Is it wrong to learn foreign languages?

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mikekle said:
Has anyone stopped to think that maybe by trying to justify speaking other languages by clever interpretations of verses, we are doing the very thing God was trying to prevent? When something is common or popular in modern times, I tend to think too many people seek verses that justify their actions.

Im not claiming to know why God did this, but I DO believe the bible to be accurate, so in this case, he ‘scrambled the languages for some reason’, our society today has gotten SOOO off track when it comes to God, people dont want to admit they are doing something wrong in the eyes of God, especially if it is something that SEEMS benign to us, and is fairly common practice in the modern world. Alot of times people will say, 'well this or that verse isnt literal, its a metaphor, or its symbolic of something else, but in the end, they are usually trying to find something that justifies the particular action.

As humans, we dont know the ways of God, and the reasons why he did many of the things he did, but he did them for good reason, I dont doubt that one bit, if he saw a problem with the situation, and changed it, then I have to believe he did so for good reason…even if I disagree with it, or dont see anything wrong with it.
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So, then, do you think it’s wrong to learn foreign languages?
 
What is your intent to learn a foreign language? Is it so you can communicate with better with others who use that language? Do you plan on being a translator? Is is for personal fulfillment or academic goals?

I cannot for the life of me see how anyone could think that was sinful.

Now, if you planned to learn a foreign language so you could defraud or harm people (human trafficking, that sort of thing), it could be considered sinful, but overall, learning to communicate in someone else’s language? Do you feel that pastors/priests/missionaries are sinning when they learn the language of the people they are ministering to?

Are you scrupulous?
 
MysticMissMisty said:
Why? (And, please make some reference to the passages with which I began this thread in your answer.)
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For something to be considered a sin, it must go against one of the Ten Commandments that were given to Moses.

The Church further explains the Ten Commandments in the the Catechism of the Catholic Church.

What Commandment would learning another language break?
 
Mary_Gail_36 said:
For something to be considered a sin, it must go against one of the Ten Commandments that were given to Moses.

The Church further explains the Ten Commandments in the the Catechism of the Catholic Church.

What Commandment would learning another language break?
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For one thing, it could be going against the command to love the Lord your God with all your heart, mind, etc. in that it might be going against His purpose in separating the languages as I articulated above (to keep us separated so that we would not progress as a society to such an extent as to become too prideful and possibly separate ourselves from our need for God). (Not saying that this could be the ONLY way to understand God’s purpose in separating the languages, but it seems a most logical understanding from the passage itself.)
 
MysticMissMisty said:
Salvete, omnes!

As a Latinist by training and as a language enthusiast generally, the Tower of Babel account in Sacred Scripture has always rather bothered me…
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I’m curious, where did you get that idea from? My son in law, a tongue speaking Pentecostal, recently said something similar. Is this a new concept going around in Evangelical and Pentecostal circles? It happened after I showed him that the King James translation of certain Greek terms didn’t correspond to the correct meaning.

It seems like that’s just a way to limit people from pointing out his errors. Did something similar happen to you? You might want to consider the motivation of the one telling you that.
 
Ignatius said:
I’m curious, where did you get that idea from? My son in law, a tongue speaking Pentecostal, recently said something similar. Is this a new concept going around in Evangelical and Pentecostal circles? It happened after I showed him that the King James translation of certain Greek terms didn’t correspond to the correct meaning.

It seems like that’s just a way to limit people from pointing out his errors. Did something similar happen to you? You might want to consider the motivation of the one telling you that.
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I’m not at all Pentecostal, so not sure if this is some independent idea going around. In fact, I’m not from a so-called “charismatic” tradition at all.

How I got the idea was simply from reading the Genesis passage logically and thinking through its implications.
 
JerryZ said:
:hmmm: I don’t know about scripture verses BUT: I am sure that St. Paul could fluently speak Hebrew AND Greek.
St Peter lived in Rome several years, where the common language was Latin.
He spoke Aramaic and probably Hebrew. The lingua franca of commerce in Israel at the time of Jesus was Greek.
St Peter as a fisherman we are told owned several boats, so in order to sell his catch everyday he would have to communicate with his buyers. I would bet he also spoke Greek.
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Well, all I can say, this is not the only contradiction in the bible (shrugs?)

Plenty of other examples where God/Jesus/ bible, says one thing, but other verses, its the complete opposite.
 
MysticMissMisty said:
Salvete, omnes!

As a Latinist by training and as a language enthusiast generally, the Tower of Babel account in Sacred Scripture has always rather bothered me…

If God separated our languages, is it right to learn a language other than your native one? Did He not separate our languages for a reason, most likely to separate us as people so that we would not progress so much so as to no longer need God? After all, in the Genesis account of this, God says that He wishes to confuse human languages since, basically, there would otherwise be no limits to what humanity could do if it continued to have one language. So, again, is it sinful to learn other languages because, in doing so, it, to some extent, even if small, serves to re-unite people who would otherwise be divided because of the separation that God made between the languages in order to keep us separated?

Men in both the Old and New Testaments didn’t really seem to have any problem with learning other languages and the Church seems never to have expressed reservation about it. However, the fact that this occurs both in the OT and NT does not necessarily mean that God endorses it; for there is no direct endorsement of learning other languages in either as far as I know. I only recall (I think it was Augustine) in his discussion of the Babel account expressing some reservation about non-Christians doing so because of their natural tendency to use such to their own destruction.

So, if it is all right for Chistians to learn foreign languages, is it also all right for non-Christians, even though they could, as with anything, use it to their own hurt? I mean, one could argue that, for both Christians and non-Christians there are benefits to learning other languages such as economic and social ones. It both facilitates trade and promots cultural understanding. However, are these reasons sufficient ones for God to allow us to learn other languages?

I’ve always wondered if the passage in Genesis is more descriptive than prescriptive in that it describes why the languages were separated but does not necessarily prescribe that, because of this, we do not learn foreign languages.

Perhaps in support of this view, it may be proposed that no-one is now capable of learning every single language in the world and most people are only capable of learning one, two or three foreign languages fluently in their lifetimes and that we will thus never have the kind of universal language that we once had which was capable of making “anything” possible for us and leading to pride and potential separation from God. However, English now, as was the case with Greek/Latin in the past, is quickly becoming a kind of “world language”. So, should we be cautious of this? Or should we say that God is all right with this since He has sovereignly separated the languages in such a way that we will, as I say, never get to the point of language being so universal as to lead to the potential for progress we had previous to our linguistic separation. I mean that, even though many many people may eventually know English, it will not be so widespread as to make us like the pre-Babel civilization. Perhaps, indeed, God knew what He was doing and that, despite our learning various languages and even English around the world, He sovereignly designed it such that we would never achieve pre-Babel unity.

Does the Church, outside of the Scriptures, speak to this in any way, whether infallibly/dogmatically or not? Again, it seems that the Church has never collectively expressed reservation about either those within her or within the world learning foreign languages.

So, basic question, is it or is it not sinful to learn one or more foreign languages? For the Church? For the world? Why or why not?
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Sadly, your question came too late for me to employ against the good sisters who attempted to teach me Latin and French.
 
MysticMissMisty said:
For one thing, it could be going against the command to love the Lord your God with all your heart, mind, etc. in that it might be going against His purpose in separating the languages as I articulated above (to keep us separated so that we would not progress as a society to such an extent as to become too prideful and possibly separate ourselves from our need for God). (Not saying that this could be the ONLY way to understand God’s purpose in separating the languages, but it seems a most logical understanding from the passage itself.)
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Well, no. The Catechism doesn’t state that learning a language breaks the first commandment. Perhaps learning a language to the extent of neglecting prayer and worship could, but that is true for anything.
 
I just want to really quickly clarify that I have not at all come to any conclusions about this topic, at least, not yet. I am suspending judgment until I can flesh all these issues out as much as possible.

As I said in my original post, I myself am a Latinist by training and a general language enthusiast by hobby, so, in a way, I don’t want the conclusion that might arise of it being sinful to learn a foreign language to be true. However, I am not a seeker of what I want to be true. I am a seeker of what is true.

Again, the reason I am seeming to “contradict” people so much is, I am, as it were, and, please, forgive the metaphor, but, playing the “devil’s advocate” so that I can, as I say, fully flesh out all the ins and outs of this issue. I am not at all trying to be “nasty” to people who bring up this or that in reply. Just trying to be honest.

So, let’s continue to try to work this out. I continue to look forward to responses to this issue.
 
Mary_Gail_36 said:
Well, no. The Catechism doesn’t state that learning a language breaks the first commandment. Perhaps learning a language to the extent of neglecting prayer and worship could, but that is true for anything.
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From my admittedly limited knowledge of the Catechism (at this point, anyway), what I understand is that it certainly does not address every. little. issue. in life but that we can discern from what it does address what we should do in cases that it doesn’t. So, arguing “ex nihilo” that just because it doesn’t address this issue directly, it is not a sin, seems, at the very least, to be a weak logical stance (as indeed many ex nihilo arguments are).
 
MysticMissMisty said:
From my admittedly limited knowledge of the Catechism (at this point, anyway), what I understand is that it certainly does not address every. little. issue. in life but that we can discern from what it does address what we should do in cases that it doesn’t. So, arguing “ex nihilo” that just because it doesn’t address this issue directly, it is not a sin, seems, at the very least, to be a weak logical stance (as indeed many ex nihilo arguments are).
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Here is a very small quote from the Catechism, explaining very briefly the first commandment.
The first commandment requires us to nourish and protect our faith with prudence and vigilance, and to reject everything that is opposed to it. There are various ways of sinning against faith
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How would learning a language prevent us from nourishing or protecting our faith?
 
MysticMissMisty said:
So, basic question, is it or is it not sinful to learn one or more foreign languages? For the Church? For the world? Why or why not?
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Let’s approach this another way.

Why don’t you define for us what you think the Catholic Church means when it refers to sin. Please give us your definition.
 
DaddyGirl said:
7 Come, let Us go down and there confuse their language, that they may not understand one another’s speech.”
8 So the Lord scattered them abroad from there over the face of all the earth, and they ceased building the city.
9 Therefore its name is called Babel, because there the Lord confused the language of all the earth; and from there the Lord scattered them abroad over the face of all the earth.
—Genesis 11:4–9[1]

The scripture says God confused people’s language…but it didn’t say anything about not wanting people to un-confuse it.
Sounds to me from this story that he then wants people* to learn* the languages to understand each other again.

.
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I really don’t see your logic, here.

God confused our languages so we could un-confuse them? Why, then, would He confuse them in the first place? Also, could you cite the particular part of this passage that indicates to you that God wants us to un-confuse the languages? :confused:

Indeed, one of His purposes here seems to be so that they would not understand one another’s speech. Doesn’t sound like He wanted everyone to speak a unified language by “un-confusing” them or otherwise…
 
InNomineDomini said:
Let’s approach this another way.

Why don’t you define for us what you think the Catholic Church means when it refers to sin. Please give us your definition.
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As I understand sin, it means intentionally acting contrary to God’s Law, i.e., to the Law of Love either of God Himself or of neighbor or, with qualifications, of oneself. Now, as far as what the Church says, I am still looking more closely into that. (I have only started this journey relatively recently, so, please bear with me.)
 
MysticMissMisty said:
As I understand sin, it means intentionally acting contrary to God’s Law …
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… and you would interpret the point of the Tower of Babel story to be a revelation of an eternal law of God with regard to language. Is that correct?
 
InNomineDomini said:
… and you would interpret the point of the Tower of Babel story to be a revelation of an eternal law of God with regard to language. Is that correct?
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Not necessarily, though it may be. When I say, it may be, I mean not necessarily in a direct way, but in an implicit one.

(BTW, folks, this is a great way to go about debate/discussion! If more of us could use this kind of questioning and/or point-counterpoint method, I think it would make things a whole lot easier for all of us. Just saying…)
 
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