Is it sinful to lie to cover up a surprise?

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Mrs_Sally said:
Then in this case you simply don’t answer. You can turn the subject without answering. And you can say something like, “all your questions are awfully pesky!” with a smile. Then you haven’t outright lied and you haven’t confirmed either.

I would also recommend that you stop being so mysterious in your actions so that the person in question stops wondering so much! 🙂
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That is not true. Not answering or evading the question would be the same as admitting the fact that you are planning something, or, if you are not, just making the person frustrated/upset given that the obvious reaction is to assume that you are planning something.

How is this a problem? You are not intending to do evil by lying, you are not withholding information indiscriminately, you are not committing heresy etc. by lying to them. You are concealing a surprise which they do not have a right to know (because that would ruin the surprise). An answer that it is sinful seems to brush up uncomfortably against legalism.
 
Baelor said:
**That is not true. Not answering or evading the question would be the same as admitting the fact that you are planning something, or, if you are not, just making the person frustrated/upset given that the obvious reaction is to assume that you are planning something.**QUOTE]

My point exactly, Baelor. You took the words out my mouth.

These kind of situations are tricky. Because refusing to answer or evading the question can be an admission, and it can upset the person. Answering, on the other hand, ruins the surprise.
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puzzleannie said:
no why would you think so?
it is probably imprudent and may result in more problems than you realize, but that does not necessarily make it sinful. If you did it to me for instance, knowing that I have often said how much I hate such surprises, it could be at least uncharitable. But not every ill-considered act is sinful

It is discussions like this, which are invariably on the wrong forum that give us the reputation for promoting scrupulosity.
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I was a victim of one, and God knows, how unpleasant it was. We were surprised that instead of coming 1 person, came another that we do not want to come. Awful…We had to smile al the way through.

I dont think it is a lie. It is a pain in the neck,

though I have seen another with a Lady, because she was not expecting her brother to come from America that we were afraid that she would have an heart attack…
 
Richard320 said:
If it is, then logically it follows that it is a sin to tell children that Santa Claus delivered those presents that appeared under the tree.
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Don’t give your children presents on Christmas Day. It does nothing but undermine the religious importance of the day. Rather give gifts on 6th of December, Saint Nicholas’s Day. Prior to the day, pray a novena to Saint Nicholas that you’ll be able to give your kids some gifts. Then you can truly say they got them by the intercession of Saint Nicholas.
 
Baelor said:
That is not true. Not answering or evading the question would be the same as admitting the fact that you are planning something, or, if you are not, just making the person frustrated/upset given that the obvious reaction is to assume that you are planning something.

How is this a problem? You are not intending to do evil by lying, you are not withholding information indiscriminately, you are not committing heresy etc. by lying to them. You are concealing a surprise which they do not have a right to know (because that would ruin the surprise). An answer that it is sinful seems to brush up uncomfortably against legalism.
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I did not say it was necessarily sinful. I do not believe we are required to answer every question posed to us, whether or not we are planning a suprise. If someone is pestering you with questions, it is perfectly reasonable to ask them to stop, even without answering any of them.

My real point is that one can plan a suprise without being so obvious about that a million questions come up. :rolleyes:
 
I once came up with an elaborate “cover” when my dad and I were planning a small surprise party for my mom’s 60th birthday which fell on a Sunday: my folks were going to the evening Mass that night (since my dad had to work during the day that day). Rather than going to Mass with them, I decided to use that time to get the house ready for the party, and I decided to go to an earlier Mass. Rather than twig my mother’s curiosity, I told her I was going to Mass earlier since there was an online chat scheduled for a writing group that I was involved in and it happened to be in the early evening when my folks were going to Mass.

I later asked her if this would be considered a lie; said she, “No, as I didn’t have the right to know what you were up to, 'cause it would have spoiled the surprise.”
 
This thread brings up a lot of important issues about answering questions that we don’t want to answer without lying. This is really an important issue. I will probably be discussing this issue further in another thread, sometime in the future.
 
Personally this thread makes me think that Catholics need to lighten up a bit. We’re talking about a little white lie to cover for a surprise party, an act of love towards the one the party is directed at. We’re not talking about covering up a crime.

Surely at worst it is a venial sin.

Not all lies are wrong. If the Nazis came knocking at the door of a family hiding a Jewish person in WWII, the Nazi says “any Jews here” and the person answering the door answers “no”, I highly doubt God will be punishing that lie at judgment day.

God will forgive us if we don’t undergo a major theological analysis before each minor situation.
 
And all this time I thought we were past the Santa Claus posturing until next Christmas. Apparently Hell - or at least Purgatory - is filled with parents who gave their kids presents on Christmas (and credited Santa), and planned surprise parties for family and friends. “Lighten up a bit” indeed.
 
Tarpeian_Rock said:
And all this time I thought we were past the Santa Claus posturing until next Christmas. Apparently Hell - or at least Purgatory - is filled with parents who gave their kids presents on Christmas (and credited Santa), and planned surprise parties for family and friends. “Lighten up a bit” indeed.
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Weeeeelll, the traditional Catholic calender extends the Christmas season till February 2nd, aka, the feast of the Purification of Mary, aka Candlemas, and that was just a couple days ago…
 
vz71 said:
I was subject of a surprise party once.

When the party was over I remarked that they all were able to lie to me so well.

I don’t get many surprises anymore.
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Pfaffenhoffen said:
why?
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Glad you asked.
I suppose it was an indication on my end that I disliked being lied to.

True, they had the best intention, and they intended no evil purpose behind the lies at all.

But they so easily lied to me that I have to wonder if they are lying to me every time they speak now.
 
vz71 said:
Glad you asked.
I suppose it was an indication on my end that I disliked being lied to.

True, they had the best intention, and they intended no evil purpose behind the lies at all.

But they so easily lied to me that I have to wonder if they are lying to me every time they speak now.
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NOOOOO.
It is like Carnival. Everyone hides behind a mask.
 
Matrix_Refugee said:
I once came up with an elaborate “cover” when my dad and I were planning a small surprise party for my mom’s 60th birthday which fell on a Sunday: my folks were going to the evening Mass that night (since my dad had to work during the day that day). Rather than going to Mass with them, I decided to use that time to get the house ready for the party, and I decided to go to an earlier Mass. Rather than twig my mother’s curiosity, I told her I was going to Mass earlier since there was an online chat scheduled for a writing group that I was involved in and it happened to be in the early evening when my folks were going to Mass.

I later asked her if this would be considered a lie; said she, “No, as I didn’t have the right to know what you were up to, 'cause it would have spoiled the surprise.”
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You must trust your mom.

But if anyone insists on something more authoritative to support you, let them read the book of Tobit and know that Angel Raphael lied too similarly to keep his identity a surprise for Tobias and his parents.
 
Can’t you just manage to say something like, “I’m busy,” if the person is questioning you about what you’re doing on his/her birthday?

You don’t have to answer every question posed to you. Personally, I like, “I’m busy,” because it can mean anything. I could be “busy,” for example, chasing dust bunnies with a broom! In this case, you’d be “busy” making the final orchestrations for the surprise. No lie, and no explanation. The more elaborate explanations are, the more false they ring.
 
odile53 said:
Can’t you just manage to say something like, “I’m busy,” if the person is questioning you about what you’re doing on his/her birthday?
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If my friend told me that, I would reevaluate the friendship.

I still think that there is no problem with covering for a surprise party, and although the “alternative” solutions are possible (although not a single one so far is even close to viable), I do not see the moral need to employ them.
 
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