sense because the mystic’s will is to do the Father’s will, so it doesn’t even occur to pray for – or even desire for that matter – something that would be outside of God’s will. A mystic has already found that the kingdom is more tasty than any self-directed program.

So it is in that latter sense that I can accept the statement.

Alan

 

[BluesPicker]

I haven’t heard that specifically, but in one sense I’m ok with it and in one I’m not.

To the non-mystic, this may sound like a mystic can just “get anything whatever.” Just pray and voila! New car, promotion at work, whatever.

But to the mystic, this statement can make sense because the mystic’s will is to do the Father’s will, so it doesn’t even occur to pray for – or even desire for that matter – something that would be outside of God’s will. A mystic has already found that the kingdom is more tasty than any self-directed program.

So it is in that latter sense that I can accept the statement.

Alan

Dear Alan,

   You know you really say some very profound and deep truths.  I am going to copy that and cite your expression of this in the future.  You expressed this great truth very concisely.

Thanks,
BP

 

[AlanFromWichita]

Dear Alan,

   You know you really say some very profound and deep truths.  I am going to copy that and cite your expression of this in the future.  You expressed this great truth very concisely.

Thanks,
BP

And thank you.

I’m glad to hear my words were helpful to somebody.

It’s what I live for.

Alan

 

[MtnDwellar]

So it is in that latter sense that I can accept the statement. Alan

It is precisely in the latter sense that I intended it.

BUT - I am dissapointed that you explained my thought so well so soon.
I was hoping to mess with the pagan a little…LOL

 

[AlanFromWichita]

It is precisely in the latter sense that I intended it.

BUT - I am dissapointed that you explained my thought so well so soon.
I was hoping to mess with the pagan a little…LOL

Hey, we can still do that – we can even kick it up a notch.

For example, what are the salient differences between praying for something, and casting a spell? That way we can offend everybody in the room, all at once!

j/k of course. Pay no attention to that man behind the curtain! We’re not in Kansas anymore!

Alan

 

[Hunter24]

I didn’t know that Christianity teaches that astral projection is manipulation of our memories. I thought it was only me who taught it. Thanks. Now I don’t feel so alone.

Have you heard this: “A fully developed Catholic mystic can obtain anything he desires through prayer”?

No ive never heard that, but Alan gave a stellar explanation:thumbsup:

 

[BluesPicker]

A friend of mine visited a bookstore, and quite by accident wandered into the New Age section. He picked up a book. On the left hand page was a spell and on the right side was the exorcism prayer of Pope Leo XIII. Wiccans and other pagans endeavor to control their lives and the lives of other people by manipulation of spirits. This is expressly forbidden in the Bible. Their attempts at exorcism are merely lower demons being bound by higher demons. Satan’s kingdom is a mock of God’s Heaven. It has a hierarchy of demons.
But we need not study the occult but merely follow our Christian faith to defeat Satan’s minions both spiritual and human. In fact Satan & his group have been defeated by Christ.

  If a hypnotist can implant false memories, visions and powers what can a demon do? This is why we must reject all things that contradict our faith.

  St. Paul writes of a time when people will fore go  sound doctrine and embrace the doctrines of demons.  He says these people are under strong delusion.  If Satan could speak through St. Peter at one time of weakness then what can he do to those who completely reject God's Living Word?

   Many people are lost souls blinded, full of pride, and quite possibly in danger of going to Hell.  "None are so blind as those who can't see" said St. Paul of these poor people.

We must be wary of them but pray for them because only our prayers and penances can safe them.

BP

 

[Hunter24]

A friend of mine visited a bookstore, and quite by accident wandered into the New Age section. He picked up a book. On the left hand page was a spell and on the right side was the exorcism prayer of Pope Leo XIII. Wiccans and other pagans endeavor to control their lives and the lives of other people by manipulation of spirits. This is expressly forbidden in the Bible. Their attempts at exorcism are merely lower demons being bound by higher demons. Satan’s kingdom is a mock of God’s Heaven. It has a hierarchy of demons.
But we need not study the occult but merely follow our Christian faith to defeat Satan’s minions both spiritual and human. In fact Satan & his group have been defeated by Christ.

  If a hypnotist can implant false memories, visions and powers what can a demon do? This is why we must reject all things that contradict our faith.

  St. Paul writes of a time when people will fore go  sound doctrine and embrace the doctrines of demons.  He says these people are under strong delusion.  If Satan could speak through St. Peter at one time of weakness then what can he do to those who completely reject God's Living Word?

   Many people are lost souls blinded, full of pride, and quite possibly in danger of going to Hell.  "None are so blind as those who can't see" said St. Paul of these poor people.

We must be wary of them but pray for them because only our prayers and penances can safe them.

BP

You can believe whatever you want, but… just a few notes:

1. Wiccans and SOME pagans use magic. some such as Asatru have little to no magic at all.
2. we do not use magic to control others.
3. ya know, the “only our prayers can save these poor people” stuff is rather self flatering. not only that, if god is omni-potent then why will god need prayers to save someone.

 

[MtnDwellar]

1. ya know, the “only our prayers can save these poor people” stuff is rather self flatering. not only that, if god is omni-potent then why will god need prayers to save someone.

Welllll. Who taught you about prayer? The statement is not self flattery, but shows our total dependence upon God.

Your question is interesting. God could have gone straight to the bottom line if He chose. He could have created some of us and let them in heaven. The rest go to eternal damnation. Why give us life, free will, etc. I DON"T KNOW. It seems that He wants to give us a chance to love Him. He also wants to help us on this path. He apparently likes to work through us, hence the effectiveness of prayers.

 

[BluesPicker]

You can believe whatever you want, but… just a few notes:

1. Wiccans and SOME pagans use magic. some such as Asatru have little to no magic at all.
2. we do not use magic to control others.
3. ya know, the “only our prayers can save these poor people” stuff is rather self flatering. not only that, if god is omni-potent then why will god need prayers to save someone.

God doesn’t need our prayers. Those who reject God need prayers and penances of other people to receive the graces of reconciliation. That is because, of and by themselves, they reject God and cut themselves off from His graces by cooperating and giving themselves to demonic entities, elemental spirits, powers, and other evil spirits. While some maybe passively evil Wiccans and other pagans worship, glorify and give honor to these demonic entities. They in turn impinge upon their minds senses of well being, psychic powers, and other Satanic mockery of the Gifts of the Holy Spirit.

  Being aligned with evil, any  graces of salvation in the past sent by a merciful God, have been rejected.   While they may lament their situation at some point they lose the ability to make a sincere act of repentance to be able come back to God.This is not a joke or some light matter.  There is no neutral ground, you are either in one camp or the other.  Salvation can be obtained in a sincere moment of perfect contrition; but sanctification is a life long process.   We all need graces from those devoted to prayer.

Yet, God in His Mercy has chosen people to pray, do penances, and other acts of redemptive suffering graces of reconciliation so that lost souls may find God. These people are called “victim souls.”

  If you really want to inform yourself  Hunter24,  read about  Fr. Fortea's Marta or Martha.  Read about the lives of  Josefa Menendez, Luisa Piccarreta, St. Faustina, St. Gemma, and  Padre Pio.

Now the above is meant to be a general address, and to you per se, but I don’t know how I can even make my crude attempt to impart the dynamics of this without touching upon these things. It is obvious that you are not confirmed yet on your said path. But I know one day you will have to make a choice, the most important choice anyone makes in their life here.

There are a lot of people here praying for you to make the choice for God and make a clean break with the path you are on. I hope that you would visit a Church and make a heartfelt plea asking God to help you.

The way all this works is because God wants us to live united spiritually as a Church Family called the Church with Christ as the Head.  And as members of a family have love and compassion, responsibility and respect for each other so does the Church Family.

And just as any family who has lost a member can never be as happy until that member is found; so the same is with the Church Family.

Many Blessings,

 

[Hunter24]

God doesn’t need our prayers. Those who reject God need prayers and penances of other people to receive the graces of reconciliation. That is because, of and by themselves, they reject God and cut themselves off from His graces by cooperating and giving themselves to demonic entities, elemental spirits, powers, and other evil spirits. While some maybe passively evil Wiccans and other pagans worship, glorify and give honor to these demonic entities. They in turn impinge upon their minds senses of well being, psychic powers, and other Satanic mockery of the Gifts of the Holy Spirit.

  Being aligned with evil, any  graces of salvation in the past sent by a merciful God, have been rejected.   While they may lament their situation at some point they lose the ability to make a sincere act of repentance to be able come back to God.This is not a joke or some light matter.  There is no neutral ground, you are either in one camp or the other.  Salvation can be obtained in a sincere moment of perfect contrition; but sanctification is a life long process.   We all need graces from those devoted to prayer.

Yet, God in His Mercy has chosen people to pray, do penances, and other acts of redemptive suffering graces of reconciliation so that lost souls may find God. These people are called “victim souls.”

  If you really want to inform yourself  Hunter24,  read about  Fr. Fortea's Marta or Martha.  Read about the lives of  Josefa Menendez, Luisa Piccarreta, St. Faustina, St. Gemma, and  Padre Pio.

Now the above is meant to be a general address, and to you per se, but I don’t know how I can even make my crude attempt to impart the dynamics of this without touching upon these things. It is obvious that you are not confirmed yet on your said path. But I know one day you will have to make a choice, the most important choice anyone makes in their life here.

There are a lot of people here praying for you to make the choice for God and make a clean break with the path you are on. I hope that you would visit a Church and make a heartfelt plea asking God to help you.

The way all this works is because God wants us to live united spiritually as a Church Family called the Church with Christ as the Head.  And as members of a family have love and compassion, responsibility and respect for each other so does the Church Family.

And just as any family who has lost a member can never be as happy until that member is found; so the same is with the Church Family.

Many Blessings,

ive heard this kind of “you unknowingly worship demons” stuff before, and personaly i find it to be just a christian scare tactic to win converts. its not true. we worship GOD in BOTH its forms, both GOD and GODDESS and all the pagan dietys the present themselves as. they arn’t demons, you might think they are and go ahead and think what you want, but they arnt, they are in every one of us, we are all part of them.

lastly, “passively evil wiccans”? so im evil?