Is it wrong to like dragons?

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I think that dragons as images are harmless in themselves, but if they are used as symbols in occult practices, then this image is contaminated in that case. But generally in the way people see them, it is a harmless images. There are many things that can be used for good or evil, but which are not always evil.
 
Havard said:
Ehh…

“And they adored the dragon, which gave power to the beast: and they adored the beast, saying: Who is like to the beast? and who shall be able to fight with him? And there was given to him a mouth speaking great things, and blasphemies: and power was given to him to do two and forty months.” Rev 13:4

I’m not super-keen on dragon-fixations, even if they aren’t quite the dragon from The Apocalypse.
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:rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

You do know that the Bible used goats to symbolize sinners too right? If so, what does that make goat cheese? The Devil’s Cheese? :rolleyes:
meetmehere said:
if u like worshipping the occult, and practicing the black arts. yeah i guess its alrightthen
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If that were true then people would be too scared to play Yu-Gi-Oh! with me. My deck’s just full of dragons! (E.g. Red-Eyes Black Dragon, Armed Dragon, Horus the Black Flame Dragon) 😛

Anyways, to the original poster, I wouldn’t worry about it. Dragons are fictional creatures. There is no canon that defines their alignment. The same with other creatures like trolls, orcs, ogres, fairies, vampires, werewolves, sea serpents, elementals etc. These are things you can create and design in your mind. Such is the powerful gift of the imagination.

Personally, I’m fascinated with dragons and often use them as my signature creature. I especially love their depiction as ancient powerful beings with great control over the forces magic. Considering that I have a nasty habit of self-inserting myself in my stories as either a wizard or a magic swordsman, I think it’s a perfect match wouldn’t you think? 😛
 
Lost_Wanderer said:
:rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:You do know that the Bible used goats to symbolize sinners too right? If so, what does that make goat cheese? The Devil’s Cheese? :rolleyes:
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I don’t appreciate the uncharitable insinuation that I’m superstitious cretin. Let’s just stick to facts.

Look at your example. In Scripture, goats are represented as clean and fit for food, as well as acceptable offerings for sacrifice (Old Testament). In fact, in Canticles 4, the Lord says of His spouse: “How beautiful art thou, my love, how beautiful art thou! thy eyes are doves’ eyes, besides what is hid within. Thy hair is as flocks of goats, which Come up from mount Galaad.”

Contrast that with dragons. There is not one positive mention of dragons in Scripture, and the vast majority are of wailing, wickedness, poison, desolation, or Satan himself.
 
Havard said:
Contrast that with dragons. There is not one positive mention of dragons in Scripture, and the vast majority are of wailing, wickedness, poison, desolation, or Satan himself.
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The same can be said of snakes or did you forget what was it that tempted Eve in Genesis? What about the attack of snakes in which Moses had to create a bronze serpent to cure the people? (Numbers 21:4-9) The same bronze serpent was then named Nehushtan and was destroyed when the people began worshiping it. (2 Kings 18:4)

Following your logic, snakes are evil too.

P.S.

I wasn’t insinuating anything. I was merely disappointed that someone would still imply that we should adhere to obsolete, fundamentalist traditions of literature. All that does is enforce religious oppression of creativity and imagination. And for the record, you do remember that mermaids were considered evil omens during the old days of England too right? I guess that means you better get rid of you kids’ Little Mermaid merchandise. What about giants? The Bible doesn’t exactly portray the Nephilim in a good light. I guess we oughta be scared of the likes of Yao Ming.
 
Okay, let’s look at ‘snakes’ in the Bible then…

There are a dozen Hebrew words for serpents used in the Bible, and several more Greek ones. Some mean ‘venomous snake’, some mean ‘coiled’, and some mean ‘small reptile.’ If you look into their usage, you’ll find that there are many passages where snakes are not portrayed as evil at all. On the other hand, the Dragon in Revelations is the Greek word “drakon”, uniformly. It is described as an enormous, red, clawed, horned, multi-headed, fire-breathing serpent. Quite a specific description.

Secondly, I never implied any such thing about “oppression of creativity” in literature. I don’t appreciate words being put in my mouth. I read novels with dragons in them, and novels with demons in them. The last book I read, in fact, was about a soldier banished to a planet full of demons - Dead Sky, Black Sun. The point I made was not to fixate on dragons, as I would not fixate on demons, or anything satanic.
 
Havard said:
Okay, let’s look at ‘snakes’ in the Bible then…

There are a dozen Hebrew words for serpents used in the Bible, and several more Greek ones. Some mean ‘venomous snake’, some mean ‘coiled’, and some mean ‘small reptile.’ If you look into their usage, you’ll find that there are many passages where snakes are not portrayed as evil at all. On the other hand, the Dragon in Revelations is the Greek word “drakon”, uniformly. It is described as an enormous, red, clawed, horned, multi-headed, fire-breathing serpent. Quite a specific description.
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Show me exactly where these verses are. Translators aren’t stupid nor are they incompetent. If the word for serpent refers to a specific type in a certain passage, they would always mention it in the footnote. However, the serpents I speak of are the ones commonly associated with evil in the Bible: long, slithering, and scary. Just because the same Hebrew word is used for other reptiles does not change their association to that specific type. It’s the same way just because “dog” can be used to describe both a poodle and a pit bull, it doesn’t take away the negative connotations of pit bulls when I refer to them as savage, mangy mutts.
Havard said:
Secondly, I never implied any such thing about “oppression of creativity” in literature. I don’t appreciate words being put in my mouth. I read novels with dragons in them, and novels with demons in them. The last book I read, in fact, was about a soldier banished to a planet full of demons - Dead Sky, Black Sun. The point I made was not to fixate on dragons, as I would not fixate on demons, or anything satanic.
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Nope, you’re just proving my point. The problem is you’re equating dragons to demons as something that is evil, to be shunned, and (worse) to be destroyed. I love dragons, not as cliche fairy tale monsters that eat princesses, but as powerful noble companions who embody charismatic qualities such as honor, freedom, and power. Thus, you are indeed trying to oppress creativity by making implications that we shouldn’t deviate from obsolete literary norms.
 
Christ is symbolized as a dragon. I think it’s in the Nordic Christian myths that Christ and Satan are depicted as a white and a red dragon in battle. Evil people who deny they are sinners will see the image they deny in Christians. So to them Christ will seem to be a dragon. Just as He is blamed for the evils of society to day and religion is blamed for all the wars Christ is a dragon to those who oppose Him.
 
Lost_Wanderer said:
Show me exactly where these verses are. Translators aren’t stupid nor are they incompetent. If the word for serpent refers to a specific type in a certain passage, they would always mention it in the footnote. However, the serpents I speak of are the ones commonly associated with evil in the Bible: long, slithering, and scary. Just because the same Hebrew word is used for other reptiles does not change their association to that specific type. It’s the same way just because “dog” can be used to describe both a poodle and a pit bull, it doesn’t take away the negative connotations of pit bulls when I refer to them as savage, mangy mutts.

Nope, you’re just proving my point. The problem is you’re equating dragons to demons as something that is evil, to be shunned, and (worse) to be destroyed. I love dragons, not as cliche fairy tale monsters that eat princesses, but as powerful noble companions who embody charismatic qualities such as honor, freedom, and power. Thus, you are indeed trying to oppress creativity by making implications that we shouldn’t deviate from obsolete literary norms.
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Alright let’s boil this down to 3 different questions. You actually added one when you misrepresented my original post, but let’s talk about it anyway.
  1. Do dragons represent the devil and/or anti-Christ in the Bible exclusively?
  2. Is it appropriate to represent demons or dragons as ‘good’ in the name of creativity?
  3. Is it appropriate to fixate on demons or dragons? (Quite a different question than 2).)
  4. Yes, the only words in Scripture that specifically means ‘dragon’ (as opposed to snake, serpent, or wild beast) are exclusively used to describe members of the unholy trinity. The word is Greek, and it is ‘drakon’. It is used in the New Testament, in Revelations. The description of it is quite detailed, as I mentioned earlier, it’s distinctly a dragon.
The Hebrew word ‘tannin’ has been translated as dragons in the Old Testament, but it is also used to describe jackals, whales and snakes in various places as well. Likewise, the word ‘tanniyn’ has been translated as ‘dragon’ in some versions, but literally it meant ‘wild animals’.
  1. Some artists like to portray the devil or demons in a sympathetic light. It is an interesting concept, and contrary to what you have posted, I have never outright condemned it, but it is not a theme I would recommend to the theologically ignorant. It is important to understand what the Church teaches about these beings, because they are not merely fictional. As long as you know the truth, I find no reason not to judiciously examine other representations.
  2. “Fixation in a general sense, in human psychology, refers to the state where an individual becomes obsessed with an attachment to another human, animal or inanimate object. eg fixation to intangibles (i.e., ideas, ideologies etc.) can occur (see zealotry and fanaticism).” psychology.wikia.com/wiki/Fixation
My original point was that I’m not hot dragon fixations, because only a few healthy pursuits demand obsessive attention. If you want to read Eragon, be my guest, but if you can’t stop thinking about dragons, you might want to put the book down.
 
Havard said:
  1. Yes, the only words in Scripture that specifically means ‘dragon’ (as opposed to snake, serpent, or wild beast) are exclusively used to describe members of the unholy trinity. The word is Greek, and it is ‘drakon’. It is used in the New Testament, in Revelations. The description of it is quite detailed, as I mentioned earlier, it’s distinctly a dragon.
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This does not in anyway even address the fact that the same type of serpent (the slithering, legless, hissing variety) is also used to represent the devil or at the very least a bad omen.
Havard said:
  1. “Fixation in a general sense, in human psychology, refers to the state where an individual becomes obsessed with an attachment to another human, animal or inanimate object. eg fixation to intangibles (i.e., ideas, ideologies etc.) can occur (see zealotry and fanaticism).” psychology.wikia.com/wiki/Fixation
My original point was that I’m not hot dragon fixations, because only a few healthy pursuits demand obsessive attention. If you want to read Eragon, be my guest, but if you can’t stop thinking about dragons, you might want to put the book down.
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Everyone here has already warned against obsession. Then again, you could have a “fixation” on any other creature (mythological or otherwise). My issue with you is how you use Scripture to imply that portraying dragons in a positive light is in a way un-Christian. That, sir, was my original point.
 
Lost_Wanderer said:
This does not in anyway even address the fact that the same type of serpent (the slithering, legless, hissing variety) is also used to represent the devil or at the very least a bad omen.
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Probably because the topic of this thread regards dragons, not ‘creatures that have been represented in a negative light in Scripture.’
Everyone here has already warned against obsession. Then again, you could have a “fixation” on any other creature (mythological or otherwise). My issue with you is how you use Scripture to imply that portraying dragons in a positive light is in a way un-Christian. That, sir, was my original point.
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That is a flat out lie, I have been quite clear on my stance from the beginning, and all you have done is misrepresent and distort it. I wonder if it is a forum violation to consistently sling baseless accusations which could be represented as personal attacks.
 
“Wrong to like dragons?
I dunno.
Ask St. George.”

Lol I love St. George.
 
Havard said:
Probably because the topic of this thread regards dragons, not ‘creatures that have been represented in a negative light in Scripture.’
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The only person not getting the point is you. The OP more or less asked if it was bad to have a sort of positive appreciation of dragons. Your post clearly shows that your position is that of “Nay”. With regards to that however, snakes also have a bad reputation in the Bible (along with giants). So thus, following your implication, snakes are also evil. Also, just because you say they used the same word for other reptiles doesn’t change the fact that they associate the actual snake as a symbol of the devil.
Havard said:
That is a flat out lie, I have been quite clear on my stance from the beginning, and all you have done is misrepresent and distort it. I wonder if it is a forum violation to consistently sling baseless accusations which could be represented as personal attacks.
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Are you kidding me? Over 85% of your post consists of a verse depicting dragons in a negative light. Your “main point” was like, what, one hardly relevant sentence?

Maybe it oughta be a forum violation for being confusing and inconsistent.
 
Lost_Wanderer said:
The only person not getting the point is you. The OP more or less asked if it was bad to have a sort of positive appreciation of dragons. Your post clearly shows that your position is that of “Nay”. With regards to that however, snakes also have a bad reputation in the Bible (along with giants). So thus, following your implication, snakes are also evil. Also, just because you say they used the same word for other reptiles doesn’t change the fact that they associate the actual snake as a symbol of the devil.

Are you kidding me? Over 85% of your post consists of a verse depicting dragons in a negative light. Your “main point” was like, what, one hardly relevant sentence?

Maybe it oughta be a forum violation for being confusing and inconsistent.
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Look at it this way, an argument that might be seen to support the restriction of gun usage and ownership (a.k.a. gun control) could also be used as an argument to support gun safety. Like a statistic on gun-related fatalities. But not everyone who favors gun safety favors gun control. You’ve been interpreting my arguments as me being for ‘dragon control’, but all this time I’ve been arguing for ‘dragon safety’. Does that make sense?
 
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